Riat 2003
Riat 2003
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Will be making a call to said RIAT offices this very morning, Hope to get a reply later today...
Oakham.... now theres a wonderful place.... Thoroughly enjoyed my stay at her majesty's expence...
Natives Very friendly too!!!
Cracking Chinese in the town square as well... would be nice to re visit...
Maybe they should shuffle it every other year and give the poor old residents of Fairford a rest from all the traffic congestion....
Oakham.... now theres a wonderful place.... Thoroughly enjoyed my stay at her majesty's expence...
Natives Very friendly too!!!
Cracking Chinese in the town square as well... would be nice to re visit...
Maybe they should shuffle it every other year and give the poor old residents of Fairford a rest from all the traffic congestion....
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Will there be any aircraft available at all??!
Oh yes, plenty of French stuff.
I wonder if the security risk may be too high?
I hope not - but I guess it is too early to tell just yet. Fingers crossed.
Oh yes, plenty of French stuff.
I wonder if the security risk may be too high?
I hope not - but I guess it is too early to tell just yet. Fingers crossed.
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I've been wondering this for a couple of months now. Firstly 'what airplanes'? Even if we're not flying them somewhere hot, it's not like '91, when the RAF was double the size it is now and we had a lot fewer other commitments, so we could afford to give people and equipment the time off after GW1 and still do RIAT. Mind you some unusual stuff from China might be good, and the Russians haven't been for years.
Secondly 'what base'? If Fairford is not a goer, you can bet it will be a brave Stn Cdr that agrees to let this particular bandwagon onto his Stn when the UK will not be top of certain people's Christmas card lists.
Thirdly, last year there was an enormous contingent of personnel for security - where are they going to come from this time? I can't see the security issues getting smaller.
Don't get me wrong - I've worked there and had enormous fun for over 7 years and have every intention of going back this year if it happens - remember the war is not inevitable, Uncle Tony said so. I'm just being pragmatic.
Divergent Phugoid - any answer?
Secondly 'what base'? If Fairford is not a goer, you can bet it will be a brave Stn Cdr that agrees to let this particular bandwagon onto his Stn when the UK will not be top of certain people's Christmas card lists.
Thirdly, last year there was an enormous contingent of personnel for security - where are they going to come from this time? I can't see the security issues getting smaller.
Don't get me wrong - I've worked there and had enormous fun for over 7 years and have every intention of going back this year if it happens - remember the war is not inevitable, Uncle Tony said so. I'm just being pragmatic.
Divergent Phugoid - any answer?
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Folks, Sorry for the delay in getting back...
The show is on!! I believe the dates are 19/20 July. There is at present no intentions of moving the venue elsewhere.
All the relevant participants and exhibitors are being booked on the basis that the show will be based at Fairford. (I can hear the villagers cringing already!)
As for the security measures, can't be as chaotic as last year! (can it?)
Will be in contact with RIAT reception over the next few weeks, if there are any updates I will post them on here.
Cheers DP.
The show is on!! I believe the dates are 19/20 July. There is at present no intentions of moving the venue elsewhere.
All the relevant participants and exhibitors are being booked on the basis that the show will be based at Fairford. (I can hear the villagers cringing already!)
As for the security measures, can't be as chaotic as last year! (can it?)
Will be in contact with RIAT reception over the next few weeks, if there are any updates I will post them on here.
Cheers DP.
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AlanM,
Do you honestly think that RIAT is fun
It is the worst airshow in the world to go to if you are displaying and/or doing 'Pedro' ops. And static is even worse!
Unless you are a foreign dignitary, an airship or chaiman of BWOS then forget it, it is definately NOT FUN
Perhaps that's why so many aircrew who have done it once, don't do it again! You are treated disgracefully, sorry.
Still, I hope it does go ahead, if only for the reasons you alude to regarding RAFBF. Maybe if they cut down all the wasteage at RIAT, then they would have considerably more money to hand over to Ben Fund, and the RAFBF and RAFA wouldn't be so strapped for funds.
Regards
The swinging Monkey
'Caruthers, al large Grouse please'
Do you honestly think that RIAT is fun
It is the worst airshow in the world to go to if you are displaying and/or doing 'Pedro' ops. And static is even worse!
Unless you are a foreign dignitary, an airship or chaiman of BWOS then forget it, it is definately NOT FUN
Perhaps that's why so many aircrew who have done it once, don't do it again! You are treated disgracefully, sorry.
Still, I hope it does go ahead, if only for the reasons you alude to regarding RAFBF. Maybe if they cut down all the wasteage at RIAT, then they would have considerably more money to hand over to Ben Fund, and the RAFBF and RAFA wouldn't be so strapped for funds.
Regards
The swinging Monkey
'Caruthers, al large Grouse please'
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Mr Monkey…..
We agree on most things, but I’m not sure if I agree with you on this one!
RIAT is a fantastic weekend away. Yes, it has its problems, but it’s the biggest military air show in the world… What do you expect? Bringing all those people into a countryside location, then trying to find accommodation for them, yes, there are going to be problems.
As for the high wastage’s…. What do you mean? Do you have any specific examples? All in all, I think if you are prepared to take the rough with the smooth, then it’s a good weekend away… Better then being sent to the desert! (any aircrew out there who would care to differ with me?
Well, lets just hope it happens, and if it does, I’ll see you all there (Hopefully!). If nothing else, the 14 B52’s would make a good display!
Happy landings
Grob Driver
We agree on most things, but I’m not sure if I agree with you on this one!
RIAT is a fantastic weekend away. Yes, it has its problems, but it’s the biggest military air show in the world… What do you expect? Bringing all those people into a countryside location, then trying to find accommodation for them, yes, there are going to be problems.
As for the high wastage’s…. What do you mean? Do you have any specific examples? All in all, I think if you are prepared to take the rough with the smooth, then it’s a good weekend away… Better then being sent to the desert! (any aircrew out there who would care to differ with me?
Well, lets just hope it happens, and if it does, I’ll see you all there (Hopefully!). If nothing else, the 14 B52’s would make a good display!
Happy landings
Grob Driver
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Well I have had fun since 1995!
As Grob Driver says it is such a vast event that some people will always be a bit p'd off.
I have never heard of any crews saying that they didn't want to go back.......... You obivously don't like beer, or invite the right chicks to yr aircraft!!
Yes, there isn't as much as would be like going in to the fund from the show, but that is due to the vast amount of overheads brought in over the past 5 years. Insurance etc is unbelievably high now.
Oh well, see you at teh Sunday Night Party to discuss further!
As Grob Driver says it is such a vast event that some people will always be a bit p'd off.
I have never heard of any crews saying that they didn't want to go back.......... You obivously don't like beer, or invite the right chicks to yr aircraft!!
Yes, there isn't as much as would be like going in to the fund from the show, but that is due to the vast amount of overheads brought in over the past 5 years. Insurance etc is unbelievably high now.
Oh well, see you at teh Sunday Night Party to discuss further!
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Grob, Alan,
Looks like I am in a minority, maybe!
The wasteage: well, no one can have been to RIAT without seeing every air cadet under the sun wearing hats, t-shirts, sweatshirtas blah!
I know it is good to give them all something, but how can RIAT, RAFBF and RAFA plead poverty one one hand, and give away literally thousands and thousands of pounds worth of 'freebies' on the other?? You cannot have both.
And the hospitality chalets blah?
The last time I did the show (2 - 3 yrs ago) the aircrew were treated shamefully. I know, I was there! No food, no drinks, diddly squatt! However, I managed to sneek a look in at the RIAT enclosure/hospitality tent - holy cow!! I've never seen such a spread, but alas, it's only for the very people I elude too in my earlier post.
Alan, of course we like beer and girlies, what are you suggesting?? But, good hosting isn't for just the post show party.
I agree it's the biggest airshow in the world, but Waddo comes a very, very close second, and if Paul Byram and his team can do it, with their limited resources, then RIAT should be able to do it! Maybe they could visit Waddo to see how the 'participants' should be, and ARE treated. Very much better than RIAT.
Grob, Yes, anything is better than a weekend in the desert, even RIAT (sorry!) and as you say, a flypast of BUFFS will go down a BOMB!!!
See you all there (maybe?
)
Swinging Monkey
'Caruthers, rant over - fetch me a scotch, and make it a double'
Looks like I am in a minority, maybe!
The wasteage: well, no one can have been to RIAT without seeing every air cadet under the sun wearing hats, t-shirts, sweatshirtas blah!
I know it is good to give them all something, but how can RIAT, RAFBF and RAFA plead poverty one one hand, and give away literally thousands and thousands of pounds worth of 'freebies' on the other?? You cannot have both.
And the hospitality chalets blah?
The last time I did the show (2 - 3 yrs ago) the aircrew were treated shamefully. I know, I was there! No food, no drinks, diddly squatt! However, I managed to sneek a look in at the RIAT enclosure/hospitality tent - holy cow!! I've never seen such a spread, but alas, it's only for the very people I elude too in my earlier post.
Alan, of course we like beer and girlies, what are you suggesting?? But, good hosting isn't for just the post show party.
I agree it's the biggest airshow in the world, but Waddo comes a very, very close second, and if Paul Byram and his team can do it, with their limited resources, then RIAT should be able to do it! Maybe they could visit Waddo to see how the 'participants' should be, and ARE treated. Very much better than RIAT.
Grob, Yes, anything is better than a weekend in the desert, even RIAT (sorry!) and as you say, a flypast of BUFFS will go down a BOMB!!!
See you all there (maybe?
)Swinging Monkey
'Caruthers, rant over - fetch me a scotch, and make it a double'
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Monkey, monkey, monkey… I think all that swinging has made you dizzy!
Waddo is great, a truly fantastic show, but it’s no where near the same scale was RIAT (FACT!). You just can’t compare the two.
The hospitality tents that you refer to are paid for by the shows ‘sponsors’ No, it’s not for us aircrew, it’s for big wigs in this world who see 9 hawks blasting around the skies and think ‘I’ll have myself 100 of those please’. Or sees an E-3 with CFM’s and think I’ll put those on my 707’s
The air cadets thing…. Ye, cant argue with that, but it’s all good publicity for the RAF, and the powers above would say it pays for itself in promoting the Royal Air Force.
Waddo is great, a truly fantastic show, but it’s no where near the same scale was RIAT (FACT!). You just can’t compare the two.
The hospitality tents that you refer to are paid for by the shows ‘sponsors’ No, it’s not for us aircrew, it’s for big wigs in this world who see 9 hawks blasting around the skies and think ‘I’ll have myself 100 of those please’. Or sees an E-3 with CFM’s and think I’ll put those on my 707’s
The air cadets thing…. Ye, cant argue with that, but it’s all good publicity for the RAF, and the powers above would say it pays for itself in promoting the Royal Air Force.
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Swingin Monkey -
Fair points - must admit that until 18 months ago I was on the Organising Ctte and was the Gala Dinner/Sunday Night Party organiser so saw little of the airshow!!! Lucky to get southside for 30mins for the weekend.
Seriously, I am sorry you were messed around. Yes, it is amazing the mass number of freebies given to volunteers, but then they are just that. Also, the air cadets were used for such great jobs as cleaning the hangar on the Monday morning AFTER the party. Thereore, sponsor funded T-shirts/hats are minimal really. (with BAe Sytems logos on them!)
I had a great thought a few years ago.......everyone planning to come to the show could stay at home, and donate a tenner and therefore not have a show. Would probably raise more cash for the fund, but no fun!!!
Also remember that as a crew you are PAID to be there and maybe are in a hotel - all the support staff are volunteers taking annual leave to sleep in a cot for 10-14 days!
My personal opinion is that it has just got too big really - a victim of it's own success you could say. The sheer scale of the event means a lot of the aircrew side has diminished and you are just another person in a flying suit.
Finally, yes other shows are almost as big, and equally well run. Maybe both Paul Byram and Paul Bowen should get together!
If you make it this year to the Party I will shout you a beer!
P.S. Yes the food in the chalet was excellent!!!
P.P.S. What type/sqn are you from?
P.P.P.S. If you like beer that much why aren't you in happy hour??
Fair points - must admit that until 18 months ago I was on the Organising Ctte and was the Gala Dinner/Sunday Night Party organiser so saw little of the airshow!!! Lucky to get southside for 30mins for the weekend.
Seriously, I am sorry you were messed around. Yes, it is amazing the mass number of freebies given to volunteers, but then they are just that. Also, the air cadets were used for such great jobs as cleaning the hangar on the Monday morning AFTER the party. Thereore, sponsor funded T-shirts/hats are minimal really. (with BAe Sytems logos on them!)
I had a great thought a few years ago.......everyone planning to come to the show could stay at home, and donate a tenner and therefore not have a show. Would probably raise more cash for the fund, but no fun!!!
Also remember that as a crew you are PAID to be there and maybe are in a hotel - all the support staff are volunteers taking annual leave to sleep in a cot for 10-14 days!
My personal opinion is that it has just got too big really - a victim of it's own success you could say. The sheer scale of the event means a lot of the aircrew side has diminished and you are just another person in a flying suit.
Finally, yes other shows are almost as big, and equally well run. Maybe both Paul Byram and Paul Bowen should get together!
If you make it this year to the Party I will shout you a beer!
P.S. Yes the food in the chalet was excellent!!!
P.P.S. What type/sqn are you from?
P.P.P.S. If you like beer that much why aren't you in happy hour??
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Chaps,
I'm delighted we have found some common ground at last, even if we still differ on a couple of points
Grob, the hospitality chalets provide by BWOS, for BWOS guests is fine, and I have no real problem with that. Same goes for CFM and all the others. My gripe here are the chalets provided by RIAT for their guests.
The idea of RIAT, as we all know, is primarily to support and raise funds for RAFBF and RAFA. Why then, do the very people who we are raising money for, need to splash out vast sums of money on people who, quite frankly, don't need it and/or could comfortably afford to pay for it themselves ??!!
Alan, I agree entirely that the ATC do a marvellous job at RIAT. But it is no better a job than they do at many other events, but without the lavish freebies. Yes, it does project the RAF. Yes, it is good positive publicity. But, they do get a free day out at what we all agree is the worlds greatest airshow, and I seriously must question the need to further heap freeby goodies on them Whether BWOS sponsor hats, T-shirts blah or not is irrelivant. Give the cost of them all to those that need it, ie the RAFBF and the RAFA. Sorry, but they need it most!
As for the chalet food; I bet it was wonderful!
As you will know, to give out my sqn and a/c type will cost me my life!! so I regret I cannot comply!
As for the beer and happy hour, well I'd love to, but firstly I'm a bit of a 'Grouse' man myself. And secondly, if the boss caught at happy hour instead of on call he would go bananas I don't think he would appreciate me climbing into my flying machine under the 'afluence of incahol', hic!
I genuingly hope that RIAT happens, and raises millions for RAFBF and RAFA. Times are hard for the old boys, and we must do all we can to help them, just like they have helped us.
Keep smiling
The Swinging Monkey
'Caruthers, put the kettle on old boy, theres a good chap!'
I'm delighted we have found some common ground at last, even if we still differ on a couple of points
Grob, the hospitality chalets provide by BWOS, for BWOS guests is fine, and I have no real problem with that. Same goes for CFM and all the others. My gripe here are the chalets provided by RIAT for their guests.
The idea of RIAT, as we all know, is primarily to support and raise funds for RAFBF and RAFA. Why then, do the very people who we are raising money for, need to splash out vast sums of money on people who, quite frankly, don't need it and/or could comfortably afford to pay for it themselves ??!!
Alan, I agree entirely that the ATC do a marvellous job at RIAT. But it is no better a job than they do at many other events, but without the lavish freebies. Yes, it does project the RAF. Yes, it is good positive publicity. But, they do get a free day out at what we all agree is the worlds greatest airshow, and I seriously must question the need to further heap freeby goodies on them
Whether BWOS sponsor hats, T-shirts blah or not is irrelivant. Give the cost of them all to those that need it, ie the RAFBF and the RAFA. Sorry, but they need it most!As for the chalet food; I bet it was wonderful!
As you will know, to give out my sqn and a/c type will cost me my life!! so I regret I cannot comply!
As for the beer and happy hour, well I'd love to, but firstly I'm a bit of a 'Grouse' man myself. And secondly, if the boss caught at happy hour instead of on call he would go bananas
I don't think he would appreciate me climbing into my flying machine under the 'afluence of incahol', hic!I genuingly hope that RIAT happens, and raises millions for RAFBF and RAFA. Times are hard for the old boys, and we must do all we can to help them, just like they have helped us.
Keep smiling
The Swinging Monkey
'Caruthers, put the kettle on old boy, theres a good chap!'
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Well said ol' bean - but we'll have to agrere to disagree.
As I said earlier, at least the French and Russian's would be at RIAT - even if the Brits and Yanks are away!!
Cheers
As I said earlier, at least the French and Russian's would be at RIAT - even if the Brits and Yanks are away!!
Cheers
Last edited by AlanM; 7th Mar 2003 at 19:31.
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I was with the ATC at RIAT 2002.
1. I seem to remember that we had to pay for the cap.
2. Only those guarding the flight line (not me) had a free airshow. The rest of us were busy doing tasks such as selling yearbooks and assembling the lunches for everyone.
3. Who do you think had to do a FOD plod to stop you aircrew getting a cheese sandwich down your air intake.
Surely a shirt (which probably costs 50p each) is worth the savings made. If you wanted I am sure we could charge £4.65 an hour for each of the cadets over the period they stay.
P.S. If you are the member of the B1 in the static display who told a group of cadets they could have a look round at 5pm, you should be ashamed for not being there when we returned. You are lucky i can't see your registration in the photo i have
1. I seem to remember that we had to pay for the cap.
2. Only those guarding the flight line (not me) had a free airshow. The rest of us were busy doing tasks such as selling yearbooks and assembling the lunches for everyone.
3. Who do you think had to do a FOD plod to stop you aircrew getting a cheese sandwich down your air intake.
Surely a shirt (which probably costs 50p each) is worth the savings made. If you wanted I am sure we could charge £4.65 an hour for each of the cadets over the period they stay.
P.S. If you are the member of the B1 in the static display who told a group of cadets they could have a look round at 5pm, you should be ashamed for not being there when we returned. You are lucky i can't see your registration in the photo i have
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Theundisputedtopgun…. Ha ha ha!!!
Oh dear! Sorry, no offence meant by this post old boy, but who do you think you are!!!!….. “You are lucky i can't see your registration in the photo i have”. Oh ye, and what good do you think it would do if you could see the registration? Don’t tell me, you’d write the boss of the squadron and have them make a written apology to you because they weren’t there at 5pm to show you around their jet. Sorry, but maybe they had more important things to be doing…. There’s a lot of beer that has to be drunk at these shows!
You make it sound like it’s a real chore having to help out as an air cadet at airshows. Remember, you’re in a military forum here… Most of us have been there and done that before. Your help is most defiantly appreciated, don’t get me wrong, but remember, it’s something that you volunteer for, and you DO get to see a lot of the show. I don’t believe that you were serving food from 8am to 6pm for two days solid. As for that T-shirt, well, first, I’m sure they cost more than 50p, and even if they are 50p, 2000 cadets at a show, that £1000 that COULD have gone to the benevolent fund… After all, I’m sure all the cadets would have helped out even if there was no T-shirt!
Oh dear! Sorry, no offence meant by this post old boy, but who do you think you are!!!!….. “You are lucky i can't see your registration in the photo i have”. Oh ye, and what good do you think it would do if you could see the registration? Don’t tell me, you’d write the boss of the squadron and have them make a written apology to you because they weren’t there at 5pm to show you around their jet. Sorry, but maybe they had more important things to be doing…. There’s a lot of beer that has to be drunk at these shows!
You make it sound like it’s a real chore having to help out as an air cadet at airshows. Remember, you’re in a military forum here… Most of us have been there and done that before. Your help is most defiantly appreciated, don’t get me wrong, but remember, it’s something that you volunteer for, and you DO get to see a lot of the show. I don’t believe that you were serving food from 8am to 6pm for two days solid. As for that T-shirt, well, first, I’m sure they cost more than 50p, and even if they are 50p, 2000 cadets at a show, that £1000 that COULD have gone to the benevolent fund… After all, I’m sure all the cadets would have helped out even if there was no T-shirt!
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Grob Driver
The point i was highlighting was that the cadets are put to work which probably saves the organisers a lot of money. Prehaps you can provide a quote for the contracting of people to do what we did and then see how much the RAFBF will get.
Naturally i was pi**ed off about the B1.
The point i was highlighting was that the cadets are put to work which probably saves the organisers a lot of money. Prehaps you can provide a quote for the contracting of people to do what we did and then see how much the RAFBF will get.
Naturally i was pi**ed off about the B1.