Is war likely with Iran? Consequences for EK?
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This thread have elements of brownshirt propaganda.
These posted vidoeclips regarding muslims in Europe are typical propaganda that made the brownshirts get elected into our parlaments in Europe.
In the 30īs there was a economic crisis, rampant unemployment and the brownshirts were elected in to parlament....
If this continues we will have the Star of David replaced by the Crescent on the garments of the above mentioned.
Please continue the discussion about the implications of a conflict in the Gulf with regards to EK and the other carriers.
These posted vidoeclips regarding muslims in Europe are typical propaganda that made the brownshirts get elected into our parlaments in Europe.
In the 30īs there was a economic crisis, rampant unemployment and the brownshirts were elected in to parlament....
If this continues we will have the Star of David replaced by the Crescent on the garments of the above mentioned.
Please continue the discussion about the implications of a conflict in the Gulf with regards to EK and the other carriers.
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Don't quite understand your statement
AH727
Please clarify.
If this continues we will have the Star of David replaced by the Crescent on the garments of the above mentioned.
Please clarify.
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AH727,
it's a free world (for the time being) so , with your permission, I would like to post and talk about the issues that I deem to be useful to be debated.
Even if your politically correct ears don't like to listen nor watch I am afraid you will have to accept not only the muslims' view but mine as well.
It's the very core of our democracies and since you seem to be a fellow European citizen of mine and we are politically/socially and economically linked I also feel I still have the right to express my views without being labeled as a xenophobe or a fascist (which of course I am not) just because lately it's in fashion to silence anyone who raises his head above western politically correctness by simply calling him a neo-nazi.
You seem to be living in Sweden, so here are some more videos you surely won't like and possibly label as lies or neo-azi/pro-zionist (you can throw that into any subject nowadays) propaganda but since we are all pilots and spend lots of time overnighting I am sure many of us will have the chance to see for themselves next time they check in in a hotel in ARN/GOT/MMX...
By the way this is just food for thought for those politically correct and by no means I am trying to label the whole of Sweden nor every muslim in any way but I am convinced this is a growing issue that will have to be faced because it bears lots of socially dangerous potential.
And denying it is the biggest danger, just like with what goes on in the so called arab spring.
it's a free world (for the time being) so , with your permission, I would like to post and talk about the issues that I deem to be useful to be debated.
Even if your politically correct ears don't like to listen nor watch I am afraid you will have to accept not only the muslims' view but mine as well.
It's the very core of our democracies and since you seem to be a fellow European citizen of mine and we are politically/socially and economically linked I also feel I still have the right to express my views without being labeled as a xenophobe or a fascist (which of course I am not) just because lately it's in fashion to silence anyone who raises his head above western politically correctness by simply calling him a neo-nazi.
You seem to be living in Sweden, so here are some more videos you surely won't like and possibly label as lies or neo-azi/pro-zionist (you can throw that into any subject nowadays) propaganda but since we are all pilots and spend lots of time overnighting I am sure many of us will have the chance to see for themselves next time they check in in a hotel in ARN/GOT/MMX...
By the way this is just food for thought for those politically correct and by no means I am trying to label the whole of Sweden nor every muslim in any way but I am convinced this is a growing issue that will have to be faced because it bears lots of socially dangerous potential.
And denying it is the biggest danger, just like with what goes on in the so called arab spring.
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Thanks AH727
Bulls eye
The Zionist are the problem to all the conflicts in the planet
They are bleeding the Us and the poor American tax payer are just watching and bracing for the next economical recession .
In the meantime they are getting military aid to kill any one who is resisting their project look how they manage to manipulate the American public opinion by taking control of all the media, Tv , newspaper , wall street, banks , and the judicial system in the USA .
Where the average American is left like an idiot completely ignorant not informed having no clue what is going on in the rest of the world.
After having manipulated and infiltrated at every level all the political arena in America and the contribution of the AIPAC they manage to trigger all this war by proxy and lies while sitting in occupied land killing children .
In the name of friendship with USA how selly is that
Bulls eye
The Zionist are the problem to all the conflicts in the planet
They are bleeding the Us and the poor American tax payer are just watching and bracing for the next economical recession .
In the meantime they are getting military aid to kill any one who is resisting their project look how they manage to manipulate the American public opinion by taking control of all the media, Tv , newspaper , wall street, banks , and the judicial system in the USA .
Where the average American is left like an idiot completely ignorant not informed having no clue what is going on in the rest of the world.
After having manipulated and infiltrated at every level all the political arena in America and the contribution of the AIPAC they manage to trigger all this war by proxy and lies while sitting in occupied land killing children .
In the name of friendship with USA how selly is that
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@sitty:
"People have to stand up for what is right, even if it means being pepper-sprayed as an 80 year old grandmother."
@ maybepilot:
So what happened 70 years ago justifies whats happening today ?
Europeans kill jews and Palestinians had to pay the price ?
Where's the justice in that ?
"People have to stand up for what is right, even if it means being pepper-sprayed as an 80 year old grandmother."
@ maybepilot:
So what happened 70 years ago justifies whats happening today ?
Europeans kill jews and Palestinians had to pay the price ?
Where's the justice in that ?
Last edited by SCATANA; 12th Mar 2012 at 14:49.
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Argument, and counter argument, the circle is never ending, both in terms of the rhetoric and the violence, and yet none of the key points relating to the issues of the Middle East have even been discussed. The simple reason is because its actually far more complicated and has far more scope than we can hope to discuss.
Certainly if you do a little bit of digging, you will find the many of the neighbouring states to Israel are complicit in the confinement/arming/goading of the Palestinians, and yet in public they declare in one loud voice they support a two state solution.
The Palestinians for their part have as has been stated "never fail to miss an opportunity", Arafat had his chance but then why have peace when conflict is sooo much more profitable? Hamas for their part think exactly the same way, all they need to do is continue the "resistance" to recieve a good chunk of support from Damascus, Tehran and North London, all the while poisoning the minds of 4 year old "maytrs" with suicide dolls and anti-semitic kids TV shows. Its good business with a ready supply of young maleable talent for the future.
Israel for the most part is more sanguine, if not a bit divided, but then again for the IDF and Elbit, its good business, export orders flow in for new weapon sytems, and as long as the Jewish Lobby in the US shout louder, things will continue in the usual fashion.
Uncle Sam for its part has bled a lot of blood and treasure, and yet STILL fails to understand that this will never be a battle for right or wrong, appeasement or determination, it is in fact merely a reflection of its own deeply flawed foreign policy.
The way forward is anyones guess, war with Iran is a possibility, but a remote one IMHO simply because the Iranians don't want war, they want to play brinkmanship, and they are far more astute than Sadam ever was.
Israel is the wild card of course, but again they will lose plenty of tacit support from other gulf states if they act unilaterally, of course the current Israeli government is particularly beligerant so could just as well cut of its nose to spite itself.
Whatever the outcome, there is fault on all sides, uncle Sam is certainly not the value driven country it once was (in the 40's-early 50's) as it has become a haven for corporate corruption and special interests. Iran for its part is playing a dangerous game, a game it won't win in its present form, as usual however it will be the innocent Mr and Mrs average on the street who will suffer, just as their counterpart lower socio-economic groups in the US and UK do today as they make up the greatest percentage of boots on the ground in the various regional on-going military misadventures.
Certainly if you do a little bit of digging, you will find the many of the neighbouring states to Israel are complicit in the confinement/arming/goading of the Palestinians, and yet in public they declare in one loud voice they support a two state solution.
The Palestinians for their part have as has been stated "never fail to miss an opportunity", Arafat had his chance but then why have peace when conflict is sooo much more profitable? Hamas for their part think exactly the same way, all they need to do is continue the "resistance" to recieve a good chunk of support from Damascus, Tehran and North London, all the while poisoning the minds of 4 year old "maytrs" with suicide dolls and anti-semitic kids TV shows. Its good business with a ready supply of young maleable talent for the future.
Israel for the most part is more sanguine, if not a bit divided, but then again for the IDF and Elbit, its good business, export orders flow in for new weapon sytems, and as long as the Jewish Lobby in the US shout louder, things will continue in the usual fashion.
Uncle Sam for its part has bled a lot of blood and treasure, and yet STILL fails to understand that this will never be a battle for right or wrong, appeasement or determination, it is in fact merely a reflection of its own deeply flawed foreign policy.
The way forward is anyones guess, war with Iran is a possibility, but a remote one IMHO simply because the Iranians don't want war, they want to play brinkmanship, and they are far more astute than Sadam ever was.
Israel is the wild card of course, but again they will lose plenty of tacit support from other gulf states if they act unilaterally, of course the current Israeli government is particularly beligerant so could just as well cut of its nose to spite itself.
Whatever the outcome, there is fault on all sides, uncle Sam is certainly not the value driven country it once was (in the 40's-early 50's) as it has become a haven for corporate corruption and special interests. Iran for its part is playing a dangerous game, a game it won't win in its present form, as usual however it will be the innocent Mr and Mrs average on the street who will suffer, just as their counterpart lower socio-economic groups in the US and UK do today as they make up the greatest percentage of boots on the ground in the various regional on-going military misadventures.
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Scatana,
If you read Hamas' statute (do a little serch) you will find out that it's their official goal to "liberate" a country that does not exist from what they call the Zionist invader and that should be achieved by jihad .
Now if you read the main kampf you'll find many analogies between the two documents.
To me that says it all about the intentions of the democratically elected leadership that the Palestinians have chosen, then if you look at what have the Iranians or the Lebanese chosen there is very little these people can teach the Americans in the case of GWB.....
Why don't we talk about the other lobbies as well then? Like the Muslim brotherhood who are democratically winning elections, instating theocracies across the Arab world, ethnically cleansing their terrotories from the infidels, funding the Islamization of he western world through so called islamic cultural centers and the building of mosques and minarets all over the European continent?
Oh I forgot these things can't be debated just like we cannot freely draw cartoons anymore......
If you read Hamas' statute (do a little serch) you will find out that it's their official goal to "liberate" a country that does not exist from what they call the Zionist invader and that should be achieved by jihad .
Now if you read the main kampf you'll find many analogies between the two documents.
To me that says it all about the intentions of the democratically elected leadership that the Palestinians have chosen, then if you look at what have the Iranians or the Lebanese chosen there is very little these people can teach the Americans in the case of GWB.....
Why don't we talk about the other lobbies as well then? Like the Muslim brotherhood who are democratically winning elections, instating theocracies across the Arab world, ethnically cleansing their terrotories from the infidels, funding the Islamization of he western world through so called islamic cultural centers and the building of mosques and minarets all over the European continent?
Oh I forgot these things can't be debated just like we cannot freely draw cartoons anymore......
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THR MCT... It's time for you to step away from the keyboard and take a reality check on life.
Israel does not promote women and children to strap bombs to their bodies and take out other innocent women and children.
That has to be one of the most uncivilized depraved indifference to human life there can be
.
You can beat your chest until the cows, chickens, camels or whatever comes home... this is just plain evil!
Israel does not promote women and children to strap bombs to their bodies and take out other innocent women and children.
That has to be one of the most uncivilized depraved indifference to human life there can be
.You can beat your chest until the cows, chickens, camels or whatever comes home... this is just plain evil!
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in the simplest form
Without any quotes or stories from Wikipedia, swaying political replies, posted videos, or other visual aids, let me say this in the simplest form.
If the US presence is ONLY oil driven, why aren't we loaded to the hilt in Venezuela ?
Someone commented " Of course that's the inconvenient truth....and who is paying for it...the American taxpayer ...next time you guys take care of it on your own.....after all you have it figured out. Now go check your iPhones and date check me, wearing your Raybans & your American Eagle shirts while your sitting in Starbucks before you head off to grab a cheeseburger on the way to the movies...
nobody in the US queuing at this regions embassies for a better life...care to checkout the line at the US embassies around the world "
Exactly my point. I'm sick to death of my tax dollars offering humanitarian efforts to those thousands of miles away when right in our own " back yard" we have homeless and hungry children and war vets. That is just plain wrong.
Our US govt is very corrupt and yes, big corporation run by lobbyist. No American doubts that now. Yes, the baby boomers were raised and educated to be manipulated that the US is the strongest, best, most diplomatic safe country in the world. However, we're no longer nieve. We are fully aware that war sustains the economy and it would be hypocritical for me to disagree given the fact that due to it, my husband and I are living in the ME where his career is dependent on it now as a freight pilot. Yes we can all stand up and protest yet, if we don't pay taxes, we're jailed. If we don't vote, we shouldn't have a say, If we are politically incorrect, we get sued in civil court. The political correctness is now causing our schools to stop correcting kids when their bad, stopped allowing God to be in our schools, stopping free speech, preventing parents from spanking their children. We haven't lost sight of what is right and wrong, we're just not allowed to practice it. Gangs are running the cities. I'll never forget my 1st gang related shooting. Having to ask a gang leader permission to expose and examine my patient because cutting a gang members clothing is an insult to their "colors"
Someone also stated that commenting might result in being labeled " un patriotic". I'll take that any day versus the alternative in other countries for speaking out or protesting the government. But I am certain that too will change later down the road.
If only I could convince my now adult children to leave the US and quit giving 50% of their incomes to a government who doesn't help the very people that they are supposed to support.
Not only are our tax dollars going halfway around the globe, they are going right into the pockets of illegal aliens who are swimming right past our borders.
Hubby said we're going to move into Mexico, obtain citizenship there, then swim back into the US where we will receive free housing, free health care, food stamps, and settle in California where our youngest who is in law school can finish school for free
In regards to Gaza... if you want the facts on what is really going on there, talk to the only 2 doctors who have been allowed in there to work. Dr's Mads Gilbert and Erik Fossee. I met both of these doctors at the Trauma Management Conference in Al Ain 3 years back and as a Paramedic whos worked in EMS and FEMA disaster response, I was literally sick to my stomach to learn what is really going on, see pictures of the victims, see pictures of the hospital they were working out of that was bullet and bomb ridden. Isreal said that they hit 90% of their target in Gaza. Do they fail to mention that those targets were schools and hospitals ? They are using taxi's to transport patients because the ambulances are targets. I've never wanted to go work somewhere as badly as Gaza and offered to. But sadly, I was reminded that as an American female, I would be dead within a week. I saw pictures of the injured that showed proof the injuries were from DIME bombs. They are not legal to use and of course Israel denied using them. Gaza has the offense strike nothing bigger than a bottle rocket. Pathetic that they are as defenseless as they are and yet Israel keeps hitting them hard. For what is Gaza's fight? to try and gain back the land that was theirs to begin with? If you want to learn the truth on Gaza, Gaza Volunteer Doctor Tours North America | Community Affairs | Islamic Insights
start there. During the conference, speakers were limited to 15 or 20 minute intervals. When Dr Gilbert got up and spoke, his time was running into 30 min. He apologized and without a dry eye in the building, we stood in ovation requesting he continue. If only the truth were really out there. But the lobbying Zionist don't allow it. In my 12 years of working with medical professionals both domestic and international and working natural disasters, I've never met anyone with so much compassion, caring and TRUTH.
If the US presence is ONLY oil driven, why aren't we loaded to the hilt in Venezuela ?
Someone commented " Of course that's the inconvenient truth....and who is paying for it...the American taxpayer ...next time you guys take care of it on your own.....after all you have it figured out. Now go check your iPhones and date check me, wearing your Raybans & your American Eagle shirts while your sitting in Starbucks before you head off to grab a cheeseburger on the way to the movies...
nobody in the US queuing at this regions embassies for a better life...care to checkout the line at the US embassies around the world "
Exactly my point. I'm sick to death of my tax dollars offering humanitarian efforts to those thousands of miles away when right in our own " back yard" we have homeless and hungry children and war vets. That is just plain wrong.
Our US govt is very corrupt and yes, big corporation run by lobbyist. No American doubts that now. Yes, the baby boomers were raised and educated to be manipulated that the US is the strongest, best, most diplomatic safe country in the world. However, we're no longer nieve. We are fully aware that war sustains the economy and it would be hypocritical for me to disagree given the fact that due to it, my husband and I are living in the ME where his career is dependent on it now as a freight pilot. Yes we can all stand up and protest yet, if we don't pay taxes, we're jailed. If we don't vote, we shouldn't have a say, If we are politically incorrect, we get sued in civil court. The political correctness is now causing our schools to stop correcting kids when their bad, stopped allowing God to be in our schools, stopping free speech, preventing parents from spanking their children. We haven't lost sight of what is right and wrong, we're just not allowed to practice it. Gangs are running the cities. I'll never forget my 1st gang related shooting. Having to ask a gang leader permission to expose and examine my patient because cutting a gang members clothing is an insult to their "colors"
Someone also stated that commenting might result in being labeled " un patriotic". I'll take that any day versus the alternative in other countries for speaking out or protesting the government. But I am certain that too will change later down the road.
If only I could convince my now adult children to leave the US and quit giving 50% of their incomes to a government who doesn't help the very people that they are supposed to support.
Not only are our tax dollars going halfway around the globe, they are going right into the pockets of illegal aliens who are swimming right past our borders.
Hubby said we're going to move into Mexico, obtain citizenship there, then swim back into the US where we will receive free housing, free health care, food stamps, and settle in California where our youngest who is in law school can finish school for free
In regards to Gaza... if you want the facts on what is really going on there, talk to the only 2 doctors who have been allowed in there to work. Dr's Mads Gilbert and Erik Fossee. I met both of these doctors at the Trauma Management Conference in Al Ain 3 years back and as a Paramedic whos worked in EMS and FEMA disaster response, I was literally sick to my stomach to learn what is really going on, see pictures of the victims, see pictures of the hospital they were working out of that was bullet and bomb ridden. Isreal said that they hit 90% of their target in Gaza. Do they fail to mention that those targets were schools and hospitals ? They are using taxi's to transport patients because the ambulances are targets. I've never wanted to go work somewhere as badly as Gaza and offered to. But sadly, I was reminded that as an American female, I would be dead within a week. I saw pictures of the injured that showed proof the injuries were from DIME bombs. They are not legal to use and of course Israel denied using them. Gaza has the offense strike nothing bigger than a bottle rocket. Pathetic that they are as defenseless as they are and yet Israel keeps hitting them hard. For what is Gaza's fight? to try and gain back the land that was theirs to begin with? If you want to learn the truth on Gaza, Gaza Volunteer Doctor Tours North America | Community Affairs | Islamic Insights
start there. During the conference, speakers were limited to 15 or 20 minute intervals. When Dr Gilbert got up and spoke, his time was running into 30 min. He apologized and without a dry eye in the building, we stood in ovation requesting he continue. If only the truth were really out there. But the lobbying Zionist don't allow it. In my 12 years of working with medical professionals both domestic and international and working natural disasters, I've never met anyone with so much compassion, caring and TRUTH.
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Sassy,
I could talk to you about the 1.5 million Israeli Arabs (20% of the total Israeli population and 3 times the population of Gaza) and their right to study and get an education, right to vote ( they even have their representation in the parliament with 3 Arab political parties) , right to join the military (yes there are Arab Muslims in the IDF and entirely Beduin battalions ), right to receive healthcare and social benefits just like the other Israelis , I could tell you about the cities of Jaffa or Acre or Nazareth which are in fact populated by a majority of Israeli Arabs who can conduct a normal and wealthy western standard of life, of course I could also tell you about what you call bottle rockets fired from Gaza indiscriminately over civilian areas and their 40km range (24 miles if you prefer or the distance between Newark and Long Beach) with their deadly effects ( yes there are tens of Israeli victims due to bottles including Israeli Arabs), I could tell you about hamas firing mortar shells from school backyards or civilian building's rooftops or using ambulances to move weaponry and militants or firing from an area and shortly after moving children in hoping to make the news when the Israeli air force hits them back, I could talk to about the almost daily rocket attacks and the thousands Israelis running for shelter when the sirens go off while the news is not even mentioned by international media ( the Syrian regime has killed more civilians in 2011-2 alone than the Israelis since the foundation of the state in 1948 but I'm sure your doctor friend doesn't care and prefers bashing Israel instead).
As you see there are many things we could talk about but let's be honest, you also say that the Arabs are fighting for a land that was theirs in the first place implying you don't recognize the very existence of Israel ......then there's very little to talk about I' m afraid.
P.S.: whose land was America in the first place?Where are the native Indians living?You call them reserves right?
But if a native mexican, whose ancestors were living in the American continent centuries before yours decided to conquer it, wants to move north then you want him out.......
I could talk to you about the 1.5 million Israeli Arabs (20% of the total Israeli population and 3 times the population of Gaza) and their right to study and get an education, right to vote ( they even have their representation in the parliament with 3 Arab political parties) , right to join the military (yes there are Arab Muslims in the IDF and entirely Beduin battalions ), right to receive healthcare and social benefits just like the other Israelis , I could tell you about the cities of Jaffa or Acre or Nazareth which are in fact populated by a majority of Israeli Arabs who can conduct a normal and wealthy western standard of life, of course I could also tell you about what you call bottle rockets fired from Gaza indiscriminately over civilian areas and their 40km range (24 miles if you prefer or the distance between Newark and Long Beach) with their deadly effects ( yes there are tens of Israeli victims due to bottles including Israeli Arabs), I could tell you about hamas firing mortar shells from school backyards or civilian building's rooftops or using ambulances to move weaponry and militants or firing from an area and shortly after moving children in hoping to make the news when the Israeli air force hits them back, I could talk to about the almost daily rocket attacks and the thousands Israelis running for shelter when the sirens go off while the news is not even mentioned by international media ( the Syrian regime has killed more civilians in 2011-2 alone than the Israelis since the foundation of the state in 1948 but I'm sure your doctor friend doesn't care and prefers bashing Israel instead).
As you see there are many things we could talk about but let's be honest, you also say that the Arabs are fighting for a land that was theirs in the first place implying you don't recognize the very existence of Israel ......then there's very little to talk about I' m afraid.
P.S.: whose land was America in the first place?Where are the native Indians living?You call them reserves right?
But if a native mexican, whose ancestors were living in the American continent centuries before yours decided to conquer it, wants to move north then you want him out.......
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maybepilot,
My God told me that your wallet is mine, so hand it over chump.
Otherwise I will take it by force, and throw you out onto the street, and stop all medicine and food reaching you. That way I can clean out your lot, and bring my own people in.
If you decide to fight me, I will send in tanks and jets to annihilate you. I will then tell the world that you threw a rocket at me first.
If things start to get out of hand, I will imprison you in a barren land, and control your movement in the land which was once your own.
Why will I do this again, oh yes, because my God told me that your wallet is mine.
In the end, you will love me. Kisses.
My God told me that your wallet is mine, so hand it over chump.
Otherwise I will take it by force, and throw you out onto the street, and stop all medicine and food reaching you. That way I can clean out your lot, and bring my own people in.
If you decide to fight me, I will send in tanks and jets to annihilate you. I will then tell the world that you threw a rocket at me first.
If things start to get out of hand, I will imprison you in a barren land, and control your movement in the land which was once your own.
Why will I do this again, oh yes, because my God told me that your wallet is mine.
In the end, you will love me.
Kisses.
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Actually, the population of Gaza is 1.7million so better check your facts. Israel has conscription and so these Bedouin battalions that you speak of aren't volunteers, they're forced into the army. As for the bottle rockets, they're no match for the US built M1 Abrams tanks, F15/F16 fighters, AH1 Apache helicopter gunships with their hellfire antitank missiles that terrorise the largely hapless population of Gaza who are struggling to survive under an israeli blockade.
Wasn't Israel founded on terrorism? I seem to remember that British soldiers were murdered by Zionist terrorists in the run up to 1948.
As for the thread:
Let's bear in mind that US intelligence has stated that Iran stop its nuclear weapons programme back 2003/4. They made this claim in 2007. This is not a secret, it's just not widely reported by the pro Zionist media. The same way that intelligence agencies knew that Saddam no longer possessed WMDs and yet the media seemed to ignore that fact too!!
Wasn't Israel founded on terrorism? I seem to remember that British soldiers were murdered by Zionist terrorists in the run up to 1948.
As for the thread:
Let's bear in mind that US intelligence has stated that Iran stop its nuclear weapons programme back 2003/4. They made this claim in 2007. This is not a secret, it's just not widely reported by the pro Zionist media. The same way that intelligence agencies knew that Saddam no longer possessed WMDs and yet the media seemed to ignore that fact too!!