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-   -   Is Ukraine about to have a war? (https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/639666-ukraine-about-have-war.html)

rattman 23rd Aug 2022 22:15


Originally Posted by mickjoebill (Post 11283958)
Number for normal day is ..?

Mjb

your the one claiming there 800 military aircraft up. I am not going to go count them, but 200-250 at a guess

cynicalint 23rd Aug 2022 22:33


Originally Posted by mickjoebill (Post 11283948)
Approximately 800 military aircraft airborne over USA in the last hour.
HIgh level of surveillance aircraft airborne around US and North of Venezuela https://ua.usembassy.gov/security-al...yiv-ukraine-6/
Mjb

So, unless the USA is going to invade Venezuela, what are the implications for Ukraine?, Why would 800 aircraft airborne around US and north of Venezuela necessitate the evacuation from Ukraine of US personnel?

rattman 23rd Aug 2022 22:42


Originally Posted by cynicalint (Post 11283971)
So, unless the USA is going to invade Venezuela, what are the implications for Ukraine?, Why would 800 aircraft airborne around US and north of Venezuela necessitate the evacuation from Ukraine of US personnel?

nearest military aircraft to venezula is a spanish A-310, so unless spain is planning to invade with 200 infantry

fdr 23rd Aug 2022 22:44


Originally Posted by WB627 (Post 11283907)

That is a major game changer. If Turkey takes that position, they have the ability to stop all Russian marine trade beyond the Bosphorus, which trashes Russias dwindling energy revenues which are already hurting. That can be done softly, in a manner like the French did to Japan on car trade back in the day. Considerer how long a single inspector would take to do a comprehensive safety survey and search for war munitions, while applying all EU OH&SA rules impeccably, and workplace agreements, breaks for a hookah, Coffee & baklava etc. By the time the inspector has driven from Antalya to Istanbul, amidst the traffic, the poor guy/girl will be exhausted. Pity. Fridays are out... Sundays are out for the other side of the creek.... Russias capacity was limited previously, with a 4 day round trip cycle... India is now around 40 days, China is 70 days.. and the oil is being sold at a $35 discount on a collapsing price due to, at least in part the cooling of global trade caused by Putin and his ruckus. At present oil is costing more to sell than produce for Vlad's wonder math, and that is going to be the case while Russia remains belligerent. Latest projection by Yale university is Russia is heading for "economic oblivion", which is not going to go down well with the priviledged of Moscow and St Petes. Makes for sober reading, and does not appear to be biased, it just presents some brutal facts that Vlad should have been keenly aware of prior to his field trials of the Russian military.

Russia has to work out a way to recover any semblance of confidence in its trading partners, as the partners it now has been forced to trade with are price driven, not ideological. While V Putin is in power, or any of his crony crims, that is going to be... "....is problem...".

The NRA could rapidly gain support I would think, the winds of change may be starting to "blow",as heralded by the hapless young lady Dugina; Guess Russian Uber may become popular with the current Russian regime, "...is safer, da..."


cynicalint 23rd Aug 2022 23:13


Originally Posted by rattman (Post 11283975)
nearest military aircraft to venezula is a spanish A-310, so unless spain is planning to invade with 200 infantry

Quite! I was just querying the relevance of the information to the situation in Ukraine!

pattern_is_full 23rd Aug 2022 23:15


Originally Posted by mickjoebill (Post 11283948)
Approximately 800 military aircraft airborne over USA in the last hour.
Mjb

Perhaps RTB following: https://www.mlive.com/news/2022/07/m...in-august.html

cynicalint 23rd Aug 2022 23:19

FDR
Perceptive, thought provoking post!

NutLoose 23rd Aug 2022 23:37

Turkey could also screw up Russias Syrian support by closing their airspace to overflights.

NutLoose 23rd Aug 2022 23:44


Originally Posted by Tartiflette Fan (Post 11283879)
Scholz has just announced the delivery of 3 x Iris-T AA systems and 10 recovery-tanks. Total value about E 500 million. No dates given. It might be coincidental, but these could not be described as offensive weapons: he still seems to sit on the fence.

They are also providing 250 Vulcano artillery rounds that are high precision 80Km rounds and if you look at what they have or are providing it is extensive.

https://www.bundesregierung.de/breg-...kraine-2054992

https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato...ojectiles.html

etudiant 24th Aug 2022 00:43


Originally Posted by dead_pan (Post 11283949)
His assessments have been wrong on many occasions. Most likely will be wrong on this too


I respect Mearsheimer's expertise and take his comments seriously, because he was outspoken about the disastrous consequences likely to result from the effort to bring Ukraine into the western fold.
He called that exactly, so his current posting deserves attention. Just because it does not make for happy reading is no excuse for brushing it under the rug.

etudiant 24th Aug 2022 00:47


Originally Posted by Fitter2 (Post 11283955)
It could have been dictated by Moscow's troll factories. Give Putin this time what he will be content with to avoid nuclear war.

1. If Putin is insane, then nuclear war is inevitable anyway.

2. If He isn't insane, giving him anything now guarantees he will regroup and be back for more. Followed, at some point when it goes too far by WW3,

logically, therefore, only defeat for the rapists and other war criminals (preferably with a Nuremberg style trial and sentencing of the criminals, but I don't hold my breath on that one) is the only possibility to avoid WW3. QED.

Did you even read the article? Your comments don't relate to anything Mearsheimer wrote.

mickjoebill 24th Aug 2022 02:05


Originally Posted by rattman (Post 11283975)
nearest military aircraft to venezula is a spanish A-310, so unless spain is planning to invade with 200 infantry

US mil aircraft doing search track on adsb at time of posting.


mickjoebill 24th Aug 2022 02:47


Originally Posted by rattman (Post 11283961)
your the one claiming there 800 military aircraft up. I am not going to go count them, but 200-250 at a guess

At time of original post, from adsb.
https://imgur.com/a/RlsCxwR

rattman 24th Aug 2022 03:51


Originally Posted by mickjoebill (Post 11284045)
At time of original post, from adsb.
https://imgur.com/a/RlsCxwR

Not sure what you are trying to prove with a photo taken by a potato, but at the time there was approx 250 military aircraft up over the US. The majority of these were trainers. T-38, texans, Cessna 172 and EC135's none of which are useful for invading a country. This was about normal or fraction above normal amount for the time of day

megan 24th Aug 2022 04:36


The Kremlin's mouthpieces blame Ukraine, Estonia and the UK for Daria Dugina's death
One thought I had was did her father purposely sacrifice his daughter in an attempt to rally the population?

Tartiflette Fan 24th Aug 2022 07:12


Originally Posted by fdr (Post 11283977)
. That can be done softly, in a manner like the French did to Japan on car trade back in the day. Considerer how long a single inspector would take to do a comprehensive safety survey A

On a point of accuracy, I never heard of that (whilst working in that industry). There was ,however, the well-publicised requirement for all video-recorders to be examined at the Poitiers customs-post - many hundreds of km from major ports. IIRC cars were simply limited in number on an EU-wide basis

Video Mixdown 24th Aug 2022 07:34


Originally Posted by megan (Post 11284065)
One thought I had was did her father purposely sacrifice his daughter in an attempt to rally the population?

Purposely? Unwittingly? Under Duress? Mistakenly? On Putin's orders? By some nascent resistance group? Could be any of the above in Russian politics. I think the least likely is Ukraine - why would they bother when their country is full of much more important targets.

Economics101 24th Aug 2022 08:52


Originally Posted by etudiant (Post 11284011)
I respect Mearsheimer's expertise and take his comments seriously, because he was outspoken about the disastrous consequences likely to result from the effort to bring Ukraine into the western fold.
He called that exactly, so his current posting deserves attention. Just because it does not make for happy reading is no excuse for brushing it under the rug.

Wrong on one major point. Ukraine is not being brought into the western fold by others: it's desperately trying to escape from Moscow's clutches. It is not about western manipulation and plotting its about Ukraine's own very fervently held wishes.

peter we 24th Aug 2022 08:57


Originally Posted by Video Mixdown (Post 11284106)
Purposely? Unwittingly? Under Duress? Mistakenly? On Putin's orders? By some nascent resistance group? Could be any of the above in Russian politics. I think the least likely is Ukraine - why would they bother when their country is full of much more important targets.

There is a story circulating that Dugin offered to sacrifice his faughter for the cause. The nazi one.

peter we 24th Aug 2022 09:00


Originally Posted by Economics101 (Post 11284147)
Wrong on one major point. Ukraine is not being brought into the western fold by others: it's desperately trying to escape from Moscow's clutches. It is not about western manipulation and plotting its about Ukraine's own very fervently held wishes.

it's a disaster for Russia..

Freedom from the Russian threat, Nato membership and economic growth will mean future generations think it was worth the cost.


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