Edinburgh-4

[gham89]

Westjet S23

Westjet have removed from sale GLA-YYZ. EDI-YYZ remains on sale but at crazy high prices. Been like this for weeks now. Double the price of AC flights. I suspect we may be about to find out what their plans are for EDI. The slots suggest daily to YYZ and a much rumoured daily to Calgary on a 787.

787-9 would be a new visitor to EDI. Exciting tines.

[willy wombat]

Negotiating with airports’ management?

[Planeraz]

Negotiating with airports’ management?

Westjet have also removed DUB-YYZ from sale. I wonder if EDI is about to next? Something is going on.

[A350Saltire]

Rumour is that they will make a TATL23 announcement on Monday so we should know soon enough

[Plane mad 134]

SeanM on twitter has posted the timings for EDI-YYC, looks to be 3x weekly. Flight number is WS03/04.

Source: https://twitter.com/SeanM1997/status/1599749578404036610?t=xPqToVg3rh1a5gQ7SYKZjg&s=19

[Planeraz]

Rumour is that they will make a TATL23 announcement on Monday so we should know soon enough


Calgary

Confirmed. 3 x weekly from17th May 2023.

[wesleyscott]

FANTASTIC!

[Planeraz]

Calgary

Confirmed. 3 x weekly from17th May 2023.


In addition to Calgary, EDI-YYZ appears to have survived. 3 x weekly in S23.

What’s not clear yet is if the new route to Calgary is summer seasonal or year round. I’d be surprised if it were year round,

[gham89]

Calgary

Confirmed. 3 x weekly from17th May 2023.
Shy of Emirates picking back up their slots, a 787-9 will be the largest scheduled visitor by seats?

Qatar's A350-1000s are longer and have 7 more seats, but they seem to only be an occasional gap filler.

[tartan 201]

In addition to Calgary, EDI-YYZ appears to have survived. 3 x weekly in S23.

What’s not clear yet is if the new route to Calgary is summer seasonal or year round. I’d be surprised if it were year round,

Seasonal to the 8th October according to https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/221205-wsns23yyc

EDI-YYZ is on sale only at the highest fares as has been the case for weeks. Presumably will be removed from sale soon.

[A350Saltire]

Great news. 3x per week is ambitious but WS have the data from operating this summer to support their decision. I wish them well and might even give the route a try next year.

[Planeraz]

Westjet

EDI-YYZ will be dropped. Most S23 dates removed from website. Good news for AC.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

Mystified by this. Seems to be driven by the fact that they are taking the B787 and so have to try and fill them somehow but are basing them all in YYC with none in YYZ. GLA/EDI-YYZ is a reliable known quantity that they're able to crew from the existing YYZ B737 base, YYC hasn't been served since AIr Transat flew it from GLA a while back.

[CabinCrewe]

Westjet

EDI-YYZ will be dropped. Most S23 dates removed from website. Good news for AC.
What a shame to have gone from 3 WJ routes to Scotland (2x YYZ and 1x YHZ) to now 3/wk YYC only. Lets hope this new hub idea works for them! AC don’t really seem to be putting up much of a fight even in London.
Interesting that they stopped any further 787 new deliveries :bored:

[tictack67]

What a shame to have gone from 3 WJ routes to Scotland (2x YYZ and 1x YHZ) to now 3/wk YYC only. Lets hope this new hub idea works for them! AC don’t really seem to be putting up much of a fight even in London.
Interesting that they stopped any further 787 new deliveries :bored:

Air Canada increasing to daily from Edinburgh S23.

[A350Saltire]

Who is next for EDI after today’s announcement?

EK?

[Planeraz]

Who is next for EDI after today’s announcement?

EK?

Perhaps. I wonder if EK is waiting to see if QR go double daily in 2023 before stepping in again? The current slots suggest they could do. It wouldn’t be a huge surprise given the Doha route continues to perform very strongly with LF’s in the high 90’s.

[Sk1schoolsam]

Perhaps. I wonder if EK is waiting to see if QR go double daily in 2023 before stepping in again? The current slots suggest they could do. It wouldn’t be a huge surprise given the Doha route continues to perform very strongly with LF’s in the high 90’s.

Anecdotal: “(EK) have shortage of cabin crew and so the return of A380 or second daily at Glasgow or return to Edinburgh is still being worked on.”

It’s a waiting game, however I would have thought that if S23 was going to happen then it would have been launched by now. Just my opinion.

[Planeraz]

Anecdotal: “(EK) have shortage of cabin crew and so the return of A380 or second daily at Glasgow or return to Edinburgh is still being worked on.”

It’s a waiting game, however I would have thought that if S23 was going to happen then it would have been launched by now. Just my opinion.

Without doubt only rumour, but a few people on different forums posting that EK may be about to leave GLA and operate only out of EDI. Is their any substance to this rumour/speculation?

[willy wombat]

Can EDI handle the A380? (I know GLA currently 777 but presumably A380 to return to Scotland in due course).

[Planeraz]

Can EDI handle the A380? (I know GLA currently 777 but presumably A380 to return to Scotland in due course).

An A380 unable to land or take off at EDI. Runway too short. The taxi ways would also have to be upgraded significantly. EDI do have gates and bridges that can accommodate an A380.

[tartan 201]

Without doubt only rumour, but a few people on different forums posting that EK may be about to leave GLA and operate only out of EDI. Is their any substance to this rumour/speculation?

Can you post a link to these posts please?

[Planeraz]

Can you post a link to these posts please? wrote: ↑ (http://gla.scot/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8372#p8372)Tue Dec 06, 2022 2:31 pm

So EK have a choice. Either be at a competitive disadvantage from Scotland where they have less capacity than QR for 6 months or double up the GLA flights.Or bin GLA and move it all to EDI. And before anyone says anything, I’m aware they have a lounge. Won’t stop them moving though I bet.
See, telt you you don’t think there’s a market worth serving from GLA. http://twemoji.maxcdn.com/2/svg/1f971.svgThe market that AGS appear to be very willingly let disappear 45 miles east.

[Fletch]

How come Emirates dropped EDI in the first place?

[CabinCrewe]

How come Emirates dropped EDI in the first place?
Hadn’t built up any momentum when covid struck. Not enough demand for all the far east and Oz lockdown countries.
Qatar fares are/were significantly cheaper.

[Fletch]

Why would Emirates then risk their inertia? Why would they go head to head with a carrier offering a better product at a lower price point?

[inOban]

For some reason a lot of people want to visit Dubai. There are still more pax on EK from Glasgow than Qatar from Edinburgh

[willy wombat]

Sounds like a good reason to stay at GLA!

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

Either be at a competitive disadvantage from Scotland where they have less capacity than QR for 6 months or double up the GLA flights.Or bin GLA and move it all to EDI. And before anyone says anything, I’m aware they have a lounge. Won’t stop them moving though I bet.
Having less capacity doesn't automatically mean disadvantaged. This is sheer "my airpor's better than yours". GLA is on the floor but as travel bounces
back, EDI may well remain Scotland's No. 1 airport but the notion that GLA would or should have nothing long haul is nonsense. It may be 2nd choice for inbound but no market likes a monopoly, and as and when EDI gets to the bursting at the seams point, people will look for other options. EDI is doing really well but I suspect WS swapping YYZ for YYC simply because they need to fly B787s they didn't cancel won't end well.

It's a finite market and we've been here before. Not every entrant is net new and as they battle for limited market share, expect something to give in the medium term.

[Asturias56]

I've always though the GLA is an "outbound" airport and EDI is an "inbound" one

Emirates operate from Birmingham and Newcastle - neither of which is overrun by people from the Gulf (tho they do fly their business jets into NCL in the shooting season) - it's all outbound sourced traffic

Their business is tourists to Dubai - much as SIA was in the early days

[SWBKCB]

Outside London, where in the UK is overrun by people from the Gulf?

EK is about beyond Dubai, not Dubai itself.

And nobody mentions cargo.

[gham89]

Easyjet adding Catania for S23 (via Sean M on twitter)

[inOban]

Wasn't that announced for S20 but obviously never happened?

[chaps1954]

In answer SWBCB Manchester now is awash with people from the gulf area

[CabinCrewe]

Wasn't that announced for S20 but obviously never happened?
Yes. Announced in 2019.
“easyJet - Edinburgh to Catania. Flights start 29 March 2020 EDI 0710-1150”

[tartan 201]

SunExpress

New Route S23

EDI-Izmir

1 x flight weekly. Start date 29th August 2023.

Strange start date, The summer season in Scotland will be all but over by then. This start date could change?

credit SeanM

Start date confirmed. AYT going to five weekly.

https://corporate.edinburghairport.com/media-centre/news-releases/taking-off-to-turkey

[OltonPete]

I've always though the GLA is an "outbound" airport and EDI is an "inbound" one

Emirates operate from Birmingham and Newcastle - neither of which is overrun by people from the Gulf (tho they do fly their business jets into NCL in the shooting season) - it's all outbound sourced traffic

Their business is tourists to Dubai - much as SIA was in the early days

Although this is correct in the main due to VFR traffic to South Asia and Australia, pre COVID there was significant traffic for Birmingham & Warwick Universities from Asia which kept the 615 seat A380's nice and topped up and I realise that is difficult to believe to some in the north and south :)

What I don't know is if this traffic has recovered but EK are operating around 85% full in low periods and 95% in school holidays. I would say it is doing okay (but not awash :)) and in September it had a 92% load factor which of course is the influx date for uni's. Also of course Middle East money is courted for development projects now that a little more caution is required where one goes with the begging bowl.

Pete

[Planeraz]

Ryanair

Edinburgh - Bournemouth

4 x weekly from March 26 2023.

Nipping in ahead of EZY? Have EZY missed a trick here or made a mistake dropping the route which performed strongly. Will they respond and reinstate?

[SKOJB]

Ryanair

Edinburgh - Bournemouth

4 x weekly from March 26 2023.

Nipping in ahead of EZY? Have EZY missed a trick here or made a mistake dropping the route which performed strongly. Will they respond and reinstate?

EZY will introduce SOU instead is my guess

[Albert Hall]

easyJet had every opportunity to fly EDI-BOH (and BFS-BOH which they served at the same time, and which looked to do well, as much as you can judge by pax numbers alone). They haven't taken the opportunity and now someone else had. They hardly have any cause for complaint.

[Planeraz]

SAS

ShaunM reporting that Scandinavian will increase EDI - Stockholm from 7 to 10 x weekly. Double daily on certain days. A nice little increase and a welcome boost. Will Norwegian retaliate?

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

The return of Ryanair to BOH domestics is because of the reduction in APD? It wasn't a volume issue these routes faced, it was that the assets could simply make money elsewhere, now APD is being reduced, that market dynamic has changed (back). Same reason for STN-EDI, good to see a return to sensible domestic connectivity options.

[Planeraz]

The return of Ryanair to BOH domestics is because of the reduction in APD? It wasn't a volume issue these routes faced, it was that the assets could simply make money elsewhere, now APD is being reduced, that market dynamic has changed (back). Same reason for STN-EDI, good to see a return to sensible domestic connectivity options.

Sadly, for the aviation sector, APD is devolved to the Scottish Govt. It’s no secret that Sturgeon and her green chums are very anti aviation. The welcome reduction in APD by the UK Gov means pax departing from English and Welsh airports should see a benefit. Flights or pax departing from Scotland will still have to pay this tax. Sturgeon as per normal has not yet committed to follow the UK Gov decision. A real disadvantage for pax, airline and airports in Scotland.

[tartan 201]

Sadly, for the aviation sector, APD is devolved to the Scottish Govt. It’s no secret that Sturgeon and her green chums are very anti aviation. The welcome reduction in APD by the UK Gov means pax departing from English and Welsh airports should see a benefit. Flights or pax departing from Scotland will still have to pax this tax. Sturgeon as per normal has not yet committed to follow the UK Gov decision. A real disadvantage for pax, airline and airports in Scotland.

APD isn't devolved. The Scotland Act of 2016 allowed for it to be devolved, but its replacement, laid out in the Air Departure Tax (Scotland) Act 2017, has yet to be effected. According to this (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/rates-and-allowances-for-air-passenger-duty) the rate of APD on domestic flights within the UK from 1 April 2023 (when the reduction comes in to force) will be the same, irrespective of which part of the UK the flight arrives and departs from (Scottish Highlands and Islands excepted). The rates for the other bands (i.e. non-domestic flights) are the same across the UK, with the exception of direct flights from Northern Ireland to destinations outside Band A. So passengers on flights from Scotland (H&I excepted) will pay the same rates of tax as those from England and Wales (and from NI to destinations within Band A).

[Planeraz]

APD isn't devolved. The Scotland Act of 2016 allowed for it to be devolved, but its replacement, laid out in the Air Departure Tax (Scotland) Act 2017, has yet to be effected. According to this (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/rates-and-allowances-for-air-passenger-duty) the rate of APD on domestic flights within the UK from 1 April 2023 (when the reduction comes in to force) will be the same, irrespective of which part of the UK the flight arrives and departs from (Scottish Highlands and Islands excepted). The rates for the other bands (i.e. non-domestic flights) are the same across the UK, with the exception of direct flights from Northern Ireland to destinations outside Band A. So passengers on flights from Scotland (H&I excepted) will pay the same rates of tax as those from England and Wales (and from NI to destinations within Band A).

I should have worded my post differently. Scot Gov deferred the decision to have full control of APD due to legal challenges and the impact on HIA airports. You are correct in terms of what the policy is right now. There is nothing to say that the Scottish Gov may opt to take control and retain the current levels of tax, which they have renamed it as The Air Departure Tax. Just to give it a bit of a tartan twist…

[tartan 201]

There is nothing to say that the Scottish Gov may opt to take control and retain the current levels of tax, which they have renamed it as The Air Departure Tax. Just to give it a bit of a tartan twist…

Not long to wait to see if you're right as this time next week the Scottish budget for FY23-24 will be published.

[Flightrider]

Sadly, for the aviation sector, APD is devolved to the Scottish Govt. It’s no secret that Sturgeon and her green chums are very anti aviation. The welcome reduction in APD by the UK Gov means pax departing from English and Welsh airports should see a benefit. Flights or pax departing from Scotland will still have to pay this tax.

It's not a question of re-wording, the statement is just plain wrong on several counts. The reduction in APD on domestic flights applies to passengers to/from airports in Scotland just as it does everywhere else in the UK, so passengers won't still have to pay the £13 tax but £6.50 instead.

​​​​​​​

[tartan 201]

A35K on the MCO service when it returns.
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/980x2000/screenshot_20221210_200500_2328d092117c2775d8f4182eaaa5a1d14 315cd20.png

[Breathe]

This EDI spotters will love grabbing a snap of that. First time for an A350-1000 at EDI or have Qatar sent one in the past?

[tartan 201]

This EDI spotters will love grabbing a snap of that. First time for an A350-1000 at EDI or have Qatar sent one in the past?
​​​​​​
​There's been at least one QR one.

[Planeraz]

This EDI spotters will love grabbing a snap of that. First time for an A350-1000 at EDI or have Qatar sent one in the past?

Although the S23 season is starting much later in June, it’s still a nice upgrade from the dated A333. Particularly in upper class. Qatar have used an A351 on a few occasions. Their is also speculation that they may go double daily again next year. The slots requested also indicate a double daily service.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

It's a Hell of an upgrade (+50%) from the A330-300 at 264 seats at C31W48Y185 vs. 397 on the Beach Fleet A35K at C16W56Y325. Still less than the 455 on the B747-400s that were filled out of GLA but good to see Orlando getting some love given the challenges of the £/€ exchange rate.

[GrahamK]

Strange one given that the A330s were very rarely more than 75% full.

[Sk1schoolsam]

Strange one given that the A330s were very rarely more than 75% full.

mid I am not mistaken the EAdI flight operates with the MAN based aircraft and crew so I suspect the change to a new high density aircraft aimed at the holiday market and not biz travel is more about increasing capacity at MAN with an incidental increase for EDI as a result. Allows them to reroute a more premium heavy aircraft to more biz travel routes.

[inOban]

Also, isn't it just twice weekly, rather than three-x?

[CabinCrewe]

Strange one given that the A330s were very rarely more than 75% full.
Seems like a MAN related logistical move. The revenue management of this sector might now be interesting for anyone interested in using it. Whether its sustainable remains to be seen given this years average loads for the whole season.

[Planeraz]

It's not a question of re-wording, the statement is just plain wrong on several counts. The reduction in APD on domestic flights applies to passengers to/from airports in Scotland just as it does everywhere else in the UK, so passengers won't still have to pay the £13 tax but £6.50 instead.


it’s just plain wrong to rule out…when you have individuals in Sturgeons coalition of chaos determined to destroy the aviation and travel sector in Scotland.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/green-party-chief-lorna-slater-28701963
​​​​​​​

[SWBKCB]

Slater is currently in Montreal for the UN COP15 biodiversity summit.

That must have been some train journey. With three routes dropped, not sure the new French policy is that “exciting”. How many UK routes would be impacted - less than two and a half hours by train and a low level of interlining?

[mwm991]

She's an utter clown. Routes like MAN-EDI/GLA which have decent road/rail alternatives are not returning anyway. Good luck with Scotland to SOU, BRS, EXT on the ground though.

Usual pie in the sky from the idealistic hippies. They're all jet setting and getting chauffeured anyway so who's the mugs?

[tictack67]

She's an utter clown. Routes like MAN-EDI/GLA which have decent road/rail alternatives are not returning anyway. Good luck with Scotland to SOU, BRS, EXT on the ground though.

Usual pie in the sky from the idealistic hippies. They're all jet setting and getting chauffeured anyway so who's the mugs?

Edinburgh to Manchester in 3.5 hrs by train (219 miles) , Madrid to Malaga is 2.5hrs by train (320miles) where the Spanish train goes at 100km hour faster than UK.

That's before any train ticket cost differential.

Then yes. Who is the mug
​​​​​​

[nighthawk117]

United just ordered 100 787s with options for 100 more

I guess this will be forming the transatlantic fleet in future.

[CabinCrewe]

if the XLRs come on line first, suspect you're locally more likely to be seeing them

[Sk1schoolsam]

United just ordered 100 787s with options for 100 more

I guess this will be forming the transatlantic fleet in future.

Are there not a few unused 787’s ex Norwegian lying around that could be leased and repurposed by United and AA if they’re short of metal. I am sure there’s a couple even at PIK still.

[Sk1schoolsam]

if the XLRs come on line first, suspect you're locally more likely to be seeing them

Don’t disagree but the A321 will have a very similar capacity to the current B757 and considering there used to be 2-3 daily flights by UA from Central Scotland to Newark and now only one it’s also not unreasonable that they might consider a larger frame in the future especially in the peak summer. I understand the route load factors on this route have been strong this year.

[A350Saltire]

Don’t disagree but the A321 will have a very similar capacity to the current B757 and considering there used to be 2-3 daily flights by UA from Central Scotland to Newark and now only one it’s also not unreasonable that they might consider a larger frame in the future especially in the peak summer. I understand the route load factors on this route have been strong this year.

Agree I suspect we might get a 787 on EWR or IAD and A321s on the other routes.

[nighthawk117]

Don’t disagree but the A321 will have a very similar capacity to the current B757 and considering there used to be 2-3 daily flights by UA from Central Scotland to Newark and now only one it’s also not unreasonable that they might consider a larger frame in the future especially in the peak summer. I understand the route load factors on this route have been strong this year.
The flight has been completely full for the last few months at least.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

EDI-EWR is a strong B787 candidate, and they're going to have a massive fleet to play with. Given the huge size of the order, they may have sub-fleets tailored towards leisure markets that would be a better fit rather than the current Polaris heavy layouts.

[A350Saltire]

EDI-EWR is a strong B787 candidate, and they're going to have a massive fleet to play with. Given the huge size of the order, they may have sub-fleets tailored towards leisure markets that would be a better fit rather than the current Polaris heavy layouts.

I agree but IAD was the one this year that saw the 764 over a 752.

[Rutan16]

I agree but IAD was the one this year that saw the 764 over a 752.

The 764s used on Washington were NOT driven by demand more rather aircraft utilisation .

The 764 is primarily used on economy heavy routes from the east coast whilst most of the 763 fleet are now very premium heavy

Indeed those premium heavy 763s have Fewer seats than the 757s and just 99 in steerage and I don’t think the 757 are used on many other routes from Dulles anyway.

I suppose the question remains why/if Washington ( albeit limited programme) is even viable to be honest - Except as a secondary feeder and spoke beyond IAD and reliever for Newark ( that was the case at Manchester a few years back)

No disrespect Edinburgh must have cut a favourable deal with United and Delta behind the scenes.

And true high season US point of sale is a magnitude stronger than Manchester however falls off a cliff pretty quickly.

[4eyed anorak]

Out of curiosity, has the C.A.A. stop publishing the monthly airport data? Nothing put up since the September readings were taken.

Regards 4ea

[Sk1schoolsam]

Out of curiosity, has the C.A.A. stop publishing the monthly airport data? Nothing put up since the September readings were taken.

Regards 4ea

Funny I was thinking exactly the same……
last update to Sept figures was in November.

[Sk1schoolsam]

The 764s used on Washington were NOT driven by demand more rather aircraft utilisation .

The 764 is primarily used on economy heavy routes from the east coast whilst most of the 763 fleet are now very premium heavy

Indeed those premium heavy 763s have Fewer seats than the 757s and just 99 in steerage and I don’t think the 757 are used on many other routes from Dulles anyway.

I suppose the question remains why/if Washington ( albeit limited programme) is even viable to be honest - Except as a secondary feeder and spoke beyond IAD and reliever for Newark ( that was the case at Manchester a few years back)

No disrespect Edinburgh must have cut a favourable deal with United and Delta behind the scenes.

And true high season US point of sale is a magnitude stronger than Manchester however falls off a cliff pretty quickly.

If there’s no demand how come United and Delta still have routes through W22?

From what I have seen the IAD route performed strongly in S22 so really don’t get where you think that it’s not a viable route.

[GrahamK]

If there’s no demand how come United and Delta still have routes through W22? From what I have seen the IAD route performed strongly in S22 so really don’t get where you think that it’s not a viable route.Indeed all UA routes performed strongly from EDI this summer. ​​​​​​​As for the CAA stats, suspect October's will be due any day now. Usually a month or 2 behind.

[A350Saltire]

Indeed all UA routes performed strongly from EDI this summer. As for the CAA stats, suspect October's will be due any day now. Usually a month or 2 behind.

They did (although I acknowledge that load factors are not the only representative of a route's success) and just as a reminder, I have borrowed the load factors from the EDI forum (although couldn't find July). Certainly suggests the demand is there:

BOS (DL 763), June - 96%, August - 91%, September - 93%
JFK (DL 763), June - 99%, August - 94%, September - 95%
EWR (UA 752), June - 92%, August - 92%, September - 94%
IAD (UA 764), June - 96%, August - 90%, September - 91%
ORD (UA 752), June - did not operate, August - 87%, September - 95%

Interestingly also the combo of AC and WS on YYZ operating both 7M8 (WS) and 788/9 (AC) were:

YYZ, June - 87%, August - 89%, September - 89%

Of course WS's route to YYZ is now gone and replaced by YYC on a 789 for Summer 2023.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

The 764s used on Washington were NOT driven by demand more rather aircraft utilisation .

The 764 is primarily used on economy heavy routes from the east coast whilst most of the 763 fleet are now very premium heavy

Indeed those premium heavy 763s have Fewer seats than the 757s and just 99 in steerage and I don’t think the 757 are used on many other routes from Dulles anyway.

I suppose the question remains why/if Washington ( albeit limited programme) is even viable to be honest - Except as a secondary feeder and spoke beyond IAD and reliever for Newark ( that was the case at Manchester a few years back)

No disrespect Edinburgh must have cut a favourable deal with United and Delta behind the scenes.

And true high season US point of sale is a magnitude stronger than Manchester however falls off a cliff pretty quickly.
EDI has a strong inbound pull for seasonal tourism, it's a great city break as well as the clear long haul gateway to Scotland and parts of Northern England. Have the management at EDI cut a good deal with their airlines? I should imagine so, compare this to GLA who simply can't compete anymore. I
am surprised UA offer IAD, EWR and ORD, it used to be 2 x EWR and I was impressed by that. But summer traffic is much about US tourists making the best use of $USD buying power in years. Which partly explains why old favourite Orlando is on the floor while BOS/IAD have bounced back.

Flipping the question, how come MAN can't hold onto a single US carrier? Perhaps there's something to be said for cutting a deal?

[CabinCrewe]

Have the management at EDI cut a good deal with their airlines?
Especially if theres a potential sale on the cards… the sustainability of such deals show when routes come and go over varying duration cycles. If they can’t manage high loads at the height of summer in an inbound dollar frenzy, I don’t know when they could.

[Rutan16]

EDI has a strong inbound pull for seasonal tourism, it's a great city break as well as the clear long haul gateway to Scotland and parts of Northern England. Have the management at EDI cut a good deal with their airlines? I should imagine so, compare this to GLA who simply can't compete anymore. I
am surprised UA offer IAD, EWR and ORD, it used to be 2 x EWR and I was impressed by that. But summer traffic is much about US tourists making the best use of $USD buying power in years. Which partly explains why old favourite Orlando is on the floor while BOS/IAD have bounced back.

Flipping the question, how come MAN can't hold onto a single US carrier? Perhaps there's something to be said for cutting a deal?

Skip go read my earlier post I acknowledged that Edinburgh has high albeit exceptionally seasonal US point of sale advantage; we aren’t disagreeing in anyway !

What I was simply saying and for third time use of the 764 was for utilisation on the short seasonal service and should not be considered in isolation of empirical evidence for very high demand or profitability and you of all know that scenario well enough.

As for Manchester sure the dynamic is very much UK point of sale however I remain of the opinion United will return in 2024 with the replacement of the 757 .

I also expect Delta to open Boston in the same time frame and I have read somewhere ( third hand so no citation afraid to say) that MAG are seeking restoration of San Francisco probably with Virgin again 2024 seems likely.

Delta remains present in the market via the VS joint venture on New York and Atlanta routes in particular.

I do have concerns for the strength of Orlando particularly through the second half of 2023 with current domestic economic conditions.

MAG - May yet be making deals however I have no specific evidence either way.

Since the reopening of most international traffic flows, massive labour shortages I think MAG Group has been prioritising and consolidating rather than expanding - that said Kuwait and Gulf Air have been added whilst Hong Kong and mainland China services have been restored .

And the guys and lassies from Dallas have abandoned almost everywhere in Europe sans Heathrow and their mates hubs in EU centres.

Only exception of any significance being Italy and a cruise season to Athens

Now would this post probably be better in the dedicated Manchester thread sure but I think the points are pertinent right here in explaining the entire reason for the comments up stream specifically the use of the 764 by United nothing else.

I haven’t commented on Chicago largely because it was an even shorter season and I don’t know enough about why United even bothered to be honest - As a transit a hub for both AA and UA it’s had its day

[nighthawk117]

Fuel issues at EDI:

Q) EGPX/QFULT/IV/NBO /A /000/999/5557N00322W
A) EGPH
B) 22/12/14 15:15 C) 22/12/21 15:15
E) REFUELING CANNOT BE GUARANTEED DUE ONGOING TECHNICAL ISSUES WITH EXTERNAL ACFT FUEL SUPPLIERS, ACFT OPERATORS TO MAXIMISE INBOUND TANKER

This mornings EWR flight operated via GLA. I suspect a few others may do too.

[Breathe]

Air France have brought back their later morning flight for S23 from 28/3/23.

AF1686 10:20 CDG-EDI
AF1687 11:55 EDI-CDG

This will avoid some long connection times at CDG for connecting flights.

[CabinCrewe]

Air France have brought back their later morning flight for S23 from 28/3/23.

AF1686 10:20 CDG-EDI
AF1687 11:55 EDI-CDG

This will avoid some long connection times at CDG for connecting flights.
Looks like on three days of the week

[Planeraz]

Looks like on three days of the week

Correct. on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday. Frequency still below pre pandemic levels, but a step in the right direction. AF will also benefit from KLM cuts. I’m sure this is probably part of the reason for the increase.

[tictack67]

Air France have brought back their later morning flight for S23 from 28/3/23.

AF1686 10:20 CDG-EDI
AF1687 11:55 EDI-CDG

This will avoid some long connection times at CDG for connecting flights.

All flights will be on Air France metal.

Midmorning flight will be A320

[tictack67]

Summer 2023

LH keeping Their morning 0600hrs night stopper (A320)

The lunchtime and evening flight will be A321

[SWBKCB]

Out of curiosity, has the C.A.A. stop publishing the monthly airport data? Nothing put up since the September readings were taken.

Regards 4ea

October stats are available

[Planeraz]

October stats are available

Qatar carried 16230 in October. Used 788 and 359’s. A rough calc gives a LF of around 98%. Impressive stats again.

[A350Saltire]

Qatar carried 16230 in October. Used 788 and 359’s. A rough calc gives a LF of around 98%. Impressive stats again.

Very impressive. You can see why they are considering double daily.

Also worth noting given discussions up thread that the route to North America with the most pax carried in October was, yes you’ve guessed it - IAD (with 12,993 pax). EWR was 10,153 and JFK was 9,415.

[Rutan16]

Very impressive. You can see why they are considering double daily.

Also worth noting given discussions up thread that the route to North America with the most pax carried in October was, yes you’ve guessed it - IAD (with 12,993 pax). EWR was 10,153 and JFK was 9,415.

Yet can we see recovery margins - Probably not

New York healthy enough sure can’t argue. Want to see New York through November as a stand-alone US point of entry/ exit .

Washington actually had similar high load factors prior to removal at Manchester, however abysmal recovery rates for both BMI and later United over the years . Not to discredit to Edinburgh right now.

And with the 764 one doesn’t need to look too deeply at the motives to flog many of the 203 economy seats very competitively especially in the US markers.

Remember COVID and it’s effects a significant amount of the domestic US clientele were holding massive amounts of redeemable vouchers and some holiday entitlement subject to personal contracts and that they had to use up this past summer.

These voucher redemptions are now largely spent both sides of the Atlantic today.

2022 is a difficult year to measure and base future projections imho.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

2022 will be a year like no others to spend USD in the UK, that alone is enough to give some confidence. Interesting parallel with BMI's MAN-IAD, the way to think about this, is that MAN-IAD vs. IAD-EDI I think. Point of sale was predominantly UK in the first and seems to be US skewed in the latter. Which may also explain why the Thomas Cook US routes are still a gap at MAN, as UK POS dominated and that's relatively weaker now.
It's funny how we get fixated with long haul and the big jets, STN,MAN, LGW,GLA thread all similar sentiments :)

[Planeraz]

Qatar carried 16230 in October. Used 788 and 359’s. A rough calc gives a LF of around 98%. Impressive stats again.

US Routes - Approx LF’s

JFK reduced to 5 x weekly mid October. IAD ended 27th.

JFK - 99%
EWR - 97%
IAD - 98%

Canada

YYZ - 95%

[Asturias56]

overall quite a few long haul routes worldwide are flying near full - the question is are they making enough money at current oil prices to encourage them to start expanding back pre-covid frequencies?

[CabinCrewe]

Wasn't DOH previously daily A350 rather than mix of smaller 787?

[tictack67]

Wasn't DOH previously daily A350 rather than mix of smaller 787?

In what context are you asking this?

[Rutan16]

overall quite a few long haul routes worldwide are flying near full - the question is are they making enough money at current oil prices to encourage them to start expanding back pre-covid frequencies?

Very much agree and summer 2022 traffic numbers ( seats occupied) has been inflated by absolutely massive levels of voucher redemptions further impacting potential and actual profit margins.

[Rutan16]

In what context are you asking this?
Perhaps that fact that 22 A359s are parked some potentially for ever might have an influence do you think?

[tictack67]

Perhaps that fact that 22 A359s are parked some potentially for ever might have an influence do you think?

No idea, going by past posts appears to be some sort of negative point.


DOH was 16230 passengers in October and continues daily thru winter.

No idea what relevance the question is. DOH is still daily.

People obsessed about aircraft size.

I'm just grateful EDI continues with new routes and new airlines and choice.

I remember the old days where the only international routes were AMS, DUB and Maybe CDG.

[willy wombat]

I remember the old,old days when the international scheduled routes were zero (maybe Dublin, nothing else). The highlight (summer only) was the Sterling Caravelle student charter on a Wednesday.

[SWBKCB]

Qatar carried 16230 in October. Used 788 and 359’s. A rough calc gives a LF of around 98%. Impressive stats again.

In what context are you asking this?

Maybe in this context? If impressive load factor figures are being mentioned the size of aircraft is relevant, especially if it is smaller than originally scheduled. Anyway as we all know load factors don't tell you much. As the old saying goes, any fool can fill an aircraft, it's filling it and making money that is the difficult bit.

[Planeraz]

Maybe in this context? If impressive load factor figures are being mentioned the size of aircraft is relevant, especially if it is smaller than originally scheduled. Anyway as we all know load factors don't tell you much. As the old saying goes, any fool can fill an aircraft, it's filling it and making money that is the difficult bit.

Lots of good points of view. It’s all about opinions after all. With regards to Qatar, they have served EDI for many years now. They have been incredibly loyal to EDI. Continued to operate throughout the pandemic. What did all the other long haul carriers do? They suspended completely. Cargo will have played an important part. A source of income despite pax numbers falling off the cliff. Compare Oct 22 to Oct 21. Qatar carried around 4000 in 21. They won’t have made any profit from such low pax numbers. More than 16000 in Oct 22 is impressive. They must be more than happy with how the route is performing. As we know, they have applied for double the number of slots in 2023. They must be actively considering going double daily. Let’s see if they actually do.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

Don't make the mistake of thinking airlines are loyal to airports. Qatar had an enormous wide body fleet that flew because of the pressing need to keep the global supply chain going, that's not something the US majors did with B757/B767s. United did keep their B77Ws and B787s flying on cargo only but only a smaller fleet.

[Rutan16]

Maybe in this context? If impressive load factor figures are being mentioned the size of aircraft is relevant, especially if it is smaller than originally scheduled. Anyway as we all know load factors don't tell you much. As the old saying goes, any fool can fill an aircraft, it's filling it and making money that is the difficult bit.

Exactly this, it’s a few spotter types on every thread lacking crucial business acumen and when sort of challenged they get a little defensive.

Has Edinburgh as an airport been successful under GIP yes; we have seen a massive growth of services - many from/to Europe in particular due in no small part to the EU open sky policies ( now lost) and indeed strong work by the Scottish administration and Visit Scotland aboard to encourage inbound travellers .

Some of the routes such as Rotterdam, Paris Orly and the Scandinavian/Nordic/ Faroese routes are definitely inbound biased.

Has GIP and Visit Scotland also been successful in the US; recently certainly however caveat the previous referred factors in 2022 particularly.

Through there have been disappointments notably via the UAE and beyond - Both carriers are currently OUT of the market, so is that an indication that volumes ( out bound point of sale ) going East and further aren’t as strong as some believe ?

Hainan’s short Chinese service didn’t deliver the expectations of CAISSA even before COVID struck.

I am ( personal opinion) less than convinced that Westjet will be able to make Calgary work as a hub; several flights a week from Edinburgh ( on a Dreamliner no less) seems exceptionally risky both with adequate range of connectivity and ability for a balanced revenue bundle. I think they are making a grave mistake but we shall see in 18 months or sooner ( not just on the Edinburgh route )

Toronto performs okay in high season through the clientele have morphed and changed over the years - long gone VFR mothers and daughters and several 747s from Ayr and Manchester each day.

Whilst I don’t entirely know I suspect GIP are wanting their money out because the airport has peaked in the growth curve at least in the short to mid term and the required investment in the existing infrastructure and return/ recovery has the potential to damage the parent gearing levels.
Considered opportunity risk “may” well be elsewhere for them.

[CabinCrewe]

In what context are you asking this?
If you're having to ask that, we are in trouble.
If you don’t get higher loads on a smaller than previously operated schedule then something is a miss. Was the same with NCLs EK service when overall weekly capacity was reduced. Its not rocket science as others have shown.
But everone loves an apparent personal vendetta :rolleyes:

[VickersVicount]

few spotter types on every thread lacking crucial business acumen and when sort of challenged they get a little defensive
LOL. This thread perhaps the archetype ! Seasons Greetings everyone.

[VickersVicount]

.
Whilst I don’t entirely know I suspect GIP are wanting their money out
Have we had any further rumblings about an offload sale? presumably there might be a sweet spot sale time before any risk gathers (should that be ‘gatters’ ) momentum.

[tictack67]

If you're having to ask that, we are in trouble.
If you don’t get higher loads on a smaller than previously operated schedule then something is a miss. Was the same with NCLs EK service when overall weekly capacity was reduced. Its not rocket science as others have shown.
But everone loves an apparent personal vendetta :rolleyes:

Note at all, this thread goes of at many different tangents.

All you stated wasn't DOH an A350.

Yes they've changed to a B787 and managed to fill it and this is somehow a failure here.

GIP have owned Edinburgh for over 10 years, so the quick buy quick sale doesn't stand up.

Yes the old business saying turnover (Pax numbers) is vanity profit is sanity.

I used to work in revenue management for a large UK airline.

Just seems lots of Edinburgh downers in here who glee at any reduction and find flaw with any positive.

I've noticed this particular trend with your posts in particular and your choice of vocabulary in some posts. (For example an increase in Air France flights to 3 a week is seen as a negative).

It's not EDI fault that other UK airports are not able to attract or keep their routes. Complain to them.

[Rutan16]

I remember the old,old days when the international scheduled routes were zero (maybe Dublin, nothing else). The highlight (summer only) was the Sterling Caravelle student charter on a Wednesday.

BEA/ BA operated via Birmingham and Manchester onto Milan , Brussels and Düsseldorf with the good old 1-11 in the early 70s and direct to Paris if memory serves.

Through certainly a blight for much of the day .

As for Sterling yes remember them doing a few flights each summer and them going onto Dublin as well .

[Rutan16]

Note at all, this thread goes of at many different tangents.

All you stated wasn't DOH an A350.

Yes they've changed to a B787 and managed to fill it and this is somehow a failure here.

GIP have owned Edinburgh for over 10 years, so the quick buy quick sale doesn't stand up.

Yes the old business saying turnover (Pax numbers) is vanity profit is sanity.

I used to work in revenue management for a large UK airline.

Just seems lots of Edinburgh downers in here who glee at any reduction and find flaw with any positive.

I've noticed this particular trend with your posts in particular and your choice of vocabulary in some posts. (For example an increase in Air France flights to 3 a week is seen as a negative).

It's not EDI fault that other UK airports are not able to attract or keep their routes. Complain to them.

GIP are a hard nosed venture capitalist business with billions of billions of dollars invested around the world and aviation being a small element of that.

Prior evidence is that they have a policy of selling most of their assets to realise profits after a given period of time ( gains achieved and the very essence of the business model) . They are very adept in the art of sweating assets, often buy in after someone else has done the prior development and at the start of a cycle ( Also a key to the business model and practices)

However when real investments ( not terminal cosmetics such as South terminal Gatwick) loom high, they are known to offload rather quickly.

Right now that’s Turnhouse in a nutshell growth achieved ( mid term growth numbers uncertain) massive levels of real construction and buildings needed - hundreds of millions if not billions of pounds with a recovery period stretching into the mid and long term .
Perfect time to recover your profit I’d suggest.

Allow the day to day operator to offer a range of discounts and varnish the table ready for someone else to take on the risk opportunity.

Qatar have 22 A359s grounded and the remaining twelve are in their premier Q seat format and needed for the US in the main . Pure and simple that’s why they have largely disappeared .
Not a criticism just a fact .

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

Which comes back to my point, that if Scortand is to have a gateway to the world for the 21st century, it needs a new build fit for purpose terminal at EDI. What we have now is an impressive volume of traffic through a 1977 terminal built for Tridents and Viscounts with some major bolt ons. Anyone who flew throught LHR terminals pre 2008 knows where that ends up. And that sort of investment usually means taxpayer funded and the hamster wheel turns once more.

[Rutan16]

Which comes back to my point, that if Scortand is to have a gateway to the world for the 21st century, it needs a new build fit for purpose terminal at EDI. What we have now is an impressive volume of traffic through a 1977 terminal built for Tridents and Viscounts with some major bolt ons. Anyone who flew throught LHR terminals pre 2008 knows where that ends up. And that sort of investment usually means taxpayer funded and the hamster wheel turns once more.

Quite and agreed Skip .
Yet I just don’t think (and based on their prior evidence elsewhere) GIP are the company to provide the necessary funds , it will be someone else or regrettable it will be Holyrood and that’s not a particularly good thing ( even for an old socialist)

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

GIP will quite rightly want their ROI and move on elsewhere, no complaint from me on that. The actual tricky bit is that to take the business to the next phase, fit for the next 30 years, they need to have space to grow and the current design has natural limitations and pain points. Look at MAN, the current expansion is long overdue and painfully piecemeal. I don't see EDI making a better job on a much lower traffic base. Private sector just won't fund it given the ROI. Nothing against EDI or MAN, just my thoughts on the constraints they operate under.

[Rutan16]

GIP will quite rightly want their ROI and move on elsewhere, no complaint from me on that. The actual tricky bit is that to take the business to the next phase, fit for the next 30 years, they need to have space to grow and the current design has natural limitations and pain points. Look at MAN, the current expansion is long overdue and painfully piecemeal. I don't see EDI making a better job on a much lower traffic base. Private sector just won't fund it given the ROI. Nothing against EDI or MAN, just my thoughts on the constraints they operate under.

Pretty much agree with that synopsis Skip

[GoEDI]

If you're having to ask that, we are in trouble.
If you don’t get higher loads on a smaller than previously operated schedule then something is a miss. Was the same with NCLs EK service when overall weekly capacity was reduced. Its not rocket science as others have shown.
But everone loves an apparent personal vendetta :rolleyes:

Whilst that is fair enough, loads aside, QR also carried more pax in Oct 22 than they did in pre-covid Oct 19, even though the schedule has been reduced. So it's not just a case of higher loads due to lower capacity, outright demand for the route is stronger than ever currently. There are no doubt reasons for that, travel rebound/EK still way down on 2019 capacity in Scotland etc, but I don't think there should be any doubt that QR are currently performing strongly at EDI and growth for S23 is highly likely.

[willy wombat]

Lots to discuss here. GIP have shown themselves to be masters at squeezing the proverbial quart into a pint pot. At EDI this has been done with a mish mash of terminal bolt ons. At LGW it has been done by achieving a considerable increase in the declared capacity of its single runway. In the 1990s I used to participate in the bi annual runway capacity meetings at LGW. These consisted of representatives from ATC, the airport operator, the principal airlines (operating at LGW) and the Scheduling Committee. Obviously safety was the number one concern but thereafter we looked at the modelled effect that increasing runway capacity would have on delays. In general, naturally the airport operator wanted the maximum possible number of movements allowed as this translated directly into revenue for them. The airlines also wanted increased capacity as that meant more slots available, but not at the expense of too much of an increase in delays. We were ecstatic, and highly impressed by ATC, when we managed in the 1990s to get a couple of hours each day declared at 40 movements (previously the maximum was in the 30s). Since then the declared capacity has steadily increased and now peak hours are coordinated to 55 movements. The effect of this is obvious to anyone who travels regularly from LGW - you frequently sit in a queue of departing aircraft for over 30 minutes. As the domestic route I travel on most often is LGWEDI and vv I get the full GIP experience - delays at LGW and inadequate terminal facilities at EDI. Suffice to say I am no fan of GIP.
So what does this mean for EDI in the future? IMHO there is no way GIP will invest in significant terminal expansion (and the idea of knocking it down and rebuilding from scratch is a pipe dream). This is not the GIP model which is, again IMHO, to pump up the asset and sell it on. I cannot see any other source of private equity undertaking massive terminal expansion. I think Holyrood getting involved with any expansion is a non starter. The owners of GLA would scream unfair competition, Nicola is in hoc to the Greens and airport expansion does not fit with the Green agenda and anyway, Scotland has loads of airport capacity, just not necessarily in the right place (but that’s the case with UK airport capacity in general).
My best guess is that EDI will continue to muddle along with a bit of bolt on capacity here and there. If growth continues it will eventually have to be fully coordinated but based primarily on terminal capacity rather than runway capacity. Airlines wishing to add flights will either have to accept sub optimal timings or overflow, presumably to GLA or NCL (while they wait for slots at EDI to become available).
Finally, I agree that this thread is a bit spotter orientated at times which is obvious from some of the rather naive comments posted. But don’t knock the spotters - I started as one in the 1960s and I could name quite a few senior managers in UK airlines who did the same. It’s a tough industry and it helps if you have an enthusiasm for it. After all, you’re (hopefully) going to work for a large chunk of your adult life and it’s much nicer to do something you enjoy.

[Rutan16]

Lots to discuss here. GIP have shown themselves to be masters at squeezing the proverbial quart into a pint pot. At EDI this has been done with a mish mash of terminal bolt ons. At LGW it has been done by achieving a considerable increase in the declared capacity of its single runway. In the 1990s I used to participate in the bi annual runway capacity meetings at LGW. These consisted of representatives from ATC, the airport operator, the principal airlines (operating at LGW) and the Scheduling Committee. Obviously safety was the number one concern but thereafter we looked at the modelled effect that increasing runway capacity would have on delays. In general, naturally the airport operator wanted the maximum possible number of movements allowed as this translated directly into revenue for them. The airlines also wanted increased capacity as that meant more slots available, but not at the expense of too much of an increase in delays. We were ecstatic, and highly impressed by ATC, when we managed in the 1990s to get a couple of hours each day declared at 40 movements (previously the maximum was in the 30s). Since then the declared capacity has steadily increased and now peak hours are coordinated to 55 movements. The effect of this is obvious to anyone who travels regularly from LGW - you frequently sit in a queue of departing aircraft for over 30 minutes. As the domestic route I travel on most often is LGWEDI and vv I get the full GIP experience - delays at LGW and inadequate terminal facilities at EDI. Suffice to say I am no fan of GIP.
So what does this mean for EDI in the future? IMHO there is no way GIP will invest in significant terminal expansion (and the idea of knocking it down and rebuilding from scratch is a pipe dream). This is not the GIP model which is, again IMHO, to pump up the asset and sell it on. I cannot see any other source of private equity undertaking massive terminal expansion. I think Holyrood getting involved with any expansion is a non starter. The owners of GLA would scream unfair competition, Nicola is in hoc to the Greens and airport expansion does not fit with the Green agenda and anyway, Scotland has loads of airport capacity, just not necessarily in the right place (but that’s the case with UK airport capacity in general).
My best guess is that EDI will continue to muddle along with a bit of bolt on capacity here and there. If growth continues it will eventually have to be fully coordinated but based primarily on terminal capacity rather than runway capacity. Airlines wishing to add flights will either have to accept sub optimal timings or overflow, presumably to GLA or NCL (while they wait for slots at EDI to become available).
Finally, I agree that this thread is a bit spotter orientated at times which is obvious from some of the rather naive comments posted. But don’t knock the spotters - I started as one in the 1960s and I could name quite a few senior managers in UK airlines who did the same. It’s a tough industry and it helps if you have an enthusiasm for it. After all, you’re (hopefully) going to work for a large chunk of your adult life and it’s much nicer to do something you enjoy.

If this thread had a thumbs up feature you would get awarded several :ok:

[A350Saltire]

Several QR flights oh DOH-EDI over the Christmas period now showing as an A359 rather than 788. There are actually two flights now scheduled for the 27th December - morning flight is an A359 and afternoon flight is a 788.

[Planeraz]

Several QR flights oh DOH-EDI over the Christmas period now showing as an A359 rather than 788. There are actually two flights now scheduled for the 27th December - morning flight is an A359 and afternoon flight is a 788.

Good to see the service continuing to perform well. Today’s flight in both directions were completely full.

[Plane mad 134]

Qatar are to increase EDI-DOH to 10x weekly from February.

Source: https://twitter.com/EDI_Airport/status/1605186273148280834?t=HXSBwnopyWy5FrRP39XniA&s=19

[Planeraz]

Qatar are to increase EDI-DOH to 10x weekly from February.

Source: https://twitter.com/EDI_Airport/status/1605186273148280834?t=HXSBwnopyWy5FrRP39XniA&s=19

A very welcome but not unexpected increase in frequency. The operating aircraft will no doubt change as/when required to satisfy demand. Will a certain other ME carrier announce a comeback soon?

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

A very welcome but not unexpected increase in frequency. The operating aircraft will no doubt change as/when required to satisfy demand. Will a certain other ME carrier announce a comeback soon?
I imagine it's a pre-emptive strike to wrap up market share knowing that Emirates are indeed coming back.

[Planeraz]

I imagine it's a pre-emptive strike to wrap up market share knowing that Emirates are indeed coming back.

I think you may be right. The lead in time to going 10 x weekly is also short. Little over a month before increasing. It could also be that demand is high enough to warrant an almost immediate increase. February is normally a slow month for travel, so my money is on what you suggest.

[VickersVicount]

Presumably aiming to get back to the original 2019 capacity up to 10/wk almost exclusively on A350 back then.

[Planeraz]

Presumably aiming to get back to the original 2019 capacity up to 10/wk almost exclusively on A350 back then.

Interesting article showing how much the route has grown. Even more interesting is that India isn’t in top ten final destination for QR from EDI. Presumably EK command this market from Glasgow?

https://simpleflying.com/qatar-airways-10-weekly-edinburgh-flights-february-2023/

[VickersVicount]

when referencing last rise to 10/wk wonder why they chose to comment
”However, with 238,000 seats for sale, it achieved a low seat load factor of just 70%”
Wonder when the current S23 timetable 1x daily offering will switch for after March

[Planeraz]

Multiple diversions at EDI this morning due to fog. United went to Dublin. DL flight was cancelled. Potentially another night in Edinburgh for the DL pax whose flight to JFK was booked full. I assume DL will send over another 763 this evening as the Monday flight is also full apart from one J seat.

[tartan 201]

Multiple diversions at EDI this morning due to fog. United went to Dublin. DL flight was cancelled. Potentially another night in Edinburgh for the DL pax whose flight to JFK was booked full. I assume DL will send over another 763 this evening as the Monday flight is also full apart from one J seat.

Compounded by the ILS being u/s on 06 and Cat I only on 24:
A0005/23 NOTAMNQ) EGPX/QIUCG/I /NBO/A /000/999/5557N00322W005A) EGPH B) 2301010930 C) 2301042359E) ILS RWY 24 CAT I ONLY
CREATED: 01 Jan 2023 09:38:00 SOURCE: EUECYIYN

NOTAM A8571/22: Edinburgh Airport (EGPH)A8571/22 NOTAMNQ) EGPX/QILAS/I /NBO/A /000/999/5557N00322W005A) EGPH B) 2212311030 C) 2301042359E) ILS LOCALIZER RWY 06 U/S
CREATED: 31 Dec 2022 11:05:00SOURCE: EUECYIYN

[Aps473]

Edinburgh airport now showing as a destination again on emirates website it’s on the destination list and route map again after being removed when the route was cancelled

[Planeraz]

A post on a GLA forum is suggesting that EK are about to confirm return to EDI. A lounge is also rumoured for EK at EDI. A number of the contributors appear to be worried about EK’s commitment at Glasgow. Rumours of course until anything is confirmed.

buddyboy (http://gla.scot/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=77) wrote: ↑ (http://gla.scot/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8587#p8587)Thu Dec 29, 2022 3:36 pmInterestingly/worryingly neither the EK app or website are allowing me to book for next summer at the moment....

Will allow me to select flights then has an error......

EDI also has an EK flag next to it when you search for it unlike the other UK airports they don't fly to. However it won't show any flight.

Things are getting more and more concerning. Hopefully schedule tinkering and nothing more.This is an unsubstantiated rumour. EDI ground handlers claiming that EK is returning to EDI with plans for a lounge. This could be nothing of course or is their something more than a rumour?

[VickersVicount]

A post on a GLA forum is suggesting that EK are about to confirm return to EDI. A lounge is also rumoured for EK at EDI. A number of the contributors appear to be worried about EK’s commitment at Glasgow. Rumours of course until anything is confirmed.

buddyboy (http://gla.scot/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=77) wrote: ↑ (http://gla.scot/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8587#p8587)Thu Dec 29, 2022 3:36 pmInterestingly/worryingly neither the EK app or website are allowing me to book for next summer at the moment....

Will allow me to select flights then has an error......

EDI also has an EK flag next to it when you search for it unlike the other UK airports they don't fly to. However it won't show any flight.

Things are getting more and more concerning. Hopefully schedule tinkering and nothing more.This is an unsubstantiated rumour. EDI ground handlers claiming that EK is returning to EDI with plans for a lounge. This could be nothing of course or is their something more than a rumour?
oooft, you don’t half get carried away….
Flights freely bookable on all platforms.
Lounge seems ambitious when even 5/wk hasn’t been announced.
Get back to us with something more than GLA spotters forum rumours.

[Planeraz]

oooft, you don’t half get carried away….
Flights freely bookable on all platforms.
Lounge seems ambitious when even 5/wk hasn’t been announced.
Get back to us with something more than GLA spotters forum rumours.

Carried away? I’ll continue to post as I see fit and within the rules of this forum. Instead of making personal and immature posts, perhaps you can come back with something worthy. Have a great evening

[wesleyscott]

as soon as anyone has the schedule, please post...thank you :)

[tictack67]

Carried away? I’ll continue to post as I see fit and within the rules of this forum. Instead of making personal and immature posts, perhaps you can come back with something worthy. Have a great evening

I agree with Planeraz here.

Dang lol, why is Edinburgh the only forum where people lose their absolute sh#t at the mere discussion of a new route.

Haters got to hate.

[billyg]

I agree with Planeraz here.

.

No s**t Sherlock ?

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

I agree with Planeraz here.
Dang lol, why is Edinburgh the only forum where people lose their absolute sh#t at the mere discussion of a new route.
Haters got to hate.
It's common on here.
MAN vs. LPL
BFS vs. BHD
BOH vs. SOU
NCL vs. MME
GLA vs. EDI
LTN vs. STN
Each local airport is working to take traffic from that which is "righfully" the others. There's also a few settled ones.
CVT vs. BHX
PIK vs. GLA
DSA vs. er....anyone else

[Asturias56]

BOH _SOU is the bitterest IMHO - really crazy..............

[CabinCrewe]

anyway, back to predictions. If Hainan are resurfacing at MAN (and infact upping to twice weekly) could then retry the ill-fated triangle route EDI DUB again or even EDI MAN?

[Sk1schoolsam]

anyway, back to predictions. If Hainan are resurfacing at MAN (and infact upping to twice weekly) could then retry the ill-fated triangle route EDI DUB again or even EDI MAN?

😂 Careful that sort of wild speculation might really wide a few people up!😂
I once thought that this thread was actually for exactly that purpose in terms of rumours and speculation - but have become dismayed by the number of self proclaimed experts ready to slam any hint of non verified fact.

Although it would be good to see I think a restart by Hainan is unlikely. Would like to see EK return at some point.

[4eyed anorak]

I reckon PLAY might try a thice weeky. It would be nice to get some Far East charters like JAL/ANA weekly during the summer months, similar to Korean at GLA. Would Hanian/CAAC try the same?

Regards 4ea

[Planeraz]

anyway, back to predictions. If Hainan are resurfacing at MAN (and infact upping to twice weekly) could then retry the ill-fated triangle route EDI DUB again or even EDI MAN?

As much as I’d like to see a direct or some form of Chinese route from EDI, given the current political agendas restricting pax traveling to/from China, I don’t see this happening anytime soon. It would also be an open goal for Sturgeon to try to reimpose restrictions on foreign travel to/from Scotland. History tells us she would jump at the chance to politicise matters and do something different from England.

[CraigJay]

I remember it was heavily rumoured that China eastern would be announcing Shanghai a few years ago, Edinburgh was rumoured alongside Stockholm and Stockholm did launch. Once things settle in China you might see this pop up again.

[A350Saltire]

IMHO EK is a given. It’s just when.

[Planeraz]

TK

Turkish have increased capacity for the next week with equipment changes. Starting tomorrow, A333, Sun 321 then 332 Monday to Friday. The slots allocation did indicate an increase in capacity in 2023. It could also be to meet increased demand from pax traveling from China. I suspect further changes to operating equipment is likely.

[Sk1schoolsam]

TK

Turkish have increased capacity for the next week with equipment changes. Starting tomorrow, A333, Sun 321 then 332 Monday to Friday. The slots allocation did indicate an increase in capacity in 2023. It could also be to meet increased demand from pax traveling from China. I suspect further changes to operating equipment is likely.


Just curious if TK add EDI to their Pakistan Airlines code share agreement?
I have seen posts that suggests that this has driven up loads and lead to TK increasing capacity elsewhere in UK.

[Rutan16]

Edinburgh -PK5343 / TK1343

Answer yes !

[Sk1schoolsam]

Edinburgh -PK5343 / TK1343

Answer yes !

Cheers

[CabinCrewe]

Peak summer Jun-Sep FR service EDI-NQY for S23
Quite a lot of capacity from Scotland now to NQY, can it all last?

[tictack67]

Peak summer Jun-Sep FR service EDI-NQY for S23
Quite a lot of capacity from Scotland now to NQY, can it all last?
Calm down it's only 2 flights a week with RK from Jun-Sep

Loganair are doing a reduced 5 to 6 a week variable.

Don't see what the panic is, just Ryanair filling the mayfly for their UK reg aircraft that's doing 3 Edi-Stn a day with BOH and hopefully LDY on alternate days I'm the gaps.

[CabinCrewe]

Calm down it's only 2 flights a week with RK from Jun-Sep

Loganair are doing a reduced 5 to 6 a week variable.

Don't see what the panic is, just Ryanair filling the mayfly for their UK reg aircraft that's doing 3 Edi-Stn a day with BOH and hopefully LDY on alternate days I'm the gaps.
Good old Tikkers.. right on cue. :rolleyes: Its getting tiresome. Everyone is ‘calm’ and there is no ‘panic’ except seemingly some drama from you.

[tictack67]

Good old Tikkers.. right on cue. :rolleyes: Its getting tiresome. Everyone is ‘calm’ and there is no ‘panic’ except seemingly some drama from you.

I'm challenging you to provide data for your claims and comments that two weekly FR is overcapacity after all you've invited discussion.

Loganair have already said back in August'22 they will curtail their NQY summer 23 programme

The eden project has over 1 million visitors a year, 1.2 million live within a 90min catchment of NQY with no real alternative. With the Cornwall area having and estimated 4.8 million visitors.





​​

[SWBKCB]

Loganair have already said back in August'22 they will curtail their NQY summer 23 programme

Loganair's curtailing of the NQY programme involved dropping MME-INV and re-directing planned growth

In a further blow to Cornwall’s connectivity, summer routes linking Newquay with Teesside and onwards to Inverness will not return in 2023, and planned growth on other routes is to be redirected to other UK airports.

This was due to:

We’re most disappointed that short-sighted and short-term decisions by the airport’s management to incentivise unsustainable operations by other airlines leave no prospect of winter flights remaining viable, particularly against a backdrop of high fuel prices and rising inflation.

https://www.loganair.co.uk/our-story/latest-news/2022/loganair-suspends-cornwall-aiport-newquay-operations-this-winter/

[A350Saltire]

Well this is interesting from Etihad

https://twitter.com/seanm1997/status/1614716408222326786?s=46&t=OJmRHT889ENOWaIr4JQKTg

[Plane mad 134]

Looks like it could be a return of Etihad. Very good news if confirmed!

[gham89]

That's a very exciting addition.

Do wonder if this would impact a potential Emirates return though? Is there demand for 3 middle east carriers?

[VickersVicount]

….full daily frequency three ME carriers year round… id say that was overkill if was to come to fruition.
But its barely twice daily on one carrier this year, so perhaps jumping the gun

[Planeraz]

It would certainly be a major coup for EDI to have QR and possibly EY and EK. Is demand high/big enough to satisfy the big three ME carriers? If EY do return, would this be on a 787? I’m not sure if they still use 332/3?

[A350Saltire]

It would certainly be a major coup for EDI to have QR and possibly EY and EK. Is demand high/big enough to satisfy the big three ME carriers? If EY do return, would this be on a 787? I’m not sure if they still use 332/3?

If EY were to return it would most likely be a 789 as they have loads of them. The A330s are gone now I think.

[CraigJay]

Dublin can support all 3 comfortably, I’m sure EDI can too.

[Planeraz]

Dublin can support all 3 comfortably, I’m sure EDI can too.

Something else to consider or think about is EY’s codeshare with UA. It could be very positive for EDI should EY return.

[NotanAVGeek]

Certainly be interesting if Etihad returned to EDI. Seems so out of the blue with everyone suspecting Emirates. What was there reason for pulling out originally and it seemed almost immediately EK started up.

Edelweiss seem to be night stopping an aircraft a few times a week recently. Lufthansa started doing this also last year.

Easyjet to base a 321 Neo also.

Great to see the industry returning almost to pre pandemic levels.

[tictack67]

[QUOTE=NotanAVGeek;

Easyjet to base a 321 Neo also.
[/QUOTE]

I believe easyjet EDI base 2023 is 9 aircraft:
​​​​​​2 A319
3 A320 Neo
4 A320

Edelweiss won't be nightstopping in summer but days ...456. will be Swiss A320-Neo operating
Brussels airlines using a Cityjet CRJ900 on Sat/Sun.

Lufthansa confirmed nightstopping A320-neo as 3rd daily flight. The lunchtime and evening flight will using A321.

Munich returns to daily on LH own metal

Sadly I think the Etihad image is a spoof as none of the flight number match the route listed, they already have an extensive codeshares with KLM to Scottish airports

[nighthawk117]

Etihad have just announced two new routes today, one of which was on that list, one of which isnt.

Copenhagen and Düsseldorf..

https://airlinergs.com/etihad-airways-announces-new-routes-to-copenhagen-and-dusseldorf/

[inOban]

Is it clear what additional services will be operated by the extra EZY frame? So far EZY have dropped AGP and added Catania. Is it needed for increased frequency on existing routes or are new routes still to be announced?

[Planeraz]

Selected November 2022 Stats

Pax numbers and approx load factors based on CAA figures.

Qatar - Doha 14362 / 95%
TK - Istanbul 9724 / 93%
DL - JFK 7985 / 96%
UA - EWR 9461 / 94%

More very solid numbers and load factors.

[A350Saltire]

Is it clear what additional services will be operated by the extra EZY frame? So far EZY have dropped AGP and added Catania. Is it needed for increased frequency on existing routes or are new routes still to be announced?

They’ve added Antalya today I think.

[NotanAVGeek]

They’ve added Antalya today I think.

AYT is bookable on the website. Looks like twice weekly. So is Santorini on a weekly flight.

Jersey is also returning, I wonder if there will be any more.

[inOban]

I see them all now. When did they drop Gibraltar? It was operating up to Christmas but has entirely disappeared.

[GrahamK]

I see them all now. When did they drop Gibraltar? It was operating up to Christmas but has entirely disappeared.Gibraltar was taken off sale overnight I believe. It had been due to resume in March?

[NotanAVGeek]

Gibraltar was taken off sale overnight I believe. It had been due to resume in March?

Quite surprised by that as this was only link to GIB from Scotland and they’ve also stopped AGP too. Albeit a lot of competition on that route.

[ld0595]

That's odd, it was still up for sale when I checked last week

[VickersVicount]

Quite surprised by that
I’m not especially. Seem to remember thinking at the time it was marginal /wouldn’t last and a bit ‘niche’. Perhaps will resurface in a Santorini once weekly high summer style…?

[MKY661]

Gibraltar was taken off sale overnight I believe. It had been due to resume in March?

Was 100% on sale yesterday between now and March & between July & September (as posted on the GIB thread), but looks to be gone completely now.

Luton was the same when they dropped that, they didn't serve the route between July & August oddly then ended up getting rid of it, and I saw when they released the winter schedule for 2023/24 it didn't appear after September. For me though EasyJet don't really seem to advertise Gibraltar as an alternative gateway to southern Spain, really just for the city itself

[tartan 201]

ATL to be daily when it restarts, rather than the initially-announced five-weekly
https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/230121-dlns23

[Planeraz]

ATL to be daily when it restarts, rather than the initially-announced five-weekly
https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/230121-dlns23

More positive news. On a Saturday in peak S23 to use as an example, EDI will have 7 x flights to the US and 2 x to Canada. I haven’t included TUI to Orlando Melbourne and Cancun Mexico on certain dates as I’m not sure if they have been chopped? When you try to book, all the flights show as sold out.

[GayFriendly]

As an interested outsider (I've only ever used EDI as a passenger) do those in the know on this thread honestly think there's enough demand to fill up to 9 flights a day across the pond? I know EDI and Scotland is a big draw for North Americans but it's a thousand + of seats a day to fill?

Just interested in your thoughts and of course I hope for all concerned S23 TATL from EDI proves a rip roaring success!

[ATNotts]

As an interested outsider (I've only ever used EDI as a passenger) do those in the know on this thread honestly think there's enough demand to fill up to 9 flights a day across the pond? I know EDI and Scotland is a big draw for North Americans but it's a thousand + of seats a day to fill?

Just interested in your thoughts and of course I hope for all concerned S23 TATL from EDI proves a rip roaring success!
You ask a very valid question. It is entirely possible that over capacity could lead to more than one carrier losing money and deciding to pull off EDI leading to over capacity turning into under capacity almost overnight.

It has happened before, not necessarily at EDI. Hopefully the airlines have got their sums right in the current somewhat unstable economic climate.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

I was about to pose the same question. The strength of the Dollar vs GBP means there hasn't been a better time to visit for years, but this does mean we're in a bit of a bubble. I suspect it will right-size rather than burst, the economy is in a better place than when Scotland lost NWA and United in the space of three months back in the 90s or BA and Laker in the space of a month in the 80s. See also Pan Am in 1973. I think there's room for Delta, United and maybe American but probably at a medium term reduced frequency. Basically, enjoy summer 23 and take loads of photos :)

[nighthawk117]

Delta will have a better idea than anyone what the demand is. They operated two flights a day (Boston and New York) in 2022, so they'll know the market well, and clearly feel there's a demand for another flight. Flights to new destinations open up new markets - there might well be a lot of people in Atlanta who decided they didnt want to travel to Scotland as it meant connecting. Now they can do it non-stop. Also opens up much more convenient connection opportunities to Florida and Central America/Mexico.

Let's not forget that the US flights were averaging around 95% load factors all summer, and there was no sign of any price dumping, so there certainly seems to be plenty of demand. I think they will do just fine.

[Planeraz]

The airlines will have done their homework I’m sure. DL, presumably is going daily on the ATL route to meet demand. The route has been on sale for approx three months so they’ll know how things are looking. DL routes to JFK and BOS performed really strongly in 2022. BOS increasing to daily and starting earlier in 2023 in a more premium heavy 763 is a good indication of demand, particularly in Biz Class. All the UA routes are well established and will do just fine. I’m less convinced that VS will hang around at EDI. They are planning to use a high density 351 which seats 400+ pax and are re-starting much later than S22. If the current seat maps is anything to go by, so far, they still have lots of seats to fill.

[VickersVicount]

why didn’t self-same inbound US travellers not choose to use the ATL service last couple of times it was tried?
As for outbound UK travellers, in the current climate, I can’t see a sudden new expanded cohort willing to travel to US -so for that quota (if connecting over hubs) will just dilute I suspect this year.
The ‘homework’ may just be where can the put aircraft when other routes get dropped or reduced as its a shorter summer season to top up.
Agree VS will be very interesting to watch, wonder if they’ve resubmitted their homework after attempting Barbados. WestJet Calgary another interesting to see how that ‘fares’.
Were there not gate delays and main hall issues with crowding and seating S22 which affects overall experience. Presume no new premium Lounge facilities planned?

[ld0595]

Given the success of the US routes from EDI recently, I'm surprised AA hasn't re-entered to help bolster the OneWorld presence to/from JFK/PHL. Hopefully next year or the year after on the A321XLR.

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

The OneWorld presence is multiple connections via BA over LHR, AA's European offering is relatively poor due to it's ability to connect with BA at LHR.

[Sk1schoolsam]

The airlines will have done their homework I’m sure. DL, presumably is going daily on the ATL route to meet demand. The route has been on sale for approx three months so they’ll know how things are looking. DL routes to JFK and BOS performed really strongly in 2022. BOS increasing to daily and starting earlier in 2023 in a more premium heavy 763 is a good indication of demand, particularly in Biz Class. All the UA routes are well established and will do just fine. I’m less convinced that VS will hang around at EDI. They are planning to use a high density 351 which seats 400+ pax and are re-starting much later than S22. If the current seat maps is anything to go by, so far, they still have lots of seats to fill.

IMO - Suspect there will be a fair few pax of the VS Orlando flights on Virgin Holiday packages who won’t have been allocated seats as yet until closer to time or check in- not necessarily low sales.

[willy wombat]

Given that the VS traffic is presumably mainly UK originating, as opposed to the rest of the TA traffic at EDI which is predominantly North American originating, I actually think VS may have made a mistake moving from GLA to EDI. There again, maybe they got an offer they couldn’t refuse.

[Planeraz]

DL

EDI-ATL

Daily service - DL system now amended. Additional flights available to book.

[tictack67]

Given that the VS traffic is presumably mainly UK originating, as opposed to the rest of the TA traffic at EDI which is predominantly North American originating, I actually think VS may have made a mistake moving from GLA to EDI. There again, maybe they got an offer they couldn’t refuse.

Actually Delta are to codeshare with VS on MCO-EDI.

Within a 2 hour drive of MCO is Jacksonville (1 million Pop) Miami (6 Million) Tampa (400k).

Just at the weekend in a cafe in Edinburgh I spoke with two well to do Spanish woman from Cartenga in South of Spain, I asked how they got here, Ryanair from Alicante (1h15m drive)

There are large catchment areas now for direct flights, and what we would view "bucket and spade" flights do often have a hugely mixed clientele.

Just as everyone who flies to Edinburgh, Edi isn't their final destination as the Glasgow city centre bus to Edi apt can testify too.

[Wycombe]

Within a 2 hour drive of MCO is Jacksonville (1 million Pop) Miami (6 Million) Tampa (400k).

Miami is a bit more than 2hrs from MCO at around 230 miles, there are quite a lot of flights (esp. with American) between the two cities main airports.

[Planeraz]

United S23

Is UA about to upgrade aircraft on the IAD route? A contact at EDI believes that the planned 752 may be replaced by a 787. This would be nice to see at EDI.

[Albert Hall]

UA978/979 IAD presently listed in the slot database as a 767-400. That won't do much for stand occupancy, if the previous amount of unplanned stand occupancy with broken 764s at EDI is anything to go by.

[nighthawk117]

Back on the subject of capacity to North America, one of the managers at Edinburgh has been posting on social media regarding Delta increasing capacity to Edinburgh. He mentions that there are 100,000 departures lost to hub airports each year, so plenty of capacity to soak up. Obviously a lot of that is probably price sensitive and choosing to avoid more expensive direct flights, but there is clearly lots of unserved demand in the market.

[Albert Hall]

I don't get it. Delta and others are flying to US airports which are hubs. Atlanta is a hub - and a very big one at that. If Edinburgh is the same as any other destination, a majority of the passengers flying to Atlanta will be getting on a connecting flight to somewhere else. From Edinburgh's perspective, a passenger going DL EDI-ATL-Nashville as opposed to BA EDI-LHR-Nashville and being served either way.

[Planeraz]

I don't get it. Delta and others are flying to US airports which are hubs. Atlanta is a hub - and a very big one at that. If Edinburgh is the same as any other destination, a majority of the passengers flying to Atlanta will be getting on a connecting flight to somewhere else. From Edinburgh's perspective, a passenger going DL EDI-ATL-Nashville as opposed to BA EDI-LHR-Nashville and being served either way.

Interesting point about BA. In past week or so they have been increasing frequency to/from LHR. For example 12 departures to LHR tomorrow. The planes are rammed full. £421 one way in economy on a few departures tomorrow. How many of the people are transferring at LHR onto long haul flights? Last week, at Heathrow en-route to EDI, at check-in, I was offered £300 to give up my seat as the flight was oversold by ten. Not even to the next flight. It was on to the last departure of the day. I declined given BA’s recent spate of last minute cancellations. To drive down prices, year round, EDI needs more year-round transatlantic flights. BA and one-world/AA / code share have it too good. No surprise that AA opted not to re-start direct services from EDI. If the management is serious about TSA pre-clearance at EDI, surely the airport needs more year-round services to the US?

[inOban]

There's also a lot of business using Dublin as a hub.

[Breathe]

Press release for 2022 passenger numbers:Edinburgh Airport records strong recovery in 2022https://corporate.edinburghairport.com/edinburgh-airport-records-strong-recovery-in-2022

Edinburgh Airport has published its 2022 passenger traffic statistics, signalling a strong recovery compared with both the previous year and its busiest year on record, which was 2019.

A total of 11,261,873 people travelled through the airport in 2022, up from 3,031,140 in 2021. In 2019, the busiest ever year for a Scottish airport, Edinburgh Airport recorded 14.7 million passengers.

Gordon Dewar, Chief Executive of Edinburgh Airport, said:

“We are encouraged by the ongoing recovery in passenger numbers in 2022, which we hope in turn reflects more economic activity across the country, as inbound visitors to Scotland provide a much-needed shot in the arm for our tourism and hospitality industries.

“There is little doubt that people want to travel – both from Scotland for holidays or business opportunities or those international tourists coming to experience the best of Scotland’s visitor attractions and beautiful places and landmarks.

“The important challenge for us, in partnership with the city, the Scottish Government and others, is to facilitate growth in a responsible way and in a way that protects the vast number of high-quality jobs that airports provide, both directly and indirectly through airlines, handling agents among others, and the supply chain that supports us all.”

The figures are published as a leading Scottish academic explores how Edinburgh Airport can shape a more prosperous Scottish economy, moving towards net zero, and how Scotland’s airports can provide sustainable growth by working more closely with the cities and wider areas they serve.

Professor Duncan Maclennan is looking at Edinburgh Airport’s broader role in civic Scotland, comparing and contrasting with international cities like Sydney and Toronto. The airport hopes Professor Maclennan’s report will start a national conversation in Scotland about the role of aviation in building stronger international trade connections.

Background

The airport announced in December that Professor Maclennan would be looking at Edinburgh Airport’s role in shaping a prosperous, net zero Scotland. The report was commissioned as part of the airport’s Greater Good sustainability strategy – click here for more (https://corporate.edinburghairport.com/edinburgh-airports-role-in-shaping-prosperous-net-zero-scotland-examined).


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/942x296/edi_2022_8807ced3bb1e18cfef51d3195b009cc45381be08.jpg

[Breathe]

Press release for 2022 passenger numbers:Edinburgh Airport records strong recovery in 2022https://corporate.edinburghairport.com/edinburgh-airport-records-strong-recovery-in-2022

Edinburgh Airport has published its 2022 passenger traffic statistics, signalling a strong recovery compared with both the previous year and its busiest year on record, which was 2019.

A total of 11,261,873 people travelled through the airport in 2022, up from 3,031,140 in 2021. In 2019, the busiest ever year for a Scottish airport, Edinburgh Airport recorded 14.7 million passengers.

Gordon Dewar, Chief Executive of Edinburgh Airport, said:

“We are encouraged by the ongoing recovery in passenger numbers in 2022, which we hope in turn reflects more economic activity across the country, as inbound visitors to Scotland provide a much-needed shot in the arm for our tourism and hospitality industries.

“There is little doubt that people want to travel – both from Scotland for holidays or business opportunities or those international tourists coming to experience the best of Scotland’s visitor attractions and beautiful places and landmarks.

“The important challenge for us, in partnership with the city, the Scottish Government and others, is to facilitate growth in a responsible way and in a way that protects the vast number of high-quality jobs that airports provide, both directly and indirectly through airlines, handling agents among others, and the supply chain that supports us all.”

The figures are published as a leading Scottish academic explores how Edinburgh Airport can shape a more prosperous Scottish economy, moving towards net zero, and how Scotland’s airports can provide sustainable growth by working more closely with the cities and wider areas they serve.

Professor Duncan Maclennan is looking at Edinburgh Airport’s broader role in civic Scotland, comparing and contrasting with international cities like Sydney and Toronto. The airport hopes Professor Maclennan’s report will start a national conversation in Scotland about the role of aviation in building stronger international trade connections.

Background

The airport announced in December that Professor Maclennan would be looking at Edinburgh Airport’s role in shaping a prosperous, net zero Scotland. The report was commissioned as part of the airport’s Greater Good sustainability strategy – click here for more (https://corporate.edinburghairport.com/edinburgh-airports-role-in-shaping-prosperous-net-zero-scotland-examined).


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/942x296/edi_2022_8807ced3bb1e18cfef51d3195b009cc45381be08.jpg

[Buster the Bear]

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/homenews/23274941.edinburgh-airport-domestic-passengers-43-pre-pandemic-level/

[Planeraz]

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/homenews/23274941.edinburgh-airport-domestic-passengers-43-pre-pandemic-level/

The CEO, on radio earlier this evening wasn’t holding back with his thoughts on why domestic numbers had slumped and failed to recover as quickly. He cited lack of political will to engage about a safe return to travel and un-necessary restrictions kept in place in Scotland longer than elsewhere in the UK. I wonder who he was referring to??

[Richard Taylor]

The CEO, on radio earlier this evening wasn’t holding back with his thoughts on why domestic numbers had slumped and failed to recover as quickly. He cited lack of political will to engage about a safe return to travel and un-necessary restrictions kept in place in Scotland longer than elsewhere in the UK. I wonder who he was referring to??

Douglas Ross? :)

[tartan 201]

The CEO, on radio earlier this evening wasn’t holding back with his thoughts on why domestic numbers had slumped and failed to recover as quickly. He cited lack of political will to engage about a safe return to travel and un-necessary restrictions kept in place in Scotland longer than elsewhere in the UK. I wonder who he was referring to??

Which radio programme was this statement made on?

[Planeraz]

Which radio programme was this statement made on?

Tay FM drive time. The attached article should leave no one in doubt what the CEO’s views are in relation to Sturgeon and her actions or in-actions.

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18934747.edinburgh-airport-boss-accuses-nicola-sturgeon-campaigning-aviation/

[tictack67]

Tay FM drive time. The attached article should leave no one in doubt what the CEO’s views are in relation to Sturgeon and her actions or in-actions.

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18934747.edinburgh-airport-boss-accuses-nicola-sturgeon-campaigning-aviation/

I'm afraid Gogs had lost a fair bit credibility over the years, taking a salary of £500K he was also appointed to the board of the Scottish Police Authority in 2021 but is seemingly no longer there. Perhaps asked to leave or out his depth as the newspaper articles show

https://www.spa.police.uk/news/2021/members-appointed-to-scottish-police-authority/

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/4292266/taxi-driver-edinburgh-airport-gordon-dewar-police-charged/

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15698807.edinburgh-airport-boss-gordon-dewar-urged-apologise-glasgow-train-whore-joke/

[Breathe]

I'm afraid Gogs had lost a fair bit credibility over the years, taking a salary of £500K he was also appointed to the board of the Scottish Police Authority in 2021 but is seemingly no longer there. Perhaps asked to leave or out his depth as the newspaper articles show

https://www.spa.police.uk/news/2021/members-appointed-to-scottish-police-authority/

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/4292266/taxi-driver-edinburgh-airport-gordon-dewar-police-charged/

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15698807.edinburgh-airport-boss-gordon-dewar-urged-apologise-glasgow-train-whore-joke/
I do remember that bizarre story of Gordon Dewar and the taxi incident! Apparently the CCTV didn't fully capture the incident - really?

[Breathe]

Another lounge potentially coming to the airport, along with a new convenience store.

Edinburgh Airport releases three prime advertising, lounge and retail opportunities

https://www.moodiedavittreport.com/edinburgh-airport-releases-three-prime-advertising-lounge-and-retail-opportunities/

Edinburgh Airport has revealed three major commercial opportunities for a new lounge, a convenience store and a contract to manage the Scottish travel hub’s advertising portfolio.

The airport company is seeking proposals for a 365sq m airside premium lounge unit to offer a “best in class” facility to passengers. The unit will occupy prime space in the international departures lounge, which enjoys high footfall due to its terminal location.

An opportunity also exists for a 359sq m convenience store in prime space that enjoys strong visibility from inside and outside Edinburgh’s single terminal.

The final opportunity is for the management of Edinburgh Airport’s advertising activities encompassing a diverse portfolio of approximately 70 media sites, both internal and external to the terminal.

In 2022, the airport served 76% of pre-pandemic 2019 passengers, with 11.2 million travellers passing through.

The Global Infrastructure Partners-owned travel hub works with airlines such as Qatar Airways, Turkish Airlines, KLM, British Airways, United, Delta, Virgin Atlantic, Ryanair and easyJet among others.

Edinburgh Airport offers connections to 154 destinations, including Doha, Istanbul, New York, Chicago, Toronto and mainland Europe.

Edinburgh Airport Director of Retail and Property Gail Taylor said: “The return of passengers to Edinburgh Airport in 2022 was incredibly encouraging. The demand we saw for travel as people reconnected with one another and explored new places was a boost to the whole industry.

“We are proud to offer our passengers a fantastic choice of retail outlets and food & beverage options, but we are always looking to expand that choice and bring new partners and brands into Scotland’s busiest airport.

“We think the potential to have a customer base of 11 million people – a number we are confident will return to pre-pandemic levels within the next couple of years [14.7 million passengers in 2019 -Ed] – is an exciting opportunity for both the airport and new and existing retail outlets. We would be keen to hear from potential new partners about how we can work together and bring choice to our passengers.”

[Sk1schoolsam]

Is the convenience store just a replacement for the store that was at the top of the escalators?

Are they trying to fill the old FlyBe lounge space? Can’t visualise where else unless Aspire are pulling out of one of there 2 locations.

Opportunity for EK lounge for there so far failed to materialise return 😉😉😉
(I am only kidding before anyone take this as a serious suggestion)

[tartan 201]

Is the convenience store just a replacement for the store that was at the top of the escalators?

Are they trying to fill the old FlyBe lounge space? Can’t visualise where else unless Aspire are pulling out of one of there 2 locations.

Opportunity for EK lounge for there so far failed to materialise return 😉😉😉
(I am only kidding before anyone take this as a serious suggestion)

Their article about it pictures the Aspire lounge near gate 4 so I guess it's that one?

https://corporate.edinburghairport.com/doing-business-with-us/retail-and-property-opportunities

[VickersVicount]

‘Best in class’ lounge would need to be seriously impressive. Outside premium airline owned lounges, Ive yet to experience something that could fulfil that. All those ‘On The Beach’ free lounge passers need to go somewhere!

[Planeraz]

Their article about it pictures the Aspire lounge near gate 4 so I guess it's that one?

https://corporate.edinburghairport.com/doing-business-with-us/retail-and-property-opportunities


Looking at landside map of terminal, unit R202/203 does appear to be the space currently occupied by M&S. The “opportunity” advertised today therefore would suggest that M&S is about to leave the airport. Which supermarket or other known convenience store brand would be a likely replacement? Can’t see it being Nisa Local!

[Sk1schoolsam]

Looking at landside map of terminal, unit R202/203 does appear to be the space currently occupied by M&S. The “opportunity” advertised today therefore would suggest that M&S is about to leave the airport. Which supermarket or other known convenience store brand would be a likely replacement? Can’t see it being Nisa Local!

Disappointing if M&S are leaving - downgrade to a Tesco express or opportunity to upgrade to a Waitrose 😉

Not surprised Aspire are leaving the Gate 4 lounge - post pandemic I have never seen it open. I always head to the one above Gate 16.

What airlines tend to leave from Gates 1- 4 these days?

[Planeraz]

Disappointing if M&S are leaving - downgrade to a Tesco express or opportunity to upgrade to a Waitrose 😉

Not surprised Aspire are leaving the Gate 4 lounge - post pandemic I have never seen it open. I always head to the one above Gate 16.

What airlines tend to leave from Gates 1- 4 these days?

Peak summer, gates 1-4 used by multiple airlines. Long haul - mostly United with their 752’s and gate 4 for the 764 used on IAD route. Shorthaul/European - Jet2, Aer Lingus/Emerald, EZY and KLM. S23 with at least another two wide bodies - Westjet 789, additional DL 763 and potentially a second daily 788 or bigger 359 from Qatar, gates with air bridges will be in constant use.

[tictack67]

Aer Lingus/Emerald are increasing Edinburgh by an extra 11 rotations per week from the end of March

Dublin to Edinburgh from 31 to 38 PWBelfast City to Edinburgh from 22 to 26pw

[A350Saltire]

Might be seeing the A359 back on DOH-EDI with QR more permanently soon now that they have settled their dispute with Airbus:

https://www.qatarairways.com/en/press-releases/2023/January/QatarAirways-and-Airbus-Reach-Amicable-Settlement.html

[Planeraz]

Might be seeing the A359 back on DOH-EDI with QR more permanently soon now that they have settled their dispute with Airbus:

https://www.qatarairways.com/en/press-releases/2023/January/QatarAirways-and-Airbus-Reach-Amicable-Settlement.html

Hopefully, QR may soon be in a position to confirm S23 schedules from EDI and the other UK airports. SeanM on Twitter commented earlier today that slots issues may be the reason why QR, so far, have not confirmed their S23 schedules.

[A350Saltire]

https://twitter.com/seanm1997/status/1621440814894178305?s=46&t=LjxY1PglHewC-r4haDnHig

[inOban]

Did I miss it, or was today the first of the extra Qatar flights? Fares going forward seem quite high so LFs must be good.

[ld0595]

It's tomorrow isn't it? QR32 at 7.45am and QR30 at 2.00pm.

[Planeraz]

Did I miss it, or was today the first of the extra Qatar flights? Fares going forward seem quite high so LFs must be good.

Started last Thursday - 2nd Feb. S23 schedules will be announced imminently apparently. EDI will be hoping for double daily each day in line with the initial slots request.

[Sk1schoolsam]

Started last Thursday - 2nd Feb. S23 schedules will be announced imminently apparently. EDI will be hoping for double daily each day in line with the initial slots request.

And still no indication from EK if they will restart EDI. Maybe it’s S24 at the earliest now.
Also seams Iceland Air has come to knot - does
it cost airlines to hold slots and not use them?

[Planeraz]

And still no indication from EK if they will restart EDI. Maybe it’s S24 at the earliest now.
Also seams Iceland Air has come to knot - does
it cost airlines to hold slots and not use them?

No penalty for foreign airlines not using slots at EDI. Only UK registered airlines must use or lose slots following CAA’s amnesty on slots usage was withdrawn for S23. I wonder if EK is holding off to see what QR do before making a decision? They also have well documented staffing issues, which may be a factor. They are also due to take deliveries of A350’s and 787-9 in 2024. The recently rumoured return of Etihad is still on the cards according to contacts at EDI.

[Breathe]

No penalty for foreign airlines not using slots at EDI. Only UK registered airlines must use or lose slots following CAA’s amnesty on slots usage was withdrawn for S23. I wonder if EK is holding off to see what QR do before making a decision? They also have well documented staffing issues, which may be a factor. They are also due to take deliveries of A350’s and 787-9 in 2024. The recently rumoured return of Etihad is still on the cards according to contacts at EDI.
Etihad coming back would be a bit of surprise. Perhaps now that they're in a better financial shape, compared to the years of excessive and wasteful investments during the James Hogan era, they are looking at growing the business again in a more sustainable manner.

From a purely selfish point of view I'd prefer Emirates to return over Etihad, simply because they fly to destinations that Etihad don't fly to. :) Still a bit of competition with Qatar would be good for EDI passengers regardless if either or both decide to return.

[tartan 201]

11th based Ryanair aircraft: https://www.heraldscotland.com/business_hq/23307030.ryanair-unveils-six-new-destinations-edinburgh-airport/

[inOban]

11th based Ryanair aircraft: https://www.heraldscotland.com/business_hq/23307030.ryanair-unveils-six-new-destinations-edinburgh-airport/
Looking at their website I see that Weez which had no schedule in S23 now has up to 4/wk. Tallinn has gone.

[Planeraz]

Sean M reporting that VS is about to join the Sky Team Alliance. More codeshare opportunities for EDI, primarily with AF and KLM.

[Flightrider]

No penalty for foreign airlines not using slots at EDI. Only UK registered airlines must use or lose slots following CAA’s amnesty on slots usage was withdrawn for S23.

Sorry if I sound argumentative, but it's pretty hard to fit as many incorrect statements into two sentences as you have.

Edinburgh is not a fully coordinated airport. The UK has eight fully coordinated (also known as "Level 3") airports which are LHR, LGW, STN, LCY, LTN, MAN, BHX and BRS (for night movements). Most other airports including Edinburgh are schedules facilitated ("Level 2") where technically, slots do not exist. Airlines notify their schedules to the coordinator and maintain a database which does all sorts of things including planning tools and flight information feeds to systems and airport screens. The coordinator may ask if Airline X or Y can move their planned timings to alleviate forecast congestion.

No slot alleviations were given by the CAA. The CAA has no role in slots policy. The alleviations were consulted upon by the UK Department for Transport, passed into law by Parliament and then enacted by Airport Coordination as the UK coordinator. The CAA were almost the only people not to have anything to do with it!

There is no difference in policy applying between UK airlines and overseas airlines operating at UK airports - the slot use-it or lose-it rules are the same for all. So if you have slots at a fully coordinated airport for Summer 2023, you have to use them with 80% regularity or you won't earn historic rights to those slots for future seasons. Not relevant in the case of Edinburgh as it's not fully coordinated to begin with.

[Planeraz]

Sorry if I sound argumentative, but it's pretty hard to fit as many incorrect statements into two sentences as you have.

Edinburgh is not a fully coordinated airport. The UK has eight fully coordinated (also known as "Level 3") airports which are LHR, LGW, STN, LCY, LTN, MAN, BHX and BRS (for night movements). Most other airports including Edinburgh are schedules facilitated ("Level 2") where technically, slots do not exist. Airlines notify their schedules to the coordinator and maintain a database which does all sorts of things including planning tools and flight information feeds to systems and airport screens. The coordinator may ask if Airline X or Y can move their planned timings to alleviate forecast congestion.

No slot alleviations were given by the CAA. The CAA has no role in slots policy. The alleviations were consulted upon by the UK Department for Transport, passed into law by Parliament and then enacted by Airport Coordination as the UK coordinator. The CAA were almost the only people not to have anything to do with it!

There is no difference in policy applying between UK airlines and overseas airlines operating at UK airports - the slot use-it or lose-it rules are the same for all. So if you have slots at a fully coordinated airport for Summer 2023, you have to use them with 80% regularity or you won't earn historic rights to those slots for future seasons. Not relevant in the case of Edinburgh as it's not fully coordinated to begin with.

I am similarly not being argumentative. However, happy to correct you. In the first sentence you copied and pasted to quote, the comment I made was in relation to any penalties an airline could face at EDI for not using slots they apply for. I’m factually correct in saying that no such penalty exists. Many airlines apply for slots but never actually use them for whatever reason. In relation to the CAA and any involvement with legislation pertaining to slots, it is a fact that they were involved in or consulted with prior to decision/legislation being introduced. Trust this clarifies…

[NotanAVGeek]

DL209 to JFK had an emergency landing at Prestwick shortly after take off from EDI.

A replacement aircraft positioning from BRU to PIK to take the passengers onwards to JFK

[Planeraz]

DL209 to JFK had an emergency landing at Prestwick shortly after take off from EDI.

A replacement aircraft positioning from BRU to PIK to take the passengers onwards to JFK

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/edinburgh-delta-air-lines-flight-29183947

This must have been terrifying. Fire from part of the wing or engine? Huge credit to the pilots for getting this aircraft down safely.

[Wycombe]

Fire from part of the wing

Looks like a surgeing engine to me!

[nivsy]

Looks like a surgeing engine to me!
Does it really matter from pax.point of view? Looks like flames, acts like flames, fuel.load high, ancient aircraft, and a need to divert and land within 30 minutes to PIK and.utilise long runway, not forgetting the total.disruption to all.pax. Yes ofcourse safety first....so.what causes engine surge?

[DaveReidUK]

Does it really matter from pax point of view?

Well from this passenger's point of view it would, if it was actually the wing on fire. :O

[nivsy]

Well from this passenger's point of view it would, if it was actually the wing on fire. :O
🫣🤭..I'll change to "pax perception".

[Wycombe]

so.what causes engine surge?

I'm not an expert, so can't tell you what causes them, but they are not uncommon, and can cause a lot of banging and flames - so I agree that they can be alarming to pax who are not aware.

As for a wing fire, I really don't think it was (based on the video evidence)

[Planeraz]

Lufthansa reducing frequency on FRA and MUC routes. Europe wide reductions, not just EDI. It looks like MUC will revert to the previously planned 3 x weekly and not daily. Brussels Airlines is increasing to daily from May.

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/230213-lheu

[tictack67]

Lufthansa reducing frequency on FRA and MUC routes. Europe wide reductions, not just EDI. It looks like MUC will revert to the previously planned 3 x weekly and not daily. Brussels Airlines is increasing to daily from May.

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/230213-lheu


Every UK airport apart from Belfast is being reduced.

GLA,NCL,MAN,BHX,BRS,LCY, LHR.all facing similar cuts for the summer.

The reason for the reductions of nearly 1,000 flights over the summer because it can't find enough staff not because demand is low. Interestingly most flights are either Friday, Saturday or Sunday

https://www.businessinsider.com/lufthansa-cancels-flights-labor-staff-shortage-airline-germany-transport-europe-2022-6

[Asturias56]

You can charge business people a lot more than stag & hens.................

[Planeraz]

December 2022

A few stats and approx load factors for the long haul routes. Strong performances again.

QR 14,951 or 98%
TK 10,110 or 96%
DL 7,736 or 94%
UA 9,484 or 95%

[A350Saltire]

QR to go double daily from July. No surprise as the loads have been very good!

https://twitter.com/seanm1997/status/1628304182863069184?s=46&t=eqAuhYsiCd9lMS3bf1tjMA

[Planeraz]

QR to go double daily from July. No surprise as the loads have been very good!

https://twitter.com/seanm1997/status/1628304182863069184?s=46&t=eqAuhYsiCd9lMS3bf1tjMA

Good news indeed. Frequency drops to 1 x daily on 29th October. 789 aircraft currently showing as operating aircraft.

[Planeraz]

Vueling

Cuts to frequencies on BCN route.


https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/230222-vybcn

[VickersVicount]

Not sure i’ve grasped why they're only doing twice daily for 3-4 months. What is the J seating layout on 789 versus the original double daily A389 plan?

[A350Saltire]

Not sure i’ve grasped why they're only doing twice daily for 3-4 months. What is the J seating layout on 789 versus the original double daily A389 plan?

Suspect winter isn’t finalised yet. Once the A359s are fixed by Airbus we might see them back.

[Planeraz]

Not sure i’ve grasped why they're only doing twice daily for 3-4 months. What is the J seating layout on 789 versus the original double daily A389 plan?

789 has a larger overall capacity compared to a 787-8 or a non suite 359.

789 - J30 E281 total - 311
788 - J22 E232 total - 254
359 - J36 E247 total - 283

October is a long way off and things can change. Qatar, as we know like to mix up aircraft used. It may also be the case that it will take longer than anticipated to reintroduce the A359’s following the remedial work. A 789 still offers a decent number of premium seats and a hefty number of cattle class seats.

[tictack67]

I'm sure Qatar know what they are doing with frequencies and aircraft type, given they'll have the valuable data.

It is in fact a B787-8 on the double daily from Edinburgh.

Agreed like Turkish (recent A330 and B777) they are flexible and often upgrade to meet demand.




​​​​

[Sk1schoolsam]

Good news indeed. Frequency drops to 1 x daily on 29th October. 789 aircraft currently showing as operating aircraft.

Current booking schedule only shows 10 weekly- Areoroutes reported same10 weekly NOT double daily (14 weekly)

[Planeraz]

Current booking schedule only shows 10 weekly- Areoroutes reported same10 weekly NOT double daily (14 weekly)

The original source (SeanM) is normally very accurate with his information. That said, Qatar and EDI marketing normally fire out press releases. Nothing has been released to date about a double daily service - 14 x P/W.

[GoEDI]

Booking engine a couple days ago was definitely showing 10pw until start of July before increasing to 14pw. Has since been updated again today to 10pw throughout. Looks like it's still a work in progress.

[Sk1schoolsam]

Just flew into GLA on Emirates this morning (full flight BTW)
Noted on the looped information display that EDI is shown as one of there European routes.
Maybe it’s still on as a partner codeshare.

[tictack67]

From late June Loganair increases:

Exeter will be double daily return AM & PM flights each way.

Southampton will be 5 flights return a day5 flights Mon-Thur
4 flights on Fridays 3 daily Sat/Sun

Bergen also increasing in frequency

[tartan 201]

Booking engine a couple days ago was definitely showing 10pw until start of July before increasing to 14pw. Has since been updated again today to 10pw throughout. Looks like it's still a work in progress.
Qatar double daily from 2/7 restored:
https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/230303-qrns23

[Planeraz]

UA

EDI-EWR. Could this go double daily again? Same question being banded around on other forums.

[inOban]

Qatar double daily from 2/7 restored:
https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/230303-qrns23
I'm surprised that it's not until 2/7. Other posters have reported very high loads on the existing flights. Unless they're intending by to replace the 787-8 with something larger. Did we not see an occasional 350-1000?

[Sk1schoolsam]

UA

EDI-EWR. Could this go double daily again? Same question being banded around on other forums.

Would an up gauge to a B787 or B764 be more likely than double daily 752?

Have not checked recently but has the IAD flight been upgraded to a B764 like last year?

[tartan 201]

Would an up gauge to a B787 or B764 be more likely than double daily 752?

Have not checked recently but has the IAD flight been upgraded to a B764 like last year?

IAD is showing as a 757. The potential second daily EWR appears on the United Cargo website using the same flight numbers (161/2) as the old EWR-GLA service but isn't currently on sale on united.com. Time will tell if it's a glitch or if they do intend to operate it.

If the latter, it would be a modest increase over UA's S22 capacity with four daily 757s compared two daily 757s and one daily 764 in S22. It would also mean seven daily EDI-US flights at the height of S23 (EWRx2, IAD, ORD, JFK, BOS and ATL (last three all DL 763s)) plus daily to YYZ (788), three-weekly YYC (789) and twice-weekly MCO (A35K). An impressive portfolio and recovery.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/980x2000/screenshot_20230304_120727_9b18bfd7c335d892216f18b22a2acc1d5 a5bc822.png

[Jb355]

UA

EDI-EWR. Could this go double daily again? Same question being banded around on other forums.

Always here people mention about hearing rumours about in lots of different forums for Edinburgh airport could someone link all of the different ones. Thanks