BIRMINGHAM - 6

[getonittt]

Gatwick's O & D is lower than Birmingham's and they HAVE A FLIGHT.
That was the point I was making . Yes we all know Manchester's catchment area is bigger than Birmingham's we are reminded enough times.

[nigel osborne]

Ringwayman,

You shot yourself in the foot,

As the LGW figures on your assumption should mean BHX has more than enough to get a Chinese flight

Nigel

[chaps2011]

The only reason LGW got chinese route was lack of slots at LHR same
with Korean and Vietnam

Chaps

[LAX_LHR]

Nigel,

Hardly shooting himself in the foot, as the figures suggest MAN should have 3 times as many China passengers and deserves a flight even more.

[Skipness One Echo]

Don't be surprised if EDI pulls off a Chinese flt somehow before BHX or MAN,

Oh it's getting silly now.....
What's the segmentation between EDI-PVG / PEK / CAN / HKG? Lumping EDI-China in as one is actually more misleading than EDI-USA as one entity. By your logic, you're expecting people traveling to New York to be changing in Los Angeles? Also what's the breakdown of open jaw where this customer base doesn't visit London or arrive / depart via a London airport?

[ssflyer]

EK039 ?

Saw it lining up over Hatton-and at 13.50 the screens still showed eta 12.25
The outgoing is shown as delayed.
Was it a last minute diversion due to the vicious cross wind and if so to where?

[LAX_LHR]

EK39 has gone to LGW. Been quite a few diversions around the northern half of the country today.

[getonittt]

Also what's the breakdown of open jaw where this customer base doesn't visit London or arrive / depart via a London airport?

Nobody knows, likewise nobody knows how many have driven past or near to other airports to get to another to fly direct to China. I'm sure there is thread buried away on pprune somewhere about the complexities of O & D surveys!

[111KAB]

Aegean

Apologies if this has been posted previously ....


Aegean to add flights from Birmingham | Buying Business Travel

[bhxstu]

Here's a video of the Emirates aircraft making a go around. Although sensationalist reporting my the mail!

Good vid though.

Video: Plane at Birmingham Airport misses runway trying to land in high winds - Birmingham Mail

[nigel osborne]

LAX-LHR

As someone else pointed out the Chinese figures are pretty meaningless anyway , as they are not figures for Beijing or Shanghai but for all Chinese visiting from all of China .

So how does that help any of us guess what the market share potential per Chinese district is ?

Nigel

[hammerb32]

Based purely on geography it's inevitable that catchment numbers from MAN and LHR will include passengers from the 'greater' Birmingham metro area, EMA and BRS to a less extent also. As LAXLHR alluded to above (I think) the same could work the opposite way however the status quo is to a large extent now set. That said I have this view based on nothing factual that in time China will be connected to both MAN and BHX, there's just to many business interests established around Birmingham and too many O&D passengers available, add to that the number of Chinese airlines who have to expand somewhere there's a sense of inevitability to me.

[busz]

"Positive rate, gear up"? On the emirates video?

[LAX_LHR]

Nigel,

You say the figures are meaningless but lets face it they are not.

The table shows that for every BHX passenger to China, there are at least 2.5 from MAN. That points to the likely outcome that most, if not all the China destinations are bigger from MAN. Also, even on the very off chance BHX has a higher number to destination XYZ, the sheer fact MAN is more than twice the size of the BHX market at this time still means MAN stands a better chance of a route for the numerous connection oppertunities.


Also, you say the figures are meaningless, but, lets be 100% honest with here, if the MAN and BHX figures were swapped I have a sneaky suspicion the figures would not be so meaningless then, in fact, likely to be highly promoted.

[Ringwayman]

And we need to remember that Hainan Airlines is launching Beijing-Boston on the back of, wait for it, approximately the same number of visitors from all over China going to Boston as there are who MAN bound.

[North West]

And we need to remember that Hainan Airlines is launching Beijing-Boston on the back of, wait for it, approximately the same number of visitors from all over China going to Boston as there are who MAN bound.

Rather proving the point I think many have been making, which is that they are at best only a small part of the story and at worst, misleading

Still, if it helps the my town is better than your town brigade feel better about themselves, then they have at least some use

[nigel osborne]

LAX-LHR

Think we will have to agree to disagree on the question of meaning and usefulness of the figures.

Your entitled to your opinion and can see where your coming from, but it can only be wild speculation.Nobody knows how many are from which region especially if they are transiting on different airlines and alliances through different airports to get to MAN

In relation to your BHX comments again disagree due to exactly the same reason ,any BHX figures are meaningless too in my opinion anyway.Although until after another pointed out the obvious that being a bit thick I had missed..

Nigel

[LAX_LHR]

Think we will have to agree to disagree on the question of meaning and
usefulness of the figures.

I think we will Nigel, as when you look back at the history of MAN vs BHX debates, I have a very very hard time believing these figures would have been seen as meaningless had BHX been shown more favourably, but there you go.

[LAX_LHR]

HOWEVER, it doesn't work like that. People don't necessarily flock to a
non-stop service especially one that is not daily. If they are on business they
won't sit in (and pay for) a Beijing hotel for an extra day waiting for the
non-stop flight, instead they'll be on Lufthansa or Finnair or any of the other
'hub' possibilities to get home asap.

I agree with you to an extent, but, to say this in a very layman's term, surely all routes have to start somewhere?

There are so, so many routes in history that started less than daily, and for long 'thin' routes such as MAN/BHX-PEK, a daily flight is likely to be overkill initially and gives the route less chance of working than one that starts off less than daily.

It could be seen as a catch 22. Not enough punters to go in at a daily level, but then punters reluctant to book a flight that is less than daily.

[Bagso]

And until MAG somehow address the issue of the price comparison web sites it will be dead within 6 months !

The default position is geared to lowest price which can mean you cannot even find departures on those services that operate already as price dumping means it can be cheaper to fly back an hour to Amsterdam , Frankfurt or Paris than fly direct.

I am not sure how you get round it but I do find it bizarre that somebody hasn't questioned this, it penalises Manchester everytime as our flights are totally buried.