Bristow North Sea
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AFAIK the Sunday meeting was cancelled as the BALPA company council offered to talk to anyone who had concerns on Monday afternoon.
I'm led to believe that the guys got a grip of the individuals who were making noises and gave a briefing to anyone interested as to the progress of the pay talks so far.
It evidently quitened down the noisy minority as they realised that the chaps did have their interests at heart and were actually trying to get the best deal they could.
Hopefully the "trouble-makers" will now shut up and ask the guys at the battle front if they have any concerns rather than trying to muck rake with unproven rumours both from PPRuNe and also from similar types on the other side of the runway.
But then again, why let the truth get in the way of a good rumour?
I'm led to believe that the guys got a grip of the individuals who were making noises and gave a briefing to anyone interested as to the progress of the pay talks so far.
It evidently quitened down the noisy minority as they realised that the chaps did have their interests at heart and were actually trying to get the best deal they could.
Hopefully the "trouble-makers" will now shut up and ask the guys at the battle front if they have any concerns rather than trying to muck rake with unproven rumours both from PPRuNe and also from similar types on the other side of the runway.
But then again, why let the truth get in the way of a good rumour?
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Hi there, Q, just thought that you'd like to know that Jim Wilhite is advertising for pilots for Trinidad on a 56/28 rotation....
http://www.justhelicopters.com/justpilots.htm
Now there's a thought........
http://www.justhelicopters.com/justpilots.htm
Now there's a thought........
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(86% voted NO!) Bristow pilots rejected pay review
Aircrew Ballot Results
Q1. Do you accept the July 2001 Pay and Benefits Review?
Yes - 13.9%
No - 86.1%
Q2a. Are you prepared to take part in industrial action short of a strike?
Yes - 75%
Q2b. Are you prepared to take part in strike action?
Yes - 71.5%
Scotia and Bristow: Let's stick together and we'll see the results very shortly!
Q1. Do you accept the July 2001 Pay and Benefits Review?
Yes - 13.9%
No - 86.1%
Q2a. Are you prepared to take part in industrial action short of a strike?
Yes - 75%
Q2b. Are you prepared to take part in strike action?
Yes - 71.5%
Scotia and Bristow: Let's stick together and we'll see the results very shortly!
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Well we have done our bit! Over to you now CC. Please make sure that you know what we all want and that you represent OUR interests. There is no backing down from this one.
Happy Flying
Happy Flying
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Well your quote of "Well we have done our bit! Over to you now CC. Please make sure that you know what we all want and that you represent OUR interests." sounds threatening to my mind.
The CC of whatever company you work for needs the support of everyone throughout, not just up to initial ballot!
I'm not on a CC but I am giving them my full support throughout and I don't feel I need to make comments such as yours. I will now see what they can achieve from management, and I am sure they will get the best deal that they can on our behalf. However, it is now up to management to understand that WE ALL are fed up with the way we have been treated over the years. If they cannot afford to pay more now, then they must find some way to assure us all that they will find a way over a period of time.
I hope the CC will be successful, but in the end I think they will not be able to achieve much more than they have already got, and that isn't down to a poor CC or BALPA members, it's down to management not understanding properly the feelings of us all.
We must all stick together - CC and the members.
The CC of whatever company you work for needs the support of everyone throughout, not just up to initial ballot!
I'm not on a CC but I am giving them my full support throughout and I don't feel I need to make comments such as yours. I will now see what they can achieve from management, and I am sure they will get the best deal that they can on our behalf. However, it is now up to management to understand that WE ALL are fed up with the way we have been treated over the years. If they cannot afford to pay more now, then they must find some way to assure us all that they will find a way over a period of time.
I hope the CC will be successful, but in the end I think they will not be able to achieve much more than they have already got, and that isn't down to a poor CC or BALPA members, it's down to management not understanding properly the feelings of us all.
We must all stick together - CC and the members.
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You seem very keen to put your ideas over publically. I have a very good reason for not going public on this forum about our CC. However, if you take the time to read previous forums, you will see that I have, indeed, been very supportive of our CC. Especially in encouraging folk to join BALPA and give them a mandate for phase 2 of the negotiations. There have been som very vociferous comments made re BALPA many of which I have not agreed with. I certainly do not think that now, is the time for that. However, I do think that I have got the right to say "We have done our job. (i.e. given you a mandate) Now CC over to you please make sure you represent our interests".
This is because, historically, I do not think that they have. If you wish to know my reasons for this then e-mail me at [email protected],pprune.com. I refuse to be dragged into a public slanging match. However, I think that we are both agreed that the CC need the total support of the membership and that is what I have advocated throughout.
Happy flying.
[ 11 August 2001: Message edited by: Tuckunder ]
This is because, historically, I do not think that they have. If you wish to know my reasons for this then e-mail me at [email protected],pprune.com. I refuse to be dragged into a public slanging match. However, I think that we are both agreed that the CC need the total support of the membership and that is what I have advocated throughout.
Happy flying.
[ 11 August 2001: Message edited by: Tuckunder ]
What the ABZ Press & Journal reports to the outside world...
Copter pilots reject latest Bristow offer
Arthur Macdonald
Offshore helicopter pilots and search-and-rescue crews throughout the UK have rejected the latest pay offer from operator Bristow.
The British Airline Pilots' Association (Balpa) yesterday overwhelmingly said no to the deal which it estimated offered captains between 5.5% and 14.1% on basic pay.
The helicopter pilots are demanding parity with fixed-wing pilots, an issue that has been a running sore in the offshore industry for some time.
The salaries of helicopter captains average about £50,000 a year compared with £80,000 for fixed-wing captain.
North Sea helicopter operators have been losing pilots to the airlines because of the differential.
The Bristow pay negotiations cover some 180 employees in Scotland and 220 in England, largely in the oil industry but including rescue crews at Bristow's four stations at Stornoway, Sumburgh, Lee on Solent and Portland.
Captain Richard Maloney, who represents Balpa at Bristow, said: "Although Bristow has gone some way to address the urgent issue of pay and the growing problem of pilot recruitment and retention especially in the North Sea, our members believe it has not gone far enough.
"Under the company's offer, there would still be a significant and unacceptable pay gap between Bristow's highly skilled helicopter pilots and pilots of fixed-wing aircraft. We are therefore calling on the company to significantly improve its offer."
Mick Rowsell, a search-and-rescue aircrewman, added: "Aircrewmen based at Bristow's search-and-rescue stations strongly feel that Bristow has failed to address properly a number of long-standing pay issues.
"Bristow's aircrewmen now earn significantly less that their military counterparts. This cannot continue."
A spokesman for Bristow said that the negotiations which began in May were continuing and hoped the talks would be brought to a successful conclusion. He added: "Bristow helicopters believes that it has made a good offer that would result in a significant increase both to basic pay and allowances payable to flying crew and is disappointed that, although Balpa itself recommended its members accept the offer, members have decided negotiations should continue
Copter pilots reject latest Bristow offer
Arthur Macdonald
Offshore helicopter pilots and search-and-rescue crews throughout the UK have rejected the latest pay offer from operator Bristow.
The British Airline Pilots' Association (Balpa) yesterday overwhelmingly said no to the deal which it estimated offered captains between 5.5% and 14.1% on basic pay.
The helicopter pilots are demanding parity with fixed-wing pilots, an issue that has been a running sore in the offshore industry for some time.
The salaries of helicopter captains average about £50,000 a year compared with £80,000 for fixed-wing captain.
North Sea helicopter operators have been losing pilots to the airlines because of the differential.
The Bristow pay negotiations cover some 180 employees in Scotland and 220 in England, largely in the oil industry but including rescue crews at Bristow's four stations at Stornoway, Sumburgh, Lee on Solent and Portland.
Captain Richard Maloney, who represents Balpa at Bristow, said: "Although Bristow has gone some way to address the urgent issue of pay and the growing problem of pilot recruitment and retention especially in the North Sea, our members believe it has not gone far enough.
"Under the company's offer, there would still be a significant and unacceptable pay gap between Bristow's highly skilled helicopter pilots and pilots of fixed-wing aircraft. We are therefore calling on the company to significantly improve its offer."
Mick Rowsell, a search-and-rescue aircrewman, added: "Aircrewmen based at Bristow's search-and-rescue stations strongly feel that Bristow has failed to address properly a number of long-standing pay issues.
"Bristow's aircrewmen now earn significantly less that their military counterparts. This cannot continue."
A spokesman for Bristow said that the negotiations which began in May were continuing and hoped the talks would be brought to a successful conclusion. He added: "Bristow helicopters believes that it has made a good offer that would result in a significant increase both to basic pay and allowances payable to flying crew and is disappointed that, although Balpa itself recommended its members accept the offer, members have decided negotiations should continue
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Tuckunder:
It seems that we are in agreement. However, it was your comment that I felt was in the wrong and I said so. What went on in the past is irrelevant as it is the present which is of great importance.
As we are both agreed that support for the CC is important, then I have no more to say. As far as I am concerned this matter between us is now closed.
It seems that we are in agreement. However, it was your comment that I felt was in the wrong and I said so. What went on in the past is irrelevant as it is the present which is of great importance.
As we are both agreed that support for the CC is important, then I have no more to say. As far as I am concerned this matter between us is now closed.
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Hello
I am new here. I support the CC to represent us for a better pay rise than the pathetic one given to us by Bristow Management. It is an insult after all this time. I have not posted before but feel that I have to because I am so angry with management attitude towards us.
I am disillusioned with BALPA because they recommended that we accept the rise offered by Bristow. I know that we must have them to represent us but they seem to be too oriented towards the company view and out of touch with the members.
I don't know what more we have to do to be heard. Please BALPA, get with it and get us what we deserve.
I heard that the pilots in the Gulf of Mexico got significant rises by organising and threatening to go on strike according to Rotor and Wing,well, it is about time that we showed the companies what we can do and stopped talking about it so that we can get significant rises as well.
Who would support limited action to start now? Maybe we should carry full fuel everywhere and refuel at every stop, shut down of course.
I am new here. I support the CC to represent us for a better pay rise than the pathetic one given to us by Bristow Management. It is an insult after all this time. I have not posted before but feel that I have to because I am so angry with management attitude towards us.
I am disillusioned with BALPA because they recommended that we accept the rise offered by Bristow. I know that we must have them to represent us but they seem to be too oriented towards the company view and out of touch with the members.
I don't know what more we have to do to be heard. Please BALPA, get with it and get us what we deserve.
I heard that the pilots in the Gulf of Mexico got significant rises by organising and threatening to go on strike according to Rotor and Wing,well, it is about time that we showed the companies what we can do and stopped talking about it so that we can get significant rises as well.
Who would support limited action to start now? Maybe we should carry full fuel everywhere and refuel at every stop, shut down of course.
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Brother:
According to the Bristow CC they were put in the position of recommending the deal for a couple of reasons:
1. because the membership wanted to know what was on offer as there had been a gagging order in force by the management
2. because the company were going to refuse to put on the table the offer that we were shown if BALPA did not recommend the offer.
According to the BAPLA IRO (or whatever he is called) at a members meeting, this is quite normal in negotiations and then it is up to the members to decide (as we have) that it is not acceptable.
We can now give the CC a new mandate so that the management are aware that the offer just isn't good enough.
To me, the CC got the best deal that they could at the time even if they had to "recommend" it to us, as I guess they couldn't get anything better. We didn't like it and we have said so very strongly judging by the figures above.
The main problem is that we are all new to pay ngotiation dealings and we all have to learn as we go along.
According to the Bristow CC they were put in the position of recommending the deal for a couple of reasons:
1. because the membership wanted to know what was on offer as there had been a gagging order in force by the management
2. because the company were going to refuse to put on the table the offer that we were shown if BALPA did not recommend the offer.
According to the BAPLA IRO (or whatever he is called) at a members meeting, this is quite normal in negotiations and then it is up to the members to decide (as we have) that it is not acceptable.
We can now give the CC a new mandate so that the management are aware that the offer just isn't good enough.
To me, the CC got the best deal that they could at the time even if they had to "recommend" it to us, as I guess they couldn't get anything better. We didn't like it and we have said so very strongly judging by the figures above.
The main problem is that we are all new to pay ngotiation dealings and we all have to learn as we go along.
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Speedwing:
I am doing now what I vowed I wouldn't! It is very big of you to say, "as far as you are concerned it is the end of the matter". Or should I say arrogant? I believe that history IS relevant, it has an uncanny habit of repeating itself. I stand by my original comment and I do not consider it to be threatening. I am glad we are agreed on the main issue of present solidarity and as far as I am NOW concerned it is the end of the matter!!!!!!
Happy Flying
[ 12 August 2001: Message edited by: Tuckunder ]
I am doing now what I vowed I wouldn't! It is very big of you to say, "as far as you are concerned it is the end of the matter". Or should I say arrogant? I believe that history IS relevant, it has an uncanny habit of repeating itself. I stand by my original comment and I do not consider it to be threatening. I am glad we are agreed on the main issue of present solidarity and as far as I am NOW concerned it is the end of the matter!!!!!!
Happy Flying
[ 12 August 2001: Message edited by: Tuckunder ]
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Speedwing/tuckunder and all
Scotia CC met with the pilots last week to keep us up to date with events. We were told of the results of the Bristows ballet and I am pleased that you have rejected there latest offering, we were told that our management would like to offer some sort of(undefined) productivity scheme along with a non pensionable pay rise over possibly 1 to 3 years, this was rejected unanimously by all at the well attended meeting and our CC were instructed to tell the management that we were not interested in anything other than Parity with narrow bodied jet scales, with immediate effect. Scotia CC will meet with Scotia Managment on the 17th of this month and SCotia managment will present them with an improved offer for which they will require a answer by the 24th of August, we are aware that your CC will be meeting with Bristows management on the 3rd of Sept, There will be a meeting of pilots from both sides of the tarmac sometime between the 24th and 3rd venue to be notified, It is hoped that this meeting will serve as a joint BALPA forum for discusion on the next phase.
The end is near.
Scotia CC met with the pilots last week to keep us up to date with events. We were told of the results of the Bristows ballet and I am pleased that you have rejected there latest offering, we were told that our management would like to offer some sort of(undefined) productivity scheme along with a non pensionable pay rise over possibly 1 to 3 years, this was rejected unanimously by all at the well attended meeting and our CC were instructed to tell the management that we were not interested in anything other than Parity with narrow bodied jet scales, with immediate effect. Scotia CC will meet with Scotia Managment on the 17th of this month and SCotia managment will present them with an improved offer for which they will require a answer by the 24th of August, we are aware that your CC will be meeting with Bristows management on the 3rd of Sept, There will be a meeting of pilots from both sides of the tarmac sometime between the 24th and 3rd venue to be notified, It is hoped that this meeting will serve as a joint BALPA forum for discusion on the next phase.
The end is near.
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Classic stuff this....
Pilot A makes a statement, Pilot B doesn't like his tone so they have a public row about who is 'right' and having agreed that they are both right, they continue the row.
What message does this kind of exchange send? Management must be pi$$ing themselves!
Pilots? United? A bit of a contradiction in terms. One has only to look at the acrimonious exchanges going on in other threads for evidence of this.
If North Sea pilots were 'united' they would have each others e-mail and communicate their plans privately.
Every NS pilot pay-related thread that turns into a slanging match takes kudos away from the idea that a 'united front' might be in the offing.
---------
And having plunged my hand firmly into the wasp nest, I shall beat a hasty retreat.
Pilot A makes a statement, Pilot B doesn't like his tone so they have a public row about who is 'right' and having agreed that they are both right, they continue the row.
What message does this kind of exchange send? Management must be pi$$ing themselves!
Pilots? United? A bit of a contradiction in terms. One has only to look at the acrimonious exchanges going on in other threads for evidence of this.
If North Sea pilots were 'united' they would have each others e-mail and communicate their plans privately.
Every NS pilot pay-related thread that turns into a slanging match takes kudos away from the idea that a 'united front' might be in the offing.
---------
And having plunged my hand firmly into the wasp nest, I shall beat a hasty retreat.
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Taff Missed
I agree with you. I always said that if Balpa was an association, were we associates ? If it is a union, are we united ?
Well, by the recent notes received from Scotia and the latest BHL/Balpa ballot, it seems that we are becoming united at last. It is a good thing, and let's not spoil it.
I agree with you. I always said that if Balpa was an association, were we associates ? If it is a union, are we united ?
Well, by the recent notes received from Scotia and the latest BHL/Balpa ballot, it seems that we are becoming united at last. It is a good thing, and let's not spoil it.
