Chaos at Terminal 5
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The problem here is that upgrading something that's already in use is always harder than starting from scratch
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Steamchicken
T5 is not an upgrade in the sense you state - it is a totally new 'product'.
It has not been handled well - possibly because the management at BA have over the past few years, whittled away the infrastructure, leaving a shell of what was once a Great British company.
BA is no longer the 'Worlds Favourite Airline' - its service provision is generally poor, mostly due to mis-management, and partly due to the attitude of a select few who believe that the name BA overrides any deficiencies.
I truly feel sorry for the many good people who work for BA - they are getting the brunt of the reaction from a public who are still deluded enough to think that as BA is our national flag carrier, it must therefore be the best.
A sad and huge mistake; caused not by the ordinary worker, but by inept management and poor investment.
T5 is not an upgrade in the sense you state - it is a totally new 'product'.
It has not been handled well - possibly because the management at BA have over the past few years, whittled away the infrastructure, leaving a shell of what was once a Great British company.
BA is no longer the 'Worlds Favourite Airline' - its service provision is generally poor, mostly due to mis-management, and partly due to the attitude of a select few who believe that the name BA overrides any deficiencies.
I truly feel sorry for the many good people who work for BA - they are getting the brunt of the reaction from a public who are still deluded enough to think that as BA is our national flag carrier, it must therefore be the best.
A sad and huge mistake; caused not by the ordinary worker, but by inept management and poor investment.
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There used to be a nasty smell at the western end of LHR.
A big smell has returned?
At least WW was doing the TV rounds ( eventually) but without a supporting cast and of course missing yesterdays clown.
And BAA PR ?
hiding in the basement?
BBC R4 was reporting no queues this afternoon.
Having joined in the BOOs I do hope they get things sorted over the weekend and the place functions as it should prior to the next flights migrating.
A big smell has returned?
At least WW was doing the TV rounds ( eventually) but without a supporting cast and of course missing yesterdays clown.
And BAA PR ?
hiding in the basement?
BBC R4 was reporting no queues this afternoon.
Having joined in the BOOs I do hope they get things sorted over the weekend and the place functions as it should prior to the next flights migrating.
N4790P
WetBehindThe Ears,
Yes, lets have some balance. It is NOT a new airport, just a partially utilised shopping mall with terminal facilities.
Neither has there been mention of other problems with other new airports. This article sounds very familiar...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asi...fic/129891.stm
DEN, KUL and BKK all had problems with their openings too.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asi...fic/129891.stm
DEN, KUL and BKK all had problems with their openings too.
Narcissistic Personality Disorder.
The problem of "incompetent" senior management is worldwide, just look at Wall street at present.
There is a type of person who is internally "broken" and cannot empathise with people, yet who are highly intelligent and hard working. They have recently been characterised as "Industrial Psychopaths" or suffering "Narcissistic Personality Disorder". They have a huge sense of entitlement, a grandiose sense of their own self importance, will lie and scheme to get ahead, they do "ruthless" very well, since, being unable to empathise with their victims, they sleep well at night. Arrogance is also a dead giveaway. They surround themselves with sycophants, most of who will have exactly the same personality and are quite prepared to grease their way up the management tree by sucking up to the boss.
Now in our efforts towards equity and fairness, which are noble goals, we now hire essentially on "Merit", and hardworking narcissists do "merit" very well. In "the bad old days" of class and the old school tie as a prerequisite for a senior management role these people could not get ahead, because by virtue of class and the old school tie, the selectors had observed the behaviour of these loathsome creatures over many years, and under many conditions, and knew well enough not to have anything to do with them, no matter how glittering their resumes read.
These creeps infest the upper management of many large companies, and HR Departments do not yet have the tools to weed them out, in fact some of them were even hired by companies for their deliberate ruthlessness, which was seen as a virtue at the time.
P.S. And looking at the Board of BA makes my point for me., especially the Chairman's resume.
There is a type of person who is internally "broken" and cannot empathise with people, yet who are highly intelligent and hard working. They have recently been characterised as "Industrial Psychopaths" or suffering "Narcissistic Personality Disorder". They have a huge sense of entitlement, a grandiose sense of their own self importance, will lie and scheme to get ahead, they do "ruthless" very well, since, being unable to empathise with their victims, they sleep well at night. Arrogance is also a dead giveaway. They surround themselves with sycophants, most of who will have exactly the same personality and are quite prepared to grease their way up the management tree by sucking up to the boss.
Now in our efforts towards equity and fairness, which are noble goals, we now hire essentially on "Merit", and hardworking narcissists do "merit" very well. In "the bad old days" of class and the old school tie as a prerequisite for a senior management role these people could not get ahead, because by virtue of class and the old school tie, the selectors had observed the behaviour of these loathsome creatures over many years, and under many conditions, and knew well enough not to have anything to do with them, no matter how glittering their resumes read.
These creeps infest the upper management of many large companies, and HR Departments do not yet have the tools to weed them out, in fact some of them were even hired by companies for their deliberate ruthlessness, which was seen as a virtue at the time.
P.S. And looking at the Board of BA makes my point for me., especially the Chairman's resume.
Last edited by Sunfish; 28th Mar 2008 at 18:37.
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Fantastic: "The £4.3bn terminal, which opened this morning, has been touted as the gateway to a new UK, where dwindling industrial and North Sea oil revenues will be replaced by the proceeds from duty free sales."
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/03/27/t5_opening_day/
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/03/27/t5_opening_day/
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El Reg reconstructs Heathrow T5 chaos
For those of you who are having difficulty fully comprehending the fearful chaos inside Heathrow's new Terminal 5, inaugurated this week amid the kind of anarchy which only BAA can really pull off, we're delighted to offer this afternoon our representation of the scenes inside the building as enraged passengers storm the security gates in the vain hope that armed action might reunite them with their luggage:
We should explain that the security operatives seen here have just accidently shot dead the only person capable of fixing the baggage handling computer system, since he tried to get past them with an illicit 250ml of black coffee without decanting it into the regulation terror-busting plastic bags.
Anyone who's wondering why the other participants in this drama are dressed as pirates should be aware that while our Playmobil Security Check Point fortuitously turned up this morning, the box of 500 angry customers we also ordered has been delayed in transit, since it was apparently routed from Germany via a well-known UK airport.
Accordingly, we have improvised with our extensive collection of Playmobil buccaneers.
We should explain that the security operatives seen here have just accidently shot dead the only person capable of fixing the baggage handling computer system, since he tried to get past them with an illicit 250ml of black coffee without decanting it into the regulation terror-busting plastic bags.
Anyone who's wondering why the other participants in this drama are dressed as pirates should be aware that while our Playmobil Security Check Point fortuitously turned up this morning, the box of 500 angry customers we also ordered has been delayed in transit, since it was apparently routed from Germany via a well-known UK airport.
Accordingly, we have improvised with our extensive collection of Playmobil buccaneers.
Paxing All Over The World
CorkEICK
No. On the PM programme, they reported that BAA would not respond to any requests for interviews.
WetBehindThe Ears
When T5 was being planned, all involved knew the nature of the British media and knew that any mistake would be writ large. The fact that the failures were of Titanic proportions produced a similar response.
In the BBC Radio 4 programme 'PM' today, they quoted BA staff who had to remain anonymous saying: "We told them about the problems during testing and they ignored us." As per my previous post - I am not surprised.
(Cheap shot coming up) At 18:45 the BAA website still says:
Except that they have car parking and you can leave with what you came for ... Seriously, someone in BAA should have told the web master to pull all such own goals as soon as it started to go wrong.
Has any spokesperson from the BAA made any comment on TV or radio in the UK?
WetBehindThe Ears
I know I'm being incredibly naive but a more balanced view from the UK media would be welcomed.
In the BBC Radio 4 programme 'PM' today, they quoted BA staff who had to remain anonymous saying: "We told them about the problems during testing and they ignored us." As per my previous post - I am not surprised.
(Cheap shot coming up) At 18:45 the BAA website still says:
Terminal 5"Imagine Bond Street and Knightsbridge under one roof"
Last edited by PAXboy; 28th Mar 2008 at 18:47.
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I find this whole episode a tad reassuring.
Media have done a great job of exposing the sheer ineptitude of Senior Management in all of the concerns involved.
Hopefully more peeps will wake up and smell the coffee regarding the demise of the "British" tag as a positive.
UK (and Irish) Corporate Executives beware
Media have done a great job of exposing the sheer ineptitude of Senior Management in all of the concerns involved.
Hopefully more peeps will wake up and smell the coffee regarding the demise of the "British" tag as a positive.
UK (and Irish) Corporate Executives beware
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And from yesterday's Telegraph letters page (I wonder how they're feeling now?):
T5 engineering inspiration
Sir - Heathrow Terminal 5 opens to the public today: a triumph of modern engineering. With five levels, the size of 10 football pitches, it is the largest freestanding building in Britain.
Catering for up to 35 million passengers a year, it provides a crucial part of the transport infrastructure required to grow the British economy.
Part of the building's innovative technology is a rainwater-harvesting system that reuses up to 85 per cent of the rain that falls on site.
This project not only demonstrates the vital role that engineering and technology play in supporting our society, but it will also inspire a whole new generation to pursue careers in engineering.
Dr John Morton Chief Executive, the Engineering and Technology Board; Tom Foulkes Director General, the Institution of Civil Engineers; Robin McGill Chief Executive, the Institution of Engineering and Technology; Professor William Banks Senior Deputy President, the Institution of Mechanical Engineers; Blane Judd Chief Executive, the Chartered Institute of Plumbing and Heating Engineering; Nick Reeves Executive Director, Chartered Institution of Water and Environmental Management; Kevin Macan-Lind Chief Executive, the Institute of Acoustics; Dr David Brown Chief Executive, Institution of Chemical Engineers; John Williams Chief Executive Officer, Institution of Gas Engineers and Managers; John Long Chief Executive Officer, the Institute of Healthcare Engineering and Estate Management; Mary Lewis Chief Executive, the Institution of Highways and Transportation; Dr Graham Woodrow Deputy Chief Executive, the Institute of Materials, Mineral and Mining; Michael Yates Secretary, Institute of Measurement and Control; Colin Porter Chief Executive, the Institution of Railway Signal Engineers; Lt Col David Hamilton Chief Executive, the Institution of Royal Engineers; Keith Read CBE Director General, the Institute of Marine Engineering, Science and Technology; Dr Keith Eaton Chief Executive, the Institution of Structural Engineers; Lynn Cooper Chief Executive, Institution of Water Officers; Keith Mans Chief Executive, the Royal Aeronautical Society; Trevor Blakely Chief Executive, Royal Institution of Naval Architects; Professor Raymond Clarke OBE Chief Executive, the Society of Environmental Engineers; Judith Walker Secretary, Institute of Highway Incorporated Engineers; Tim Jessop Chief Executive, the Welding Institute
Sir - Heathrow Terminal 5 opens to the public today: a triumph of modern engineering. With five levels, the size of 10 football pitches, it is the largest freestanding building in Britain.
Catering for up to 35 million passengers a year, it provides a crucial part of the transport infrastructure required to grow the British economy.
Part of the building's innovative technology is a rainwater-harvesting system that reuses up to 85 per cent of the rain that falls on site.
This project not only demonstrates the vital role that engineering and technology play in supporting our society, but it will also inspire a whole new generation to pursue careers in engineering.
Dr John Morton Chief Executive, the Engineering and Technology Board; Tom Foulkes Director General, the Institution of Civil Engineers; Robin McGill Chief Executive, the Institution of Engineering and Technology; Professor William Banks Senior Deputy President, the Institution of Mechanical Engineers; Blane Judd Chief Executive, the Chartered Institute of Plumbing and Heating Engineering; Nick Reeves Executive Director, Chartered Institution of Water and Environmental Management; Kevin Macan-Lind Chief Executive, the Institute of Acoustics; Dr David Brown Chief Executive, Institution of Chemical Engineers; John Williams Chief Executive Officer, Institution of Gas Engineers and Managers; John Long Chief Executive Officer, the Institute of Healthcare Engineering and Estate Management; Mary Lewis Chief Executive, the Institution of Highways and Transportation; Dr Graham Woodrow Deputy Chief Executive, the Institute of Materials, Mineral and Mining; Michael Yates Secretary, Institute of Measurement and Control; Colin Porter Chief Executive, the Institution of Railway Signal Engineers; Lt Col David Hamilton Chief Executive, the Institution of Royal Engineers; Keith Read CBE Director General, the Institute of Marine Engineering, Science and Technology; Dr Keith Eaton Chief Executive, the Institution of Structural Engineers; Lynn Cooper Chief Executive, Institution of Water Officers; Keith Mans Chief Executive, the Royal Aeronautical Society; Trevor Blakely Chief Executive, Royal Institution of Naval Architects; Professor Raymond Clarke OBE Chief Executive, the Society of Environmental Engineers; Judith Walker Secretary, Institute of Highway Incorporated Engineers; Tim Jessop Chief Executive, the Welding Institute
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... And now Sky News has joined the throng of PPRune quoters with the "lions led by donkeys" message. This is far from being a farce now; more a very sad story involving many, many innocent people (and I am including the poor 'ordinary' BA staff as well as the infuriated pax).
I am living in Dubai at present and sincerely hope that the soon-to-be-opened "Emirates Only" DXB T3 will learn from these "teething problems". Thankfully, it is hard to see it being any worse than LHR T5.
Depressing.
I am living in Dubai at present and sincerely hope that the soon-to-be-opened "Emirates Only" DXB T3 will learn from these "teething problems". Thankfully, it is hard to see it being any worse than LHR T5.
Depressing.
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Just reported on bbc london BA to cancel 54 flights from T5>i Thought it was getting better not worse?