Where did I say any were?

All of which was expected. Things happening faster with the new variant, could turn out to be a blessing in disguise.

Yes. But you were implying restrictions should have been lifted earlier. That would have been a disaster.

Blessing? Infections are up 3000% on two weeks ago. ICU admissions are a two week lagging indicator. 3000% of current ICU admissions exceeds current capacity by about 50%. We are in trouble,

You have me mistaken if you think that I’ve been implying that the borders should have reopened earlier.

FWIW, quotes from an article published yesterday: “Experts say Omicron will likely have more recorded cases but will place a similar strain on the system as the flu season.

Data from the NSW government’s 2017 epidemiology report showed that 9330 people were hospitalised from *influenza and a further 6539 were hospitalised with influenza as a secondary illness.”

Get a grip mate. Just 72 on ventilators Australia wide and 269 serious / critical.

What I mean by blessing in disguise is that if
Omicron rips through the entire population on the east coast very quickly, the infection numbers will fall very rapidly. Combine that with very high rates of vaccinations and the east coast will be in a good position.

An article published where?

9330 cases FOR THE YEAR- NOT all at once. There are over 1700 hostpitilisations NOW and that will likely rise 10 fold in the comming weeks- likewise "just" 72 on ventilators- most of them would have been infected around 2 weeks ago- what's the percentage increase that 72 represents from a month ago? project that forwrd and we run out of ventilators- and that'sfor ANYONE who needs one- very quickly.

Anyway, we are both conjecturing- do you a deal. We will both post here on 29th of the month- I predict we will at or very near caoacity for ICUs and ventalators- you think differently?

I don’t think I’ve ever been this picky on prune, but damn your deal would have so much more gumption if you could spell ventilator.:8

Published in mainstream media, that’s why I prefixed with ‘FWIW’. The key data take from it is the numbers.

I get what you are saying regarding projecting the numbers forward and I agree on the conjecture but it’s a no deal from me - I don’t get off on winning arguments on social media, nor do I support the idea. I just wanna see the borders remain opened.

Not really what I meant. The decision to open up and let it rip has been made, well do that then. To be telling us we have to isolate if infected, get tested if you think you are, cancel events, work from home, etc etc, is "POINTLESS". It's everyone for themselves, our own individual decisions will determine what happens to our economy/recovery. right now all I'm seeing is closed, not available, delayed due to staff shortages. Surely this wasn't the plan. What will I be doing in the short term, not venturing very far from home, I'm sure I'm not alone.

Good to hear it’s not what you meant, because it’s certainly not what you said…anyhow of course it wasn’t the plan, the plan was based on the Delta. Omicron threw a spanner in the works with its transmissibility.

I don't think what I said initially is of any significant difference. Omicron was present in Australia when our borders opened in SA as is the newest variant IHU, not yet detected in Australia. there will be plenty more yet. It is what it is. Unless the omega strain breaks out somewhere we don't even need to hear about it anymore.

It was present when the border opened yes, but the plan to open and the modelling used to construct the plan was based on the Delta.

And I would say the plan to open was purely a political decision, any modelling was about what to expect as a consequence of that decision. I don't believe any of us expected that we would still be isolating, staying home, getting tested when we are not all that unwell, having our supply chains disrupted, staff shortages, cancelling anything. Opening up was supposed to end all that and so it should, at least from a government perspective. we the people will decide what happens from here as a consequence of our own individual decisions and actions. If the majority just get on with it, recovery, if on the other hand they stay home and isolate, recession. The current policy and directions are not helping recovery.

Mate I agree with you there - you won’t find me going and getting tested voluntarily.

And that's the question I'm asking really. Now that the borders are open and the virus is spreading like wildfire, I expect to be infected. I'm doing everything I can not to be. Until I know what the impact upon me personally is as a consequence of being infected, I don't intend doing much or going anywhere, even if that takes weeks, months, years. Once I am or have been infected I don't expect to have to comply with any pointless health directions.
So the question is, is everybody else doing or plan to do anything any differently.

How many ventilators and ICU beds in NSW? About 2000 each.

How many currently in use for Covid patients? 145 ICU beds and 40 Ventilators. Approx 387 ICU beds taken up with non Covid patients at any one time, so total ICU capacity not even 30% yet. And a good proportion of those were incidental, somewhere between 25-50%.

If you're going to predict that ICU and ventilators will be very near capacity (90%+) by 29/01 then you'd better be hoping for a massive increase, as data from South Africa and Europe has shown the Omicron wave peaks in about a month, so should be on the downswing by late Jan.

You are making a huge logical fallacy in that statement. You are assuming that the rise in cases is matched by a exact rise in hospitalisation/ICU admission, whereas most acknowledge increased infectiousness but decreased severity with Omicron, up to 80% less severe. It's why South Africa suffered about 1/6th the hospitalisation of their Delta wave. I'd expect ICU admissions to level out much lower, and then we really don't know the breakdown of those admitted for Covid reasons and those admitted for other reasons who test positive for regular screening, and are counted in official numbers. They may be asymptomatic. You can hardly say Covid is overloading hospitals then. About 75% of those in ICU in NSW have Delta not Omicron, so what we are seeing is the end of the Delta wave in hospitals, not so the recent rise in cases. The increasing Omicron cases will not cause a similar rise in hospital admissions/ICU

The length stay in hospitals is also lower, from 8 down to 2.8 days on average. I don't know too much about the disease treatment but I imagine you can't be admitted to hospital for Covid, get sent to the ICU, get put on a ventilator, get taken off a ventilator, be monitored back to the ICU, then downgraded to general wards and then discharged all within 2 and a half days, so the severity of the illness and strain on hospitals is surely lower with Omicron.

You are not wrong, but there are a lot of maybes and we thinks there. The way Omicron is spreading, it can BE a much less severe ailment on average and still hugely effect our health system. ICU beds don't grow on trees, in particular in terms ofpersonelle, and we only ever had as many as we thought we needed in "normal" times. Hostpitals in the US are facing an absolute crisis- admittedly in places where the Trump factor has led to loow vaccination rates, but we are in for a pretty torrid time.

I hope you're right.

And thus any pretence of a responsible individual vanishes...

Key word being voluntary. As for being responsible - I don’t interact with anyone I consider vulnerable. If I am displaying symptoms I would do as I’ve always done and stay home until no longer being symptomatic. The playbook is changing, even the government discourages unnecessary testing.

No, they discourage unneccessary PCR testing. Taking 15 minutes to do a RAT and find out what you're dealing with is just base level responsible behaviour.

So if I don’t have any symptoms, I’m supposed to take a RAT everyday this year to make sure I don’t step out in public whilst being covid positive?

Ss pilots, we are supposed to be on a 7 day rolling test regime- not to much to ask.

Airlines are cancelling thousands of flights due to staff shortages- making sure you aren't spreading it to work mates, causing ecconomic damage in the process, should be high in the mind of a supossed "get things going" advocate.

I said voluntary testing. If my employment mandates a rolling 7 day test, I would comply with that.

You are entitled to your opinion on how others should behave, but based on the fallaciousness of your previous arguments, I don’t value them highly at all.

Based on your total lack of compassion for others, mutual.

Please enlighten me how you come to the conclusion I lack total compassion for others based on what I’ve written. Generally curious as to how your braìn works.

We are? Reference please.

You're happy to walk around asymptomatic and ignorant of it, infecting those around you. Now please point out where any of my reasoning was fallacious.

Class exemption for domestic aircrew to enter Queensland.

It should apply to any aircrew who overnight in a hotspot and then return to QLD. PCR within the previous 7 days or RAT within the previous 72 hours.

Seems pointless these days really…

Dr Dre pointed it out very nicely.

I am free to walk around asymptomatic as we all are, and have been doing our entire lives. Because I CHOOSE not to voluntarily RAT myself doesn’t mean I am ignorant to the fact I may infect others. I may infect them, as they have infected me. If I don’t infect them, the next person will. That’s where we are at on the eastern seaboard. Get with it mate. Everyone is going to get infected. With our high level of vaccination, we can now treat it like how we treated the flu. That’s the words of the PM. Did you test yourself for influenza when the flu was rife in Australia or wherever you were in the world prior to this pandemic, even though you were asymptomatic? Hell, I bet you didn’t even test yourself if you displayed symptoms. You probably just stayed home like I would have.

So why do you need me to explain why you are irresponsible and uncompassionate when you articu;ate it so well yourself?

Like I said, I wanted to see how your brain works. Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

Why test ? If your double vaccinated, healthy , no underlying health issues just stay home and follow health advice ? Why are we in a made panic to get a test ? It’s just using up resources and added costs . We all going to get it , do we need it confirmed ? It’s more of a mental health issue now than a physical problem . What if we turned off the news , social media for a week , calmed down and reset this would be a lot easier .

The purpose of opening the borders was to accept the virus and get on with it. So that is the mindset. That's the decision.
I agree that there is still a need to protect vulnerable people, I believe it is reasonable to be tested virus free prior to entering a hospital, a medical facility, an aged peoples home or any or vulnerable peoples facility, except entry via a dedicated facility covid entry point, where procedures are in place.

For anywhere else it's on us to decide if you want to risk being there, whatever that risk may be and whatever procedures you decide as a family in your own space.

I don't see the need for mandatory isolation or testing for any other reason, all that's going to do is nobble our businesses even further and for longer. I don't see the need for government controlled checkins and compliance requirements in public places other than what I have already stated.

Going to be a struggle to even fly the way it’s going, I am watching crews dropping like flies at the moment. This coming fortnight is going to be tough. On the plus side it appears the public is staying away at the moment so hopefully not too many inconvenienced.

Melbourne/Sydney bases in trouble. Looks like at least 50 cancelled out of each tomorrow.

Across all airlines? Seen a bunch of J* cancellations but Qf seems to be reducing frequency due low loads on some flights not due crew shortages from what Ive heard

What I think that this pandemic is showing is how much all employers in all industries have relied on workers coming into work while sick. We've all done it, come in with just a "minor virus" or come back to work after a cold a day or two before we should have. Don't want to piss off the boss too much.

What we're seeing now is the effect on society if everyone had a full week off after a contagious illness, as they really should, to prevent passing it on. Have a think if people took a full 7 days off after every cold or illness they got in winter 2019 or before and how disrupted a business would be. Industries work their employers to the bone, and employ only the bare essential number. The best thing would be to increase sick leave and for companies to employ enough workers to cover those who are sick. But once this pandemic is over I think those phone calls pressuring workers to come to work while sick or return ASAP will resume.

I have just come from our local supermarket here in Perth. The shelves are getting empty. Speaking to the owner ( it’s an iGA ), he said there are big supply problems from the Eastern States. I just saw the QLD Premier saying she is worried about keeping the lights on, water running and food on the shelves. NSW is changing isolation rules to try and keep food on the shelves. Flights are being cancelled because of lack of crew and/ or passengers ( I’m surprised about the lack of passengers, I kept hearing about how opening the borders will release a huge pent up demand… it seems sick people don’t like to travel.)

I am waiting to see how long it takes to affect fuel supplies.

Hospitals admissions continue to climb. ICU admissions continue an upward trend. Available health care workers continue a downward trend as more get sick.

I could continue…. So I just want to check. This was the plan, wasn’t it? Open up and all will be normal. That was the idea, was it not? Just checking.

When i worked for easyJet they had the usual problem of flight attemdents taking much more sick leave than the rest of the workforce.

Their solution? They hired a third-party medical service, so if an employee called in sick, they would be transfered to a nurse.

Conversations went like this-

"Hi- I've got a cold, I need two days off sick".

"What do you do?"

"Flight attendent".

"Oh- well the guide-lines say that flightcrew need seven days off in the event of respitory infection, so I'll mark you sick for the week?"

"Err, yes- yes that would be fine...."

The system didn't last long....