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FAA License Conversion Advice: Regionals or I Pay by myself??

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FAA License Conversion Advice: Regionals or I Pay by myself??

Old 30th Aug 2019, 17:45
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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Just out of interest, where would you think someone like me would stand? 8000hrs total, 3000 on the 737 and 5000 a mixture of 777 and 747, all at a large EASA legacy carrier. All P2 time except for a few hours here and there on light aircraft.
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Old 30th Aug 2019, 19:34
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by anson harris View Post
Just out of interest, where would you think someone like me would stand? 8000hrs total, 3000 on the 737 and 5000 a mixture of 777 and 747, all at a large EASA legacy carrier. All P2 time except for a few hours here and there on light aircraft.
Those are competitive times for all the majors as long as you have a 4 year degree, some internal letters of recommendation, some volunteer activity, and maybe some line instructor experience (known as line check airman). The 4 year degree is pretty much a deal breaker, the rest you may or may not need.

4000+ total time is where I start to see most become competitive. Some are competitive with less due to who they know.
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Old 31st Aug 2019, 18:09
  #23 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by rudestuff View Post
This guy sounds like a dreamer. Under EASA you cannot command an Airbus without at the very least an ATPL and in most cases at least 3000 hours. So to claim 1000 hours PIC with 2000 total is obviously nonsense. Under EASA all of those jet hours should be logged as P2 so if he's trying to pass off pilot flying time as P1 he'll be laughed out of his next job interview.
Yes you are right rudestuff. I am a dreamer. Also, in the airline I work for, we reference PICUS as PIC. We even enter it as such in our JAR-FCL log book. So, until I received clarification on this forum, I was unaware that most of my PF hours are actually considered SIC. That's why I am here and asking for advice via this forum. Making comments like I'll be 'laughed out of his next job interview' seems a little unnecessary and definitely unhelpful. I appreciate all of the help and useful advice that I have received on this forum. But comments like yours are just a bunch of hot air.
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Old 31st Aug 2019, 22:01
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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Amonghtus,

If the majority of your time is PICUS you won't meet the requirement for 250 hours PIC with ref to the ATP license minimum. Your license conversion may be more complicated than you anticipate.
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Old 31st Aug 2019, 22:54
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pilotchute View Post
Amonghtus,

If the majority of your time is PICUS you won't meet the requirement for 250 hours PIC with ref to the ATP license minimum. Your license conversion may be more complicated than you anticipate.
pilotchute,

Yes, and IllinoisDavidson raised the question in this thread, post #4. So she may be aware of this...solution unknown:

"2) 250 PIC (It looks like none of my husband's turbine flying hours, under his EASA license, will be considered PIC. However, he did train in the US, flying under an FAA PPL, accruing 105 PIC hours with a propellor aircraft. Would this be considered? If so, he would need to somehow accrue another 145 PIC hours to fulfill this requirement.)"

Ohana to Hawaiian Airlines Agreement
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Old 1st Sep 2019, 09:56
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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pilotchute and IllinoisDavidson,

I'm NO expert on FARs related to pilot licensing but something about this issue of PICUS and licensing jogged my feeble memory and I found this in Part 61. Can any of you comment on how or if this might help amonghtus and his potential application for an FAA ATPL ? Could his EASA PICUS fill that FAA square ?:

(5) 250 hours of flight time in an airplane as a pilot in command, or when serving as a required second in command flightcrew member performing the duties of pilot in command while under the supervision of a pilot in command, or any combination thereof, which includes at least—
(i) 100 hours of cross-country flight time; and
(ii) 25 hours of night flight time.

ß61.159 Aeronautical experience: Airplane category rating. Part 61.159(a)(5)

https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/retrieveECFR?gp&r=PART&n=14y2.0.1.1.2

Last edited by bafanguy; 1st Sep 2019 at 10:23.
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Old 1st Sep 2019, 10:24
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by bafanguy View Post
pilotchute and IllinoisDavidson,
(5) 250 hours of flight time in an airplane as a pilot in command, or when serving as a required second in command flightcrew member performing the duties of pilot in command while under the supervision of a pilot in command, or any combination thereof, which includes at leastó
(i) 100 hours of cross-country flight time; and
(ii) 25 hours of night flight time.
The wording in bold that bafanguy just posted definitely applies to my husband's situation (amongtus). I think this is really what has muddied the waters for us. I have also been in touch with a former FAA employee and he referred us to the FAA regulation Title 14 CFR part 61.55(e). This regulation focuses on SIC qualifications. My huband's PF (and PICUS) experience certainly falls under the specifications of that regulation. We are trying to find definitive answers on this subject through multiple resources (and contacts). We will definitely let this forum know the final answer, especially for any foreign pilots considering transferring to the aviation business in the US. This seems to be a key component to clarify before even moving ahead with license conversion. My husband may even need to keep a second (electronic?) log book moving forward so that he can log his hours properly according to his airline's policy and FAA regulations. And I thought just flying a plane was difficult. Ha!
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Old 1st Sep 2019, 10:44
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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ID,

I'm not sure what part of 61.55(e) would apply to your husband. I'll restate my lack of expertise on this and just ask a question: To my knowledge, the Part 121 operators no longer issue SIC type ratings as such. There was a time when they did but I think it was pre-1500 hour rule. Part 121 isn't listed in 61.55(e):

(e) A person may receive a second-in-command pilot type rating for the type of aircraft after satisfactorily completing an approved second-in-command training program, proficiency check, or competency check under subpart K of part 91, part 125, or part 135, as appropriate,


So wouldn't Part 61.159(a)(5) be the defining reg with the remaining question being if EASA PICUS would satisfy the FAA for an initial ATPL ? Just playing jail house lawyer here !
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Old 1st Sep 2019, 16:25
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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And this:

If FAA recognizes foreign flight time as logable in Part 61:

(j)Aircraft requirements for logging flight time. For a person to log flight time, the time must be acquired in an aircraft that is identified as an aircraft under ß 61.5(b), and is -

(1) An aircraft of U.S. registry with either a standard or special airworthiness certificate;


(2) An aircraft of foreign registry with an airworthiness certificate that is approved by the aviation authority of a foreign country that is a Member State to the Convention on International Civil Aviation Organization;

...AND...


c)Logging of pilot time. The pilot time described in this section may be used to:

(1) Apply for a certificate or rating issued under this part or a privilege authorized under this part; or(2) Satisfy the recent flight experience requirements of this part.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/61.51

Why can't foreign PICUS flight time be applied toward the 250 hour PIC requirement for an FAA ATP ?
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Old 1st Sep 2019, 17:13
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by IllinoisDavidson View Post
The wording in bold that bafanguy just posted definitely applies to my husband's situation (amongtus). I think this is really what has muddied the waters for us. I have also been in touch with a former FAA employee and he referred us to the FAA regulation Title 14 CFR part 61.55(e). This regulation focuses on SIC qualifications. My huband's PF (and PICUS) experience certainly falls under the specifications of that regulation. We are trying to find definitive answers on this subject through multiple resources (and contacts). We will definitely let this forum know the final answer, especially for any foreign pilots considering transferring to the aviation business in the US. This seems to be a key component to clarify before even moving ahead with license conversion. My husband may even need to keep a second (electronic?) log book moving forward so that he can log his hours properly according to his airline's policy and FAA regulations. And I thought just flying a plane was difficult. Ha!
does your husband have a PIC type rating on his EASA license for the jet he was flying?
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Old 2nd Sep 2019, 09:30
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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Havick,

I don't know the answer to this specific question. I just looked through my husband's license and also asked him and he is unaware of such a rating for EASA. He is going to ask some of the captains at his airline to see if they have such a rating on their licenses.

Originally Posted by havick View Post


does your husband have a PIC type rating on his EASA license for the jet he was flying?
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Old 2nd Sep 2019, 11:56
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by anson harris View Post
Just out of interest, where would you think someone like me would stand? 8000hrs total, 3000 on the 737 and 5000 a mixture of 777 and 747, all at a large EASA legacy carrier. All P2 time except for a few hours here and there on light aircraft.
So zero command time? Not FO flying the flight logging ĎPIC.í But never a Captain anywhere? That isnít a very competitive resume. Theyíd be more interested in a 4-5K TT regional pilot with 500-1000 hrs PIC.

Unlike overseas U.S. carriers donít put any value on resumes that include their current fleet types. Everyone will go through a full training course to be an FO, even a TRE/TRI/CKA current in type.
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Old 2nd Sep 2019, 16:19
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by havick View Post
does your husband have a PIC type rating on his EASA license for the jet he was flying?
Are you asking because you feel if he had an EASA type rating somehow limited to SIC-only that it might affect the FAA's opinion on whether he could use that time as PICUS to meet the 250 hour requirement here ?

I found this regarding logging PIC time. It appears that SIC time is still SIC time in regards to meeting the 250 hour requirement:

"This requirement should not be confused with ß61.159 (a)(4), which permits a pilot to count second-in-command (SIC) time toward the 250 hours of flight time required to apply for an ATP certificate. See Legal Interpretation to John Duncan (April 13,2012)."

https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...rpretation.pdf


https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...rpretation.pdf

Last edited by bafanguy; 2nd Sep 2019 at 16:44.
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Old 2nd Sep 2019, 18:50
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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I could be wrong, but I donít believe that they have SIC type ratings in EASA. The FAA came up with SIC type ratings because back in the day, FOís werenít required to have a type rating (they still went through training that was basically a type rating), and then there was an interpretation about needing a type rating for international flights (mostly going to Canada, thatís another story in itself), and they came up with the SIC type rating to meet ICAO requirements.
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Old 3rd Sep 2019, 00:22
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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In EASA you have either a PIC or COP rating. So I assume he has a COP A330 rating since he flies as FO. And thereís no such thing in EASA where you log your PF hours as PIC time. Itís simply SIC PF. So he cannot use those hours for his resume as PIC time, itís simply FO time.
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Old 3rd Sep 2019, 03:20
  #36 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sunrig View Post
In EASA you have either a PIC or COP rating. So I assume he has a COP A330 rating since he flies as FO. And thereís no such thing in EASA where you log your PF hours as PIC time. Itís simply SIC PF. So he cannot use those hours for his resume as PIC time, itís simply FO time.
this is what i thought to be the case too
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Old 3rd Sep 2019, 09:13
  #37 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sunrig View Post
In EASA you have either a PIC or COP rating. So I assume he has a COP A330 rating since he flies as FO. And thereís no such thing in EASA where you log your PF hours as PIC time. Itís simply SIC PF. So he cannot use those hours for his resume as PIC time, itís simply FO time.
It might be true in some EASA countries, but in the UK there is no PIC or COP - it's just a type rating. The company decide if you're left seat or right seat
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Old 3rd Sep 2019, 21:42
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Originally Posted by rudestuff View Post
It might be true in some EASA countries, but in the UK there is no PIC or COP - it's just a type rating. The company decide if you're left seat or right seat
My apologies, I am not familiar with UK rules. My experience is from the mainland.
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Old 4th Sep 2019, 09:15
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by misd-agin View Post


So zero command time? Not FO flying the flight logging ĎPIC.í But never a Captain anywhere? That isnít a very competitive resume. Theyíd be more interested in a 4-5K TT regional pilot with 500-1000 hrs PIC.

Unlike overseas U.S. carriers donít put any value on resumes that include their current fleet types. Everyone will go through a full training course to be an FO, even a TRE/TRI/CKA current in type.
No, 'fraid not. I've got a couple of years TRI under my belt. Unfortunately you need a lot of seniority at my outfit for a command.
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Old 5th Sep 2019, 03:08
  #40 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by anson harris View Post
No, 'fraid not. I've got a couple of years TRI under my belt. Unfortunately you need a lot of seniority at my outfit for a command.
Applying is free but don't be stunned if you don't get called by a large U.S. major airline. People without TPIC time do get called but it's a distinct minority of the candidates. The typical candidate has 1,500+ hrs TPIC.
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