It's pretty hard not to these days. The metadata (celltower info) is stored by your service provider, it's no where near as accurate as your handset data but good enough. An android handset is almost impossible to hide.

its the start of Govt sanctioned discrimination, human rights abuse and segregation, class division in a third world country with a first world facade!

Nobody seems to mind when a company does it, like over in the QF Mandate thread.

Did you forget to count the 1.5 million AZ jabs sitting in GP fridges?

Where did you get that idea?

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-09-...aled/100440842

5:15pm WST

Looks like Mr Perrottet is starting to prepare for the kill.

Yes but the local copper asking to see my phone can’t get the metadata by looking at it.

Funnily enough, all those against a republic should consider while expressing adoration of the royals that the above is EXACTLY how they got into the castles - by their predecessors having better (swords at the time, in size or numerically) and nothing more.

If someone stopped me when I was acting within the law, demanding to see my phone, I would be asking first "do you suspect me of committing crime", second "if so, what exactly is your probable cause" and if neither of those apply "where is your search warrant".

AND, NO. I haven't been watching too many US TV shows, I live in the only State with something approximating a Bill of Rights which spells out precisely how and under what circumstances Police can stop you.

Happily, my experiences with the State Police have been that of professionalism on the part of their officers at all times (the Police Force I refer to, yes located in Australia, is consistently rated one of the most respected in the world by it's citizens). I've never had a reason to stand my ground so to speak. But I don't believe genuine concern that a crime MAY have been committed should be allowed to lazily go unchecked via exaggeration of their powers as law enforcers either.

The problem is the current system is that it relies on authorities "doing the right thing". How long are these "emergency powers" going to be kept alive? How many years am I not going to be able to travel freely within my own country? Australia has just become a pseudo Authoritarian State with 7 Countries within a country. Police checking up on citizens all in the name of "safety". Interrogation at borders about "where have you been in the last 14 days?" Is this going to continue for years to come?

Whilst everyone pans the USA there is a reason why they behave like they do are the fact they don't have Police checkpoints all over the country and Police stopping people asking what they have been doing. The problem is in Australia the pandemic may be used as an excuse for a new normal. Good luck getting a State Premier to rescind their new found power.

So we don't have "royal" programming on free to air.

Did anyone see the latest from NSW Health? Confiscation of goody bags containing excessive amounts of alcohol for those in apartment blocks that are under quarantine! You're now limited to one six-pack, or 1 x 375ml bottle of sprits per day, per man, perhaps.

That's the scariest bit, right there. The Police do not even have the legal authority to confiscate these items, but someone acting under the authority of the NSW Health Department apparently "does".

Police, in all states and territories are bound by strict legal guidelines on what they can and can't do, particularly regarding searches and seizures (ie, as hinted at by A P above, need a "reasonable suspicion" to search you, they can't just open your care packages willy-nilly), yet it would appear the same checks and balances do not apply to NSW Health. And that's downright scary when you realise the implications of it.

And in other news: 324 new cases in Victoria today. Good to see that Hard lockdown, arresting kiddies for using a playground and the Melbourne curfew is working, eh? Or is it just the nature of the beast with Delta, that once it get's a decent toe-hold, it's going to spread no matter what you do?

You do know you can either change channels or turn the idiot box off altogether?
That'd fix those pesky royals. :ok:

You're welcome.

Yes I’m aware how a TV works but thanks for the instruction. However, it’s hard to put out a fire if you keep feeding it oxygen.

Bloody scary, the act itself, and the fact that we as a nation of “free” people aren’t screaming out.

We have become the biggest pussy push overs it’s embarrassing.

As an aside, most infectious disease experts seem to agree that once case numbers hit 100 per day with an R > 1, there’s no reeling it back in to zero. NSW, and now VIC have seen that - soon the rest will follow unless we get vaccines up high enough quick smart.

Is there any real-world example to show that a 70, 80 or 90 percent vaccination rate will actually curtail infection rates?
Is there any real-world example that clearly shows that vaccination rates, on their own, are having any recognisable effect on infection rates?

Most of us will get covid , getting vaccinated won’t stop infection .

Thanks for the opinion but I was asking about real world examples.

Certainly not in the U.K. where we are not far off 90%. There is chatter here that getting the virus once vaccinated in many cases could actually be slightly beneficial in giving enhanced immunity.

McGowan now saying WA will remain 'closed' to the East Coast until April 2022 :rolleyes:

Nothing to do with the federal election due around then… :hmm:

That was a "maybe", a slowest case scenario used for budget estimates. Increased supplies of Pfizer and Moderna should push vaccination to 80-90% by November, and even with a grace period there is still a good chance of a reopening by Christmas.

Last year in early October budget documents assumed WA would remain closed to the rest of the country until April-Jun 2022. They actually opened up mid November.

Latest news by US Secretary of Airlines Association are that they might be accepting vaccinated tourists in November.

Malta

And before anyone reaches for the UK as a key example, do not compare infection rates under restrictions at lower vax % with infection rates without restrictions at higher vax %

What will catch out the dumb buggers resisting the vax is that COVID can run asymptomatic or I-couldn't-give-a-rats mild-symptomatic through the responsible types and then polish off the nutters and self-important. Good frikkin riddance.

If the medical system breaks down, who gets the ICU bed? The vaccinated or unvaccinated? Will a medical triage system be influenced by politicians? Leaving the unvaccinated who chose in all likelihood, a preventable hospitalisation, to stomp up and down about their right to intensive care.

I get the feeling within the next six months, it could all become very ugly and even more divisive than closed State borders, if the medical system bursts at the seams.

Supposedly the Vaccinated will be protected enough to not be in ICU. We will see.

The UK, USA, all of Europe and Israel have plenty of data over millions of cases that Vaccinations reduce severity of symptoms by up to 97% once fully administered. Some gain full immunity, while others will suffer no more than mild flu like symptoms, a small proportion of the vulnerable can get severe symptoms and even die, that is normal for any vaccine. Covid Vaccines have shown to be very effective as well as very safe compared to almost any other medicine, with very low severe side effects compared to even over the counter drugs like Aspirin or Panadol, considering the massive amount of doses administered so far. And don't bring up long term effects, if you take Panadol or Aspirin long term you will need to be regularly tested for kidney failure, the same with many other common drugs used to treat various common ailments. Why regular blood tests are required when on these medications long term.

You can still end up in ICU for a number of other reasons. That has always been the issue that covid patients chew up hospital resources that are needed for other things. That's why elective surgeries have been delayed to free up beds and staff.

A big Friday night on a long weekend can swamp a cities ICU capability, add 100 covid patients and then what.

I don’t think this point is fully appreciated by anyone without an understanding of how an ICU unit works when treating Covid patients. The resourcing needed and precautions that have to be taken dramatically reduce the capacity that a “Friday night” generates. This then knocks on to downstream units such as HDU, ED and surgery.
Saying they’ve had 18 months to prepare doesn’t mean the healthcare systems are actually in a position to cope, they’ve spent the time firefighting the other issues that are endemic in our underfunded, under resourced and understaffed hospitals.

The government always says they have provided beds, 100 more beds here, 800 more beds there. It's easy to build wings and add equipment, but you can not reach into a bag and pull out doctors and nurses without many years of lead time, we already import a huge amount of doctors due to the shortfall here. Add to that specialist doctors, surgeons and nurses who are actually useful in ICU. The idea is just to make em work longer and more isolated, all the while exposed to a virus that could incapacitate them for years, yeah, great for the health system.

Highly unlikely given McGowan has been interviewed by several local WA News outlets and has stated the same rhetoric that the border opening to NSW, ACT & VIC will be months away. In the meantime WA is open to SA/TAS/NT & QLD (with Quarantine).

In NSW case they are still working on the document. I sail with some ER / Doctors and while we are not NSW the basics has been discussed by all states. The basics of the ER system as it stands is most serious case gets attention first. In the a case of a complete melt down of ICU system the reverse will be instigated. The case with the best chance of survival will be treated first also to a lessor extent the one that going to take less time in the ICU. The big difference is medical staff will also have the ability to withdraw care for anyone if their chances of survival get to low. Vacination helps with all of these things, so all other things being equal if the vacinated person has a better chance of survival they will get the bed. That will the consideration regardless of it being covid, car accident , drug overdose. They will be looking at the patients and treating the one with the best chance of survival

**edit** think the numbers have stabilised enough in NSW that it wont get to that point so its hopefully a moot conversation

Fully vaxed patients in ICU has remained steady in NSW for sometime, as of today only 17% fully vax in ICU.

I do believe the 36 figure isn't fully vaccinated, if I'm looking at the same figure you are (36) as it says it doesn't discriminate between one or both vaccinations. But you are still right, it has been static all week, despite a 20% increase in ICU Covid patients.

I'd be really interested in knowing if any of those 36 have significant co-morbidities. The KRviatrix and I both had our 2nd shots last week. Didn't bother me in the slightest, but it sat her on her asre for 2 days, in bed with the chills, then feverish, then the chills again and that made me wonder, if we were to both get Covid, without being vaccinated, would I be one of those to shrug it off and she'd wind up in ICU? I dunno?

The Israeli study on Pfizer was pretty telling that in the two weeks after the first jab you were not much better off than those with none, but by day 24, which was double jab and 10 days you virtually had no chance of severe symptoms. So it's pretty critical to think of "fully vaccinated" as double dose plus 2 weeks.

Either one or two doses, the data is there. 1 dose is better than no dose.

WA not allowing NSW in at all for Xmas

QLD if I read it correctly are allowing essential workers into QLD.

Essential workers have always been allowed in QLD just people were trying to use the NSW definition of essential and not the QLD. Now the border bubble is back, hell froze over today. Bruz actually thanked the QLD government for it during the morning press conference

From the NSW surveillance report ending 21 August

Of the 1,692 people hospitalised as a result of COVID-19 in the current outbreak, 248 (15%) people were in ICU of which 211 (85.1%) were unvaccinated or whose vaccination status is unknown, and 35 (14.1%) were partially vaccinated or had a single dose within 14 days. There were 2 (0.8%) fully vaccinated cases admitted to ICU.

https://www.health.nsw.gov.au/Infect...t-20210904.pdf

Got my coercion letter from the corrupt Govt yesterday begging me to take the poison up the ass, I feel wanted-)
The fear continues for so many, amongst these pages, love it! -)

I would be scared as well if someone told me it went in there!

I just got it in the shoulder....

Living in fear? Come on.

So many brave ‘Freedom Fighters’ scared of a jab in the arm.

It’s only a little prick. I’m pretty sure you’ve seen one of those.