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Old 1st Nov 2020, 06:20
  #1961 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ragnor View Post
They can take it up with their member of parliament. At this stage I only care NSW residents fly in to Sydney to keep them safe.
Ok Iíll leave this now. Australia is a country, it should be a united country, it is far from that.

Quarantine is in place for a reason, sure we can debate home quarantine and other methods but the gov has decided it hotel quarantine.

Australians stuck around the world just need to get home, who really cares where? Yes in an ideal world to where they want to go but that ainít happening. Welcome them anywhere, do a little research and see the heartache many have gone though to get home.

Back to open borders -

It is great to see Aus opening up, bring on domestic tourism!
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 06:55
  #1962 (permalink)  
 
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Hey I want open borders but certain states have made it political. One state just voted on it so let’s make them realize what they actually voted for and NSW be selective who comes, only NSW residents. I want to be one country but, as seen recently we are apparently not. I’m livid at the situation and how it is being handled now we will be flying to Melbourne before QLD and that to me is just wrong.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 07:51
  #1963 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by C441 View Post
And as an aside…… the Greens candidate in our electorate is third on first preferences (28%), but is in the box seat to win once preferences are distributed, currently leading the sitting Labor candidate 53% to 47%. It does make one wonder sometimes…..
Ordinarily it would be highly unusual for a candidate placed third on primary votes to win a seat once preferences are distributed. Not impossible but certainly highly unusual.

Based on the info you've shared I've inferred that you're in Grace Grace's seat of McConell where the Greens' Kirsten Lovejoy is third behind the LNP's Pinky Singh. For Lovejoy to take that seat she needs to be ahead of Singh at the sixth round of preference distributions such that she picks up the LNP's preferences. That is very unlikely to occur. Lovejoy currently trails Singh by 710 votes and there are 1,255 votes for fourth place and below candidates. Lovejoy's problem is that 437 of those votes are split between One Nation and Palmer's UAP so she's not likely to pick up many of them whereas Singh should pick some, if not most, of them up. There's also anti-Greens independent Miranda Bertram's 175 votes that will go anywhere other than to Lovejoy.

Even if Lovejoy picks up all other preferences she will not finish ahead Singh come the sixth round of distributions meaning that she will be eliminated and her votes will be distributed as preferences; they will flow predominantly to Labor. Grace will end up retaining the seat with about a 60/40 2PP.

Last edited by MickG0105; 1st Nov 2020 at 10:36. Reason: Typo
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 08:21
  #1964 (permalink)  
 
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You people still don't get it.

All the noise "blaming" the premier of QLD re borders got everybody believing it was her decision to make.

Meaning she also got to take the credit, for a decision she didn't make.

Sad really, single issue election, decided on an illusion.

"These directions have all been made under the Queensland Chief Health Officer’s power to give directs to assist in containing, or to respond to, the spread of COVID-19 within the community"

https://justiceconnect.org.au/resour...covid-19-work/

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Old 1st Nov 2020, 08:23
  #1965 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by C441 View Post

And as an asideÖÖ the Greens candidate in our electorate is third on first preferences (28%), but is in the box seat to win once preferences are distributed, currently leading the sitting Labor candidate 53% to 47%. It does make one wonder sometimesÖ..
Federally the Greens generally get 10% of the primary vote but do not have 10% of the representation. Nats on the other hand....
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 08:48
  #1966 (permalink)  
 
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I watched Gladiator a few nights ago, and one comment that Marcus Aurelius said to Maximus was "My powers will transfer
to you Maximus, Commodus cannot become Emperor, he is not a moral man. I want you Maximus to end the senators
corruption and free Rome."

Well here we are 2000 years on nothing has changed.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 08:51
  #1967 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ladloy View Post
Federally the Greens generally get 10% of the primary vote but do not have 10% of the representation. Nats on the other hand....
Iíll bet that sounds impressive to you but thatís the way our democracy works. The National Party wins seats with much more than 10% of the votes IN THAT SEAT.

Seeing that weíre making unsupported assertions, I would argue that the Greens exercise vastly more power and more media attention than is justified by their ~10% support.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 10:07
  #1968 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by JustinHeywood View Post
Iíll bet that sounds impressive to you but thatís the way our democracy works. The National Party wins seats with much more than 10% of the votes IN THAT SEAT.

Seeing that weíre making unsupported assertions, I would argue that the Greens exercise vastly more power and more media attention than is justified by their ~10% support.
It's not impressive and you missed my point. I was essentially saying the same thing, that's how democracy works. If you want to talk about power and media attention, look at the constant corruption by Nationals members and the zero media attention it garners. Water Buy backs by Barnarby, Sports rort, everything that Barilaro does, Michael Mccormick helping out his mates from Rex. It seems to be silenced by the newscorp media pretty ******* quick.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 10:12
  #1969 (permalink)  
 
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ex the ECQ: Compulsory Preferential Voting- and associated Definitions.....

Compulsory Preferential Voting in QLD.....

rgds all
S28- BE

ECQ link here: https://www.ecq.qld.gov.au/how-to-vote/voting-systems

an Extract:

Counting a full preference vote

  • The first step is checking each vote is formal by ensuring all the boxes are properly numbered on the ballot paper.
  • Polling officials then count first preferences by looking for the number one (1) next to a candidate’s name and allocating the vote to that person.
  • Next, the person with the lowest number of first preference votes is eliminated from the count and their second preferences are allocated to the remaining candidates.
  • Now, the next person with the lowest number of votes is eliminated and their preferences are distributed.
  • This process of elimination continues until just two candidates remain and one has the majority of votes.
  • Once the result is clear, the Commission declares the successful candidate.
Media from- When 'it' happened, ex 2016:

Ex ABC News: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-04-...s-bill/7348172

Ex the BNE Times: https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/nat...21-goc3bs.html
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 10:31
  #1970 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ladloy View Post
Federally the Greens generally get 10% of the primary vote but do not have 10% of the representation. Nats on the other hand....
That's in the House of Reps under full preferential voting. That is not the case in the Senate under proportional representation voting; in the Senate the Greens are marginally over-represented.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 10:50
  #1971 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ladloy View Post
It's not impressive and you missed my point. I was essentially saying the same thing, that's how democracy works. If you want to talk about power and media attention, look at the constant corruption by Nationals members and the zero media attention it garners. Water Buy backs by Barnarby, Sports rort, everything that Barilaro does, Michael Mccormick helping out his mates from Rex. It seems to be silenced by the newscorp media pretty ******* quick.
So the evil Newscorp somehow Ďsilencesí the ABC, Fairfax, Guardian etc about massive LNP corruption? Makes no sense at all.

Thatís the trouble with this whole border issue. When we should be sensibly pulling together, too many idiots on all sides just make it all about their personal political hobbyhorse.

Itís too big an issue to be looking at it only with our partisan political glasses.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 11:08
  #1972 (permalink)  
 
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"That’s the trouble with this whole border issue. When we should be sensibly pulling together, too many idiots on all sides just make it all about their personal political hobbyhorse."

Too right.

Often thought watching the reportage of late, "how is that meant to help?"
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 11:59
  #1973 (permalink)  
 
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Drive around Cairns. Tourism might be open but are trading on average 70% down. Many actually had less cash burn with closed businesses and jobkeeper active. I know some have actually closed all together not even risking the upcoming wet season which is expected to bring a drenching for months.

Much support was offered this election around tourism marketing. Zero point of nobody can come. The CNY crowds wonít be coming in a few months, and god help us if a cyclone rolls on in soon, which appears bloody likely!
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 13:56
  #1974 (permalink)  
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The s#!t will hit the fan on Qld when JK stops.
If the Qld Govt was picking up the tab for JK, the borders would have been opened long ago what ever the CMO said.
Actually come to think of it, the CMO did say that money counts, but only if you are a "star" be it film or sport.
People who have real jobs don't count.


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Old 1st Nov 2020, 19:08
  #1975 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by currawong View Post
You people still don't get it.

All the noise "blaming" the premier of QLD re borders got everybody believing it was her decision to make.

Meaning she also got to take the credit, for a decision she didn't make.

Sad really, single issue election, decided on an illusion.

"These directions have all been made under the Queensland Chief Health Officer’s power to give directs to assist in containing, or to respond to, the spread of COVID-19 within the community"

https://justiceconnect.org.au/resour...covid-19-work/

Excuse me “you people”

How do you explain WA CMO recommending it’s safe to open their border months ago but WA premier overrides that CMO. We only know that because of a Clive Palmer.

Same reason Queen P won’t release QLD CMO documents on her decisions on the border it’s all a big secret. JY only says what she is told to say at the press conferences.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 19:59
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Originally Posted by JustinHeywood View Post
So the evil Newscorp somehow Ďsilencesí the ABC, Fairfax, Guardian etc about massive LNP corruption? Makes no sense at all.

Thatís the trouble with this whole border issue. When we should be sensibly pulling together, too many idiots on all sides just make it all about their personal political hobbyhorse.

Itís too big an issue to be looking at it only with our partisan political glasses.
Fairfax is headed by Costello, ABC by Buttrose who is hesvily tied to the LNP and no one takes the Guardian seriously. The narrative is controlled, just look at the last 20 years of newscorp supporting the LNP at every state election. A news conglomerate should be independent. There's the partisan stain we have on our society.

Everyone is sensibly pulling together in their respective states as border closures are incredibly popular especially in WA and Tas. QLD now made their decision that they support border closures too. We suffer as airline employees and so does the tourism industry. Vic has now pulled its head in, hopefully everything will be open soon.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 21:19
  #1977 (permalink)  
 
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For Lovejoy to take that seat she needs to be ahead of Singh at the sixth round of preference distributions such that she picks up the LNP's preferences. That is very unlikely to occur. Lovejoy currently trails Singh by 710 votes and there are 1,255 votes for fourth place and below candidates. Lovejoy's problem is that 437 of those votes are split between One Nation and Palmer's UAP so she's not likely to pick up many of them whereas Singh should pick some, if not most, of them up.
Yep, absolutely correct. I was looking at earlier figures where the projection was that the Greens candidate would slightly outpoll the LNP even though she was 400 votes behind at the time. Grace Grace, the Labor incumbent, seems now certain to retain the seat.
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Old 1st Nov 2020, 23:27
  #1978 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by C441 View Post
Grace Grace, the Labor incumbent, seems now certain to retain the seat.
This time, yes. Plenty of alarm bells ringing for Ignazia Graziella though. McConell in 2020 looks similar enough to South Brisbane in 2017 for the Greens to be thinking that it's gettable in 2024.
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Old 2nd Nov 2020, 02:42
  #1979 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ragnor View Post
Excuse me “you people”

How do you explain WA CMO recommending it’s safe to open their border months ago but WA premier overrides that CMO. We only know that because of a Clive Palmer.

Same reason Queen P won’t release QLD CMO documents on her decisions on the border it’s all a big secret. JY only says what she is told to say at the press conferences.
I will say this really slowly so you understand.

QLD is not WA.

They have different systems. Both of which are different to NSW.

Control passed to the CHO in QLD on January 29 this year when the health emergency was declared (in QLD) Includes legislative powers.

No need to call it in NSW as the CMO already has extensive powers. Extensive meaning "any means necessary" extensive.

https://www.health.qld.gov.au/system...lth-act-powers

"Who makes the decision to close Queensland's borders?"

"On paper, it's Chief Health Officer Dr Jeannette Young, but she would be discussing those decisions with key players in the Government."

"Does the Premier have any say on the border?"


"Although the final decision is made by the CHO, the Premier is able to contribute information that the State Government considers relevant."

Source - Bond University Law Professor Jonathan Crowe

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-10-...harge/12753776

Last edited by currawong; 2nd Nov 2020 at 02:53.
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Old 2nd Nov 2020, 03:21
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Originally Posted by currawong View Post
I will say this really slowly so you understand.

QLD is not WA.

They have different systems. Both of which are different to NSW.

Control passed to the CHO in QLD on January 29 this year when the health emergency was declared (in QLD) Includes legislative powers.

No need to call it in NSW as the CMO already has extensive powers. Extensive meaning "any means necessary" extensive.

https://www.health.qld.gov.au/system...lth-act-powers

"Who makes the decision to close Queensland's borders?"

"On paper, it's Chief Health Officer Dr Jeannette Young, but she would be discussing those decisions with key players in the Government."

"Does the Premier have any say on the border?"


"Although the final decision is made by the CHO, the Premier is able to contribute information that the State Government considers relevant."

Source - Bond University Law Professor Jonathan Crowe

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-10-...harge/12753776
What a load of rubbish. The CHO holds their role at the complete discretion of the premier so, in effect, the CHO will do whatever the premier tells her to. So the relevant information that the state government contributes is "do it or else"!
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