Jetstar EBA 2019

[Mitch Vernon]

You guys need to do this!

Brilliant!

I'm in helicopters. A couple of EBA's ago the pilot group where I work had to take protected action. We got there in the end.

Stay the course!

Easter & School Holidays are coming up!

[crosscutter]

any update?

I’m guessing IR have an extra spring in their step this morning.

[The Bullwinkle]

Originally Posted by crosscutter

any update?

I’m guessing IR have an extra spring in their step this morning.

I was also wondering if there was any update.
Seems to have all gone quiet.

[LeeJoyce]

Ramp workers were informed they have lost the discretionary $2000 bonus

well I’d like to see that $600k put to good use, perhaps re investing it in the business to improve staff morale and addressing the actual reason that brought about strike action in the first place

[Chris2303]

Originally Posted by LeeJoyce

Ramp workers were informed they have lost the discretionary $2000 bonus

Why did they lose it?

[Ollie Onion]

So what has happened with the meetings, I thought that they had two meetings scheduled for earlier this week? Did they go ahead? Sadly the Jetstar pilots group is looking in an ever increasingly vulnerable position with the economy turning, the massive economic bomb that is about to hit thanks to the Corona-virus and the settlement of the Qantas Shorthaul EBA.

[Ragnor]

Well unfortunately for us, and the other Airlines the corona virus will hit hard even QF. It’s expected to cost the economy 2 billion dollars!

The company will use this against us now. Question is do we fall for it and just sort it out next EBA like so many other times or stand firm and don’t budge!

[LeeJoyce]

Originally Posted by Chris2303

Why did they lose it?

well one email from head of Gops says they won’t lose it, only if they “harm” the business

also go on to define harm to some small extent

then after the action and meeting the next email says the bonus is gone

[Sunfish]

When will you learn that the time is never right for a pay rise?

[rammel]

I say f^&k the company. I'm not sure if this has happened at JQ, but the staff at QF have taken pay freezes over the years and have never made up what was given. And come the next EBA any pay freeze will be forgotten about by the company and any bonuses will come with conditions attached. Hence, f*&k em.

[PoppaJo]

Originally Posted by rammel

I say f^&k the company. I'm not sure if this has happened at JQ, but the staff at QF have taken pay freezes over the years and have never made up what was given. And come the next EBA any pay freeze will be forgotten about by the company and any bonuses will come with conditions attached. Hence, f*&k em.

QF has a large colony of what I call Alan Believers who are all too terrified to challenge anything. I’ve seen this vomit inducing stuff in action, the question is what wouldn’t they do for him! These peeps don’t exist inside JQ, it’s the opposite, you’ve got ill informed inexperienced childish juveniles trying to undercut their industry experienced mates.

Young Blokes need to grow some balls and stop throwing the toys out of the pram. Luckily these people are a minority and shouldn’t stop a common sense vote getting across the line.

The company on the defense says they are thinking long term But Long Term is going to be a dogfight to even get pilots. Long term they are not going to be remuneration competitive. Virgin will take all the GA pilots and Jetstar will be reliant on cadets. It’s going to backfire long term, they will be wiped of any industry experience.

[ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE]

Originally Posted by PoppaJo

you’ve got ill informed inexperienced childish juveniles trying to undercut their industry experienced mates.

Young Blokes need to grow some balls and stop throwing the toys out of the pram.

please explain?

I would call striking before an EBA has even been seen, let alone voted on, throwing the toys out of the pram.

But now, after our big show of strength, the union have dropped their claim for a minimum daily credit. So what exactly was the strike action in December for? What are we fighting for now? Expansion of Highline and overnight rates?

[Paddleboat]

Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE

I would call striking before an EBA has even been seen, let alone voted on, throwing the toys out of the pram.

I'm confused. What do you mean the EBA hasn't been seen? Of course its been seen. It's been in black and white since the very beginning. Go find the 2015 agreement, add 3% to it. The end. The company has been absolutely crystal clear on their position since the process began. "There is no negotiation. There is 3%. All else will be denied. Don't even show up to a meeting unless you agree to these terms". Even attempts to offset gains through productivity improvements are simply valued at zero or close to, and the improvements sought dismissed out of hand.

Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE

So what exactly was the strike action in December for? What are we fighting for now? Expansion of Highline and overnight rates?

Seriously? With this agreement we're being asked to take on further responsibility, more passengers, bigger planes, longer sectors, more international destinations. We're being saddled with the Jeppesen 'optimizer' that reduces our flying density resulting in us being at work more, for less. And we're being asked to do it for a literal pay cut. 3% won't come close to covering the deficit to your pay with the reduced density.

What are we fighting for? We're fighting to not be left behind vs those who do the same job as you. People who do far less than you in fact. And it isn't because we're struggling, and it isn't in hand with the management who will share our depressed remuneration; they're on record bonus' and taking home millions. We'll do it because people roll over and declare "well i'm still payed pretty well for my first job, its fine".

Why do you think we're not paid minimum wage? Managerial empathy? Charity? It's because pilots before you fought bloody hard for it. In the early days of JQ as it transitioned from Impulse, there was a notion among some established pilots to continue the impulse 717 conditions on the 320. But others dug in and fought hard, securing a dramatic boost. The outcome from these negotiations will carry through for the rest of your career, as those did.

That's what we're fighting for.

[ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE]

Originally Posted by Paddleboat

With this agreement we're being asked to take on further responsibility, more passengers, bigger planes, longer sectors, more international destinations.

I’ve heard this argument many times and I don’t really understand it. We’ll be flying east coast Aus to Bali (and beyond). 6 credit hours, 1 sector. Currently that’d be a pretty decent 4 sector day. I know what I’d rather do.

To second this, the Virgin Australia 737 international pilot contract in inferior to that if the domestic guys, so the idea that flying further should get us more per hour I think is off.

A good mix of NB international sectors I think would be good to vary our flying schedules. My opinion only.

Unfortunately the EBA states Narrow Body aircraft for our pay scales. It isn’t aircraft specific. I think we should get paid more for flying more A321s as pilot payscales in Aus have always been based on aircraft size but I simply can’t see that happening.

The company arent going to give an inch now that we’ve striked. They’d rather waste $100 million on further strikes rather than give us $20 million on a better contract.

My argument has never been against a better contact, it’s been that strike action won’t get us there.

[Paddleboat]

Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE

I’ve heard this argument many times and I don’t really understand it. We’ll be flying east coast Aus to Bali (and beyond). 6 credit hours, 1 sector. Currently that’d be a pretty decent 4 sector day. I know what I’d rather do.

You're considering 1 duty in isolation. All of the long distance stuff is going to be BOC so they can utilize the aircraft during the day for east coast operations. As a result, a Bali return is going to occupy something like 4 days, maybe 5 with the rest periods after. Your 6 hours a day just turned into 2.4 or 3 hours a day. Even the company has acknowledged in the road shows that density is going to decrease. Do you deny that the optimizer has also reduced our density?

As I said above, this agreement if accepted will see us take a literal paycut in dutyhour per dollar to deliver even more than we currently do. Do you dispute this? Management must be laughing their heads off at possibility that they have actually pulled this off. Laughing all the way to the bank, with your money.

Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE

To second this, the Virgin Australia 737 international pilot contract in inferior to that if the domestic guys, so the idea that flying further should get us more per hour I think is off.

News to me. Hows the international contract look at Qantas, worse? Regardless, if you want to employ an argument of precedent, then it cuts both ways. How do we compare with Tiger? In both pay and productivity?

Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE

Unfortunately the EBA states Narrow Body aircraft for our pay scales. It isn’t aircraft specific. I think we should get paid more for flying more A321s as pilot payscales in Aus have always been based on aircraft size but I simply can’t see that happening.

Capitulation rarely brings with it reward.

Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE

The company arent going to give an inch now that we’ve striked. They’d rather waste $100 million on further strikes rather than give us $20 million on a better contract.
My argument has never been against a better contact, it’s been that strike action won’t get us there.

So what will get us there?

Alternatively, what got Ryanair and BA there? How did Ryanair manage 20% against a management team even more arrogant, recalcitrant and militant than Qantas? It wasn't by asking nicely.

[ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE]

Have a look at the JQ97/98 pairings. Daylight flying. Those flights are also scheduled for April and September/October to hold the slots for the A321LRs.

Once the route goes all/mostly narrow body we’ll be doing 2/3 flights to bali from each major east coast port a day, similar to the way it’s scheduled out of Adelaide now. One daylight flight, one night flight. If the flight home is BOC then it’ll take up 3 days, otherwise 2 days, for 12 hours credit. If you don’t like it, hopefully the new bidding system will allow you to avoid it, as I’m guessing plenty of guys will want to do a couple a month and other guys as many as they can.

[Paddleboat]

You appear to have missed 3/4 of my post. And if you think the PBS is going to be implemented any time soon you're in for a nasty surprise.

[ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE]

Originally Posted by Paddleboat

You appear to have missed 3/4 of my post. And if you think the PBS is going to be implemented any time soon you're in for a nasty surprise.

around September 2020 I believe is the plan at the moment for the NB pilot group.

[Jetstarpilot]

Originally Posted by PoppaJo

Young Blokes need to grow some balls and stop throwing the toys out of the pram.

Hear Heer!!

And for the PC out there..... tha Jockettes need to grow sum titties 2

[Ragnor]

Originally Posted by ECAMACTIONSCOMPLETE

around September 2020 I believe is the plan at the moment for the NB pilot group.

Haha oh god you're kidding right! It has February down on JEN for the PBS. The company will never give it to us. Let that sink in young fella.