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Covid Shot - Side Effects?

Old 17th Jul 2021, 13:31
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Yeah, fair point, but are we ever going to get to the point where we can protect everyone - even those who won't get vaccinated? That seems to be what our pollies want so that the insta mums in Bondi and Byron can conscientiously object, keep their kids vax free and ride off the coat tails of everyone else's vaccination.
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Old 17th Jul 2021, 13:33
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I've just read that Sydney going into total lockdown for a couple of weeks. To be fair, I only read the headline but it seemed to suggest that it was extremely strict.
How is that necessary when apparently nobody's been allowed in or out of Australia for 18 months?
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Old 17th Jul 2021, 13:36
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Originally Posted by DHfan
From Wiki:
The U.S. Centers for Disease Control has warned that data from VAERS is not enough to determine whether a vaccine can cause a particular adverse event.
People can believe what they like, but personally I'd no more believe VAERS than a random bloke in the street.
But you believe what you read on Wikipaedia? That's astounding.

Originally Posted by dr dre
The problem is the the tactics anti vaxxers use to trick people is they make their arguments just convincing enough to make people hesitant. If they out and out said “vaccines will make you grow a second head” most people would realise they are nuts.

What they do is dress up their arguments with what just appears to be enough credibility, by taking stats from official sources but using them out of context or not how the authors of the stats intended them to be used......

......Soundssort of official and like the poster knows what they’re talking about, right?
The style you've described sounds remarkably similar to your own. Is this a case of "it takes one to know one"? Or, "You can't bulls**t a bulls**tter"? I suspect that while your researched opinions sound somewhat plausible on here, you would most likely stumble in a live debate or a heated pub discussion. Why is it okay (in your mind) when you do it but it's a capital offence for someone else with an opposing opinion to do the same thing?

Originally Posted by Chronic Snoozer
Why not?
No particular reason. I only mentioned what I did to save any rabies-sufferer from jumping to a conclusion and derailing the thread with a rant about my status.
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Old 17th Jul 2021, 13:38
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Originally Posted by DHfan
I've just read that Sydney going into total lockdown for a couple of weeks. To be fair, I only read the headline but it seemed to suggest that it was extremely strict.
How is that necessary when apparently nobody's been allowed in or out of Australia for 18 months?
Because quarantine's been a complete clusterf^&k and so Delta has broken in to an Australian population which is basically unvaccinated because the vaccine rollout is also a complete clusterf%^k.
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Old 17th Jul 2021, 14:12
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Originally Posted by Muttley Crew
l I suspect that while your researched opinions sound somewhat plausible on here, you would most likely stumble in a live debate or a heated pub discussion.
Youíre actually right. Iíd probably lose an argument in a pub which is a contest of who can yell the most emotive talking points out the most forcefully.

I would prefer to take the time to research what I say before I say it, back up my statements with data from credible sources, and instead of automatically believing everything Iím told by the biggest loudmouth in the pub read up on what actual experts in that field say.

And everything Iíve read from acknowledged experts in the vaccine field is pretty definite.

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Old 17th Jul 2021, 14:44
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Originally Posted by Muttley Crew
But you believe what you read on Wikipaedia? That's astounding.
Not necessarily, I sometimes use it as a quick resource.
But

If this bit wasn't true, I imagine it would have been removed:
The U.S. Centers for Disease Control has warned that data from VAERS is not enough to determine whether a vaccine can cause a particular adverse event.

If you don't believe that bit, it's astounding.
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Old 17th Jul 2021, 19:18
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Originally Posted by dr dre
And everything I’ve read from acknowledged experts in the vaccine field is pretty definite.
acknowledged according to who?! The same “experts” that put us in this big mess with now a Delta variant that is proven to spread more in vaccinated individuals? Look at Israel, the UK; perfect exemple of a BIG fail. Not so impressed by the “experts” so far!

Last edited by RMP2; 17th Jul 2021 at 21:59.
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Old 17th Jul 2021, 23:01
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Originally Posted by Muttley Crew
Originally Posted by DHfan
From Wiki: Due to the program's open and accessible design and its allowance of unverified reports, incomplete VAERS data is often used in false claims regarding vaccine safety. The U.S. Centers for Disease Control has warned that data from VAERS is not enough to determine whether a vaccine can cause a particular adverse event. People can believe what they like, but personally I'd no more believe VAERS than a random bloke in the street.
But you believe what you read on Wikipaedia? That's astounding.
Well, forget Wikipedia, what about what the CDC say about VAERS on its landing page?
​​​​​​
​​​​
VAERS accepts and analyzes reports of possible health problems—also called “adverse events”—after vaccination. As an early warning system, VAERS cannot prove that a vaccine caused a problem. Specifically, a report to VAERS does not mean that a vaccine caused an adverse event. But VAERS can give CDC and FDA important information. If it looks as though a vaccine might be causing a problem, FDA and CDC will investigate further and take action if needed.

Anyone can submit a report to VAERS — healthcare professionals, vaccine manufacturers, and the general public. VAERS welcomes all reports, regardless of seriousness, and regardless of how likely the vaccine may have been to have caused the adverse event.
That's the CDC's bolding.


Point 5 expands on the caution in the bolded text.

Last edited by MickG0105; 17th Jul 2021 at 23:02. Reason: Formatting
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Old 18th Jul 2021, 00:11
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Originally Posted by RMP2
acknowledged according to who?! The same ďexpertsĒ that put us in this big mess with now a Delta variant that is proven to spread more in vaccinated individuals? Look at Israel, the UK; perfect exemple of a BIG fail. Not so impressed by the ďexpertsĒ so far!
How have the experts (I assume you mean the ones saying vaccines will end the pandemic) been proven wrong with the Delta variant? Even with Delta the death rate from this spike in the UK is minuscule compared to previous variants. Look at the graphs:







See how itís almost remained flat for the last few weeks? Thatís vaccines at work. If vaccines were having a BIG fail the daily UK deaths would be about 500 by now.
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Old 18th Jul 2021, 05:16
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Is that because of the vaccine or the mutation in the virus?
If one argues that the majority of UK residents catching Delta Covid are unvaccinated then the theory of evolution has to come into play. I mean they were not vaccinated so why aren’t they dying?
I think current estimates are that the exponential infection growth in UK....now at 50000 plus cases a day.... is 70% non vaccinated.There should be huge death numbers but not so! With such high unvaccinated cases how does one justify the argument that it’s the effect of vaccination?
The other thing that bothers me is this risk to benefit mantra.
In Australia since the beginning of this pandemic there has been 1 death in the 10 to 29 year age group. A total of 9646 cases! That’s a fatality rate of 0.01%. Should this group be exposed to unknown risks with experimental vaccines that may reduce this rate to 0.0005%.
Dont get me wrong, because I too think that if these vaccines are shown to reduce illness by the claimed 90% then that would benefit the elderly with fatality rates of 9.3% 70-79 years and 29.0% in the 80 to 89 years group.
Risk to benefit where it is warranted. Sticking this **** into a 12 year old is sickening.
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Old 18th Jul 2021, 05:33
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Originally Posted by common cents
Is that because of the vaccine or the mutation in the virus?
If one argues that the majority of UK residents catching Delta Covid are unvaccinated then the theory of evolution has to come into play. I mean they were not vaccinated so why arenít they dying?
I think current estimates are that the exponential infection growth in UK....now at 50000 plus cases a day.... is 70% non vaccinated.There should be huge death numbers but not so! With such high unvaccinated cases how does one justify the argument that itís the effect of vaccination?
The other thing that bothers me is this risk to benefit mantra.
In Australia since the beginning of this pandemic there has been 1 death in the 10 to 29 year age group. A total of 9646 cases! Thatís a fatality rate of 0.01%. Should this group be exposed to unknown risks with experimental vaccines that may reduce this rate to 0.0005%.
Dont get me wrong, because I too think that if these vaccines are shown to reduce illness by the claimed 90% then that would benefit the elderly with fatality rates of 9.3% 70-79 years and 29.0% in the 80 to 89 years group.
Risk to benefit where it is warranted. Sticking this **** into a 12 year old is sickening.
In the UK, cases are spiking in younger people who are less likely to be vaccinated. Younger people are much less likely to die from COVID too, so cases are going up, but deaths not so much. There are now more deaths in the UK from vaccinated than non-vaccinated as age is by far the biggest influence on death. A vaccinated 70yr old is at greater risk than an unvaccinated 35yr old.
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Old 18th Jul 2021, 05:44
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Originally Posted by Potsie Weber
In the UK, cases are spiking in younger people who are less likely to be vaccinated. Younger people are much less likely to die from COVID too, so cases are going up, but deaths not so much. There are now more deaths in the UK from vaccinated than non-vaccinated as age is by far the biggest influence on death. A vaccinated 70yr old is at greater risk than an unvaccinated 35yr old.
So should we be vaccinating and introducing risk in young people or just the elderly?
Also for the purposes of Covid risk how would we define “ young people “?
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Old 18th Jul 2021, 05:45
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Originally Posted by Muttley Crew
But you believe what you read on Wikipaedia?

it has been infested by the left, like most media and so called fact checkers.

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Old 18th Jul 2021, 08:55
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Originally Posted by common cents
Sticking this **** into a 12 year old is sickening.
Obviously no common sense (sic) referring to it as **** means your posts should be immediately discounted.
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Old 18th Jul 2021, 09:25
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Originally Posted by common cents
Risk to benefit where it is warranted. Sticking this **** into a 12 year old is sickening.
We have vaccines for Meningococcal. They are were developed this century, and approved for use only a few years after being created. They are administered to children at 12 months of age, and if parents refuse theyíll lose welfare and their kids will be denied admittance to childcare.

So my question is were you as equally as vocal against all the vaccines that were never approved after trials of the test subjects as they went through childhood and puberty?

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Old 18th Jul 2021, 10:14
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Boris Johnston had it
Prince Charles had it
Donald Trump had it
Tom Hanks had it, so did his missus
Valentino Rossi had it

Do I need to keep going? All better remarkably quickly without the vaccine they are touting.

I agree, sticking this stuff into kids this early in the testing phase is sickening. So is locking them down.
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Old 18th Jul 2021, 10:53
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Originally Posted by dr dre
We have vaccines for Meningococcal. They are were developed this century, and approved for use only a few years after being created. They are administered to children at 12 months of age, and if parents refuse theyíll lose welfare and their kids will be denied admittance to childcare.

So my question is were you as equally as vocal against all the vaccines that were never approved after trials of the test subjects as they went through childhood and puberty?
No not at all. Contrary to what you might believe I am not against tried tested safe and proven vaccines or medications of any kind.
As you said Meningococcal and indeed many other vaccines were approved only after a few years of safety data. These current new and untested technologies should be thoroughly developed through proper safety analysis over a few years before use.
The difference in this case is a sense of urgency brought about by this pandemic. Thatís understandable but my question stands. Should we be injecting this **** or maybe I should say crap lest I offend DHfan again, into the arms of children and young adults .With a known recovery rate of 99.9% in this age group the risk to benefit just doesnít seem justifiable. By all means jab the elderly or the vulnerable because thatís where the real emergency seems to exist.

I am sure that the big pharmaceutical companies, our government, and the medical community have the most honourable of intentions. Is that enough to act on though? Or do we adopt a wait and see approach until the science is truly in?

Ultimately we are all free to exercise intelligent judgment and decide on an action.....at least for the present time.
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Old 18th Jul 2021, 11:07
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I'm not offended by the word but you have such a blinkered opinion I'm surprised you haven't called it poison or gene therapy yet like some .... I'll leave it blank.
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Old 18th Jul 2021, 11:41
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Originally Posted by DHfan
I'm not offended by the word but you have such a blinkered opinion I'm surprised you haven't called it poison or gene therapy yet like some .... I'll leave it blank.
No need to leave it blank on my account. Iíve got broad shoulders .
Your characterisation of my post is indeed just an opinion. Your opinion.
I posed a legitimate question about the use of this experimental vaccine in young people. Thatís a question not an opinion.
Maybe I can form an opinion if you can provide me with a sensible answer.
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Old 19th Jul 2021, 00:00
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If Aussie kids were dying of COVID and no ICU beds available, there would be less fashionable dogma with the risk assessment of vaccines.

But whilst the government hands out money and much of the middle class watch their personal wealth increase, a good percentage can grandstand in a defiance afforded the Lucky Country. Yet so many Aussie kids are fat. Idle, bellies filled with the unknowns of processed foods and high sugared diets. Many are destined for critical health issues in their twenties and thirties, you may even wonder if some of these kids are actually more at risk from COVID effects than being "poisoned" by "untrialled" vaccines.
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