MANCHESTER - 9
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International flights starting in 2015 could be announced for T.F. Green this month | Breaking News | providencejournal.com | The Providence Journal
Service on 2 days a week from 2 different airlines? This has got Condor from FRA and Thomas Cook from Manchester written all over, especially since Boston keeps appearing as a MAN destination on the Thomas Cook flights website.
Technically 2 different airlines, but one set of negotiations, which is a the best scenario given providences size.
He said the airlines would offer service four days a week — one of them on
Mondays and Wednesdays, the other on Tuesdays and Thursdays.
Mondays and Wednesdays, the other on Tuesdays and Thursdays.
Technically 2 different airlines, but one set of negotiations, which is a the best scenario given providences size.
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Also just thought of something very interesting.
On 10th May, post 2962 on this thread, I said:
And the guy at Providence stated this:
Now that is a huge co-incidence!
On 10th May, post 2962 on this thread, I said:
There seems to be 2 gaps that a MAN-BOS flight could run, which is Tuesday and Saturday, and depending how the LGW long haul flights rotate(ei a MAN based machine or the 5th 'floating' aircraft that goes to STN/GLA), there could possibly be room for a Thursday flight too.
He said the airlines would offer service four days a week — one of them on
Mondays and Wednesdays, the other on Tuesdays and Thursdays
Mondays and Wednesdays, the other on Tuesdays and Thursdays
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While it may have been established that MAN-EWR is unlikely to be cut, I would be interested to see why you think a 2 weekly Icelandair would be perceived as such a threat to UA at BHX, but, in the case of MAN, a 3 weekly Icelandair, 7 weekly AA to JFK and all the other USA carriers would not be seen as a bigger and more direct threat?
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As a perception MAG are very good at marketing themselves around here "BHX" and very good at marketing new routes
My issue is not in traditional forms of advertising but the fragmented scatter gun approach manner in which social media is embraced !
Its 2014 !
Every other major origination is using Twitter, Facebook and other forms of social media etc to maximum effect !
Whilst a billboard on a main carriageway in Birmingham is fantastic, it only reaches a very specific demographic group, it won't by example reach a trade organization in say Manchester, Merseyside, South Yorks or Humberside.
It certainly does not reach potential inbound business passengers from Charlotte !
OR
what about promoting Hajj flights to religious organisations in say Oldham, Blackburn, Bradford, Leeds etc ?
What about cargo forums etc ?
Contrast the launch of a new US service from Edinburgh this was plastered across 25 web pages by EDI themselves both here AND the US !
Our Charlotte service reached a mere, wait for it ....2
Edinburgh were equally vocal on twitter / facebook, with the multiplier effect you can reach a vast audience at little cost !
You can repeat the message in the language of the originating country Eg Arabic etc
Manchester has one of the largest twitter followers in the World , all I am saying is capture every opportunity !
LAX often quotes some gems , TAP increasing frequency over Winter, likewise Aegean, surely it cannot be much trouble to actually tell people ?
My issue is not in traditional forms of advertising but the fragmented scatter gun approach manner in which social media is embraced !
Its 2014 !
Every other major origination is using Twitter, Facebook and other forms of social media etc to maximum effect !
Whilst a billboard on a main carriageway in Birmingham is fantastic, it only reaches a very specific demographic group, it won't by example reach a trade organization in say Manchester, Merseyside, South Yorks or Humberside.
It certainly does not reach potential inbound business passengers from Charlotte !
OR
what about promoting Hajj flights to religious organisations in say Oldham, Blackburn, Bradford, Leeds etc ?
What about cargo forums etc ?
Contrast the launch of a new US service from Edinburgh this was plastered across 25 web pages by EDI themselves both here AND the US !
Our Charlotte service reached a mere, wait for it ....2
Edinburgh were equally vocal on twitter / facebook, with the multiplier effect you can reach a vast audience at little cost !
You can repeat the message in the language of the originating country Eg Arabic etc
Manchester has one of the largest twitter followers in the World , all I am saying is capture every opportunity !
LAX often quotes some gems , TAP increasing frequency over Winter, likewise Aegean, surely it cannot be much trouble to actually tell people ?
Last edited by Bagso; 13th Jun 2014 at 11:26.
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Vintage visitors
Not sure if will make much difference to PAX figures but some unusual aircraft due at the annual Aviation & Transport Festival (previously known as fair)
https://www.sendspace.com/pro/dl/irorsb
https://www.sendspace.com/pro/dl/cqfi3i
https://www.sendspace.com/pro/dl/irorsb
https://www.sendspace.com/pro/dl/cqfi3i
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Dreadful experience in and out !!
My brother, who is an airline captain has just related his horrific holiday experience at Manchester T2.
Travelling with Thomson to Menorca, having checked in online, he and his girlfriend waited 45 minutes in the bag drop queue, along with hundreds of other unfortunates. the desk for airport check-in was deserted !!
Having dumped his luggage, the next hurdle was security. Again a horrendous queue and upon reaching the front was confronted by shrieking staff, hurling aggressive instructions such as "don't take a tray", despite the airport signage requesting you to "take a tray".
Another 40 minutes of his life wasted, he finally reached the departure gate with just 20 minutes to spare.
This is in early June, how terrible will the process be when the kids are on holiday??
A very relaxing week spent in Son Bou, but any benefits of the holiday destroyed by having to wait for nearly an hour to clear immigration on arrival at Manchester and that's as a British passport holder !!
He uses airports throughout the Uk and worldwide and rates this as probably his worst experience to date and he has been flying professionally for many years.
never again will he use Manchester for a short Mediterranean break. An extra 30 minutes in the car and he can enjoy the relaxed experience of East Midlands.
How has Manchester Airport allowed it's standards to fall to these levels?
Everyone deserves to enjoy their well deserved break
and not be treated like cattle.
Travelling with Thomson to Menorca, having checked in online, he and his girlfriend waited 45 minutes in the bag drop queue, along with hundreds of other unfortunates. the desk for airport check-in was deserted !!
Having dumped his luggage, the next hurdle was security. Again a horrendous queue and upon reaching the front was confronted by shrieking staff, hurling aggressive instructions such as "don't take a tray", despite the airport signage requesting you to "take a tray".
Another 40 minutes of his life wasted, he finally reached the departure gate with just 20 minutes to spare.
This is in early June, how terrible will the process be when the kids are on holiday??
A very relaxing week spent in Son Bou, but any benefits of the holiday destroyed by having to wait for nearly an hour to clear immigration on arrival at Manchester and that's as a British passport holder !!
He uses airports throughout the Uk and worldwide and rates this as probably his worst experience to date and he has been flying professionally for many years.
never again will he use Manchester for a short Mediterranean break. An extra 30 minutes in the car and he can enjoy the relaxed experience of East Midlands.
How has Manchester Airport allowed it's standards to fall to these levels?
Everyone deserves to enjoy their well deserved break
and not be treated like cattle.
Last edited by Baltic Skies; 14th Jun 2014 at 17:14. Reason: typing error
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Baltic Skies - These sort of airport experiences happen too frequently and airport marketing, which promotes the positive experience, can give the expectation of a smooth process from check-in/bag drop to going through Security to the gateroom. Sadly this can be very different to what happens in practice and marketing will never tell you the negatives. So if the East Midlands experience is better, then go for it.
Dreadful experience in and out !!
I also went thru MAN to Menorca a couple of weeks ago.
I breezed thru security.. but then I had the foresight to pay £3.50 for Fast track.I am sure an airline captain could afford to pay £3.50 to avoid another dreadful experience.
Upon my return, using my 'chipped' passport, I passed thru immigration within 5 minutes . no delay whatsoever.
Sadly the bags then took 45 minutes to come thru.
Two out of three aint bad!!
Delays happen at all airports. its the luck of the draw but prior planning eg fast track, can reduce the risk and the hassle
I breezed thru security.. but then I had the foresight to pay £3.50 for Fast track.I am sure an airline captain could afford to pay £3.50 to avoid another dreadful experience.
Upon my return, using my 'chipped' passport, I passed thru immigration within 5 minutes . no delay whatsoever.
Sadly the bags then took 45 minutes to come thru.
Two out of three aint bad!!
Delays happen at all airports. its the luck of the draw but prior planning eg fast track, can reduce the risk and the hassle
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Baltic Skies
You have three whinges and are subject to differing considerations
1
Recent conditioning by the mainly flexible fare operators mentality and Thomas is not one. If you have baggage you might as well check in and collect boarding card from a human! - Thomas don't charge extra and it doesn't add/save any significant time !
Did they even approach the check in desk to see if they would take the luggage off them ?
Not really the Airports problem !
2
This is a combination of Home Office dictate on security and Airport operator problems in actioning it with due reference to available logistics and infrastructure.
Especially at and around peak traffic flows.
Again this is compounded by the modern flexible fares business model such that more baggage is being hand carried than ever to save a few bucks !
Right now i am of the opinion that if the CAA/JAA and government were to ban cabin carry on beyond a hand bag/ very small over night bag these security queues could be substantially reduced.
The actions of UK Borders are politically motivated at the highest level with un acceptable and direct interference in day to day operations.
It is un-acceptable and un-necessary to inspect every bl**DY UK/EEA passport/ID card however thats what the UK government wants and believes is in the national security interest (Political and xenophobic b*llo*ks!)
Again not the airport operators fault.You can be absolutely sure MAG and their retail tenants would far sooner see the foot fall in those cafes bars restaurants and partaking in the retail experience than pushing/not pushing a plastic tray or sorting out an even more pointless plastic bag and having 250mil aftershave bottles confiscated !
1
Travelling with Thomson to Menorca, having checked in online, he and his girlfriend waited 45 minutes in the bag drop queue, along with hundreds of other unfortunates. the desk for airport check-in was deserted !!
Did they even approach the check in desk to see if they would take the luggage off them ?
Not really the Airports problem !
2
Having dumped his luggage, the next hurdle was security. Again a horrendous queue and upon reaching the front was confronted by shrieking staff, hurling aggressive instructions such as "don't take a tray", despite the airport signage requesting you to "take a tray".
Another 40 minutes of his life wasted, he finally reached the departure gate with just 20 minutes to spare.
Another 40 minutes of his life wasted, he finally reached the departure gate with just 20 minutes to spare.
Especially at and around peak traffic flows.
Again this is compounded by the modern flexible fares business model such that more baggage is being hand carried than ever to save a few bucks !
Right now i am of the opinion that if the CAA/JAA and government were to ban cabin carry on beyond a hand bag/ very small over night bag these security queues could be substantially reduced.
A very relaxing week spent in Son Bou, but any benefits of the holiday destroyed by having to wait for nearly an hour to clear immigration on arrival at Manchester and that's as a British passport holder !!
It is un-acceptable and un-necessary to inspect every bl**DY UK/EEA passport/ID card however thats what the UK government wants and believes is in the national security interest (Political and xenophobic b*llo*ks!)
Again not the airport operators fault.You can be absolutely sure MAG and their retail tenants would far sooner see the foot fall in those cafes bars restaurants and partaking in the retail experience than pushing/not pushing a plastic tray or sorting out an even more pointless plastic bag and having 250mil aftershave bottles confiscated !
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Not sure a stressful experience which however does not result in missing the plane should be allowed to ruin a holiday. My experience with MAN T3 is that service levels both at check in and security are quite variable at the same time of day--- you can be through both in 20 mins or it can be well over an hour. So the best way these days is to arrive two hours before the flight time and accept you may be sitting about or you may not. I can't comment on EMA but at Leeds I wouldn't like to allow less than one and a half hours at peak time if you're not going to pay for fast track.
I've been in much worse queues at hub airports in the States!
I've been in much worse queues at hub airports in the States!
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It is un-acceptable and un-necessary to inspect every bl**DY UK/EEA passport/ID card however thats what the UK government wants and believes is in the national security interest (Political and xenophobic b*llo*ks!)
This gives them more and a little opportunity to meet and greet suspect or other persons of interest at the gate if they see fit whilst leaving the majority of legally travelling persons to go on their way !
As for customs checks for contraband thats a differing matter.
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I use both MAN & LGW several times a month and a lot depends on the day you hit MAN, but as an object lesson in how to handle security LGW does it far better IMHO
North Terminal was designed for common usage in the first place and has plenty of space to accommodate post 9/11 style security.
South Terminal has had oodles of cash spent by GIP and again had plenty of space for extended security
Manchester on the other hand has T3 a terminal designed for primarily one carrier domestic services and with reference to a future Schengen membership "that never happened" for regional flights only so no effective security hall was even envisioned !
Rump of T1 is so over stretched today it simply is unfit for propose .
Whilst T2 was designed for a time when the value of quick kerb/airside was in vogue so again lack of space for those post 9/11 security lines we all now have to live with.
Within these existing infrastructure limitations and government dictates on security and border control Manchester Airport is in a rock and hard place right now.
Its an airport thats' evolved from being primarily a tourist departure point for the Med to having flights arrive from some of the riskiest places on the planet at the moment such as Libya, Egypt and Pakistan.
Whilst runway capacity is nowhere near used - Its got a operating limit of over 320,000 annual movement and handles around 180,000 at the moment.
The Terminal capacity is notionally about 30 -32 million mark,however Manchester is among the most variable in Europe with peak flows at times already close to capacity.
Little wonder it records some of the worst onetime dispatch figures either .
To some extent MAG and its customer airlines need to re-think Terminal usage as a matter of urgency.
Its certain they will have to if/when the proposed T1/T3 redevelopment is moved forward anyway.
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horrific holiday experience at Manchester T2....hundreds of other unfortunates... horrendous queue... confronted by shrieking staff, hurling aggressive instructions...Another 40 minutes of his life wasted...benefits of the holiday destroyed by having to wait for nearly an hour...probably his worst experience...never again...
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Quoting rutankrd:
"The Terminal capacity is notionally about 30 -32 million mark,however Manchester is among the most variable in Europe with peak flows at times already close to capacity"
You're quite right I'm sure. You've only to look in T1 check-in for departures for example at say 09.00 to 10.30 to see how relatively quiet it is once the early morning rush is over. And runway movements from 10.30 to 12.00 or a bit later are significantly reduced.
It must be something of a concern to MAN as I imagine they can't accommodate many more based a/c all wanting to depart between 06.00 and 08.00, but there's no easy answer as to how those quiet periods could be filled. I suppose in theory EZY and FR could use MAN on a W pattern with an early departure from LPL or STN, on a fairly short sector to say a French provincial city, or perhaps foreign airlines utilise slots during mid morning or mid afternoon like Air Portugal. But which airlines?
In response to that earlier post about a bad experience at MAN, our own was considerably better but still raised one or two concerns. It was also a TOM flight from T2, with an early 06.10 departure. I too was surprised at the length of the queue for bag drop compared to normal airport check in, but it was well staffed and took less than 20 minutes, probably nearer 15 although I didn't time it exactly. It was a similar wait at security but I noticed only 5 of 10 channels were initially open although a 6th was just about to open as we reached the front by which time the queue had grown. The handling of the B767 didn't seem to go smoothly. There was a delay in loading the luggage containers and boarding didn't commence until less than 20 minutes before scheduled departure, not helped by the fact there was then only 1 person checking boarding passes and passports at the gate to start with. It did speed up but the Captain said there had been handling issues and, at 06.20 as the last pax boarded, he said that if we didn't get away inn the next 5 minutes (push chairs were still being loaded in the belly) ATC had warned we would be slot restricted. Fortunately we made it.
The return arrival also raised an interesting point but perhaps best left to a separate post. This one's long enough!
"The Terminal capacity is notionally about 30 -32 million mark,however Manchester is among the most variable in Europe with peak flows at times already close to capacity"
You're quite right I'm sure. You've only to look in T1 check-in for departures for example at say 09.00 to 10.30 to see how relatively quiet it is once the early morning rush is over. And runway movements from 10.30 to 12.00 or a bit later are significantly reduced.
It must be something of a concern to MAN as I imagine they can't accommodate many more based a/c all wanting to depart between 06.00 and 08.00, but there's no easy answer as to how those quiet periods could be filled. I suppose in theory EZY and FR could use MAN on a W pattern with an early departure from LPL or STN, on a fairly short sector to say a French provincial city, or perhaps foreign airlines utilise slots during mid morning or mid afternoon like Air Portugal. But which airlines?
In response to that earlier post about a bad experience at MAN, our own was considerably better but still raised one or two concerns. It was also a TOM flight from T2, with an early 06.10 departure. I too was surprised at the length of the queue for bag drop compared to normal airport check in, but it was well staffed and took less than 20 minutes, probably nearer 15 although I didn't time it exactly. It was a similar wait at security but I noticed only 5 of 10 channels were initially open although a 6th was just about to open as we reached the front by which time the queue had grown. The handling of the B767 didn't seem to go smoothly. There was a delay in loading the luggage containers and boarding didn't commence until less than 20 minutes before scheduled departure, not helped by the fact there was then only 1 person checking boarding passes and passports at the gate to start with. It did speed up but the Captain said there had been handling issues and, at 06.20 as the last pax boarded, he said that if we didn't get away inn the next 5 minutes (push chairs were still being loaded in the belly) ATC had warned we would be slot restricted. Fortunately we made it.
The return arrival also raised an interesting point but perhaps best left to a separate post. This one's long enough!
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Ian, I appreciate there are separate issues. I wasn't trying to apportion blame, merely relating our experience. Overall, we had no real complaints. Plane left 15 minutes late but arrived Palma on time. However, there was enough evidence to suggest that MAN can be on a knife edge as regards waiting times, which can suddenly increase significantly - for departures and arrivals - not least due to the variation in traffic flows that rutankrd referred to.
Over the years, our experience at MAN has been pretty good but I accept that some travellers have been less fortunate.
Over the years, our experience at MAN has been pretty good but I accept that some travellers have been less fortunate.
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We need only to move one week back to see what was said about the importance of a well functioning ground transport system at the airport. I would say it is equally as important for an airport to be a well oiled machine on the inside. Obviously one or more cogwheels have a bad tooth or three or a complete cogwheel need to change its bearings. An airport is one unit consisting of many operators, but only one operator failing is enough for the airport to lose its reputation.
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Whilst those who understand how an airport operates or are frequent travellers, realise that many parts make up the whole experience, most of those travelling through once or twice a year going on holiday, do not understand this. To them, Manchester Airport is responsible for their good/bad experience and as such its reputation can easily be tarnished. If MAG really care about its reputation, it's important for them to be proactive in making sure the overall experience is good, and not just those parts that they directly profit from.
Many airport operators around the world understand this - MAG should take a look at SIN or HKG and learn from how they operate. Even at peak periods,you rarely wait more than 5 minutes to clear security.
Many airport operators around the world understand this - MAG should take a look at SIN or HKG and learn from how they operate. Even at peak periods,you rarely wait more than 5 minutes to clear security.
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Fair point about security in Hong Kong but on the opposite side the immigration queues have regularly been horrendous. Whilst I personally love HKG as an airport I usually look forward with trepidation to the wait at immigration.