ATC VOLUNTARY OVERTIME BAN: Dublin Flights Delayed 25th January
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yeah it doesnt bode well- probbaly trying to wriggle out of doing anything at all-just so they dont have to spend anythin.
Bet your bottom doolar tho that head boys will probbably claim overnight expenses and everything else they can because they are on company time. Love to see exactly how much expenses are paid to middle management some day. Could be very interesting reading. Wonder would MOL think they deliver value for money. At least we save him money every day with tactical decisions.
Bet your bottom doolar tho that head boys will probbably claim overnight expenses and everything else they can because they are on company time. Love to see exactly how much expenses are paid to middle management some day. Could be very interesting reading. Wonder would MOL think they deliver value for money. At least we save him money every day with tactical decisions.
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Hot off the press - strike notice to be served tomorrow for 7 days time for a stoppage of an undetermined ( as of yet ) time frame.
Guess there was no progress so.
Yours as ever
OCK1F
Guess there was no progress so.
Yours as ever
OCK1F
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my 20cents
I will try to remain optomistic but when has the glorious mess that is the IAA not dragged out anything except a request by EIWT for more airspace
I would guess the union is giving mismanagement repeated chances to improve their offer, we will make some concessions such as a new 5 and 3 for DUB with longer!!!!! working hours for DUB (and we need that like a hole in the head) and see what mismanagement are willing to concede.
The union will try their best to solve the situation but honestly if it is taking this long then the IAA are unlikely willing to improve the controllers lot and we should just walk away and hit them with a work to rule.
I would guess the union is giving mismanagement repeated chances to improve their offer, we will make some concessions such as a new 5 and 3 for DUB with longer!!!!! working hours for DUB (and we need that like a hole in the head) and see what mismanagement are willing to concede.The union will try their best to solve the situation but honestly if it is taking this long then the IAA are unlikely willing to improve the controllers lot and we should just walk away and hit them with a work to rule.
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Yeah a work to rule is going to hurt but if a full stoppage becomes a reality then how the hell can they continue to deny there is a problem.
We pay our managemnet enough-how come we get monkeys?
We pay our managemnet enough-how come we get monkeys?
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MOL's ****e sprouting
Careful on this one
Even though I'm as guilty of getting DCT and RFL for RYR as everyone else I have to say there could be a hidden motive here.
He pays crap basic rates to his pilots who only make large bonuses for getting flights in on time.
So not only does he pat IAA on the back by lying about us he also gets us to take away his pilots wages, costing him less........
Could this be true?
I'd appreciate any reason for denying it.
Careful on this one
Even though I'm as guilty of getting DCT and RFL for RYR as everyone else I have to say there could be a hidden motive here.
He pays crap basic rates to his pilots who only make large bonuses for getting flights in on time.
So not only does he pat IAA on the back by lying about us he also gets us to take away his pilots wages, costing him less........
Could this be true?
I'd appreciate any reason for denying it.
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Thanks Ryanair!!
I'm in the spare room tonight, The other half is wondering where that extra 31000 euro and the extra 6 days leave are, their convinced I must be using it on my bit on the side.....
looks like it could get nasty though!!!!
I'm in the spare room tonight, The other half is wondering where that extra 31000 euro and the extra 6 days leave are, their convinced I must be using it on my bit on the side.....
looks like it could get nasty though!!!!
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no progress...no suprise
stick together lads... management are in a no win situation thanks to wrongly predicting an ecominic downturn in aug 2003(pr) and thus not employing any staff since....unbelievable but true
stick together lads... management are in a no win situation thanks to wrongly predicting an ecominic downturn in aug 2003(pr) and thus not employing any staff since....unbelievable but true
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Ok then it looks like we're in for the long haul so! Wait for the fallout in the press tomorrow....Meltdown on phone lines to tour operators.....airlines on to the company.....and (possibly) a certain govmt. minister making a call to his brother!
Maybe that's the type of negotiating the IAA will understand!
Maybe that's the type of negotiating the IAA will understand!
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From Breakingnews.ie:
Air controllers dispute unresolved after day long talks
19/02/2008 - 23:46:53
Day long talks at the Labour Relations Commission between air traffic Controllers and the Irish Aviation Authority broke up at 10.30pm this evening without agreement on interim solutions to resolve the current staff shortage.
IMPACT will now brief its members on the situation and will issue a statement in the morning on what action, if any, the union will embark on.
The Irish Aviation Authority have declined to comment on the current situation this evening.
No surprises there then.
Air controllers dispute unresolved after day long talks
19/02/2008 - 23:46:53
Day long talks at the Labour Relations Commission between air traffic Controllers and the Irish Aviation Authority broke up at 10.30pm this evening without agreement on interim solutions to resolve the current staff shortage.
IMPACT will now brief its members on the situation and will issue a statement in the morning on what action, if any, the union will embark on.
The Irish Aviation Authority have declined to comment on the current situation this evening.
No surprises there then.
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Our ATCOs had to make a call on the grounds of safety that night. Is it safer to land or divert?
Remember, as soon as an aircraft is diverted from it's original flight, it's safe passage begins to erode. Fuel and familiarity with the alternate become potent considerations. Pilot workload increases. This is no longer a routine flight.
Remember, as soon as an aircraft is diverted from it's original flight, it's safe passage begins to erode. Fuel and familiarity with the alternate become potent considerations. Pilot workload increases. This is no longer a routine flight.
You do not know anything about the fuel state. The aircraft may have had enough to fly to Cork and then divert to Shannon and still hold for more than the minimum 30 minutes before landing.
To say that as soon as an aircraft is diverted from it's original flight, it's safe passage begins to erode. Fuel and familiarity with the alternate become potent consideration is utter rubbish
Diverting to an open airport is always safer than landing at a closed one.
--------------
Of course the one thing that MOL has missed in his little attempt to grab some publicity is that the IAA were probably wrong to close the airports. What they should have done is close the airspace - make it class G and then airline and airport operators can decide if they wish to operate without ATC..............no instrument procedures...........but when faced with an ATC stopage and day - VMC, and only 30 miles to the adjacent ATC service why close the airport.
As for old Regan, he did light a fire under peoples ass and guess what - the system is better for it.
Air Corps ATCO's stepping into the breach - don't think so. But didn't many of them train on Dublin Approach Radar? Can't comment on radar displays or feeds for national securoty reasons of course but you know what I am getting at
I am sure MOL would only gladly pay WOD and his DOD very well for keeping (profit making) flights operating.At least Aer Lingus will not have to cancel all it's flights to Heathrow if the IAA ATC service stage a total walkout!
The IAA ATS division needs a cross between MOL and WW - someone who can crack the whip and weild the chopper but who can talk nicely to the customers.
Regards,
DFC
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Still about 15 years out of date with your info DFC, what do the letters stand for, Definitely Fcuking Clueless?
I look forward to earning €108000 a year, oh wait that's way over the top of the expert scale...
Do I need promotion to chief ****** to earn that kinda dough?
I look forward to earning €108000 a year, oh wait that's way over the top of the expert scale...
Do I need promotion to chief ****** to earn that kinda dough?
Last edited by badback; 20th Feb 2008 at 09:38.
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Of course, MOL is right about one thing.
The flight landing after the airport was notamed closed shows that it was not a case of there being too few ATCO's available to provide a safe service - that was proven by actually providing a service.
Can't complain that there is no one available to provide a safe service........and then go ahead an provide one anyway........to a select aircraft.
Regards,
DFC
The flight landing after the airport was notamed closed shows that it was not a case of there being too few ATCO's available to provide a safe service - that was proven by actually providing a service.
Can't complain that there is no one available to provide a safe service........and then go ahead an provide one anyway........to a select aircraft.
Regards,
DFC
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Of course, MOL is right about one thing.
FACTS FACTS FACTS - thats all you're missing in your points. i did offer to help you with your posts, i'm still waiting ........
by the way you could do with some spelling lessons -
i before e except with a c " weild "????,
and you'll find that it was Reagan, not Regan
good boy
see you next tuesday
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Ryanair
Lads,
We know that a lot of industry and press bods watch this forum so I think we should can any talk ( even light hearted) about extracting revenge from FR flights for MOLs bull**** press release. In fact I would plead with anyone posting such comments to remove them, we're the good guys for the moment but as soon as one FR gets delayed MOL will pounce and make us look bitter and vindictive.
If he got wind that there was any sort of threat from us against him he'd be all over the press and the courts with a printout of this forum.
Quote sevenstar
"I heard a rumour that when SIDS and Stars were introduced in shannon IAA management instructed staff via an office notice that they were to give priority to ryanair traffic above all other airlines. The reason was they didnt want to piss off ryanair. I guess Aer Lingus neber found out about that notice inside the IAA???????"
It would be handy to have a copy of that notice if things get nasty so ther will be a prize for the first person to get hold of that.
In the mean time, just sit on your hands and let management keep digging and lets hope IMPACT stay as strong as we have.
We know that a lot of industry and press bods watch this forum so I think we should can any talk ( even light hearted) about extracting revenge from FR flights for MOLs bull**** press release. In fact I would plead with anyone posting such comments to remove them, we're the good guys for the moment but as soon as one FR gets delayed MOL will pounce and make us look bitter and vindictive.
If he got wind that there was any sort of threat from us against him he'd be all over the press and the courts with a printout of this forum.
Quote sevenstar
"I heard a rumour that when SIDS and Stars were introduced in shannon IAA management instructed staff via an office notice that they were to give priority to ryanair traffic above all other airlines. The reason was they didnt want to piss off ryanair. I guess Aer Lingus neber found out about that notice inside the IAA???????"
It would be handy to have a copy of that notice if things get nasty so ther will be a prize for the first person to get hold of that.
In the mean time, just sit on your hands and let management keep digging and lets hope IMPACT stay as strong as we have.
Last edited by norby; 20th Feb 2008 at 09:02. Reason: Pleading
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Originally Posted by DFC
But didn't many of them train on Dublin Approach Radar
Originally Posted by badback
Still about 15 years out of date with your info DFC
-----
irishatco,
Do you drive Mick's taxi as a sideline?.........How do you know everything he says?
---------
Ock1F,
You can resist can you.
See you later indeed!
Regards,
DFC
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Island Against Aviation
Imagine a little misty island somewhere of the west coast of Europe...
D: Hey Ted, we're after spendin' a fortune on a new system that doesn't really do what it supposed to and might be a bit unsafe and we've no money to fix it.
T: Don't worry Dougle! The important thing is we got it in on time and in budget and sure won't the lads sort it out?
D: Ted, we're after stealin' a massive chunk of airspace and we didn't get any new people to work it.
T: Stop worryin' Dougle. Sure the lads will sort it out and we'll make even more money.
D: Ted, we've forced through new unworkable procedures that might be unsafe because our friends wanted them.
T: Look the lads will sort it out and we must keep our friends happy.
D: But Ted, we've moved staff around the country at great expense and lost ratings and flexibility in the process, eh, why was that again Ted?
T: Well reviewin' it wasn't it a fundementally fabulous idea at the time and you know those lads are great.
D: Ted, we haven't taken on any new lads in years and theres been a lot have retired and sure there's loads more planes and tons of those friends are flyin' their new shiny helicoptors all over the place.
T: Look Dougle! Have I not told you already? The lads will sort it. Sure if there's not enough of them they'll just have to work more. I know what! We'll take their leave off them! Sure they can't use it anyway and think of the money we'll save. In fact we won't pay them the national pay deal. We'll say we can't aford it or it has to into the pension fund or rest in my account for awhile...
Well the lads have had enough
D: Hey Ted, we're after spendin' a fortune on a new system that doesn't really do what it supposed to and might be a bit unsafe and we've no money to fix it.
T: Don't worry Dougle! The important thing is we got it in on time and in budget and sure won't the lads sort it out?
D: Ted, we're after stealin' a massive chunk of airspace and we didn't get any new people to work it.
T: Stop worryin' Dougle. Sure the lads will sort it out and we'll make even more money.
D: Ted, we've forced through new unworkable procedures that might be unsafe because our friends wanted them.
T: Look the lads will sort it out and we must keep our friends happy.
D: But Ted, we've moved staff around the country at great expense and lost ratings and flexibility in the process, eh, why was that again Ted?
T: Well reviewin' it wasn't it a fundementally fabulous idea at the time and you know those lads are great.
D: Ted, we haven't taken on any new lads in years and theres been a lot have retired and sure there's loads more planes and tons of those friends are flyin' their new shiny helicoptors all over the place.
T: Look Dougle! Have I not told you already? The lads will sort it. Sure if there's not enough of them they'll just have to work more. I know what! We'll take their leave off them! Sure they can't use it anyway and think of the money we'll save. In fact we won't pay them the national pay deal. We'll say we can't aford it or it has to into the pension fund or rest in my account for awhile...
Well the lads have had enough
Last edited by qnhhpa; 20th Feb 2008 at 16:58.