Riat 2003
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theuneducatedtopgun
I think that you will find that most ATC Sqn's/Wings get a small donation also. I started sticking up for the good work of cadets, but you are a poor ambassador my frind.
Still, as you rightly intimate, the RAF and RIAT is there to support you! (sorry - got my wires crossed......)
Grow up - I got to sit in the B1 and B2 a few years ago! I took a chick with me - great bargaining tool (The Saudi's were gonna swap her for a camel!!)
tee heee
I think that you will find that most ATC Sqn's/Wings get a small donation also. I started sticking up for the good work of cadets, but you are a poor ambassador my frind.
Still, as you rightly intimate, the RAF and RIAT is there to support you! (sorry - got my wires crossed......)
Grow up - I got to sit in the B1 and B2 a few years ago! I took a chick with me - great bargaining tool (The Saudi's were gonna swap her for a camel!!)
tee heee
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Theundisputedtopgun…
I’m not denying that the ATC cadets aren’t good value for money… Of course they are…. That’s why they use you! Sorry, I’m no personnel manager so I can’t give you a quote! But what’s your point? Everyone agrees with you. Mr Monkey says you do a great job, I say you do a great job and AlanM says you do a great job. All the swinging monkey was saying was that you don’t need the lavish ‘freebies’ that you get at RIAT…. I think that’s a fair point. It’s about raising money for RAFBF.
The reason I picked you up for your message was the way you came over all high and mighty because the crew of a B1 didn’t hang about to show you around their aircraft… And the comment about being a good job that you don’t have serial number…. As the good AlanM says…. GROW UP!!! – It’s a big boys forums!!!
I’m not denying that the ATC cadets aren’t good value for money… Of course they are…. That’s why they use you! Sorry, I’m no personnel manager so I can’t give you a quote! But what’s your point? Everyone agrees with you. Mr Monkey says you do a great job, I say you do a great job and AlanM says you do a great job. All the swinging monkey was saying was that you don’t need the lavish ‘freebies’ that you get at RIAT…. I think that’s a fair point. It’s about raising money for RAFBF.
The reason I picked you up for your message was the way you came over all high and mighty because the crew of a B1 didn’t hang about to show you around their aircraft… And the comment about being a good job that you don’t have serial number…. As the good AlanM says…. GROW UP!!! – It’s a big boys forums!!!
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AlanM
If Monkey can't accept your kind offer of a beer on the Sunday
night then keep one back for me. I WILL be there and you
probably owe me one anyway after all these years.
Got you thinking now!
P.S The cadets do a great job but wrong attitude from their
rep on this thread.
See you all in July.
If Monkey can't accept your kind offer of a beer on the Sunday
night then keep one back for me. I WILL be there and you
probably owe me one anyway after all these years.
Got you thinking now!
P.S The cadets do a great job but wrong attitude from their
rep on this thread.
See you all in July.
Whoever that B1 crew was breached a code of honour if they acted deliberately. If you promise to do something, you do it. If you make a promise which you've no intention of keeping, you are a liar.....
Back to the plot. I've enjoyed RIAT hospitality in the past and it was indeed excellent. But I agree that it seems now to be just too big. I arrived at the appointed hour, met hosts, did lunch, watched the show - but had very little time to look around the static display more than very briefly. I preferred Fairford to Cottesmore- but that was pre-2002. Didn't go last year even though I had a freebie ticket from Breitling - the tales about remote car parking and security searches put me off totally.
Best of luck - and many thanks to all those hard-working volunteers who help out so willingly. Personally I'd sooner go to Kemble to watch the displays being held there. Caught a programme on Discovery Wings with JN chatting up Dave Roome at the big 50th anniversary of the Hunter do - excellent! The 15-ship Delta flypast was proably something that'll never be seen again; wish I'd been able to go but the 'day job' prevented it!
Back to the plot. I've enjoyed RIAT hospitality in the past and it was indeed excellent. But I agree that it seems now to be just too big. I arrived at the appointed hour, met hosts, did lunch, watched the show - but had very little time to look around the static display more than very briefly. I preferred Fairford to Cottesmore- but that was pre-2002. Didn't go last year even though I had a freebie ticket from Breitling - the tales about remote car parking and security searches put me off totally.
Best of luck - and many thanks to all those hard-working volunteers who help out so willingly. Personally I'd sooner go to Kemble to watch the displays being held there. Caught a programme on Discovery Wings with JN chatting up Dave Roome at the big 50th anniversary of the Hunter do - excellent! The 15-ship Delta flypast was proably something that'll never be seen again; wish I'd been able to go but the 'day job' prevented it!
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Swinging Monkey.
Lavish Freebies, dont make me laugh, Those kids, yes they are kids, do a dam good job, most of them spend the weekend in tents, while most of the aircrew are in hotels, and getting paid.
Those kids will put most aircrews to shame, you never see them throwing there dumies out of there cockpits because of the sleeping accomadation or the food that is supplied. And you moan about them getting a free hat or t, shirt. They dont get it free they work for it.
Who do you think clears all the FOD up before departure day, From very early in the morning till late at night they work like trojans. And they are the future, in ten or fifteen years time they may need the help of the RAFBFM and they have helped to make Riat what it is today.
Leave the kids alone.
I thankyou. Ps you any relation to Hangus the monkey.
Lavish Freebies, dont make me laugh, Those kids, yes they are kids, do a dam good job, most of them spend the weekend in tents, while most of the aircrew are in hotels, and getting paid.
Those kids will put most aircrews to shame, you never see them throwing there dumies out of there cockpits because of the sleeping accomadation or the food that is supplied. And you moan about them getting a free hat or t, shirt. They dont get it free they work for it.
Who do you think clears all the FOD up before departure day, From very early in the morning till late at night they work like trojans. And they are the future, in ten or fifteen years time they may need the help of the RAFBFM and they have helped to make Riat what it is today.
Leave the kids alone.
I thankyou. Ps you any relation to Hangus the monkey.
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Ye monkey man… leave the kids alone!
Trout… what are you talking about. The ATC aren’t the only ones to be out at airshows doing FOD plods. I’ve seen the swinging monkey there too, swinging along picking up rubbish… I’ve been there myself too. Ye, the ATC take part, but they’re not the only ones. Yes, they ‘work’ for their hats and T-shirts but we were talking about money raised for RAFBF, and that should always be the number one thing on RIAT’s mind… Not giving away freebies, but raising money.
It’s obvious from your post that you’ve never done any display flying… You cant put aircrew in a tent for a weekend, feed them packed lunch, and then expect them to fly display routines… That would be a flight safety nightmare.
Cheers
Grob Driver
Trout… what are you talking about. The ATC aren’t the only ones to be out at airshows doing FOD plods. I’ve seen the swinging monkey there too, swinging along picking up rubbish… I’ve been there myself too. Ye, the ATC take part, but they’re not the only ones. Yes, they ‘work’ for their hats and T-shirts but we were talking about money raised for RAFBF, and that should always be the number one thing on RIAT’s mind… Not giving away freebies, but raising money.
It’s obvious from your post that you’ve never done any display flying… You cant put aircrew in a tent for a weekend, feed them packed lunch, and then expect them to fly display routines… That would be a flight safety nightmare.
Cheers
Grob Driver
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Gentlemen,
Well this has stirred a hornets nest hasn't it? sorry for being late to reply - busy weekend with the gales etc. (at work that is topgun, and for not a cent extra pay!)
Trout, 'me old trout
I regret to say it, but you have completely lost the plot
Never ever, in any of my postings, have I questioned the value of the ATC at major airshows such as RIAT. Indeed, if you had taken the time to read my earlier comments, you will have seen that I have nothing but praise for them. I simply made the comment about the amount of money 'given' to cadets in light of the impending financial crisis facing RAFA, together with the RAFBF's constant need for money.
Patently you know nothing about the RAFA situation, otherwise I am sure you would take a much more adult view of my comments.
As for your remarks about aircrew, dummies blah, well now you have really lost it, big mistake on the credability stakes there trout. I don't have the time or the inclination to enter into childish banter with you like that.
It is obvious you are not aircrew (so what are you doing on this forum anyway??) and if you had half a brain cell of understanding about flying, you will know that we all do our own fod plod before leaving somewhere like RIAT - our lives depend upon it. As for being paid, well I'm confused by you now. Let me in to a secret - I get paid every day of the year, whether I fly or not, whether it's a weekend, daytime or night time. The big issue for current front line aircrew like myself, is that we don't get that many weekends free to spend with our families. So I take great exception to your ill-informed coments about being 'paid' for the weekend. I don't get a penny more, and nor do I get a couple of days off 'in lieu' You are sadly very wrong. Now who's the dummy?
theundisputedtopgun (what a fantastic name!)
the same really goes for you also my dear chap, please read my comments. You will see that there is no complaints or otherwise about ATC cadets, on the contrary.
Finally your comments about the B-1 crew just sum you up perfectly, a very, very sad muppet! - go try and get a life!
Finally, AlanM
I too got to sit in the B-1 - what a machine. The trouble was, there was this camel in the co-pilots seat making eyes at me!!!
Love to all
The Swinging Monkey
'Cauthers, do you think I should change my name to something sily such as:
theundisputedswingingtopgunmonkeylifesavingaceofthebaseman?
Well this has stirred a hornets nest hasn't it? sorry for being late to reply - busy weekend with the gales etc. (at work that is topgun, and for not a cent extra pay!)
Trout, 'me old trout
I regret to say it, but you have completely lost the plot
Never ever, in any of my postings, have I questioned the value of the ATC at major airshows such as RIAT. Indeed, if you had taken the time to read my earlier comments, you will have seen that I have nothing but praise for them. I simply made the comment about the amount of money 'given' to cadets in light of the impending financial crisis facing RAFA, together with the RAFBF's constant need for money.
Patently you know nothing about the RAFA situation, otherwise I am sure you would take a much more adult view of my comments.
As for your remarks about aircrew, dummies blah, well now you have really lost it, big mistake on the credability stakes there trout. I don't have the time or the inclination to enter into childish banter with you like that.
It is obvious you are not aircrew (so what are you doing on this forum anyway??) and if you had half a brain cell of understanding about flying, you will know that we all do our own fod plod before leaving somewhere like RIAT - our lives depend upon it. As for being paid, well I'm confused by you now. Let me in to a secret - I get paid every day of the year, whether I fly or not, whether it's a weekend, daytime or night time. The big issue for current front line aircrew like myself, is that we don't get that many weekends free to spend with our families. So I take great exception to your ill-informed coments about being 'paid' for the weekend. I don't get a penny more, and nor do I get a couple of days off 'in lieu' You are sadly very wrong. Now who's the dummy?
theundisputedtopgun (what a fantastic name!)
the same really goes for you also my dear chap, please read my comments. You will see that there is no complaints or otherwise about ATC cadets, on the contrary.
Finally your comments about the B-1 crew just sum you up perfectly, a very, very sad muppet! - go try and get a life!
Finally, AlanM
I too got to sit in the B-1 - what a machine. The trouble was, there was this camel in the co-pilots seat making eyes at me!!!
Love to all
The Swinging Monkey
'Cauthers, do you think I should change my name to something sily such as:
theundisputedswingingtopgunmonkeylifesavingaceofthebaseman?
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I agree that perhaps RIAT has become too big, truly a victim of its own success. My unit was volunteered for duty there back in 99 and we got to see the show everyday, as that was part of the job, so I guess we were lucky. There are a number of Qx regarding RAFBF funding from RIAT and I've heard various rumours but don't feel it appropriate to opine further unless others know better and could tell more. I think many people, not just the Air Cadets, tend to be used as a free labour force but again, they perhaps do get some payment in kind. I also agree that some other displays are more interesting, for me the Duxford Flying Legends Air show beats all, perhaps I'm getting too old.
We could have a good airshow out here at the moment but its a bit sandy!
PS. Talking of B1s, it might be possible to sit in the cab of No 1306, based quite close to Wittering. However 1306 is a Thompson B1 4-6-0 built in 1948 for the LNER and lovely she looks in her apple green livery! Hmmm, must be the sun, sand and lack of beer!!!
We could have a good airshow out here at the moment but its a bit sandy!
PS. Talking of B1s, it might be possible to sit in the cab of No 1306, based quite close to Wittering. However 1306 is a Thompson B1 4-6-0 built in 1948 for the LNER and lovely she looks in her apple green livery! Hmmm, must be the sun, sand and lack of beer!!!
Last edited by Toddington Ted; 10th Mar 2003 at 07:55.
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Mmmm........should I start by guessing at the top as there are many people who do ME A great favour during busy and (should be) sleeping times?? How can I guess without giving a name away!
If PL mail me direct - click on WWW here on this post and then CONTACT from one of the pics!! If not - still mail me!!!
Alan
P.S> I thought that the tooth fairy delivered the aircraft. When i started drinkning they were there, when I sobered up they had gone!! Oddly happens every year!!
If PL mail me direct - click on WWW here on this post and then CONTACT from one of the pics!! If not - still mail me!!!
Alan
P.S> I thought that the tooth fairy delivered the aircraft. When i started drinkning they were there, when I sobered up they had gone!! Oddly happens every year!!
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theundisputedswingingtopgunmonkeylifesavingaceofthebase.... I like the new name! It's a bit more complicated than, the swinging monkey, but I can see your point!
I sat in the B1 too..... Thats one hell of a machine!
No camel though... The pilot said she's gone off with some monkey... I'd hate to see the end result of that romance.... A camel that scratched it's arse while swinging from the trees!!!
I sat in the B1 too..... Thats one hell of a machine!
No camel though... The pilot said she's gone off with some monkey... I'd hate to see the end result of that romance.... A camel that scratched it's arse while swinging from the trees!!!
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theundisputedtopgun
If it was a sunday I have no defence to offer, but if the offer of a look around was made on the Sat, then it was probably partly my fault they weren't there. I work in Aircrew Reception, and we run a very tight schedule on the aircrew buses to get the crews back to their hotels. It is entirely probable that the crew had no idea what time the bus was going back (we don't know ourselves until mid-morning, and the crews pitch up at oh-dark-thirty-hours oclock). We tell them to send a crew member back to check. They may well have had every intention of doing the tour, then been chased back to Reception by my happy band of chasers to ensure they got the bus. Sorry, that's just the way it is.
BTW, does anybody else remember the "flying spotter" display caused by the B1 at Cottesmore. My favourite R/T quote was "My God, he's been blown into Norfolk", or something like that. My apologies if any of you were involved, but we were ROFLMAO.
If it was a sunday I have no defence to offer, but if the offer of a look around was made on the Sat, then it was probably partly my fault they weren't there. I work in Aircrew Reception, and we run a very tight schedule on the aircrew buses to get the crews back to their hotels. It is entirely probable that the crew had no idea what time the bus was going back (we don't know ourselves until mid-morning, and the crews pitch up at oh-dark-thirty-hours oclock). We tell them to send a crew member back to check. They may well have had every intention of doing the tour, then been chased back to Reception by my happy band of chasers to ensure they got the bus. Sorry, that's just the way it is.
BTW, does anybody else remember the "flying spotter" display caused by the B1 at Cottesmore. My favourite R/T quote was "My God, he's been blown into Norfolk", or something like that. My apologies if any of you were involved, but we were ROFLMAO.
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SpotterFC, I think you might remember myself and one other (big-footed) gent from Scotland's Finest. I remember "something" about those radio calls in 2001. Fun had by all. And, if I hear correctly, you are changing jobs this year?
I'm sure I'll see you there
I'm sure I'll see you there
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Guys,
I think everyone is geting a bit hot under the collar and missing the point here. Yes I am not military and I'm not aircrew so I recognise that I am a 'guest' in this forum and hope in the main that my comments and actions reflect this.
For two weeks in July however though, I get the chance to do my bit and help repay some of the debt I owe to both the RAF and the RAFBF thanks to the skills I can offer.
Yes its very hard work, yes its frustrating and yes it does mean I have to beg, borrow and take annual leave to be there, but it allows me for two weeks to be part of something that I only wish I could do full time.
All I can say though is that this alone and the hangar party on the Sunday night make it all worthwhile!
So please dont knock the ATC, the volunteers or begrudge them a hat (it was the only freebie I got!) for seven + days of hard work. Put it this way, the 'day job' couldn't afford the level of commitment, effort and work that 90% of all volunteers willingly give and the problems they put up with.
I'm already counting the days until July - I must be mad!
'BLW'
p.s. I'm turning down an opportunity to go wave soaring in Finland for the RAF this year!
I think everyone is geting a bit hot under the collar and missing the point here. Yes I am not military and I'm not aircrew so I recognise that I am a 'guest' in this forum and hope in the main that my comments and actions reflect this.
For two weeks in July however though, I get the chance to do my bit and help repay some of the debt I owe to both the RAF and the RAFBF thanks to the skills I can offer.
Yes its very hard work, yes its frustrating and yes it does mean I have to beg, borrow and take annual leave to be there, but it allows me for two weeks to be part of something that I only wish I could do full time.
All I can say though is that this alone and the hangar party on the Sunday night make it all worthwhile!
So please dont knock the ATC, the volunteers or begrudge them a hat (it was the only freebie I got!) for seven + days of hard work. Put it this way, the 'day job' couldn't afford the level of commitment, effort and work that 90% of all volunteers willingly give and the problems they put up with.
I'm already counting the days until July - I must be mad!
'BLW'
p.s. I'm turning down an opportunity to go wave soaring in Finland for the RAF this year!
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The B1 Crew
SpotterFC
On the sunday of course wouldn't crews be starting to think
about the hangar bash and getting there earlier rather than
later!!!! Just one of many reasons why they didn't appear as
promised.
What job have you got this year then and how could it possibly
be better than Aircrew Reception????
AlanM
Did you get my message and are the beers on?
On the sunday of course wouldn't crews be starting to think
about the hangar bash and getting there earlier rather than
later!!!! Just one of many reasons why they didn't appear as
promised.
What job have you got this year then and how could it possibly
be better than Aircrew Reception????
AlanM
Did you get my message and are the beers on?
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I sincerely believe that RIAT has become too big, and too full of it's own self importance. Bigger is not neccesarily better, or even best. Sure, host your major sponsors and repay them for their coffers, but how can a Director of RIAT (allegedly) fly to 'liaison' meetings in the US and elsewhere, FirstClass (both ways,) and use the money from the Benevolent Fund to pay for it?
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FarEastMan
Still in ACR, just a different job (more stress, less time off, no more pay - just like my move into training at work!) if I can get the time off. Summer bad time for various reasons this year.
I said I had no excuse for Sunday - oh ok I lied - we actually have to chase people back to the party. We can't go until we've shut down all the tail gate parties on the C130 line!
Spacer - See you there
Still in ACR, just a different job (more stress, less time off, no more pay - just like my move into training at work!) if I can get the time off. Summer bad time for various reasons this year.
I said I had no excuse for Sunday - oh ok I lied - we actually have to chase people back to the party. We can't go until we've shut down all the tail gate parties on the C130 line!
Spacer - See you there