Network EBA
Is this correct that Qantas want to take pilots to court because they are asking for better than low cost carrier conditions? While they make record profits? Taking pilots to court. Seriously? Shameful. Good luck to those involved. Glad I choose a different path.
Shameful.
Shameful.
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Is this correct that Qantas want to take pilots to court because they are asking for better than low cost carrier conditions? While they make record profits? Taking pilots to court. Seriously? Shameful. Good luck to those involved. Glad I choose a different path.
Shameful.
Shameful.
EK rumours add an interesting twist to the saga.
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The following 3 users liked this post by dejapoo:
Yes, or at least to arbitration. Or they want us to think that’s the case anyway. They probably don’t want any of it but they do want pilots making irrational choices out of fear. Courageous move if they actually want to relinquish control to commissioners who will feel in no way compelled to comply with the Qantas wages policy.
EK rumours add an interesting twist to the saga.
EK rumours add an interesting twist to the saga.
QF are about to see how sticking to their mindless dogma and winning every battle will
be their demise.
The titanic didn’t sink because it hit an iceberg, it sank because it couldn’t change direction.
The following 7 users liked this post by gordonfvckingramsay:
They only need to apply the “BOOT” test vs the award and not against other EAs.
I don’t think it’s quite that simple but happy to be shown how I am wrong;
I don’t think this is for a determination, but for a declaration, correct? With a declaration the commission can
If it does get to a Determination then I think it is a risky call for Qantas.
In my mind the ‘significance of any arrangements or benefits’, and the ‘reasonableness of the conduct ‘ and the ‘ extent that reps have complied with good faith bargaining requirements’ could be viewed in many ways.
For example, how will a Full Bench view the Qantas Groups willingness to allow the contract to languish below the award for so long in light of the recent nationwide sentiment around Qantas and the treatment of employees?
Would a Full Bench consider that the ‘good faith’ requirements have been met? Did the representatives remain communicative and responsive throughout?
It’s a very interesting time politically to be handing any control to the Fair Work Commission.
Can someone confirm that this is just for a declaration and not a determination?
I don’t think this is for a determination, but for a declaration, correct? With a declaration the commission can
specify a post-declaration negotiation period in an intractable bargaining declaration. This allows the Commission to continue to assist parties to resolve the dispute
When making an intractable bargaining workplace determination, the Commission must take into account:
- the merits of the case
- the interests of the employers and employees who will be covered by the determination
- the significance of any arrangements or benefits in an enterprise agreement that applies to the employees and employers immediately before the determination is made
- the public interest
- how productivity in the relevant enterprise(s) might be improved
- the reasonableness of the conduct of the bargaining representatives during bargaining
- the extent that bargaining representatives have complied with good faith bargaining requirements, and
- incentives to continue bargaining at a later time.
For example, how will a Full Bench view the Qantas Groups willingness to allow the contract to languish below the award for so long in light of the recent nationwide sentiment around Qantas and the treatment of employees?
Would a Full Bench consider that the ‘good faith’ requirements have been met? Did the representatives remain communicative and responsive throughout?
It’s a very interesting time politically to be handing any control to the Fair Work Commission.
Can someone confirm that this is just for a declaration and not a determination?
That’s not quite correct : they will apply both the BOOT test and the new FWA Commission no disadvantage “clause” ie “same job and same pay” within an organisation (which Mining Companies are complaining about).
But as in all things to do with Industrial Relations it’s something of a lottery .
But here’s the kicker : Jetstar pay their Airbus pilots at a higher rate and that will be a reference for a Judgement.
QF lawyers will argue it’s different but to a Judge they will have to prove “why” they shouldn’t pay them Jetstar Wages !
VARA (flying the same aircraft) have just concluded completed a new EBA and approved by the FWA over a week ago . Everyone should look at the differences in pay and working conditions and protections (ie one example guaranteed weekend once in every 4 week roster publish). Network have never given their pilots guarantees for a weekend off etc
Lets be clear the current Network Pilot Group should persist to obtain a fair and equitable outcome .
Cheers
Buddy
Hi
That’s not quite correct : they will apply both the BOOT test and the new FWA Commission no disadvantage “clause” ie “same job and same pay” within an organisation (which Mining Companies are complaining about).
But as in all things to do with Industrial Relations it’s something of a lottery .
But here’s the kicker : Jetstar pay their Airbus pilots at a higher rate and that will be a reference for a Judgement.
QF lawyers will argue it’s different but to a Judge they will have to prove “why” they shouldn’t pay them Jetstar Wages !
VARA (flying the same aircraft) have just concluded completed a new EBA and approved by the FWA over a week ago . Everyone should look at the differences in pay and working conditions and protections (ie one example guaranteed weekend once in every 4 week roster publish). Network have never given their pilots guarantees for a weekend off etc
Lets be clear the current Network Pilot Group should persist to obtain a fair and equitable outcome .
Cheers
Buddy
That’s not quite correct : they will apply both the BOOT test and the new FWA Commission no disadvantage “clause” ie “same job and same pay” within an organisation (which Mining Companies are complaining about).
But as in all things to do with Industrial Relations it’s something of a lottery .
But here’s the kicker : Jetstar pay their Airbus pilots at a higher rate and that will be a reference for a Judgement.
QF lawyers will argue it’s different but to a Judge they will have to prove “why” they shouldn’t pay them Jetstar Wages !
VARA (flying the same aircraft) have just concluded completed a new EBA and approved by the FWA over a week ago . Everyone should look at the differences in pay and working conditions and protections (ie one example guaranteed weekend once in every 4 week roster publish). Network have never given their pilots guarantees for a weekend off etc
Lets be clear the current Network Pilot Group should persist to obtain a fair and equitable outcome .
Cheers
Buddy
Is there a way we can sponsor a NAA pilot so they can do longer PIA?
The following 3 users liked this post by 1234fly:
Not a silly question. Didn't NZ ALPA have some sort of 'loan' avalaible to members for such an eventuality once upon a time / still?
I doubt it exists in OZ at the present time, but something to consider for the future?
I doubt it exists in OZ at the present time, but something to consider for the future?
All this goes to show is that the talk of cultural change and a more constructive relationship with the staff from Ms Hudson was just that - talk.
This organisation will take the chance to screw its staff every time.
The attitudes of the Dixon/ Joyce years just keep on keeping on, although I didn’t expect any different.
Best of luck at FWC ladies and gents.
This organisation will take the chance to screw its staff every time.
The attitudes of the Dixon/ Joyce years just keep on keeping on, although I didn’t expect any different.
Best of luck at FWC ladies and gents.
The following 10 users liked this post by DirectAnywhere:
Would a FWC decision of “3% or CPI” result in the other QF Group entities getting the same? Wasn’t that a condition of the wages policy?
That alone would instil fear in the eyes of a QantasLink manager.
That alone would instil fear in the eyes of a QantasLink manager.
Has anyone seen the actual wages policy and all its terms? We know that it involves a pay freeze followed by, now, 3% annual increases but, as far as I’m aware, we don’t know what it says about award or FWC forced pay rises. You get the feeling that it says whatever they want it to say when it suits them, so I have doubts about it triggering group wide pay increases.
Has anyone seen the actual wages policy and all its terms? We know that it involves a pay freeze followed by, now, 3% annual increases but, as far as I’m aware, we don’t know what it says about award or FWC forced pay rises. You get the feeling that it says whatever they want it to say when it suits them, so I have doubts about it triggering group wide pay increases.