Merged: Qantas:The Trashing Of A Brand
Join Date: Jan 2008
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Still going downhill. On the weekend a Bejing bound 330 had a new flight libary all the charts were in the books the problem was they were out of date. Yesterdays QF12 had a double radar failure, diverted to AKL following an Air New Zealand aircraft to give it weather avoidance. Today a 767 from Melbourne to Sydney couldnt retract the gear after take off, back to Melbourne. Just a standard week for the poor old QF Titanic.
On the weekend a Bejing bound 330 had a new flight libary all the charts were in the books the problem was they were out of date.
As for the other two problems, couldn't these be experienced by ANY operator with a large and diverse fleet?
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Might as well add the lattest QF news item in this thread, there's not enough room to list another new QF maint issue thread.
Ch10 showed 2nite QF B767 ML-SYD returned with a 'warning light' that the crew noticed regarding the U/C, all safe but boy the media love this, but are they getting better at acurate reporting?...NOPE, was a joke what they said.
More to come am sure.
CW
Ch10 showed 2nite QF B767 ML-SYD returned with a 'warning light' that the crew noticed regarding the U/C, all safe but boy the media love this, but are they getting better at acurate reporting?...NOPE, was a joke what they said.
More to come am sure.
CW
Join Date: May 2004
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As much as we all like to back Qantas being the national airline and all, it really is time to accept the fact that our national airline is no better than Garuda!
A tacky third world airline that needs cleansing from the top down through ALL departments!
What a pity!
A tacky third world airline that needs cleansing from the top down through ALL departments!
What a pity!
it really is time to accept the fact that our national airline is no better than Garuda!
Which of the latest QF incidents was worse than the 1987 Garuda DC-9 accident? Or the 1996 DC-10 over-run? Or the 1997 Airbus CFIT? Or the 2002 accident when Garuda landed a 737 in a river 14nm short of the strip? Or the 2007 Yogyakarta over-run? All of these accidents were garuda, all involved fatalities.
I agree that QF needs a cleanout and the top is the best place to start, I hope it is already underway.
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I agree that QF needs a cleanout and the top is the best place to start, I hope it is already underway.
They don't call "The Designate" mini-me for nothing, so don't expect any change from the current course.
Let The Games Begin......
From Crikey today
Ben Sandilands writes:
Qantas has scored three headline incidents so far this week.
There were two yesterday, a turnback to Melbourne by a 767 domestic flight with an undercarriage that wouldn’t retract, and the trans Pacific 747 flight that used a nearby Air NZ jet as a seeing eye dog when its weather radar was inoperative for many hours.
On Sunday another QF 747 from Frankfurt arrived in Singapore to fire engines because of an undercarriage problem that delayed passengers for a day while it was fixed.
None of these incidents necessarily relate to maintenance failures at Qantas. And whether they did or didn’t result from the lowered standards of care already identified by the Civil Aviation Safety Authority in its ‘special’ audit of the carrier, the pilots did all the right things when the problems arose.
But the defensive outbursts by outgoing CEO Geoff Dixon raise more fundamental issues.
Why has the last two years of his tenure been such a shambles for Qantas customers? And will incoming CEO Alan Joyce, and hands on chairman Leigh Clifford, stick with a management culture that is a proven failure from a customer perspective, or do something about an airline that can’t keep its jets clean, punctual and fully maintained to the standards that once defined the Qantas brand?
The refusal of mechanics to work overtime for ten weeks in the middle of the year is not the reason why the airline was dysfunctional for months before that dispute, and which has been over for more than three months yet the network is still a mess.
Overtime wasn’t the reason why Qantas overlooked cracks in drip trays on a large part of its fleet, causing one 747 to have a gravely serious crisis near Bangkok on 7 January. It doesn’t explain why a maintenance team at Tullamarine last October pumped nitrogen into emergency oxygen packs, a feat of towering incompetence given the supposedly idiot proof design of the equipment they were using.
It doesn’t pardon the lie from its chief of engineering David Cox, that there was no safety problem with a missed airworthiness directive to modify the forward pressure bulkhead on six of its aged 737-400s (the ones mostly used out of Canberra) which went undetected for five years.
If Cox really has such a disregard for the gravity of compulsory airworthiness directives, which are, surprise, issued in order to correct safety issues, why is he still running the maintenance side of an airline that insists safety is of paramount concern?
Dixon’s recent comments need to be read in conjunction with the CASA audit of Qantas, which found that the airline was failing to maintain its own standards and contradicts his airbrushing of the carrier’s maintenance record.
No amount of posturing changes the farcical record of Qantas jets were being kept on the ground because of lack of spare parts or through the burden of page after page of time limited defects on jets for which there continues to be an inadequate engineering and maintenance resources.
This note from author and Fairfax escapee Ben Hills at the start of the week is just one of the Crikey collection of complaints about the inability of Qantas to keep its fleet in working order:
Qantas has scored three headline incidents so far this week.
There were two yesterday, a turnback to Melbourne by a 767 domestic flight with an undercarriage that wouldn’t retract, and the trans Pacific 747 flight that used a nearby Air NZ jet as a seeing eye dog when its weather radar was inoperative for many hours.
On Sunday another QF 747 from Frankfurt arrived in Singapore to fire engines because of an undercarriage problem that delayed passengers for a day while it was fixed.
None of these incidents necessarily relate to maintenance failures at Qantas. And whether they did or didn’t result from the lowered standards of care already identified by the Civil Aviation Safety Authority in its ‘special’ audit of the carrier, the pilots did all the right things when the problems arose.
But the defensive outbursts by outgoing CEO Geoff Dixon raise more fundamental issues.
Why has the last two years of his tenure been such a shambles for Qantas customers? And will incoming CEO Alan Joyce, and hands on chairman Leigh Clifford, stick with a management culture that is a proven failure from a customer perspective, or do something about an airline that can’t keep its jets clean, punctual and fully maintained to the standards that once defined the Qantas brand?
The refusal of mechanics to work overtime for ten weeks in the middle of the year is not the reason why the airline was dysfunctional for months before that dispute, and which has been over for more than three months yet the network is still a mess.
Overtime wasn’t the reason why Qantas overlooked cracks in drip trays on a large part of its fleet, causing one 747 to have a gravely serious crisis near Bangkok on 7 January. It doesn’t explain why a maintenance team at Tullamarine last October pumped nitrogen into emergency oxygen packs, a feat of towering incompetence given the supposedly idiot proof design of the equipment they were using.
It doesn’t pardon the lie from its chief of engineering David Cox, that there was no safety problem with a missed airworthiness directive to modify the forward pressure bulkhead on six of its aged 737-400s (the ones mostly used out of Canberra) which went undetected for five years.
If Cox really has such a disregard for the gravity of compulsory airworthiness directives, which are, surprise, issued in order to correct safety issues, why is he still running the maintenance side of an airline that insists safety is of paramount concern?
Dixon’s recent comments need to be read in conjunction with the CASA audit of Qantas, which found that the airline was failing to maintain its own standards and contradicts his airbrushing of the carrier’s maintenance record.
No amount of posturing changes the farcical record of Qantas jets were being kept on the ground because of lack of spare parts or through the burden of page after page of time limited defects on jets for which there continues to be an inadequate engineering and maintenance resources.
This note from author and Fairfax escapee Ben Hills at the start of the week is just one of the Crikey collection of complaints about the inability of Qantas to keep its fleet in working order:
Last night I was flying back from Melbourne to Sydney on QF 450, scheduled departure 4.30pm, and heard an interesting tale from two flight attendants. The flight was full to the rafters because it had been combined with QF446, which had been due to take off at 4pm but which had been cancelled. Turns out that everyone had boarded the plane when there was an announcement that they would have to deplane because of a “technical problem.”
In fact, said the two attendants, there was no technical problem. What had happened was that the plane scheduled for another flight, which was due to take off around the same time from Melbourne to Perth, had been discovered to have four blocked lavatories – apparently there are rules about how many lavatories have to be operating, and so the plane was ruled US. So Qantas decided to use the plane which had been scheduled for flight 446 instead, kicking off the Sydney passengers and replacing them with Perth passengers. To add to the chaos, there were not enough seats for everyone on QF 450, so some of those QF 446 passengers were kicked off the flight and left at Melbourne airport.
I cannot remember the last time I was on a Qantas flight that took off on time – not for at least a year. This has led to a curious fatalistic attitude by Qantas passengers, a bit like Londoners during the blitz, where they all gather together to share their woes and tell tall tales about their experiences, and the terrible lies that Qantas staff have to tell to cover up the airline’s problems.
There is a lot of work to be done to fix Qantas. Will Joyce take responsibility for this, or keep echoing Dixon’s platitudes?
In fact, said the two attendants, there was no technical problem. What had happened was that the plane scheduled for another flight, which was due to take off around the same time from Melbourne to Perth, had been discovered to have four blocked lavatories – apparently there are rules about how many lavatories have to be operating, and so the plane was ruled US. So Qantas decided to use the plane which had been scheduled for flight 446 instead, kicking off the Sydney passengers and replacing them with Perth passengers. To add to the chaos, there were not enough seats for everyone on QF 450, so some of those QF 446 passengers were kicked off the flight and left at Melbourne airport.
I cannot remember the last time I was on a Qantas flight that took off on time – not for at least a year. This has led to a curious fatalistic attitude by Qantas passengers, a bit like Londoners during the blitz, where they all gather together to share their woes and tell tall tales about their experiences, and the terrible lies that Qantas staff have to tell to cover up the airline’s problems.
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What needs to be understood with regard to Qantas is that the airline's purpose fundamentally changed when dickson took over.
It went from being an airline [which transports people] to a vehicle who's sole purpose was to generate senior executive wealth.
In it's new incarnation, under the direction of dickson and his pandering board, it has been spectacularly successful.
Are things going to be any different under clifford and that new bloke with the bad teeth?
I doubt it.
What's it going to take?
A hull loss??
It went from being an airline [which transports people] to a vehicle who's sole purpose was to generate senior executive wealth.
In it's new incarnation, under the direction of dickson and his pandering board, it has been spectacularly successful.
Are things going to be any different under clifford and that new bloke with the bad teeth?
I doubt it.
What's it going to take?
A hull loss??
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from the casual observer it appears that a rout of management is currently taking place.
it would seem that the clifford/joyce team are removing anyone that had anything to do with the APA bid.
they should be in jail not given redundancy payments.......
i will wait with bated breath for the next round of executive moves (hopefully out the door)
it would seem that the clifford/joyce team are removing anyone that had anything to do with the APA bid.
they should be in jail not given redundancy payments.......
i will wait with bated breath for the next round of executive moves (hopefully out the door)
The airline is on the verge of a total breakdown of all its systems. There are inadequate staff and those that remain are disengaged. The board have no idea whats going on, id go so far as to say that Clifford would not know if there was a 747 in his back yard until he got a knock on the door asking where the service desk was.
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Mini Me Constrained
AJ will be reluctant to do much for awhile until he gets a feel for the business.
The Chairman is running around making a lot of noise but has little idea on how to fix the growing problems,
So far he has blamed everybody except those responsible.
Replacing the marauders who are responsible will also take awhile.
Dont expect much from the citadel for now except more of Scrotum Face's well worn rhetoric.
All this will take at least a year .Lets hope the Qantas luck lasts and we dont end up with a black smoking hole witha red tail protruding from it.
The Chairman is running around making a lot of noise but has little idea on how to fix the growing problems,
So far he has blamed everybody except those responsible.
Replacing the marauders who are responsible will also take awhile.
Dont expect much from the citadel for now except more of Scrotum Face's well worn rhetoric.
All this will take at least a year .Lets hope the Qantas luck lasts and we dont end up with a black smoking hole witha red tail protruding from it.
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the clifford/joyce team are removing anyone that had anything to do with the APA bid.
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Whatever your thoughts about media beat up, exageration, incorrect information this article is succinct and covers a fair amount of the problem. The only way this problem will be resolved - that is without a hull loss - is for the repeated raising of these issues by members of the media. Preferably in a non sensational way, just the facts and the repeated statement as to the cause. Point the spotlight on those who are responsible, keep it there until their response indicates they understand. Any other way will be far too costly. We have to hope there is change before the disaster occurs.
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The Qantas sky really is falling in!
Talking about handing over a poisoned chalice,
Qantas plans flight cutbacks - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
Might just be time to retire those older birds early rather than later.
GD must be laughing his arse off at the sweet run circumstance provided him.
Qantas plans flight cutbacks - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
Might just be time to retire those older birds early rather than later.
GD must be laughing his arse off at the sweet run circumstance provided him.
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flyingblind:
......can think of much better ways to get lucky.....
tough times ahead for all - but remember the a/c tally in QF's statement to ASX statement includes some of the a/c that were going anyway, so the sky is ony falling in a select few places.
......can think of much better ways to get lucky.....
tough times ahead for all - but remember the a/c tally in QF's statement to ASX statement includes some of the a/c that were going anyway, so the sky is ony falling in a select few places.
Might just be time to retire those older birds early rather than later
What was the average age of the 744 and 767 fleet these days????
If you retire the older birds, there goes the backbone of the operation. Still I agree. Bring on the replacements. Ooh that's right, Jetstar needs them first.
Qantas, an airline in great shape.
and not take up the planned lease of two A330-200 aircraft.
not taking two leased A330-200 aircraft destined for Jetstar
Last edited by Fatguyinalittlecoat; 25th Nov 2008 at 18:28.