BA Future Pilot Programme (FPP)(Merged)
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BA FPP Selection Costs with FTE at Coventry?
Oxford and CTC seem to have costs for the first stage of selection though FTE haven't informed me of any cost - does anyone know if there is a cost for attending the first stage at Coventry?
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Again, if this is the case (and I doubt it), what is the point of group discussions and interviews? I would have thought BA are looking for the best, and I mean best overall, be it aptitude, motivation, current skills, experience etc etc.
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747-436 - This was my original thinking, the point of the group exercises and interview is to further discriminate the "best" (judged on COMPASS) that have already made it
For example, say 300 got to COMPASS and they only need 150 to the next stage interview/groups...they will only take the top 150 from COMPASS to stage 2.2, they arent going to invite everyone who passes an arbitary score as it is just creating more work for themselves in assesing and interviewing....I am partial to thinking this could be unfair as COMPASS can be put down to a good/bad day though.....at the end of the day, none of us know anything, so I'm going to stop second guessing and adding to speculation now!!
For example, say 300 got to COMPASS and they only need 150 to the next stage interview/groups...they will only take the top 150 from COMPASS to stage 2.2, they arent going to invite everyone who passes an arbitary score as it is just creating more work for themselves in assesing and interviewing....I am partial to thinking this could be unfair as COMPASS can be put down to a good/bad day though.....at the end of the day, none of us know anything, so I'm going to stop second guessing and adding to speculation now!!
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Numbers
I am led to believe that OAA received the highest number or applicants for this scheme. However, this says nothing about the quality of applicant applying, there may be some variance between the schools in that regard. All applicants would have to pass BA's own selection at a very high standard. So if it does end up in the situation where say 40 are successful at BA for Oxford, and say 20 for another school, does anyone know how BA will deal with this? Would all 40 be sent off to OAA or would 10 be offered the chance to complete their training at one of the other 2 schools?
Thoughts on a postcard...
Thoughts on a postcard...
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I think each FTO will putch forward XX candidates which is over and beyond the course quota. Each FTO group will be of a high quality. BA can be picky of which of these actually get offered a place, but in essence I think they will choose an even amount from each school....which suggests you school choice could affect your chances of getting in overall (due to the quality at your FTO, the amount at your FTO etc..)!!
That's my thoughts on a postcard, could be utter trollop though!
That's my thoughts on a postcard, could be utter trollop though!
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My hunch is that BA will receive 120-150 candidates for the final tranche of selection. From that bunch they'll choose their best 80ish.
I don't see why any regard would be given to which FTO they came from as each school could tolerate a large number and, ultimately, BA will want the best of what they're given, not the top X% from each place.
As above, this is pure speculation
I don't see why any regard would be given to which FTO they came from as each school could tolerate a large number and, ultimately, BA will want the best of what they're given, not the top X% from each place.
As above, this is pure speculation
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Student repartition between FTOs
The repartition of student between the FTOs is simple. Each FTO will have 30 FPP students this year. Given the over-supply of application they are bound to be 30 top ones in each FTO. It is unlikely that a FTO has such poor COMPASS results that BA need to move students from the FTO of their choice to another.
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To respond to CityBA, therefore would you say that you would be better off, purely based on numbers, applying to the school with the fewest applicants? Seems a bit unfair to me, but then maybe I guess life aint fair!
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FTO applicants
kingofkabul, You would be right to apply to the school with fewest applicants if the number were small enough but I think applicants will count in the 1000s for each school so they are bound to be 30 top ones in each. There is no way you can second guess in what FTO you are most likely to succeed the selection.
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Having read the email invite properly and realising it's £200 to attend I've decided against it. If it were a cost direct to BA and held at the old Cranebank selection centre I'd consider it though as it's via an FTO who obviously has a lot to gain by inviting as many as possible I've decided it's not worth the outlay. I hope there is the smallest chance someone from BA might review these pages at some stage and go back to taking ownership of their own selection processes once more. The use of FTO's as intermediaries in the selection adds nothing to this process other than a lot of cash burn from those actually offering their services and unfortunately some will be profiteering from those very people. Morally questionable.
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Okavango, given that the course fees are £84k, £200 seems rather trivial. Bear in mind that anywhere you go there are assessment fees. This includes places like GAPAN as well as all the more highly regarded FTOs. The software used in testing incurs a direct fee per student that the FTO has to pay. In addition, the time they've spent in assessing and filtering thousands of applications, plus the two days they'll spend with probably dozens of successful candidates, probably warrants the cost they're charging. If BA did this themselves, my guess is that they would still charge the fees, if only to cover the software costs and expertise of those industry specialists on the selection panels.
Saying that, at least you've looked at your situation and decided against it. If you baulked at the assessment costs, the rest of the aviation training costs probably wouldn't be your cup of tea. Better out now than wasting your time. Congrats on the invite, though. An awful lot of people didn't make it that far.
Saying that, at least you've looked at your situation and decided against it. If you baulked at the assessment costs, the rest of the aviation training costs probably wouldn't be your cup of tea. Better out now than wasting your time. Congrats on the invite, though. An awful lot of people didn't make it that far.
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It's not the cost, it's who it's being paid to and whenever I pay anyone for anything I question what's in it for them. I got to final interview with BA way back when at Cranebank when they still had responsibility for resolving their own needs at their cost. Outsourcing recruitment is all very well, but I really don't see what Oxford, CTC and FTE get out of this apart from a separate revenue stream and drumming up a wealth of business from unsuccessful applicants (who in both cases they're motivated to invite as many as possible). You'll deduce from my previous selection experience that I'm older so I consider the odds are stacked against me and therefore made the decision for them. My views won't even create the slightest ripple, though I think it's important to stand by your morals even when others can't see the wood for the trees (or have knowledge of how fast things are deteriorating in this profession and how in their own little ways are contributing to it).
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And just to provide some stats - my understanding of the old BA Cadet Pilot scheme was that previously 1/50 used to get through Stage 1, of which 1/3 went through to Stage 2, of which 1/3 were ultimately successful at final board. Odds not too dissimilar to X Factor!! My guess is that these are probably now skewed to a certain extent (by the FTO's who have nothing to lose and all to gain).
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Congrats to Okavangu for one of the bizarrest posts I've seen on pprune. I spent over £1000 on assessment fees and transport when I was trying to get sponsored. One of the best investments I've made as it saved me about 65k! Likewise, the BA scheme is the best out there and over a career is worth its weight in gold. BA don't have the resourses to run a DEP scheme at full tilt and a cadet scheme at the same time. If nothing else, the assessment centre wouldn't have the capacity. As someone said, the schools don't make a profit out of the £200 as it all goes on the fees to the provider of the tests plus all the staff and external airline pilots who give up their time to run the assessments. Also, the £200 works as a filter to stop any old person walking off the street to have a go at being a pilot who isn't serious about it.
If you have a moral objection to paying £30k for a type rating then good on you, that's worth taking a stand over, but £200 for the opportunity of a lifetime?
As for the age thing, BA welcome candidates of all ages, and as has been said it would benefit them to have a range of ages in order to stop retirement bulges in the future. They also probably would rather not have hundreds of people who will reach the maximum pay point at the age of 45 and sit there for 20 years! In reality, they cannot discriminate on age which is irrelevant in the selection process. Once at the BA selection if you pass you're in. Simples.
If you have a moral objection to paying £30k for a type rating then good on you, that's worth taking a stand over, but £200 for the opportunity of a lifetime?
As for the age thing, BA welcome candidates of all ages, and as has been said it would benefit them to have a range of ages in order to stop retirement bulges in the future. They also probably would rather not have hundreds of people who will reach the maximum pay point at the age of 45 and sit there for 20 years! In reality, they cannot discriminate on age which is irrelevant in the selection process. Once at the BA selection if you pass you're in. Simples.
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Here's how I see things from my comfortable bed in the Priory
For what it’s worth, guys n’ gals, here’s Bsranon's take on things:
I’m convinced that the whole process could have been achieved at zero cost to the applicant, with cadets paid from day one of training, if the entry requirements had simply stipulated: “must have a minimum of 3 ‘A’ levels including Maths and Physics at grades AA or AB”. Let’s face it, how many of those applying via the degree route can include these gilt edged subjects on their educational CV? My bet is only a fraction of those who actually applied. I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that BA considered this option but dropped it like a stone after they realised that most of us with these qualifications are already tied into lucrative pension schemes in other well paid professions, thereby leaving them with a brace of 18 year old pupils and fifty somethings (ahum!) who’ve already escaped the rat race; neither fitting their desired target group. After all, it does nothing for the travelling public’s confidence to see one of their drivers wearing a school blazer and shorts, and it’s a fact that in management’s eyes, more mature employees are purely trouble with a capital ‘T’!
Anyway, Propellerhead, I only wrote this to ensure that the accolade for the most bizarre post remains securely in my grasp!
I’m convinced that the whole process could have been achieved at zero cost to the applicant, with cadets paid from day one of training, if the entry requirements had simply stipulated: “must have a minimum of 3 ‘A’ levels including Maths and Physics at grades AA or AB”. Let’s face it, how many of those applying via the degree route can include these gilt edged subjects on their educational CV? My bet is only a fraction of those who actually applied. I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that BA considered this option but dropped it like a stone after they realised that most of us with these qualifications are already tied into lucrative pension schemes in other well paid professions, thereby leaving them with a brace of 18 year old pupils and fifty somethings (ahum!) who’ve already escaped the rat race; neither fitting their desired target group. After all, it does nothing for the travelling public’s confidence to see one of their drivers wearing a school blazer and shorts, and it’s a fact that in management’s eyes, more mature employees are purely trouble with a capital ‘T’!
Anyway, Propellerhead, I only wrote this to ensure that the accolade for the most bizarre post remains securely in my grasp!
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Are the flight schools still sending out invites?
Hi All,
Don't suppose anyway (really) knows if the flight schools are still reviewing applications or if that stage is already complete?
I'm still awaiting a response from FTE...and I'm fully prepared to pay whatever selection fee that they are asking for ;-)
Maybe it's wishful thinking, but I was thinking perhaps they are grouping similar "types" of applicants together and inviting in batches (e.g. those with some flying experience and a degree in one batch, those with A-levels and flying in another, those with degree and PPL in a third etc)?
The BA FPP site does state that the flight school selection stage would take place in Oct/Nov time-frame also.
Or am I really wishfully just hoping they didn't already disregard me. It feels like an awfully long time since the applications stage opened up that's all!
In my opinion, on paper I look pretty good (I have the right educational requirements, have some flying experience, know how to write English) and I think my written responses on the application should have shown my dedication and enthusiasm in aviation...but..well, let's see..
Cheers
Don't suppose anyway (really) knows if the flight schools are still reviewing applications or if that stage is already complete?
I'm still awaiting a response from FTE...and I'm fully prepared to pay whatever selection fee that they are asking for ;-)
Maybe it's wishful thinking, but I was thinking perhaps they are grouping similar "types" of applicants together and inviting in batches (e.g. those with some flying experience and a degree in one batch, those with A-levels and flying in another, those with degree and PPL in a third etc)?
The BA FPP site does state that the flight school selection stage would take place in Oct/Nov time-frame also.
Or am I really wishfully just hoping they didn't already disregard me. It feels like an awfully long time since the applications stage opened up that's all!
In my opinion, on paper I look pretty good (I have the right educational requirements, have some flying experience, know how to write English) and I think my written responses on the application should have shown my dedication and enthusiasm in aviation...but..well, let's see..
Cheers
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I wish it was as Rhcriad Bsranon persepective - would have saved a lot of FTO & BA time....however, I believe there are a significant amount of applicants who have A's at A-level, The coveted 'degree' and work experience!! Hence why a lot of stage 1 rejections went out to people who did meet either the A-Levels or degree criteria. Hence the passage "the standard of applicants were EXCEPTIONALLY high" in the rejection letter.
Having top A-levels and a degree is nothing special - EVERYONE has them. It's the extra-curciular and personality (+ more) that will be the derrivative in this process, not academics.
Having top A-levels and a degree is nothing special - EVERYONE has them. It's the extra-curciular and personality (+ more) that will be the derrivative in this process, not academics.