It’s been said a million times but just to re-iterate:

Adverse reaction follow ups on trial subjects are only done for several months after administration of the trial vaccine, never years later.

The main reason vaccine trials take years is the lack of funding, Covid vaccines had billions pumped in at the start.

There is widespread testing for the virus and millions of cases which made testing of vaccine effectiveness much more quicker.

The DNA sequence was identified right from the start.

Vaccines were premade and able to be rolled out as soon as the first trials were completed.

Colin Powell passed away despite being fully vaccinated as he had a cancer that destroyed his immune producing white blood cells, he would’ve been susceptible to any bad pathogen and his case isn’t a case of vaccine failure.

Keep on believin dre……

Stop wasting your time Dr Dre, they’ve done their research! :}

Exactly.
Has been said from the very beginning. UNDERLYING CONDITIONS. This virus is only dangerous for people with underlying conditions. People with a compromised immunological system. The vaccine is not going to change that. Is not changing that and it didn´t make the difference for Powell ( and many others).

No, is not because the lack of funding that a vaccine takes years to be fully ready. Even our COVID vaccines are still under trial ( approved or not, are still under trial). They simply don´t know all the side effects. as they didn´t know about the clots and they really don´t know what other effects can appear. You need time (days, months if you want) and a very big sample of population to see all the collateral, and that´s why they have a list of possible side effects and they are just watching and waiting...and learning. Is how it works with any vaccine.

Big Pharma and lack of funding ?........sorry it doesn´t match.

DNA sequence was completed from the start, and the vaccine was designed during a weekend but the Virus has changed already, there are many variants out there....vaccine remains the same and no matter how many shots you are being forced to take cause it won´t work as it should.
People, even in a 100% vaccinated population scenario, will continue carrying, transmitting and dying because the virus but hey! there is no need for panic....We already face many other, actually more dangerous, virus, like Flu, a virus that historically has killed way more millions of people than Covid and it continues doing so every year despite the vaccine. A vaccine, by the way, that has never been and its not mandatory.

So let´s agree to disagree. Time will say.

When you add up all the 'underlying' conditions that covid can aggravate and kill you via it adds up to more than 50% of the population, and once you are over 60 that figure is probably 90%+. So your extremely healthy part of the population is a minority group (who BTW can still get severely sick and die of covid, just in lessor amounts). Most of us writing here probably have underlying conditions of some sort, some may be aware, others not until it sends them to hospital or kills them.

”Let’s agree to disagree”. The last vestige of the critically uniformed when their debating points, derived from watching a YouTube video posted by a bloke living in his parents basement with a “please subscribe” message, have run out of steam in the face of facts.

Have you seen the total numbers regarding total confirmed cases and deaths? cause it seems to me that to survive the virus you don´t need to be extremely, as you said, healthy. And yes, I´m agree, even if you are healthy you can get severely ill with Covid ...but also with Flu, sometimes **** happens. Furthermore, even if you´re vaccinated still can get severely ill or even die from Covid...and that´s my point. The vaccine is not a final solution, a miracle, something that is going to make the virus to be gone.

This vaccine is not working as it should be, period. If it did, we wouldn´t be here discussing all this no sense of measures. I wouldn´t be passing quarantine, despite being vaccinated with 2 shots of Pfizer, and doing antigen test every week and PCR´s every now and then. I would be in Napier enjoying a nice Hawkes Bay Chardonnay instead of being in this ****hole drinking a beer full of ice cause there is no human way to keep it cold....or cycling Te Mata peak and enjoying the fresh air instead and not having to wear a mask, under 38 degrees and 80% humidity that barely allows me to breath ....

But Hey! the third shot is coming.......

Oh boy, I wanted this vaccine to work, me more than anyone else.

If you´re trying to put me in the same page of antivaxxers or as a Covid conspiracy theories supporter, you´re just wrong.

Not sure where you get that idea from, the vaccine is working perfectly fine, with 90% efficacy with virtually no side effects. Multiple studies on actual data worldwide suggests it's doing exactly what it should and the unvaccinated continue to be the main driver of spread and hospitalisations. The measures are still in place because of 'stupid' and the unvaccinated cohorts.

No, you're factually wrong. This virus is more dangerous for people with underlying conditions. Healthy people with no underlying health conditions can, and do die from it, albeit less often. Pre-existing conditions worsen the odds. The vaccine drastically reduces the likelihood of serious illness and death. A recent analysis in Texas, covering a time period where vaccines were widely available and covid was also widespread, shows the massive improvement in outcomes for the vaccinated vs unvaccinated. If you're interested, you can read it here.

COVID-19 Cases and Deaths by Vaccination Status Here's a couple of key points, if you don't want to follow the link - they have a particular focus on the time period September 4 to October 1, as that was when the Delta variant was widespread and vaccines had been freely available for a long time, taken from their report:
And
The vaccine isn't a miracle, as you say, but it makes a vast difference. Time has already said, the results are clear.

If you don't want people to put you on the same page of antivaxxers or as a Covid conspiracy theories supporter, you shouldn't repeat their conspiracy theories and disproven talking points.

Facts can be so inconvenient…

Over 98% survival rate for those infected.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....d5fc34ff0.jpeg

The majority of Australia's infections have occurred post-vaccination in the at-risk groups.

Also would you get on an aircraft if it had a 1 in 50 chance of crashing? Thats 98% survival.

I think what he's saying (badly) is that it is ok for me to go around shooting males over 60 in the head. Because obviously that portion of the population doesn't matter to them, they can just die, they were going to anyway, why can't I just speed it up.

Gee let me think about that, no obviously. What is clearly lost on you is that choosing to get on an aircraft is vastly different to living with an endemic virus in society. Hepatitis is not a pleasant infection, TB is rife in SE Asia, STDs are more common than discussed in polite society. We just get on with it. Life that is. 98.5% survival rate overall, for those under 70 years of age more like 99.5% survival rate.

I certainly never said that. By the way, SPOILER ALERT, we all die in the end.

You are saying that by round about means, the fact you are willing to choose between normal life and letting a few old people die, means you think your lifestyle is worth more than their life, it's simple really. And the age at which covid becomes deadly is about 50+ not 70+, beyond 70 it becomes about a 50/50 survival rate, from 50-70 you have about a 20% chance of dying and so on, unvaccinated of course.

I mean at least be honest with yourself, what you are exactly spruiking is that your lifestyle is worth more than a few old people. Try and word it any other way, its the same outcome. Otherwise you would not have put a big graph up saying it only kills older people and 98% survive.

Yes, you can choose to get on an aircraft, or not. An endemic virus, on the other hand, will spread widely and infect most of the population sooner or later, without public health measures to prevent it, so whether or not you get it depends a lot on the actions of others, things such as wearing masks, social distancing, and.... vaccination, which makes it much less likely that you'll be infected. If you're not infected, you won't pass it on to others such as the older age groups or just your neighbours who you didn't realise had asthma or an underlying heart condition.


If you think it only affects the elderly though, of the 756,962 dead in the USA as of a few days ago, 49,072 were in the 45-54 year old age bracket. As you get older, the risk gets worse, but in the 55-64 year old bracket there were 107,985 deaths. Personally I don't think that 45-54 is particularly old, or someone's death in that group should be discounted because "oh, it only really affects the elderly, they were going to die anyway". Call it about 156,000 dead, aged between 45 and 64, out of the ~756,000. How many people in your airline are in that age group? This idea that "it's only serious if you're elderly and infirm" seems most often propagated by those with a financial or political interest in not taking public health measures, or an ideological issue with vaccines. There are plenty of examples of them begging for prayers on social media as they go onto a ventilator.

Well, in that case, I'll tell the Homicide Squad to stand down. If we're going for gross over-simplifications then any death is just an acceleration of what was going to happen anyway over a long enough timeframe.

That is probably more dangerous that any infectious virus,

As Mr Eazy would later discover, it turns out if you ignore a dangerous virus - particularly one that doesn’t have much data on it, then you’ve got it coming too.

Attacking someone’s user name doesn’t help convince others to follow your point of view.

A lockdown to me is a requirement for all people to remain to home for all but essential reasons.

What’s happening in Austria and Germany is the unvaccinated only are being locked at home in some states, whilst the vaccinated have no restrictions. For the unvaccinated there is a very simple way to get out of lockdown, get jabbed.

The Dutch have upped capacity restrictions and some earlier closing times temporarily but still short of stay at home orders.

That link from the Daily Mail that was posted - still admits that lockdowns are a far away possibility. I don’t think anyone is ever going to completely rule out a total lockdown, but expect more restrictions on those who choose not to be vaccinated.

The conspiracy theorists can go on about their loss of freedoms and one world government all day long, for the most part if you are vaccinated you’re going to be fairly free. Whilst a lot of Europe tried to open up without discriminating against the unvaccinated it looks like they’ll be now subject to restrictions.

Australia is basically going to start with this approach, and a higher Vax rate than those European countries that are seeing spikes now so should avoid a lot of these problems.

Holy thread drift, Batman! Out of curiosity though, on a moral compass is that better or worse than a user name that sounds like an introduced pest species linked to the extinction of numerous native Australian species?

(For what it's worth, I don't really care what people's usernames are, because they were probably chosen as an obscure reference to a job or an in joke or something at the time, for all I know Foxxster might be a NATO fighter pilot - or someone who plays one on Digital Combat Simulator - and Dr Dre might be a doctor of hair and skin specialising in dreadlocks. It just seems like a bit of a ridiculous thing to focus on)

The chance of an intelligent rational person (who would be vaccinated) not booking or cancelling a flight to some destinations because of the risk of a future lockdown would be small.

Probably the same chance of an intelligent, rational person refusing a vaccine because they think it’s part of a sinister plot.

Basically except for the Netherlands most of the re-introduced restrictions were for the unvaccinated only, so the intelligent, rational person who got the vaccine would be unaffected.

Seems travel warnings have already started with respect to EU and other European countries. How long before Australia joins in.


Israel’s top health official suggested Sunday that COVID-related travel restrictions could be imposed on some European countries, due to rising infection levels in some parts of the continent.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/health...vid-outbreaks/

EU’s Top Health Authority Suggests Avoiding Travel to Majority of EU Countries as Winter Holidays Approach


https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/new...days-approach/

Days Before Reopening Borders for Europeans, US Advises Against Travel to 14 EU Countries

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/new...-14-countries/

bloody hell. What an idiot. Take your IRL first name, type it in to google, and you’ll likely find someone somewhere in history who did something stupid. Are you going to change your name now? No? You’re a bloody disgrace. How dare you.

give me a Farkin break. :ugh:

What a tantrum!

Folks, it was “notice-day” today for VA and QF/JQ - unvaccinated staff were told not to turn up for work this morning.

Some have just found themselves with a lot more spare time to post on PPRUNE.

Just let them run with it, I suggest.

So the SA Government have now advised nobody can enter or exit its state if they have been to any council areas that have a below 80% vaccination rate in Victoria.

The data being used is from 2016 census, so Melbourne City is below the figure as are many others, due to Foreign students who have now left, impacting the data. If you are a resident of SA and plan on dropping into the Melbourne city, you must quarantine for 2 weeks on return.

There goes any demand for SA -> VIC. What a crock of...

Yeah, that’s ****.

The inaccuracy bias of quoted vaccination rates based upon population calculated on pre-covid population data in certain areas has been noted, but perhaps not sufficiently included when it comes to influencing certain government policies,

Give Steve a ring and let him know. He’s a common-sense dude isn’t he?

We did a census few months ago, how long does it take for that to be processed? Population stats will shock some.

Now Germany looks like locking down. 14 million unvaccinated. Can’t imagine the effect that will have on bars, restaurants, hotels , transport etc etc. already Munich has cancelled the Christmas markets, a major tourist attraction. Forget Europe for the next few months at least. More will follow.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-citizens.html

seems all our state premiers are blessed with abundant common sense. Said no one ever. Same could be said for intelligence, integrity

The anti-vaxxers in germany are a well known problem, it's not a small group there and they even hold small parties to 'spread' the virus. A mate there has witnessed the parties while doing deliveries for the post. Locals there also show no sympathy for them, so this may end up very badly for the antis in those countries. Also be careful of how the news presents Germany and Europe in general, locals i speak to have very different views on what the news says here and the UK for that matter (suprise, suprise, the news exaggerates stuff...)

The UK is set to require a booster shot to avoid Q if travelling.


https://amp.theguardian.com/world/20...ain-covid-pass


The ‘ let’s open up and get back to normal ‘ thing is a little more complicated than it appears.

Just for old times sake and a bit of a laugh. Our old friend..off topic but.



https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-11-...raud/100627382

Great.

If they don’t want to be locked down just get vaccinated. It’s very simple and won’t cost a cent.

He never gives up!!!!

No big deal for Aussies. Boosters are freely available for those who were vaccinated 6+ months ago.

Australia being very highly vaccinated the country will be in the high 80s maybe low 90s eventually. We won’t see domestic borders close again altho WA who are still in lockdown for the foreseeable future. I couldn’t be certain that an international border closure would occur again, that is still a strong possibility.

And now it’s made it’s way to an indigenous community that has a large amount of movement back and forth between there and a NW Qld indigenous community. That’ll be the beginning of the end

WA is not in “lock down”, there are still moving around quite freely within the State. They just won’t let anyone else in from the other States. More like “isolation” I think.

Isolation-lockdown what ever you want to call it. Locked down within your own state is a better term. You can leave but can return without 14 days quarantine …… unless you’re a cricketer then it’s 5 because covid only takes 5 days in cricketers.