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-   -   Is Ukraine about to have a war? (https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/639666-ukraine-about-have-war.html)

Lonewolf_50 13th Aug 2022 19:41


Originally Posted by skridlov (Post 11277789)
This nuanced, long article in the current LRB is excellent. I'm a subscriber however I believe a number of articles are accessible FOC if you access via a VPN.
https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v44/.../blast-effects

Good article, thanks for the link. :ok:

rattman 13th Aug 2022 20:16


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11277841)
Ai think you will find they were announced a while back but just are being delivered, hats off to them as they are a poor country and they are handing over their air defence capability to rely on other countries to defend them.

They do want financial compensation for them, which I do understand for a small country like slovenia. Something like 300 million for the planes and all parts

Mogwi 13th Aug 2022 21:38


Originally Posted by rattman (Post 11277864)
They do want financial compensation for them, which I do understand for a small country like slovenia. Something like 300 million for the planes and all parts

Slovakia, not Slovenia!


NutLoose 13th Aug 2022 21:54

What can I say… they are living in cloud cuckoo land


https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....1fe8a07e8.jpeg

GlobalNav 13th Aug 2022 22:43


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11277841)
I think you will find they were announced a while back but just are being delivered, hats off to them as they are a poor country and they are handing over their air defence capability to rely on other countries to defend them.

here you go

https://twitter.com/GattoLugano/stat...54534472323072

Which countries, if any, have committed to the air defense of Slovakia?

Tartiflette Fan 13th Aug 2022 22:47


Originally Posted by GlobalNav (Post 11277914)
Which countries, if any, have committed to the air defense of Slovakia?

Their former co-state - Czech Republic.

NutLoose 13th Aug 2022 23:07


Originally Posted by Tartiflette Fan (Post 11277917)
Their former co-state - Czech Republic.

And Poland I believe, Global Nav, see the link below

https://mil.in.ua/en/news/slovakia-m...29s-in-august/

in the meantime, more views of the dam bridge damage and although the poster says it does not show much I think it speaks volumes as the main bridge support beam structure is no longer sitting on the pier, it’s gone.



..

langleybaston 13th Aug 2022 23:10


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11277891)
What can I say… they are living in cloud cuckoo land


https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....1fe8a07e8.jpeg

Contrary to Russian [and other] beliefs, even the warmest of Ukraine's supporters in this Just War have little leverage in demanding negotiations.
Ukraine decided to fight alone, and Ukraine alone will decide when enough is enough.
The Ukrainians have every reason to fight to the bitter end.
God speed.

GlobalNav 13th Aug 2022 23:17


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11277891)
What can I say… they are living in cloud cuckoo land


https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....1fe8a07e8.jpeg

The terms of negotiation should be simple and direct: Russia may withdraw all Russian troops and personnel from Ukrainian territory, boundaries as they were prior to any annexations. Alternatively, enjoy their complete destruction. With either option, Russia is required to make full restitution for the Ukrainian lives, limbs, destruction and loss of material, and extradite to the World Court specified individuals charged with war crimes.

langleybaston 13th Aug 2022 23:18

Admirable. That would do for starters.

jolihokistix 13th Aug 2022 23:19

In return Ukraine will allow two equal languages, as in Canada with French and English.

langleybaston 13th Aug 2022 23:31


Originally Posted by jolihokistix (Post 11277929)
In return Ukraine will allow two equal languages, as in Canada with French and English.

OK. Ukrainian and English?

GlobalNav 13th Aug 2022 23:37


Originally Posted by langleybaston (Post 11277931)
OK. Ukrainian and English?

Their own choice, but not German.

NutLoose 13th Aug 2022 23:56

I would add the militias of the breakaway republics would lay down their arms and Russia would withdraw from Sevastopol.

etudiant 14th Aug 2022 02:34


Originally Posted by langleybaston (Post 11277924)
Contrary to Russian [and other] beliefs, even the warmest of Ukraine's supporters in this Just War have little leverage in demanding negotiations.
Ukraine decided to fight alone, and Ukraine alone will decide when enough is enough.
The Ukrainians have every reason to fight to the bitter end.
God speed.

That is not so in terms of money or material, even if Ukraine has the will..
Ukraine is financially on life support, technically in default, although the creditors have granted a two year repayment delay ( https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-ok-debt-delay )
Likewise, Ukraine depends on outside supporters for its arms.
So they have as much freedom as their military and financial supporters provide.

NutLoose 14th Aug 2022 04:00

Which is still more than Russia who are in actual default. The rest of the world will help Ukraine rebuild, Russia not so.
And let’s face it, Ukraine is ONLY in this position because Russia invaded, prior to that they were starting to grow.

You just don’t get the west and the freedoms it gives you, do you.

rattman 14th Aug 2022 04:56


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11277999)
Which is still more than Russia who are in actual default. The rest of the world will help Ukraine rebuild, Russia not so.
And let’s face it, Ukraine is ONLY in this position because Russia invaded, prior to that they were starting to grow.

And stole billions in airliners which are now valueless and in the end they are going to have to pay for one way or the other

fdr 14th Aug 2022 07:40


Originally Posted by etudiant (Post 11277983)
That is not so in terms of money or material, even if Ukraine has the will..
Ukraine is financially on life support, technically in default, although the creditors have granted a two year repayment delay ( https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-ok-debt-delay )
Likewise, Ukraine depends on outside supporters for its arms.
So they have as much freedom as their military and financial supporters provide.

Here's the thing; Ukraine has friends and supporters. They support Ukraine as Ukraine was the victim of a mugging by a thug called Russia. The thug has conducted genocide, and murder, executions of civilians. Ukraine has friends, and while governments may vacillate, friends don't let down friends. Russia's despot has to be offered assistance from the most dysfunctional state on the 3rd rock. Lie down with dogs, get fleas. Russia's friends are.... Eritrea? North Korea.... ? yup class acts. Russia had an opportunity to be a vibrant member of Europe, and elected to kick sand in the skinny kids faces.

Russia's current economy is smaller than Belgium's. and they are famous for chocolates. Russia is famous for making a ruckus in the kitty litter and breaching treaties.

My question to you etudiant is, why are you not helping a country that has been attacked by a genocidal aggressor?

For an aviation flavor.... The USSR has managed to kill the same number of people as if you shot down a B747-200 with 269 people on it every day for 75 years. That is how murderous the history of the glorious workers paradise has been.
Good for undertakers.

ORAC 14th Aug 2022 08:03

Antonovsky bridge took another major pummelling last night including secondary explosions from equipment/armament on the bridge itself - they’re not going to fix that overnight…


Beamr 14th Aug 2022 08:29

Slovakia is doing their share, with those MIG29's mentioned earlier they are now delivering highly mobile artillery as well. MRSI capability to 6 rounds per minute.



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