Aer Lingus - 5
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: STANSTED & MANCHESTER
Posts: 1,893
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sound to me more like they dont want a 
company at all.
Who or what business would not want one of the best business men that aviation had ever seen working with or for them.
He runs and has grown one of the worlds biggest Airlines
.
company at all.Who or what business would not want one of the best business men that aviation had ever seen working with or for them.
He runs and has grown one of the worlds biggest Airlines
.
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Reality
EI has about 40 aircraft and 800 million in the bank
FR has about 120 aircraft and 2 billion in the bank
If you include the LHR slots they worth about another 200 million
I think the papers just needed an attention grabbing headline this morning.
The aviation industry is in crisis at the moment on a scale close to that of post Sept 11 2001, and that was used as a means to reduce employee numbers and force new working conditions on employees. So why would management not use this occasion to do something similar.
EI has about 40 aircraft and 800 million in the bank
FR has about 120 aircraft and 2 billion in the bank
If you include the LHR slots they worth about another 200 million
I think the papers just needed an attention grabbing headline this morning.
The aviation industry is in crisis at the moment on a scale close to that of post Sept 11 2001, and that was used as a means to reduce employee numbers and force new working conditions on employees. So why would management not use this occasion to do something similar.
TUPE??
Staff should be OK under TUPE, Transfer of Undertakings. I believe any other company taking over the EI ground handling function will have to employ existing staff under existing contracts for a defined period of time (is it 2 years) following the change.
Anyone know more about this employee protection legislation?
Anyone know more about this employee protection legislation?
Have a word with the FlyBe staff. Especially ex BA staff (Engineers are I believe taking Flybe to court).
Good luck all!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 64
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
When will union members realise that the best time to pay their "dues" is during any period of feast - and not during a famine? Union officials of Alitalia seem to have almost succeeded in leading ALL of their troops into the valley of death, rather than saving many of them to prosper while waiting for better times.
As much as many may have had reason to dislike Margaret Thatcher, she at least had the foresight to realise that union officials do nothing more than protect their own jobs first, under the pretence of protecting all others.
As much as many may have had reason to dislike Margaret Thatcher, she at least had the foresight to realise that union officials do nothing more than protect their own jobs first, under the pretence of protecting all others.
.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 278
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Daz211, these are the situations you seem to have given Aer Lingus:
Ryanair take over: Michael O'Leary has said that he would keep Ryanair and Aer Lingus as two separate and competing airlines if they were to takeover. What he hasn't said is for how long or if he would even keep this promise, he could easily turn around and say that one brand and one airline would be better in the current market conditions, therefore Aer Lingus disappears into the grips of Ryanair and is confined to the history books.
Aer Lingus fail: Aer Lingus end up like Zoom and XL despite the fact revenue is up 10.2% in the first half of the year, passenger growth of 10.5%, plenty of funds available, an aggressive cost cutting plan so they can actually make money from that 10.2% growth in revenue and cash reserves of €802.6 Million but Aer Lingus still can't turn itself around and confined to the history books.
Here's another possible outcome,
Aer Lingus return to profitability on their own: After some industry relation trouble (lets face it, it's going to happen), the cost cutting plan is implemented, savings of €100 Million coupled with the recent €40 Million in savings is achieved, cost per seat drops from €80 to around €60, passenger numbers continue to rise, revenue follows the current trend and increases and Aer Lingus become profitable again by 2010 if not earlier.
Ryanair take over: Michael O'Leary has said that he would keep Ryanair and Aer Lingus as two separate and competing airlines if they were to takeover. What he hasn't said is for how long or if he would even keep this promise, he could easily turn around and say that one brand and one airline would be better in the current market conditions, therefore Aer Lingus disappears into the grips of Ryanair and is confined to the history books.
Aer Lingus fail: Aer Lingus end up like Zoom and XL despite the fact revenue is up 10.2% in the first half of the year, passenger growth of 10.5%, plenty of funds available, an aggressive cost cutting plan so they can actually make money from that 10.2% growth in revenue and cash reserves of €802.6 Million but Aer Lingus still can't turn itself around and confined to the history books.
Here's another possible outcome,
Aer Lingus return to profitability on their own: After some industry relation trouble (lets face it, it's going to happen), the cost cutting plan is implemented, savings of €100 Million coupled with the recent €40 Million in savings is achieved, cost per seat drops from €80 to around €60, passenger numbers continue to rise, revenue follows the current trend and increases and Aer Lingus become profitable again by 2010 if not earlier.
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: ireland
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Shamrock350 cudn't agree wit u more...
Daz211
clearly u don't understand Irelands pride in it's national airline! EI has the EU on it's side on this 1
EI dont need FR.... if anything FR need EI
Daz211
clearly u don't understand Irelands pride in it's national airline! EI has the EU on it's side on this 1
EI dont need FR.... if anything FR need EI
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 2,782
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
blackred1443
This information was announced on foot of an Aer Lingus statement in the summer, however, I doubt that the balance is very up to date. As for Ryanair' bank balance this was announced with an annual report a couple of months back.
THis information should be easily accessed as both companies are listed on the Stock Exchange
sorry am i missing something here, since when did aer lingus have 800 million in the bank or ryanair 2 billion for that matter!?
THis information should be easily accessed as both companies are listed on the Stock Exchange
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: northern ireland
Posts: 95
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Daz211 your mission in several threads is to preach doom and gloom about Aer lingus, all sounds very personal to me without much real proof they are in more trouble than most airlines. Seems that Ryanair give away flights scream panic! Not much profit can be made by doing this, its just a way to try and get Passengers off other airlines and hope they go to the wall first. Take care wih what you say about other airlines as you coud find yourself libellous.
Rebel PPRuNer
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Toronto, Canada (formerly EICK)
Age: 51
Posts: 2,834
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by 840
The CSO have been publishing Irish route data since 2006
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 278
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Daz21, here is something I posted in the Aer Lingus thread but you may have missed it.
These are the situations you seem to have given Aer Lingus:
Ryanair take over: Michael O'Leary has said that he would keep Ryanair and Aer Lingus as two separate and competing airlines if they were to takeover. What he hasn't said is for how long or if he would even keep this promise, he could easily turn around and say that one brand and one airline would be better in the current market conditions, therefore Aer Lingus disappears into the grips of Ryanair and is confined to the history books.
Aer Lingus fail: Aer Lingus end up like Zoom and XL despite the fact revenue is up 10.2% in the first half of the year, passenger growth of 10.5%, plenty of funds available, an aggressive cost cutting plan so they can actually make money from that 10.2% growth in revenue and cash reserves of €802.6 Million but Aer Lingus still can't turn itself around and confined to the history books.
Here's another possible outcome,
Aer Lingus return to profitability on their own: After some industry relation trouble (lets face it, it's going to happen), the cost cutting plan is implemented, savings of €100 Million coupled with the recent €40 Million in savings is achieved, cost per seat drops from €80 to around €60, passenger numbers continue to rise, revenue follows the current trend and increases and Aer Lingus become profitable again by 2010 if not earlier.
So as Dermot Mannion put it, "If Aer Lingus is having a sneeze, the rest of Europe have colds".
These are the situations you seem to have given Aer Lingus:
Ryanair take over: Michael O'Leary has said that he would keep Ryanair and Aer Lingus as two separate and competing airlines if they were to takeover. What he hasn't said is for how long or if he would even keep this promise, he could easily turn around and say that one brand and one airline would be better in the current market conditions, therefore Aer Lingus disappears into the grips of Ryanair and is confined to the history books.
Aer Lingus fail: Aer Lingus end up like Zoom and XL despite the fact revenue is up 10.2% in the first half of the year, passenger growth of 10.5%, plenty of funds available, an aggressive cost cutting plan so they can actually make money from that 10.2% growth in revenue and cash reserves of €802.6 Million but Aer Lingus still can't turn itself around and confined to the history books.
Here's another possible outcome,
Aer Lingus return to profitability on their own: After some industry relation trouble (lets face it, it's going to happen), the cost cutting plan is implemented, savings of €100 Million coupled with the recent €40 Million in savings is achieved, cost per seat drops from €80 to around €60, passenger numbers continue to rise, revenue follows the current trend and increases and Aer Lingus become profitable again by 2010 if not earlier.
So as Dermot Mannion put it, "If Aer Lingus is having a sneeze, the rest of Europe have colds".
EI, under Willie Walsh, were one of the first legacy carriers to deal with the threat to their business from Ryanair. They had to, unlike their continental brethren, from day one EI have had FR on their patch taking customers directly out of their main hub (Dublin) and from some of their busiest routes (London, Paris etc).
The changes initiated to the EI business model during the WW reigime (and unfortunetly for all now in EI, prematurely cut short by the myopic and selfish ideals of the then Taoiseach (Prime Minister)), laid the foundations for the company surviving thus far. But into the face of the current economic slowdown and higher oil prices, to borrow a pharse from the same ex-Taoiseach "A lot done, more to do".
I would expect EI will weather the storm, but it will be much leaner organisation with potentially a much smaller route network and operating fleet, offering a changed service level by the end of it.
More often than not in private businesses, it's bad managemnt that dooms companies to fail, however, in Ireland and the union "infested" semi-state/public service and ex-semi-state area, the ineptitude and idiological bent of union reps can equially undermine the future viability of organisation.
Not just for EI, or any airline, but business in general, pragmatisim and wise leadership is needed over dogma and idiology if companis are to survive.
just my two cents
JAS
The changes initiated to the EI business model during the WW reigime (and unfortunetly for all now in EI, prematurely cut short by the myopic and selfish ideals of the then Taoiseach (Prime Minister)), laid the foundations for the company surviving thus far. But into the face of the current economic slowdown and higher oil prices, to borrow a pharse from the same ex-Taoiseach "A lot done, more to do".
I would expect EI will weather the storm, but it will be much leaner organisation with potentially a much smaller route network and operating fleet, offering a changed service level by the end of it.
More often than not in private businesses, it's bad managemnt that dooms companies to fail, however, in Ireland and the union "infested" semi-state/public service and ex-semi-state area, the ineptitude and idiological bent of union reps can equially undermine the future viability of organisation.
Not just for EI, or any airline, but business in general, pragmatisim and wise leadership is needed over dogma and idiology if companis are to survive.
just my two cents
JAS
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 647
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Explicit details please
To quote your contributor "Heard that everything is on the table including politically sensitive routes" - Is this an implicit declaration of intent , by management that recently opened bases with 50-60% load factors on the routes served , are seen to be a commercial mistake at least in the short/medium term. - if there's any element of truth in the rumour - Thats bad news for the regions affected. I'm not a bystander in this - just an SLF who would be greatly disadvantaged by an EI pullout - like hordes of others. The setting up of an airline base at an airport is an important technical boost to any local economy.
CAT III
CAT III
Last edited by Guest 112233; 17th Sep 2008 at 13:58.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Galway
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Daz your hypocracy is staggering.
You post a sensationalist headline, then a post advocating that ALT (as its known in Irelands civil service, outside the hopelessly insular aviation world) get together with MOL. You then feign shock at how Ryanair become part of the thread. You were the one who brought them into it.
Then we have Hairy promising an imminent EU ruling when everyone knows the ruling is at least two years away.
I think Aer Lingus would do well to have their lawyers look at some of the posts here given the obvious untruthful agendas being set.
You post a sensationalist headline, then a post advocating that ALT (as its known in Irelands civil service, outside the hopelessly insular aviation world) get together with MOL. You then feign shock at how Ryanair become part of the thread. You were the one who brought them into it.
Then we have Hairy promising an imminent EU ruling when everyone knows the ruling is at least two years away.
I think Aer Lingus would do well to have their lawyers look at some of the posts here given the obvious untruthful agendas being set.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Galway
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
JAS you are partially right. It will be a much leaner operation but I dont see a smaller route network other than a minor reduction on transatlantic operations.
Shannon is likely to be the only one to suffer any cutback in flights, thanks to the magnificent local airport management. What goes around comes around.
Shannon is likely to be the only one to suffer any cutback in flights, thanks to the magnificent local airport management. What goes around comes around.
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Ireland
Age: 37
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
aer lingus
If aer lingus were to use a ground handlling agent how many of their staff would actually work for the handling agent. Not many i should think not only would they be working for servisair or sky handling they would also have to take a huge paycut.
The staff in cork seem to think that the move is a definate, i was speaking to some of them yesterday and they were talking about wearing the servisair uniform and asking about the pay. I work at servisair cork.
The staff in cork seem to think that the move is a definate, i was speaking to some of them yesterday and they were talking about wearing the servisair uniform and asking about the pay. I work at servisair cork.