NEWCASTLE - 8

[LiamNCL]

Looks like Avions LY-VEN has gone tech after a reliable summer. Thomas Cooks 767 G-TCCB looks to be picking up the work

[SWBKCB]

June provisional stats

airport 2016 2015 total_pax_percent
NAPLES 2,958 1,476 100.41
SKIATHOS 1,585 854 85.60
LAS PALMAS 5,553 3,264 70.13
CANCUN 3,658 2,299 59.11
REUS 10,888 6,914 57.48
ALICANTE 38,491 24,980 54.09
BARCELONA 9,818 6,388 53.69
ARRECIFE 10,897 7,457 46.13
MALAGA 26,493 18,464 43.48
TENERIFE 14,771 10,509 40.56
CORK 1,669 1,297 28.68
RHODES 8,621 6,751 27.70
KOS 3,892 3,077 26.49
VERONA VILLAFRANCA 3,141 2,496 25.84
NEW YORK (NEWARK) 5,073 4,099 23.76
LARNACA 7,405 6,209 19.26
DUBLIN 17,210 14,608 17.81
DUBROVNIK 4,219 3,622 16.48
GENEVA 4,663 4,017 16.08
ROME (FIUMICINO) 2,539 2,240 13.35
ZAKINTHOS 8,534 7,551 13.02
FARO 16,355 14,543 12.46
KEFALLINIA 3,051 2,738 11.43
PALMA DE MALLORCA 43,393 39,310 10.39
DUSSELDORF 3,579 3,325 7.64
PAPHOS 6,247 5,848 6.82
NICE 3,978 3,736 6.48
SALZBURG 1,463 1,383 5.78
AMSTERDAM 31,752 30,757 3.24
HERAKLION 5,478 5,322 2.93
SANFORD 2,356 2,302 2.35
FUERTEVENTURA 4,519 4,429 2.03
PISA 2,107 2,079 1.35
MAHON 8,340 8,266 0.90
GENOA 131 0 0.00
GIRONA 2,458 0 0.00
HALIFAX INT 39 0 0.00
TOULOUSE (BLAGNAC) 148 0 0.00
VENICE 129 0 0.00
IBIZA 15,459 15,476 -0.11
THIRA (SANTORINI) 1,590 1,672 -4.90
BURGAS 5,872 6,215 -5.52
DUBAI 15,314 16,460 -6.96
BODRUM (MILAS) 3,174 3,458 -8.21
PARIS CDG 12,197 13,339 -8.56
PRAGUE 2,165 2,391 -9.45
COPENHAGEN 1,844 2,066 -10.75
FUNCHAL 2,728 3,083 -11.51
KRAKOW 2,177 2,487 -12.46
CORFU 8,733 9,978 -12.48
ANTALYA 5,191 6,031 -13.93
MALTA 3,546 4,705 -24.63
BRUSSELS 1,909 2,743 -30.40
DALAMAN 14,529 23,288 -37.61
MURCIA SAN JAVIER 2,896 4,843 -40.20
STAVANGER 606 1,177 -48.51
SPLIT 520 2,116 -75.43
ENFIDHA 0 7,381 -100.00
HURGHADA 0 1,476 -100.00
KAVALA 0 790 -100.00
SHARM EL SHEIKH 0 5,018 -100.00

[HH6702]

Intresting figures.
Newark 1000 extra passengers but still not enough

[EK77WNCL]

I would hesitate to say that that is one of the healthiest June's (and months in general) that I can remember, EXCEPT the Dubai figures, which infuriate me because once again it looks like we're lining up to lose out because of airlines dumping capacity elsewhere nearby and operating marginal loads.

If it keeps going on like this for the rest of the year we can wave goodbye to second daily next year... Cheers Edinburgh, owe you one!

(P.S I know I shouldn't be bitter but it annoys me that we have so much potential, but are on the bottom of the pile, and having driven up to Edinburgh last week for the first time as an adult, anyone who would put themselves through that hellish journey to save a couple of quid must be desparate for a deal! I understand if NCL doesn't offer it but...)

[HeartyMeatballs]

Well make your mind up. Why is it not ok for airlines to dump capacity on other markets but it's ok for airlines to dump foreign based capacity on NCL and operate marginal yields.wether it's a marginal load or marginal yield neither are idea.

[Heathrow Harry]

still can't believe three times as many people would rather go to Dubai than New York...............

[oldart]

Originally Posted by Heathrow Harry

still can't believe three times as many people would rather go to Dubai than New York...............

Onward connections to the far east and Australia I suspect. More relatives emigrate there than do to America.

[EK77WNCL]

It's rather different (I assume you're making digs at Ryanair), as Ryanair have expanded a large, and growing market, passenger numbers have grown some months, more than all the seats Ryanair had to offer. It was one of the first months Ryanair operated Alicante, they offered around 8,000 seats and numbers grew by more than 10,000

Also, the market can take it, if anything it will grow and right size (and right-price) NCL for once.

The exact opposite of EY and QR flooding EDI, which is simply just taking passengers from existing, and eachother's services, and is now starting to have a detrimental effect down at NCL, maybe there is rock bottom prices, but they might have ruined any chances of us getting expansion from EK in the near term.

Not to mention the new routes that Ryanair is bringing in, and I'm sure that easyjet's announcement of Berlin is a pre-emptive strike on Ryanair, I hope it is at least!

[ATNotts]

I would hesitate to say that that is one of the healthiest June's (and months in general) that I can remember, EXCEPT the Dubai figures, which infuriate me because once again it looks like we're lining up to lose out because of airlines dumping capacity elsewhere nearby and operating marginal loads.

Not time for mass wrist slitting based on June figures for Dubai! The route has suffered a triple-whammy in June. Ramadan, the monsoon season in the Indian subcontinent, and winter in Australia and New Zealand. DXB figures weren't so good on any of the UK regional routes.

[nighthawk117]

The exact opposite of EY and QR flooding EDI, which is simply just taking passengers from existing, and eachother's services, and is now starting to have a detrimental effect down at NCL

Do you have a source to back this up? CAA stats seem to show otherwise.

Why the obsession with a second daily Dubai flight? You've got a connection to Dubai, does it matter if it's one or two daily?

[HeartyMeatballs]

It's for when he's an Emirates pilot. As there will be no NCL based jobs he'll need a way to get to and from the sandpit.

[SWBKCB]

UK - ME3 June 2016

UK_airport foreign_airport 2016 2015 total_pax_percent
EDINBURGH ABU DHABI 10,659 6,131 73.85 % inc. looks wrong?
HEATHROW ABU DHABI 67,112 61,409 9.29
MANCHESTER ABU DHABI 29,411 25,936 13.40

BIRMINGHAM DOHA 9,793 0 0
EDINBURGH DOHA 10,193 9,668 5.43
HEATHROW DOHA 79,227 73,122 8.35
MANCHESTER DOHA 22,859 20,806 9.87

BIRMINGHAM DUBAI 39,584 38,567 2.64
GATWICK DUBAI 0.00 65,290 -100
GLASGOW DUBAI 0.00 32,882 -100
HEATHROW DUBAI 171,852 175,005 -1.80
MANCHESTER DUBAI 61,409 60,942 0.77
NEWCASTLE DUBAI 15,314 16,460 -6.96

[jensdad]

If I can digress a little bit into the NCL vs EDI question...


I was in Edinburgh yesterday. The city was chock a block with foreigners: both tourists and those working in the service industries. Over half of the punters in the airport itself seemed to be non-local. Compare this to the departure lounge at NCL where you barely hear an accent from outside a 60 mile radius of Woolsington. Despite what people in in organisations like the Newcastle Gateshead Initiative might tell you (I still insist on putting a gap between the words 'Newcastle' and 'Gateshead' - sorry for being a tad off-message), Tyneside and the wider North East is still a tiny player in the UK's business and tourism sectors. When comparing Newcastle to Edinburgh I think we just aren't comparing apples with apples. (Mind, this might not be a bad thing, do we really want Dunstanburgh castle to be awash with tourists? )
LBA might be a better comparison. Or even to a certain extent MME and we are in a hell of a lot better situation than them.


A wider question could be as to why this is the case. I am old enough to remember when EDI (the airport, not the city) was only slightly busier than NCL. What happened?

[fl dutchman]

" A wider question could be as to why this is the case. I am old enough to remember when EDI ( the airport not the city ) was only slightly busier than NCL. What happened?"

Answer --Change of ownership at EDI!!

[EK77WNCL]

I'm just old enough to remember about 10 years ago when NCL was one of the fastest growing in the UK and I also wonder what happened (obviously, competition happened, in the wrong places)

I am proud of NCL for the balance we have, I just think it's a little frustrating that we're being limited by said competition. If emirates were stupid enough to go into EDI any time soon that would be a huge nail in the coffin I think

I've just gotten off a train from Edinburgh and I noticed the very same thing. I was there for 4 hours, saw 3 groups of Spanish people, 1 of Portugese, countless Americans (almost everyone was!), the same for Chinese, and I went into a pub opposite Waverley, the pub at the front was all Scots, but in the restaurant in the back I was the only brit, 2 groups of Germans made friends because they heard eachother talking

That's a good thing! And it's obviously a very very cosmopolitan city, I just wish the North East was that little bit more on the tourist map. As you say, I'd hate us to be overrun, but we do have a lot to offer (obviously not to first time visitors, we can't compete with London)

And for the record that's a pathetic comment, I want a 2nd daily flight for many reasons, none come close to being due to my ambitions (And - might I add, why dampen them?) it's mainly because it opens up many more connections and offers better flight times for O&D, you don't lose 2 nights as you do now if you use the evening flight.

fl dutchman, nail on the head there! I wish we'd been bought by MAG or GIP, they both run airports very well! Not to say our management don't but there would have been more scope for growth, and existing airline partners under either of those

[SWBKCB]

Why does everybody ignore the obvious - Newcastle is a small, poor, isolated city in a small, poor, isolated region (Sir Alex was right!) - stop looking for excuses.

I too think NCL punches above it's weight, but to expect new ownership to awaken a sleeping giant is just wishfull thinking (and read the BOH, HUY and EMA threads before fluttering yr eyelids at MAG!)

[Jamesair]

I think Newcastle is doing well considering the limitations of its catchment area. Ryanair will boost the passenger numbers this coming Winter and next Summer to help the airport reach the 5m landmark again.

[fl dutchman]

When EDI was owned by BAA I think there was little in the way of low cost carriers and IT flights at EDI.
Lots of people from its catchment area used to come down to NCL to use the holiday flights etc that were not available then from EDI.
That would be in the days when NCL handled over 5 m pax.
Of course unlike the BAA who seemed not to encourage charters and LCC at that time from EDI the current owners have done a great job in attracting such airlines and operators.
Now there is less need for people to come to NCL as there are so many flights from EDI that were not available previously.
So I believe that is a significant factor in recent years falling passenger nos from NCL.
The people from Scotland used to boost Pax nos from NCL.
Of course EDI has a larger catchment area than NCL and it is a much larger inbound tourism destination.
Despite this NCL still does very well indeed.
Regarding DXB, I don't think the route is ready to go to twice daily anytime soon. We're lucky to have the daily service which has stood up well despite the competition from other carriers at EDI.
I think Emirates has a seat sale on from NCL that should boost passenger nos in the short term.
Of course Ryanair will boost numbers from NCL in the short term but I worry about the long term effect they will have on other carriers. Not to mention the falling pound which could harm outbound tourism severely and therefore the number of people using all airports.

[Skipness One Echo]

EDI was constrained by it's place in the wider strategy of Scottish Airports which saw long haul and sun flights at GLA with EDI feeding LHR and some European point to point. However Scotland has changed a lot since that strategy was sidelined more so now Edinburgh has a Parliament once again and the city was put firmly on the visitors map and has eclipsed Glasgow to some extent.

Emirates may well remain at one per day. Look at Continental at GLA. Started with a B757, moved quickly to a DC10, then a B767-400. When CO launched EDI, we saw summer 757 service at 11 weekly GLA and 10 EDI making three per day to Scotland then that switched to EDI having 11 vs GLA 10. Once the dust had settled, EDI had three daily B757s to two cities, EWR and ORD whereas GLA is back where they started in 1998 with one daily B757 to Newark. I suspect DXB-NCL will remain and do well for EK but may well stay once daily on a B77W whereas GLA will eventually see the A380 and QR and EY will continue killing each other at EDI. There's a wider picture at play.

[jensdad]

Hi all, S1E, I see your point about Edinburgh now being more of a political centre as well as an economic and tourist one. The same could be said though about Cardiff, and they have lost out massively to Bristol in recent times. The drivers of airport traffic are indeed complex. I agree with SWBKCB that we punch above our weight. Be glad that we have a daily link to Dubai which was unthinkable a few years back, and even that we have (well , until tomorrow morning anyway ) a link to NYC. Obviously we all want to see growth in our local airport but things could be a lot worse. I wasn't joking when I said that we can quite reasonably compare ourselves to MME. I remember, maybe back in the 80s I don't know, the manager of MME on Look North saying that they wanted to overtake NCL as the North East's primary airport. And at the time it really wasn't as ridiculous as it sounds now.