Jetstar EBA 2019
But of all the agreements since QF IR came up with this policy that seems to be made up on the whim of Joyce, this JQ proposal looks to be the greatest in terms of monetary gains. The increase of 20 odd percent to base salary over the life of the agreement is not something to be sneezed at.
Sounds similar to this deal with the BOOT allowance.
I’ve not read the fine details of either EA so I am happy to be corrected.
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This, is spot on! Qantas group employees are being taken for mugs. Now is the time to hold your head high and fight for decent wage outcomes. Forget bribe bonuses. Forget the backpay. They go into your account and once spent, are never seen again. It's an on-going improvement on your base pay that you want. I don't know about about other employee groups, but there is a world wide shortage of engineers. I'm hearing sections of Qantas engineering are bleeding manpower at a rate never seen before and that some of the dubious labour hire suppliers are fishing around for staff in SE Asia but the wage vs cost of living sums in moving to Australia do not add up!
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In the end I guess its fairly simple.
If you dont feel that you are worthy of the conditions, respect and remuneration offered to others within the group, Vote Yes.
If you are happy voting to take a pay freeze after nearly 2 years of not being paid whilst your managers and counterparts in other entities were, Vote Yes.
If lifestyle and quality time away from work doesnt matter to you, Vote Yes.
If you have gorged on the Kool-aid and believe that because you work for a low cost carrier you are are a low cost person and not worthy of respect, Vote Yes.
Bring on the Vote.
MCD
If you dont feel that you are worthy of the conditions, respect and remuneration offered to others within the group, Vote Yes.
If you are happy voting to take a pay freeze after nearly 2 years of not being paid whilst your managers and counterparts in other entities were, Vote Yes.
If lifestyle and quality time away from work doesnt matter to you, Vote Yes.
If you have gorged on the Kool-aid and believe that because you work for a low cost carrier you are are a low cost person and not worthy of respect, Vote Yes.
Bring on the Vote.
MCD
You still haven't answered my questions, but you have joined the clearice admiration society:
Lookleft, do you even work for Jetstar?
What is it you want?
What are you going to do to get it?
Lookleft, do you even work for Jetstar?
What is it you want?
What are you going to do to get it?
a. Too stupid to find out
b. Too lazy to find out
c. Too ignorant to find out
d. All of the above
If you get your 50%+1 yes vote then its BAU at Jetstar and the pilots can expect to be treated with the usual disdain and contempt from all parts of the Company. If it is a no vote then you and your cohort will be exposed for the charlatans that you are.
The Chief Pilot of a very successful international Low Cost Carrier once said to me: "Low Cost STOPS outside the Flight Deck Door"
Does the Jetstar CEO earn a Low Cost salary - No, he is the second highest earner in the Qantas Group...
Last edited by RealSatoshi; 27th Oct 2022 at 01:32.
CEO of second largest business in the Group being the second largest “earner” in the Group? I’m shocked! (even if it is true). At any rate, what’s that got to do with us, this is a business, we’re not CEO’s..
i wonder just how more ridiculous some of this could sound! 😆
And WTFAY to be demanding answers or are you the head of the STASI from the Always Failing Australian Pilots? If I am living rent free in your head then your IQ might be raised a few points but look at others who are posting and the level of anger with the proposal and the company. If you genuinely have to ask the question as to who I work for then you are:
a. Too stupid to find out
b. Too lazy to find out
c. Too ignorant to find out
d. All of the above
If you get your 50%+1 yes vote then its BAU at Jetstar and the pilots can expect to be treated with the usual disdain and contempt from all parts of the Company. If it is a no vote then you and your cohort will be exposed for the charlatans that you are.
a. Too stupid to find out
b. Too lazy to find out
c. Too ignorant to find out
d. All of the above
If you get your 50%+1 yes vote then its BAU at Jetstar and the pilots can expect to be treated with the usual disdain and contempt from all parts of the Company. If it is a no vote then you and your cohort will be exposed for the charlatans that you are.
Last edited by FOI; 27th Oct 2022 at 10:32.
If the perception of a few more bucks floats your boat in a US regional airline, catch you later! Don't just threaten it; show some stones, drop your precious seniority number and safe life in Australia and give it a go legends!
In the end I guess its fairly simple.
If you dont feel that you are worthy of the conditions, respect and remuneration offered to others within the group, Vote Yes.
If you are happy voting to take a pay freeze after nearly 2 years of not being paid whilst your managers and counterparts in other entities were, Vote Yes.
If lifestyle and quality time away from work doesnt matter to you, Vote Yes.
If you have gorged on the Kool-aid and believe that because you work for a low cost carrier you are are a low cost person and not worthy of respect, Vote Yes.
Bring on the Vote.
MCD
If you dont feel that you are worthy of the conditions, respect and remuneration offered to others within the group, Vote Yes.
If you are happy voting to take a pay freeze after nearly 2 years of not being paid whilst your managers and counterparts in other entities were, Vote Yes.
If lifestyle and quality time away from work doesnt matter to you, Vote Yes.
If you have gorged on the Kool-aid and believe that because you work for a low cost carrier you are are a low cost person and not worthy of respect, Vote Yes.
Bring on the Vote.
MCD
1. If you’re an adult and realise that there’s only a certain number of airline pilot jobs spread over different companies, all with different business models, and you’re lucky enough to have one of those jobs in this small country, and that job was about to give you a 20%+ payrise by mid 2025, with 12% straight up, you’d vote YES,
2. If you realise that in fact being on an EBA where you have increasing choices regarding your work arrangements, like part-time, full-time, carers lines, highline, no highline, financial protection when delayed into a DDO, increases in all allowances, then you’d vote YES,
3. If you consider the companies investment in additional state of the art new aircraft (not B737 MAX’s either..), diversity in network, quick promotions (particularly when compared to QF, whose backyard we feel compelled to peer into constantly), growth and prosperity that leads to a long career and stable employment, you’d vote YES,
4. If you recognise improvements in the leave system in terms of leave available and access to six weeks + a year, you’d vote YES.
However, if you’re just angry, don’t really know why, believe everything’s a conspiracy, the company - your employer, is making a specific project out of ruining your life by making you come to work, whilst it pays your mortgage and puts your kids through school and funds a far better retirement prospect than most of the population. Then I guess you have to vote NO.
As the PPrune grandstanding prophet MCD has put it, “bring on the vote”.
1. If you’re an adult and realise that there’s only a certain number of airline pilot jobs spread over different companies, all with different business models, and you’re lucky enough to have one of those jobs in this small country, and that job was about to give you a 20%+ payrise by mid 2025, with 12% straight up, you’d vote YES,
3. If you consider the companies investment in additional state of the art new aircraft (not B737 MAX’s either..), diversity in network, quick promotions (particularly when compared to QF, whose backyard we feel compelled to peer into constantly), growth and prosperity that leads to a long career and stable employment, you’d vote YES,
All of us know very well why we're angry.
Last edited by das Uber Soldat; 27th Oct 2022 at 12:20.
You’re right, it is simple FOI:
1. If you’re a fool and don't realise that there’s the worldnis a significantly bigger than Australian aviation and that job was about to give you a 20%+ payrise by mid 2025 which is FAR below the industry average locally and internationally, which still doesn't make way for the 2015 pay freeze which was promised to be recovered and only given that much because it's directed by the award, you’d vote YES,
2. If you realise that in fact being on an EBA where you don't have easy access to different arrangements, Flexi and carers lines, highline which is unreasonable as a level 2/3 FO, financial protection when delayed into a DDO at half rate and still no protection of your DDO because **** you all, the minimum increases in all allowances because again it's derived off what the minimum requirement, then you’d vote YES,
3. If you consider the companies investment in additional state of the art new aircraft where you might get a command in 8-10 years and you will never see the left seat of a wide body, where compared to QF with turn over and resignations you will get a WB command with in 16-18 years making it a feasible and broad range work environment compared to max overnights and paxing, no protections with rosters and no duty travel protection and a bidding system that's broken and a guaranteed 75.1 hours a month to make you take 4 standby days, you’d vote YES,
4. If you recognise the leave system has been broken for decades and now the company will make you take time off when you don't want it, you’d vote YES. However, if you’re sick of putting out fires every day you go into work because of lack of support, resources and manpower, want a better work life balance and a lower EFA, better protections for your work, duty travel, roster, OT and DDO's, hotels and transport standards and a cultural shift then potentially this isn't the deal for you.
Weigh up the priorities, read the document, don't believe anything that's not in writing and dismiss "promises"..
FOI you're not helping anyone when you spread misinformation like you are.
1. If you’re a fool and don't realise that there’s the worldnis a significantly bigger than Australian aviation and that job was about to give you a 20%+ payrise by mid 2025 which is FAR below the industry average locally and internationally, which still doesn't make way for the 2015 pay freeze which was promised to be recovered and only given that much because it's directed by the award, you’d vote YES,
2. If you realise that in fact being on an EBA where you don't have easy access to different arrangements, Flexi and carers lines, highline which is unreasonable as a level 2/3 FO, financial protection when delayed into a DDO at half rate and still no protection of your DDO because **** you all, the minimum increases in all allowances because again it's derived off what the minimum requirement, then you’d vote YES,
3. If you consider the companies investment in additional state of the art new aircraft where you might get a command in 8-10 years and you will never see the left seat of a wide body, where compared to QF with turn over and resignations you will get a WB command with in 16-18 years making it a feasible and broad range work environment compared to max overnights and paxing, no protections with rosters and no duty travel protection and a bidding system that's broken and a guaranteed 75.1 hours a month to make you take 4 standby days, you’d vote YES,
4. If you recognise the leave system has been broken for decades and now the company will make you take time off when you don't want it, you’d vote YES. However, if you’re sick of putting out fires every day you go into work because of lack of support, resources and manpower, want a better work life balance and a lower EFA, better protections for your work, duty travel, roster, OT and DDO's, hotels and transport standards and a cultural shift then potentially this isn't the deal for you.
Weigh up the priorities, read the document, don't believe anything that's not in writing and dismiss "promises"..
FOI you're not helping anyone when you spread misinformation like you are.
If you’re an adult and realise that there’s only a certain number of airline pilot jobs spread over different companies, all with different business models, and you’re lucky enough to have one of those jobs in this small country, and that job was about to give you a 20%+ payrise by mid 2025, with 12% straight up, you’d vote YES,
Last edited by RealSatoshi; 27th Oct 2022 at 15:53.
Who’s stopping anyone from pursuit of their utopia? Living a life of being subject to a visa in a country that goes boom to bust in a heartbeat, goes to war regularly, where the public carry guns around and kind of importantly.. where you’ll be arseholed out of there in a flash as soon as the economy turns. Think their unions will help you? No mate, they don’t want you there, and that will be brutally apparent more often than not.
If the perception of a few more bucks floats your boat in a US regional airline, catch you later! Don't just threaten it; show some stones, drop your precious seniority number and safe life in Australia and give it a go legends!
If the perception of a few more bucks floats your boat in a US regional airline, catch you later! Don't just threaten it; show some stones, drop your precious seniority number and safe life in Australia and give it a go legends!
how many E3 pilots were sent home to Australia during covid?
how many pilots at virgin and Qantas were stood down, and out of seniority?
If you’re trying to scaremonger, it would be advised if you backed it up with solid facts.
Interestingly the E3 pilots in the US faired wayy better, and were better looked after than pretty much anyone working/flying in Australia.
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FOI, once again thanks form the comedy routine.
You seem heavily invested in this EA getting up at the expence of most others.
I would happily vote for it if I thought it was a reasonable deal that had something for everyone. Sadly however, its not.
Its probably worth remembering, the pilot group has the final say. Not your tin pot union. No matter how you spin it or treat your members, we have the final say.
This has been beautifully illustrated with the deposing of the architect of this EA. When is he leaving again?
The credibility vortex is a difficult space for a union already struggling with a lack of tangible results for its members over a long period of time.
I guess that explains your attitude towards others. I understand your frustration but cant endorse your carry on. It is certainly an eye opener. I think I am wasting me union fees.
Lets vote .
MCD
You seem heavily invested in this EA getting up at the expence of most others.
I would happily vote for it if I thought it was a reasonable deal that had something for everyone. Sadly however, its not.
Its probably worth remembering, the pilot group has the final say. Not your tin pot union. No matter how you spin it or treat your members, we have the final say.
This has been beautifully illustrated with the deposing of the architect of this EA. When is he leaving again?
The credibility vortex is a difficult space for a union already struggling with a lack of tangible results for its members over a long period of time.
I guess that explains your attitude towards others. I understand your frustration but cant endorse your carry on. It is certainly an eye opener. I think I am wasting me union fees.
Lets vote .
MCD
Last edited by ManillaChillaDilla; 27th Oct 2022 at 20:55.
HHahhaahahahaahahahahaaha, this has to be the dumbest statement I’ve ever heard.
how many E3 pilots were sent home to Australia during covid?
how many pilots at virgin and Qantas were stood down, and out of seniority?
If you’re trying to scaremonger, it would be advised if you backed it up with solid facts.
Interestingly the E3 pilots in the US faired wayy better, and were better looked after than pretty much anyone working/flying in Australia.
how many E3 pilots were sent home to Australia during covid?
how many pilots at virgin and Qantas were stood down, and out of seniority?
If you’re trying to scaremonger, it would be advised if you backed it up with solid facts.
Interestingly the E3 pilots in the US faired wayy better, and were better looked after than pretty much anyone working/flying in Australia.
FOI, once again thanks form the comedy routine.
You seem heavily invested in this EA getting up at the expence of most others.
I would happily vote for it if I thought it was a reasonable deal that had something for everyone. Sadly however, its not.
Its probably worth remembering, the pilot group has the final say. Not your tin pot union. No matter how you spin it or treat your members, we have the final say.
This has been beautifully illustrated with the deposing of the architect of this EA. When is he leaving again?
The credibility vortex is a difficult space for a union already struggling with a lack of tangible results for its members over a long period of time.
I guess that explains your attitude towards others. I understand your frustration but cant endorse your carry on. It is certainly an eye opener. I think I am wasting me union fees.
Lets vote .
MCD
You seem heavily invested in this EA getting up at the expence of most others.
I would happily vote for it if I thought it was a reasonable deal that had something for everyone. Sadly however, its not.
Its probably worth remembering, the pilot group has the final say. Not your tin pot union. No matter how you spin it or treat your members, we have the final say.
This has been beautifully illustrated with the deposing of the architect of this EA. When is he leaving again?
The credibility vortex is a difficult space for a union already struggling with a lack of tangible results for its members over a long period of time.
I guess that explains your attitude towards others. I understand your frustration but cant endorse your carry on. It is certainly an eye opener. I think I am wasting me union fees.
Lets vote .
MCD
20 + % GET REAL
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The issue is very much the players involved.
No wonder the rank and file members are so fed up with this organisation and its divisive tactics.
Dont forget, if you are charging people membership fees, the AFAP is a service provider. If you dont provide the service your customers want, youve got a BIG problem.
5 Years to get to this point? Really???
MCD
No wonder the rank and file members are so fed up with this organisation and its divisive tactics.
Dont forget, if you are charging people membership fees, the AFAP is a service provider. If you dont provide the service your customers want, youve got a BIG problem.
5 Years to get to this point? Really???
MCD