BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions
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BBB - no idea - I've been out of that for over a year and now a (gentle)man of retired 'leisure' - actually I have never been so busy. 
In short, I would expect so. I think BA will be trawling everywhere for capacity. Problem will be that the season has started, and thus less spare capacity in general.
In short, I would expect so. I think BA will be trawling everywhere for capacity. Problem will be that the season has started, and thus less spare capacity in general.
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Originally Posted by Winch-control
And for pax to comment on how much better the BA service is without the striking crew speaks volumes....
I have always experienced excellent service on Domestic and SH out of LGW.
I have usually experienced indifferent service on LH out of LHR to the East Coast.
I prefer my criticisms to be accurately targetted
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Not very democratic
Personally I like having CC and other employees join in from time to time.
Objections aren't made regarding differences of opinion unless they get to the point where its not a reasoned opinion, its simply a smear for venting's sake.
MP11, I agree...what is it with Gatwick? I've experienced and heard nothing but positive regarding their Cabin Crew.
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@ Diplome ...
I have no idea.
I use JER-LGW, where somehow the CC manage to do a full 'quickie meal' with wine on a 45 minute sector. You can hardly eat it before "top of drop", but there's no shortcuts on the quality of service.
Last year I used LGW-MLA ... same experience. Charming and efficient CC, smiles everywhere and nothing too much trouble.
Great people ... can we have them replace the 'NFI' staff at LHR on the services to the US East Coast?
MPN11, I agree...what is it with Gatwick? I've experienced and heard nothing but positive regarding their Cabin Crew.
I use JER-LGW, where somehow the CC manage to do a full 'quickie meal' with wine on a 45 minute sector. You can hardly eat it before "top of drop", but there's no shortcuts on the quality of service.
Last year I used LGW-MLA ... same experience. Charming and efficient CC, smiles everywhere and nothing too much trouble.
Great people ... can we have them replace the 'NFI' staff at LHR on the services to the US East Coast?
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Great people ... can we have them replace the 'NFI' staff at LHR on the services to the US East Coast?
Timely that you should mention Gatwick. The Director of our Business Development division was our guest for a few days and last night at dinner the subject of the strike came up.
When I mentioned the fact that there was a definite line of separation between Gatwick and LHR Cabin Crew he paused and said "I didn't know that. Perhaps that's why I enjoy my Gatwick flights and prefer Delta back to the States."
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Re: the differences between LGW and LHR, I suspect it's partly because LGW crew are less likely to take their passengers' business for granted than LHR and there isn't the pernicious influence of the BASSA hotheads on CC. Also, given the LHR pay structure there's a fair number of crew who should have left years ago but can't/won't because of the pay and the lifestyle.
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I wouldn't comment on the reasons ... I just assure you that difference is dramatic [and encountered on a regular basis].
OK - I'll agree with 'LD12986' on a general conceptual up-for-negotation basis.
OK - I'll agree with 'LD12986' on a general conceptual up-for-negotation basis.
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LGW CC
I think that the major difference between the LGW & LHR Cabin Crew is the average age. Whilst I have always received excellent service from both bases, the LGW CC must, on average, be 20 years younger than their LHR colleagues.
Therefore, NO 58 years old CSDs protecting their status & allowances!
Therefore, NO 58 years old CSDs protecting their status & allowances!
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Now, now, Finky ... respect for the aged, please, and no gratuitous dissing of CC 
I will admit I have never tried to analyse the ages of CC on my various flights recently, but the OH has bought me a new notebook to record [accurately] our experiences next week.
BTW, Mr Walsh, I'm available as a 'secret shopper' any time you care to call.
I will admit I have never tried to analyse the ages of CC on my various flights recently, but the OH has bought me a new notebook to record [accurately] our experiences next week.
BTW, Mr Walsh, I'm available as a 'secret shopper' any time you care to call.
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I have not been able to read all of this thread and the other one. That is the one from which all those apparently persecuted by BA, or persecuted by those who are persecuted by BA are banned.
But from the little reading here and there, I thinks that when all the chaos was happening because of the eruption of Eyjafjallajokul there were many British Airways passengers who were stranded in various places through out the world.
It is my thoughts that BA made serious efforts to bring these passangers back to England as speedily as possible. It is further what I understand that BASSA and UNITE absolutely refused to bend the agreements they have with BA even the tiniest little bit, thereby enormously adding to the misery and expense of passangers who were left stranded, not by British Airways, because the strike was not even on then, but by the BASSA people themselves.
What has been written above is only my uinderstanding and it is not a statement of fact. However, I am a little astonished that it would appear that the British press would also seem not to have picked up this story if it is true. This of course, since the British press is so excellent, probably means that the story is entirely, as you say, apocryphal. (?) So what happens now when, as seismologists and geologists seem to be thinking is going to happen and Katla goes boom? Will BASSA allow its agreements or whatever they may be terminologied, to be flexible to save the citizens or will it not ride to the top of the hill to plant the Joe Rosenthal it so proudly and possibly disgracefully inappropriately claims as its own logo?
But from the little reading here and there, I thinks that when all the chaos was happening because of the eruption of Eyjafjallajokul there were many British Airways passengers who were stranded in various places through out the world.
It is my thoughts that BA made serious efforts to bring these passangers back to England as speedily as possible. It is further what I understand that BASSA and UNITE absolutely refused to bend the agreements they have with BA even the tiniest little bit, thereby enormously adding to the misery and expense of passangers who were left stranded, not by British Airways, because the strike was not even on then, but by the BASSA people themselves.
What has been written above is only my uinderstanding and it is not a statement of fact. However, I am a little astonished that it would appear that the British press would also seem not to have picked up this story if it is true. This of course, since the British press is so excellent, probably means that the story is entirely, as you say, apocryphal. (?) So what happens now when, as seismologists and geologists seem to be thinking is going to happen and Katla goes boom? Will BASSA allow its agreements or whatever they may be terminologied, to be flexible to save the citizens or will it not ride to the top of the hill to plant the Joe Rosenthal it so proudly and possibly disgracefully inappropriately claims as its own logo?
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If Katla goes boom, shares in Cunard and any other cross-Atlantic ship carrier will soar.
Personally, I can think of better ways to spend 4 days watching waves - 8 hours of watching clouds is quite enough!
Personally, I can think of better ways to spend 4 days watching waves - 8 hours of watching clouds is quite enough!
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MPN 11
I wasn't dissing BA CC. As I said in my preamble, I have always received excellent service from CC members from both bases. But on my LHR flights, I have rarely been aware of the prescence of the CSD, unlike on my LGW flights.
I was just expessing an opinion as to the age & dedication, or lack of, of some aged LHR based CSDs.
Discuss?
I was just expessing an opinion as to the age & dedication, or lack of, of some aged LHR based CSDs.
Discuss?
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fincastle84
Finky, I misread you, for which apologies. OK?
The difference between the LGW and LHR pax service is, however, exactly as you describe.
I just wouldn't attribute it to the age of the CC, mainly because on LHR LH I hardly ever see them, so I couldn't possibly comment
The difference between the LGW and LHR pax service is, however, exactly as you describe.
I just wouldn't attribute it to the age of the CC, mainly because on LHR LH I hardly ever see them, so I couldn't possibly comment
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MPN 11
Absolutely no apologies required.
I'm sure that you'll have a great flight to IAD. I'm also pleased that you received such great assistance from BA in changing your flights, as I did prior to the planned Christmas strike.
The money markets are still showing strong support for WW, judging by the share price.
I'm sure that you'll have a great flight to IAD. I'm also pleased that you received such great assistance from BA in changing your flights, as I did prior to the planned Christmas strike.
The money markets are still showing strong support for WW, judging by the share price.
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Back to the thread.
There are many things concerning this dispute that I don't understand - some of the terminology is but one, small, item which constant reading tends to clarify - but currently the most unfathomable is BASSA's thinking over the last few weeks. To be sure, 'thinking' and 'BASSA' are words not often accurately linked in this matter, but the sheer stupidity - I can think of no better word - of the BASSA leadership is breath taking.
If their leadership had sat down to discuss their next action, with the specific objective of making the worst, possible decision for their membership, this would probably be it.
It is almost impossible to imagine a more destructive decision, in the circumstances - one wonders if Willie Walsh sometimes has to rethink his strategy because he keeps granting the BASSA leadership an average amount of intelligence and they keep proving him wrong!
There is another aspect that BASSA either doesn't understand, doesn't know, is trying to ignore or wishes it didn't know. As I have said before, I have read all of the BA/BASSA thread and all of this one and it is possible to 'sense' the strength of feeling in the rest of BA. After the 23 day strike announcement, the strength of feeling against BASSA in all the other departments who have negotiated and agreed with BA, who are now 'pulling out all the stops' to ensure the continuation of BA as a viable entity, is quite extraordinary.
It is not difficult to imagine the baggage handlers, for example, as having quite strong union membership - UNITE membership indeed - yet these people feel genuinely threatened by the BASSA action and are ready, willing and able to take strike breaking action. There have been several posts by people who are definitely working well above and beyond normal working practice with the sole objective of breaking the BASSA industrial action. This fact alone should make any proactive, thinking, caring union, sit up and take lots of notice.
BASSA, it seems, are either unaware or completely unconcerned. I am very much afraid that those who go on strike in the next tranche' will be the very first to cry 'foul' and 'its so unfair' to a crowded dole office. After so long and so many people trying to tell them how it really is, it is difficult to see them as anything else but volunteers.
Roger
If their leadership had sat down to discuss their next action, with the specific objective of making the worst, possible decision for their membership, this would probably be it.
It is almost impossible to imagine a more destructive decision, in the circumstances - one wonders if Willie Walsh sometimes has to rethink his strategy because he keeps granting the BASSA leadership an average amount of intelligence and they keep proving him wrong! There is another aspect that BASSA either doesn't understand, doesn't know, is trying to ignore or wishes it didn't know. As I have said before, I have read all of the BA/BASSA thread and all of this one and it is possible to 'sense' the strength of feeling in the rest of BA. After the 23 day strike announcement, the strength of feeling against BASSA in all the other departments who have negotiated and agreed with BA, who are now 'pulling out all the stops' to ensure the continuation of BA as a viable entity, is quite extraordinary.
It is not difficult to imagine the baggage handlers, for example, as having quite strong union membership - UNITE membership indeed - yet these people feel genuinely threatened by the BASSA action and are ready, willing and able to take strike breaking action. There have been several posts by people who are definitely working well above and beyond normal working practice with the sole objective of breaking the BASSA industrial action. This fact alone should make any proactive, thinking, caring union, sit up and take lots of notice.
BASSA, it seems, are either unaware or completely unconcerned. I am very much afraid that those who go on strike in the next tranche' will be the very first to cry 'foul' and 'its so unfair' to a crowded dole office. After so long and so many people trying to tell them how it really is, it is difficult to see them as anything else but volunteers.
Roger
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BASSA, it seems, are either unaware or completely unconcerned. I am very much afraid that those who go on strike in the next tranche' will be the very first to cry 'foul' and 'its so unfair' to a crowded dole office.
A colleague of my wife has just been informed her flight on the 24th (Phoenix to London) has been canceled. As a teacher she's not exactly able to just dip into a vast pool of cash to buy another ticket. I certainly hope she'll be able to get her money back from BA and book another airline in time or her dream vacation to Italy will be wrecked.
These Bassa idiots need to be treated with the contempt they deserve.
- Peter.
I've just seen an interview with the new Transport Secretary Phillip Hammond.
Apparently he's having a meeting with BA and UNITE "next week".
The strike is due to start Tuesday for Gods sake. If I'd have been the new Transport Sec I'd have got them in today and not let them out again until either UNITE agree to stop their pointless destructive strike and start looking after ALL their members interests, but if they refuse, instruct WW to issue P45's to all those striking on the first and (if any) subsequent days of the strike. This insanity has got to be stopped once and for all.
Apparently he's having a meeting with BA and UNITE "next week".
The strike is due to start Tuesday for Gods sake. If I'd have been the new Transport Sec I'd have got them in today and not let them out again until either UNITE agree to stop their pointless destructive strike and start looking after ALL their members interests, but if they refuse, instruct WW to issue P45's to all those striking on the first and (if any) subsequent days of the strike. This insanity has got to be stopped once and for all.
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Mr Walsh was accused of intimidating strikers before the last strike with the removal of staff travel.
If I was him, this time, I would not announce any action in advance of the strike.
I would have a fleet of couriers ready to deliver a sacking notice by hand to each striker as soon as they went on strike.
Yes they could claim unfair dismissal.
How long would the strike last and how many couriers would he need?
If I was him, this time, I would not announce any action in advance of the strike.
I would have a fleet of couriers ready to deliver a sacking notice by hand to each striker as soon as they went on strike.
Yes they could claim unfair dismissal.
How long would the strike last and how many couriers would he need?
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What WW does next…
There seems to be a number of posts recently where “flog ‘em and hang ‘em” or “feed ‘em to the sharks” seem to be the underlying sentiments.
I think we have to remember that there is a very large number of people watching… and one of the most, probably the most, interested group of stakeholders is the ‘sensible’ staff of BA, the CC who have not chosen to follow blindly the BASSA lead, yes, and also all the other staff groups, who collectively seem to have the long term interests of the Company at heart.
When this whole thing is over, the problem remains of rebuilding the Company so that it really is ‘One Team’, and can go on to do great things. There is no doubt that the removal of the militant tendency from the CC will facilitate that process; but the fact remains that there are deep wounds in the organisation. Everyone who chooses, or is chosen, to stay is going to have to make sure that their words and deeds reflect a new start, or the whole cancerous debacle will repeat itself. And then one will have to ask if the surgeon knew his task.
So WW Is constrained not only by the legality of his next moves, but also by the need to keep the other BA staff ‘on side’; and to do that, he must be seen to be fair and reasonable, however tough.
I think we have to remember that there is a very large number of people watching… and one of the most, probably the most, interested group of stakeholders is the ‘sensible’ staff of BA, the CC who have not chosen to follow blindly the BASSA lead, yes, and also all the other staff groups, who collectively seem to have the long term interests of the Company at heart.
When this whole thing is over, the problem remains of rebuilding the Company so that it really is ‘One Team’, and can go on to do great things. There is no doubt that the removal of the militant tendency from the CC will facilitate that process; but the fact remains that there are deep wounds in the organisation. Everyone who chooses, or is chosen, to stay is going to have to make sure that their words and deeds reflect a new start, or the whole cancerous debacle will repeat itself. And then one will have to ask if the surgeon knew his task.
So WW Is constrained not only by the legality of his next moves, but also by the need to keep the other BA staff ‘on side’; and to do that, he must be seen to be fair and reasonable, however tough.
Last edited by GemDeveloper; 14th May 2010 at 08:26. Reason: The last paragraph fell off!
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Many long haul trips last longer than 4 days. If someone on a 4 day or longer trip did not turn up as scheduled on the 9 June (the last day of the strike) they would obviously not be available to carry out their duties after June 12 when the strikers lose their protection. Would these individuals be considered as taking unlawful industrial action? Could BA then start disciplinerary action against them?
Regards
Regards