Afriqiyah Airbus 330 Crash
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I guess we have the revolt/NATO action to thank for this fine gentleman providing what I am sure is the authoritative report on the accident. Had stability remained I doubt he would have been able to provide his report.
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But instead of pulling the plane up, the pilot pushed the plane down, making it hit the ground and crash.
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"The control tower has made a big mistake by letting the aircraft land on Runway 09, and not on 27," he says. "I have no idea why they are so insistent on it."-
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somatogravic effect
I wonder if somatogravic effect has some part in this crash.
and googled for other , but find no good
and all the links in old thread are "ded!
http://www.pprune.org/tech-log/9199-...-illusion.html
somebody have a good link of explaining the fenomen
Maybe we can update the good old link
Ulf
It all sounds quite possible. A trail of small factors leading up to the big hole. The tower favour the runway that suits them so they do not have to squint into the sun. The captain is feeling off colour, spends most of the flight in the cabin and lets the tired copilot do the non precision approach into the sun with low clouds making the runway hard to see. When the correct decision to go around occurs, the captain takes over, has a heart attack and the rest is history. Sure the last part is conjecture, but it is a hypothesis I would certainly explore. At the very least even if he did not take over, it could have distracted the copilot. Reminds me a bit of the Staines Trident where the captain was also conjectured to have had a heart attack. The only bit that I doubt, is that Captain Amer graduated from Oxford University, though he most probably trained at Oxford Aviation.
scanhorse
somatogravic effect
Quote:
I wonder if somatogravic effect has some part in this crash.
I find this old thread in trying to understand this "effect"
and googled for other , but find no good
and all the links in old thread are "ded!
somatogravic illusion
somebody have a good link of explaining the fenomen
Maybe we can update the good old link
Ulf
somatogravic effect
Quote:
I wonder if somatogravic effect has some part in this crash.
I find this old thread in trying to understand this "effect"
and googled for other , but find no good
and all the links in old thread are "ded!
somatogravic illusion
somebody have a good link of explaining the fenomen
Maybe we can update the good old link
Ulf
Some reference here
franzl
Drain Bamaged
And to go back with the topic, apparently "they" weren't even looking out (away from the sun) since it's a crew waiting for departure that noticed them of the accident.
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Thanks Franzl
Just start reading on page 47, it has been discussed in great detail.
Some reference here
franzl
Some reference here
franzl
Ulf
I update old thread with new info
(but that was a closed thread
)
Dog Tired
You may be aware of the fact that...
The FDR will reveal the movements of both side-sticks - that is: who was imputting control at the time. If the captain had tried to take over/if the FO flew it into the ground/if the captain had incapacitation and pushed the stick forward - these things are revealed.
The FDR will reveal the movements of both side-sticks - that is: who was imputting control at the time. If the captain had tried to take over/if the FO flew it into the ground/if the captain had incapacitation and pushed the stick forward - these things are revealed.
The flight safety officer's version might be reasonably expected to mention input from the captain's sidestick had it been recorded. One possibility is a more insidious incapacitation, that might also partially explain why the crew were distracted enough to descend well below minimum before trying to initiate the go around. The implication of the serious incident, which occured on a flight shortly before, is that this was a crew in any case not at the top of their game.
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Given the events in Libya, who knows ? but does anyone know if an agency (somewhere) are progressing the investigation ? Airbus ? or the Dutch (given how many of their nationals were counted amongst the victims)
I realise that whatever agency in Libya was tasked with investigating this may not even exist anymore (physically or metaphorically
) but just wondered if somebody "offshore" was running with it.
As a confirmed Scarebus -sceptic, I would be disillusioned if this one is just swept under the carpet under the catchall conclusion of "crew machine interaction/crew cock-up" as so often happens when these devices go wrong, or to pacify the "lovers" are. . . wrongly operated.
I realise that whatever agency in Libya was tasked with investigating this may not even exist anymore (physically or metaphorically
) but just wondered if somebody "offshore" was running with it.As a confirmed Scarebus -sceptic, I would be disillusioned if this one is just swept under the carpet under the catchall conclusion of "crew machine interaction/crew cock-up" as so often happens when these devices go wrong, or to pacify the "lovers" are. . . wrongly operated.
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and I wonder that the public still doesn't know the cause of the accident.
FO pressed take-over button (i.e. autopilot off) instead of push-to-talk switch for the radio, captain didn't realize that autopilot isn't flying, never took over airplane, crashed into the ground.
This is from very reliable sources.
FO pressed take-over button (i.e. autopilot off) instead of push-to-talk switch for the radio, captain didn't realize that autopilot isn't flying, never took over airplane, crashed into the ground.
This is from very reliable sources.
Ouch! 
If true, that would be, sadly, not the first ever "knobology/switchology" crash, and likely not the last.
If true, that would be, sadly, not the first ever "knobology/switchology" crash, and likely not the last.
But there is a distinct aural warning when the AP is disconnected!
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15 months ago….. http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/4...ml#post5770568
Hotel Tango: depending upon task loading, would that aural warning trigger a response on short final? Hopefully, yes.
About aural warnings, like the stall warning of AF447 going off for a while: sometimes the sound doesn't penetrate into the aware part of the pilot's attention.
About aural warnings, like the stall warning of AF447 going off for a while: sometimes the sound doesn't penetrate into the aware part of the pilot's attention.
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yeah, cavalry and Level 3 warning.
But it was more complicated: The guy (as they say) continued talking on the radio and kept on pressing the AP off button. There is a Priority-light plus Voice warning if you press that button. But if you keep on pressing you lock out the other side stick. Until the other presses it too. But obviously never did...
But it was more complicated: The guy (as they say) continued talking on the radio and kept on pressing the AP off button. There is a Priority-light plus Voice warning if you press that button. But if you keep on pressing you lock out the other side stick. Until the other presses it too. But obviously never did...
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Annexe 13 Investigation
The Libyans were not being overly helpful to the foreign accredited investigators before the revolution, and nothing has progressed since January.
Families are now petitioning ICAO to do something useful, which might be getting the BEA to take over charge of the investigation (since they are experts on A330 problems these days)
watch this space
Families are now petitioning ICAO to do something useful, which might be getting the BEA to take over charge of the investigation (since they are experts on A330 problems these days)
watch this space
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No one knows what to do here. A Dutch news-bulletin (Nu.nl) wrote that it is also the fault of the particular (Dutch) governmental institutions who are quite unwilling to show some action.
On the other hand, what can one do under those chaotic circumstances where the investigating body is destroyed in the battlescene.
One should consider that traveling Africa is subject to a certain degree of extra risk. Men and machine are less predictable and sudden mishaps are a continuous source of worry.
On the other hand, what can one do under those chaotic circumstances where the investigating body is destroyed in the battlescene.
One should consider that traveling Africa is subject to a certain degree of extra risk. Men and machine are less predictable and sudden mishaps are a continuous source of worry.