MANCHESTER 1

[toon22]

EI JFK

Aer Lingus introduced a MAN - SNN - JFK c.1993 for two reasons: EI were struggling to justify the continuation of SNN - JFK durung the Winter season. Secondly, having lobbied and won 'open skies' to the US for regional airports, Manchester was becoming embarrassed by the lack of take-up of the opportunity, especially by US carriers. After applying for slots year after year, gradually Northwest, United et al dropped out and eventually EI were the only show in town. Why did it end? Lack of premium traffic.

[Betablockeruk]

Shaheen Air pulling MAN flights from 15th Feb.

They had an incident in January where one of the engines was deemed unsafe, so not sure if it's linked to that?

Shame, they were doing well load wise

.

Those engines that sound like a Typhoon on a QRA? Incredible noise on departure!

[LAX_LHR]

Could be another 2 BA routes announced on 21st.

[rutankrd]

Suzeman thanks for filling the blanks particularly the UK DOT and partners BA (or was it BE at the time) with their usual complaints over the competition in the regions !

I knew the EI services ended sometime in the late 70s and that the EC effectively outlawed the pooling packs in 1983.

That the European Aviation sector went through series of regulations and timelines towards the fully openskys we in the UK continue to participate in for the moment.

toon22 thanks for the 333 operation timeline

[Gordon_uk3]

Could be another 2 BA routes announced on 21st.

New York and Chicago maybe?

[LAX_LHR]

No, they will be Cityflyer routes again.

[MANFOD]

Vueling:

As it seems MAN are not getting a base this summer, can anyone confirm how many weekly departures they have with non-based a/c?

Is there a Vueling timetable as such? There's no point looking on MAN's web site timetable which I find pretty unreliable. When I looked a few days ago, putting Houston in as a destination came up with no direct flights!

[LAX_LHR]

Vueling:

Barcelona daily A321
Amsterdam 6 weekly A320
Alicante 3 weekly A320
Tenerife 2 weekly A320
Rome 2 weekly A320

Given its also a transfer point, Rome strikes me as a route that could do with more flights, especially with AMS and ALC having higher frequencies.

[MANFOD]

Many thanks LAX. So, 20 flights weekly, which I guess is equivalent to about 1 based a/c.
Interesting mix with some of the other popular Spanish destinations not served but AMS and Rome are. I wonder if ORY would be viable (which they are operating from BHX), despite MAN having 3 carriers to CDG.(plus RYR to Beauvais). There are already 3 carriers to AMS and that didn't deter them.

[j636]

25,627,368 + 10.6%

[MANLEJ]

Shaheen

Originally Posted by Betablockeruk

.

Those engines that sound like a Typhoon on a QRA? Incredible noise on departure!

https://www.geo.tv/latest/128572-Shaheen-Air-risks-lives-of-passengers-by-operating-faulty-plane

Not surprised they are pulling the route if the above is true.

[nguba]

With regard to BA and MAN, whilst I don't think we'll see a full base at MAN there are plenty of reasons why it could see BA growth:

- BA's approach to competition. BA's approach to the growth of LCCs was "cut and run". It is now paying for this having indirectly assisted on more than one occasion easyJet becoming the dominant carrier at LGW. It is quite clear IAG does not want to repeat this with Norwegian.

- BA Holidays. This has one of the quiet success stories for BA over the past few years. BA being able to offer hotel packages on ba.com without taking on inventory risk has been a game changer and has resulted in significant long-haul growth at LGW.

- Summer leisure short-haul. Again, a huge area of growth. BA had next to no coverage of Ibiza a few years ago. Now it will operate around 40 flights from the UK to Ibiza in the summer peak. LHR has seen a number of summer leisure flights too long to list (Nantes, Montpellier, Biarritz, Kalamata, Chania, Kos, Santorini, Mykonos, Zante, Pula, Faro, Malaga, Palma, Murcia, Brindisi...)

- Avios. This now has coverage across BA, Aer Lingus, Iberia, Flybe and others. It gives BA a huge amount of data on flying habits from its user base across the UK and members in UK regions now have a lot more options for earnings and redemptions.

- Mixed short-haul / long-haul flying. LGW & MF crews operating both short-haul and long-haul does give more scheduling flexibility that wouldn't have been possible on the EF/WW fleets.

- IAG/BA approach to return on capital. A number of measures in recent times to extract more from existing assets. The 777s are to be "densified" and have their life extended to 30 years.

[TURIN]

With regard to the "new" BA, probably worth reminding ourselves of Alex Cruz's words from March of last year, when asked about BA considering long haul flying from MAN:

“I’ll give you the same answer I have given my staff, and the answer is “not yet.” We are serving Manchester. We have an inherent interest in the city of Manchester because we have a pretty large call centre there.......

...not for long if the rumours are true.

[nwoody2001]

Originally Posted by LAX_LHR

Vueling:

Barcelona daily A321
Amsterdam 6 weekly A320
Alicante 3 weekly A320
Tenerife 2 weekly A320
Rome 2 weekly A320

Given its also a transfer point, Rome strikes me as a route that could do with more flights, especially with AMS and ALC having higher frequencies.

So interesting, I didn't realise this was the schedule for vueling at MAN.

This is out of pure curiosity (and this isn't meant to be a MAN vs BHX) but as vuelling launched MAN before BHX, it's interested that BHX has grown to offer more flights/seats a week in summer 2017 than MAN.

Based on the above, and assuming 320 = 180 seats / 321 = 230 seats, I see the MAN schedule has 20 flights a week to 5 destinations offering circa 7,900 seats a week. BHX will be offering 21 flights a week to 5 destinations offering circa 8,160 seats a week.

Taking this into account and knowing Vueling had been interested in a base at MAN for a while, surely BHX is also in for a good shot of a base?!?

[LAX_LHR]

Nwoody,

Firstly, Vueling have 2 A320 configs. One has 180 seats, the other has 186 seats so worth checking what operates each flight. Also the A321 is 220 seats IIRC.

I've not seen any evidence to suggest Vueling were looking at a BHX base, and I don't think we can make any assumptions based on the difference of 1 weekly flight. It also looks like BCN could be going 9 weekly from MAN, as their online timetable shows a late Friday flight as well as the afternoon flight once more.

[nwoody2001]

I was in no way suggesting that 1 weekly flight made BHX 'better, bigger or more important' in anyway than MAN, nor that any information could be deduced or concluded. As this place is indeed a discussion forum, I just thought it would be an interesting topic of discussion, will Vueling open a new base in the UK? and if so where?


With all the talk of a new base opening up at MAN, I just simply assumed the vueling operations were significantly bigger at MAN than BHX (or anywhere else for that matter) and that MAN would therefore be the obvious choice for a new base in the UK. I was therefore shocked, that give or take a flight per week and a couple of seats, the operations were pretty similar between MAN/BHX...


Thanks for the info LAX_LHR. Based on information on Wiki, a VY A320 has 144 seats and A321 has 220 seats. Therefore, as the current timetable stands, for Summer 17 MAN has 20 weekly flights providing 6,820 seats a week with BHX having 21 weekly flights and 6,960 seats a week, however, as we know, there is plenty of time to change and this is just a snapshot!

[Mr A Tis]

144 seats ?? that's for the A319.
Lax-LHR is correct 180 / 186 seats

[DP.]

Those engines that sound like a Typhoon on a QRA? Incredible noise on departure!

I'm about 10 miles from MAN, almost under the usual departure path for this flight. I can always pick out that it's that aircraft when it's going over, purely from the noise of it!

[LAX_LHR]

Nwoody,

The Vueling website itself is actually the best info for the aircraft configs. When you run through a mock booking, it actually tells you straight away of the aircraft has 180/186/220 seats.

In terms of the base, the size of the current operation doesn't really give an indication of basing opportunities, and that applies to all airlines.

For example, blue air are bigger at Luton, but opened a Liverpool base. Norwegian were bigger at Manchester but opened an Edinburgh base and so on.

[Betablockeruk]

Lots of Northern Powerhouse chat under Concorde's wings today with this plush report launched:

North of England must go global to boost growth - Transport for the North - Transport for the North

Not read it but MAN pushing out loads of positive quotes on @manairport