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Alpha Aviation Academy

Middle East Many expats still flying in Knoteetingham. Regional issues can be discussed here.

Alpha Aviation Academy

Old 3rd Mar 2012, 10:26
  #261 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Dubai
Posts: 10
AED 440,000 you say plus line training costs about AED 150,000 (mostly deducted from 1st officer salary - if offered a job) and 5 year bond AED 100,000. Plus living costs during training.
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Old 3rd Mar 2012, 10:53
  #262 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Dubai
Posts: 10
Forgot to mention I understand there is a salary paid during 2nd officer contract period of 750 hours but quite low - maybe average of about AED 10,000 per month.
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Old 3rd Mar 2012, 17:05
  #263 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: UAE
Posts: 95
Thanks Greenkiwi for the information. It will help the new cadets before they part with their money to Alpha. However no contract is even mentioned when we joined. Only verbal promises were made like : Reasons for joining Alpha
a We have 99% success ratio
b You are guaranteed employment at the end of your training.
Then mysteriously an unseen contract appears which is enforced upon cadets and which empowers Alpha to remove cadets. No other associated costs like paying towards line training are told but you are made to assume that your DH 440,000 covers the 40 sectors.
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Old 4th Mar 2012, 03:10
  #264 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: earth
Posts: 272
I have been following this thread for sometime, and could hazard a guess that there is a very small percentage chance in gaining a job with alpha afterwards and then being stuck with a useless MPL licence. I think if you are in the UAE, then Horizon International flight academy at AL AIN would be a far better choice for your fixed wing training, at least at the end you will have a stand alone licence frozen ATPL, that will allow you to be employable in the gulf region. Unfortunatley in the Gulf and Asia pacific region, you have and have had many different Companies promising you the world, with strange sponsorships and contracts which are not worth the paper they are written on, the reason these companies are in the gulf and asia pacific region is because this is where the money is, and wealthy familys can afford to buy their son or daughter a career and these dubious companies are all to willing to sell a dream.
Being a pilot is hard work and a long road to maintain your comitment and discipline. If a company offers you a cadet sponsorship then this is what it means, you pay nothing... they pay you a cadet salary throughout your training, if you pass and become online first officer then for the next few years you will have a reduced salary to pay off the training bond. It seems that some Airlines are saying this word "sponsorship" and then asking the cadet for money to start training
With the guys in the gulf have you tried to go to the U.S as the training is a alot cheaper and you will be able to walk away with a FAA atpl, south africa and even spain are all alot cheaper and will provide you with a worthwhile stand alone Licence that will get you into any country for your first job.
Here's a question, as I am not a fixed wing pilot, if you gain a MPL licence with ALpha get online at air arabia..... then air arabia as a company stops operating what will happen to you, with your shiny MPL licence..... 99% of companies will not accept this licence.

All the best

Fluffy5
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Old 4th Mar 2012, 10:03
  #265 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Classified
Posts: 25
Fluffy5 you are absolutely right. For the students sake I just hope for a couple of things...1. that Air Arabia will not stop operating, and 2. if they do stop operating, then the cadets will have enough hours and experience to convert to an ATPL where they can use their shiny GCAA Licenses with 99% of the other companies.

Last edited by BlueSky1; 4th Mar 2012 at 10:19.
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Old 4th Mar 2012, 10:14
  #266 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Classified
Posts: 25
"We have 99% success ratio"

Aakhan, this may have been true when students were training in the UAE or even in Clark. Considering the standards they have there, I am guessing it was close to 99% with all the time it took, and the fact that even when the Instructors recommended that a student be chopped from the course, Management asked them to continue anyway.

I am probably willing to bet that there were a few students who were rejected in the interview process, but got through anyway for the sake of a cheque that cleared in the Alpha laundering account.

However now that training is being outsourced to Australia I am hoping things will change, and that the figure of 99% will drop, as it usually does in any respectable flying training academy.

Last edited by BlueSky1; 4th Mar 2012 at 10:35.
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 06:08
  #267 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: UAE
Posts: 95
How very true
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 13:25
  #268 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: UAE
Posts: 8
I completely second what Stratocruiser377 has said. I have personally spoken with the HR personnel at Air Arabia recently and they have confirmed that they are indeed partnered with Alpha Aviation and would recruit MPL holders, subject to meeting their standards.

If anyone has doubts, feel free to approach Air Arabia to establish the verity of this.

Please stop posting content of misguiding nature...
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 16:37
  #269 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Abu Dhabi
Age: 31
Posts: 250
To Share

Guys, as you are discussing the matter of Employment or Air Arabia Line Training...etc. & MPL

As you all Know, ANY Cadet Pilot Training Program puts the responsibility on the cadet to achieve & pass his training, I have friends in Cadet Pilot training programs in the region & somewhere out of the region (including Mexico), ALLLLLL of them say it, if they don't pass in their training phases, the Airline that is responsible for them SUES them, by Simply asking their Guarantor (who signed the papers for financial stuff) to pay for their "FAILED" Training fee, as an example, there is an airline here in UAE, that has a cadet pilot program & it costs the airline 540,000 AED...if you fail, you spend your life paying back (Some or All) depending on your stage...this is LEGAL, same thing applies everywhere...70 Cadets will find their way into Aviation & into ABY, lets wait & see.

Speaking of Air Arabia, if you remember...a month ago, we had our Graduation Party & of course, GCAA, Air Arabia & AAG were present (Including Parents)...and Of course, Each had a Speech, Air Arabia's Speech was simply...the Best, it was done by a Senior Captain & he said:

"In 2003, everybody went against our Idea of a Low Cost Carrier, they told us that the people here are used to BMWs, Mercedes, Audis & Porche...its impossible to succeed in here, but with time...WE PROVED THEM WRONG..., we belief in MPL & we are sure that it is the right way of training the new generations of Pilots...some people went against it, but, with time, We simply Proved them WRONG"

To Prove that...ABY has stopped accepting CPL holders & only a very very few were accepted into ABY & until this moment haven't had the chance to start their Type Rating...why, simply because MPL has Priority, when you go & speak about MPL with the Management/Training Dept. they show a lots of attention & enthusiasm about the MPL Program.

GCAA is doing its Job aswell, where just yesterday, a GCAA inspector was flying with one of my colleagues to inspect MPLers & give feedback to ICAO...I can tell you, we are doing a Hell of a Job he was really happy with the Cockpit atmosphere & the way the line training was going on...etc.

MORE CHANGES TO COME
malirm is offline  
Old 5th Mar 2012, 16:47
  #270 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: UAE
Posts: 95
The fact remains that two contract are signed by cadets. One is with Alpha where the cadets pay Dh440,000 in which Air Arabia is not mentioned. The second contract is with Air Arabia when they undergo line training. No where it is written that it is binding for Air Arabia to hire all MPL cadets. Why does Alpha and Air Arabia not come up with one contract written and signed that all MPL cadets will be hired. No verbal promises otherwise many cadets will be left behind in the name of not meeting the required standards. From the first few batches all may be hired because it helps with the publicity. No verbal promises Alpha.
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 17:07
  #271 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: UAE
Posts: 7
Taras B I am no supporter of Alpha's business skills etc but to be fair we just don't how many MPLers will get recruited by Air Arabia. All of batch 1 yes. After that time will tell.
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 17:18
  #272 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: UAE
Posts: 7
I think Alpha has just been really lucky in Clark where the airline business cycle in the Philippines enabled them to get most but not all cadets placed in jobs. The Clark cadets who got into Air Arabia were really lucky. The same is happening at the moment in SHJ where Air Arabia has a shortage of FOs. The problem is in a downturn caused by eg problems in Iran, acute competition from say Fly Dubai, fewer resignations, say partial fleet grounding. Then it will be MPL cadets sitting around waiting and hoping with nowhere else to go. Then the problems of a non sponsored ( I mean sponsored in the true and traditional sense) cadet training programme will be apparent. By the way guys it is a fact in life that there is often no guarantee of a job to anyone doing a training course at Uni but the issue highlighted here is that everyone is asked to invest massively in a qualification that realistically has 1 and only 1 employer. I would be surprised if Alpha could do the same trick again as they did with placing the Clark cadets in an airline in another country that was never the sponsor of the cadets.
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 17:36
  #273 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: 30k
Posts: 71
If any of you guys feel that all cadets MUST be hired Air Arabia and the contracts to be made that way, let me tell you it ain't gonna happen! In fact it happens nowhere! Don't expect anyone/everyone to be hired into the airline....the good ones should be hired though! why should any airline have an obligation of hiring someone who is not upto the mark???? Not every MBA grad gets into McKinsey, not every graduate doctor gets into American Hospital, not every CPL holder gets an airline job and neither would all MPLs get into the partner airlines...that's how it works everywhere. Stop staying in fool's paradise guys! Get real and hit the books! Blue skies up!!
Cheers
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 17:38
  #274 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Dubai
Posts: 10
You need to check the GCAA website and see eg CAAP 37 re MPL. There is also some stuff not written in the regs. I think this is the position with MPL. On qualification you get a MPL that is both type (A320 not A320 family) and airline (Air Arabia) specific. This is what the batch 1 guys have. Why - well I think the GCAA is just following the practice in other countries such as the UK and I think they seem to be following the UK CAA policy on endorsements to the licence. Just google Uk CAA lasors part K MPL and I think you will find a PDF on the CAA regs on MPL. You will see that as per the UK provisions the airline endorsement can be removed after line training. If you try to get another type rating endorsed before line training then bad luck you have to start the SIM training agian I think. After line training on the original type I think you can then get a new type endosed on the MPL. Also look at GCAA provisions for licence upgrades. MPL to ATPL requires 1,500 hours but can only count half time as PNF under GCAA regs so effectively say about 2,200 hours on flight deck to upgrade to ATPL.
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 17:59
  #275 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: UAE
Posts: 7
Google ok but a MBA graduate, a medical graduate and a CPL holder can work for anyone worldwide so they have the chance to try and get the foot in somewhere, anywhere to get their CV going. See Green Kiwi's post - the GCAA MPL will be limited to Air Arabia until at least completion of line training and Air Arabia has no obligation to offer anyone that line training. I agree that expecting a guartantee of a job is not in the real world BUT this programme could have been set up differently so there was far more vetting of candidates and a mix of self paying, financing available and more deduction from salary when online so it was quasi sponsored in the true sense and this would have attracted a lot more candidates. Either that or offer a CPL or frozen ATPL and the best then go forward to A320 type rating with a high expectation of a job at Air Arabia. Those that don't still can use the qualification elsewhere. Fact is most people (parents) don't have AED 440,000 plus so the pool of potential cadets is very limited.
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 18:21
  #276 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: UAE
Posts: 95
The AAG managers in Sharjah should inform future cadets that only the best will be hired with Air Arabia and then see how many will part with their hard earned money. Thus in order to lure cadets they are not even shown the contract. Tall verbal promises are made. Air Arabia will hire Mpls from Alpha des not mean all MPL cadets will be hired.
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 18:31
  #277 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: 30k
Posts: 71
Atis777, agree completely. AA program could have been set up differently. A lot can be improved and it should be! I have expressed same views in my previous post. My point is, cadets at alpha have made a choice already and they had an option of doing a conventional CPL/IR before joining alpha. Were they all guaranteed a job at Arabia? If yes, I stand corrected. Apologies. If no, they cannot blame alpha for 'their' wrong choice..everyone knew MPL is a new program. Will take time before it starts running smoothly. If I were to do my flight training again, I would be wary of such a program. At least at this stage.
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Old 5th Mar 2012, 18:54
  #278 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: UAE
Posts: 7
Thanks Google. Alpha gave no guarantee there would be a job but the programme does offer a good prospect (time will tell) because of the link with Air Arabia. Frankly noone in their right mind would have waited and waited and waited through all the delays if this was a CPL/IR programme.
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Old 9th Mar 2012, 09:25
  #279 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Classified
Posts: 25
Bad Planning

One of the biggest problems with Alpha’s planning for this program, is that there was no real planning done.

They set up a flight line in Sharjah, with no research into Sharjah Airport, and then found out the hard way about all the restrictions with airspace, traffic and ATC.

They set up a MCC department in Sharjah, but why did they go for a B737 Sim, when Air Arabia are using A320’s?

And finally they knew they had to do an Intermediate and Advanced phase for the sim, however no thought was put into where this would happen, and how much it would cost. And with the high turn over in management at the top, I am guessing that whatever was planned, was also quickly forgotten when Staff either walked out, or were kicked out the door.

In the end I am really surprised that despite all the planning (or lack thereof), Alpha actually gained GCAA approval to operate.

However I guess things are improving…Flight training is now being sent to Australia. The latest rumour is that the MCC Sim will eventually be replaced with an A320. And by now I am guessing that Alpha have got their act together, and the Cadets are not being sent all over the world to complete the Intermediate and Advanced phase???

Last edited by BlueSky1; 9th Mar 2012 at 21:11.
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Old 11th Mar 2012, 11:36
  #280 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Asia
Posts: 177
it is NOT a 737sim this is a specific sim for MPL courses.

Press Releases


Configured as a generic twin-engine heavy jet aircraft, the Ascent® XJ Trainer™ integrates a suite of advanced avionics such as TCAS, EGPWS, FMS and weather radar to familiarize Alpha’s pilot students with the automated flight deck as well as the performance and speeds of today’s modern jet aircraft. Featuring a 180° x 35° projected display, the FSTD provides the highest level of visual fidelity via a Raster/xT Image Generator from RSI. A lesson plan editor enabling the instructors to prep-program scenarios and build a library of training sessions is also included; students’ performances can be measured and compared in similar conditions.


the 320 type rating training is done on a dedicated A320 Level D sim
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