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-   -   Monarch Anyone? (https://www.pprune.org/terms-endearment/486524-monarch-anyone.html)

stewiegriffin 13th Jul 2012 14:10

cool thanks for that. When did you guys get your apps in?

greywind 13th Jul 2012 18:47

I put an online application in about a month ago and heard very little. Chased up via email and been told to be patient as they have a lot of applications to work through.

Two guys I know, same airline and base as me at the moment have interviewed and been offered jobs but apparently they had their CVs passed in and didn't do the online application.

Doesn't look hopeful when people are getting job offers and some haven't heard anything. Has anyone who applied online heard anything yet? Yes or no?

tchaikovsky 13th Jul 2012 20:34

Greywind et al,

Don't read too much into people getting offers. It's the way things are done in mon, jobs offered as they go on with the interviews (bit strange, but they are quite set in their ways).

If you meet the minimum requirements I.e. type rated/good T.P. time
then you have a good chance of getting an interview.

Best of luck.

Iver 13th Jul 2012 20:36

Recent A330 Lease Transaction
Mesh and Rhino,

You have said the longhaul fleet is being replaced and that shorthaul will be the focus going forward. And yet Monarch signed an agreement for 2 A330s with Guggenheim Aviation partners yesterday. Will these A330s be used on short-haul sectors or will they continue to be used on longhaul? Very confusing... Are these A330s used to cover existing contracts for a limited time? Any thoughts?

See article about the A330s below:

Guggenheim Aviation Partners Leases Two Aircraft to Monarch Airlines

Press Release: Guggenheim Partners, LLC 23 hours ago

LONDON, July 12, 2012 /PRNewswire/ -- Guggenheim Aviation Partners Limited (GAP), an affiliate of Guggenheim Partners, LLC, today announced the lease of two Airbus A330-200 aircrafts to Monarch Airlines, one of the United Kingdom's largest privately-owned airlines. The leases were concluded last quarter.

"We are extremely delighted to continue our longstanding relationship with Monarch Airlines," said Paul Newrick, GAP's President and Managing Director. "These two Rolls Royce-powered Airbus A330-200 planes are valuable additions to our growing portfolio due to their proven reliability and ever increasing customer base."

Monarch Chairman Iain Rawlinson commented: "The Airbus A330-200 is at the heart of Monarch's long-haul fleet and we are pleased to enter into these long-term leases with Guggenheim Aviation evidencing its confidence in and future commitment to Monarch Airlines."

Monarch Airlines operates a fleet of 32 aircrafts from bases in the UK throughout Europe, North America, Asia and Africa.

mesh 13th Jul 2012 20:50

How long is a piece of string
These are our aircraft, not 2 new. Some will say it's an intention to keep LH and the truth is nobody knows yet. However, the company has stated many times their intention to become sh only. In the short term we need to keep these to maintain mod, hajj etc capability, but I believe over next few years these will disappear...

Direct DIKRO 13th Jul 2012 22:10


Are you saying if you're not type rated they're looking at TP guys and gals next?

TartinTon 13th Jul 2012 22:33

The problem is that the company's in-house tour operator Cosmos seems incapable of competing on the longhaul stage. There is a real opportunity to carve out a significant niche in Goa and Florida but a seeming lack of vision/aspiration/balls in the senior management at Cosmos appears to be holding the company back. The tour operator is in danger of shrinking out of existence as it's only growth source is the airlines scheduled division and at some stage the question will be asked why bother with your own tour operator when there are so many better placed consolidators/OTAs out there?

Iver 14th Jul 2012 00:03

Agreed TartinTon. Mate of mine flew on a Monarch A330 to Sanford a few months back. Aircraft, not surprisingly, was packed to the gills. :D

You would think that Monarch could (if it hasn't already) establish solid, perhaps year-round, business to Sanford, Cancun and Antigua/Barbados using A330s. Probably fill most of those flights - especially the Orlando/Sanford flights. And that excludes popular Goa and Phuket service that could be flown seasonally. So, one would think Monarch probably could support more than 2 A330s on the Atlantic flying once the A300-600Rs are gone - right? Are these routes not profitable for Monarch? Is the intent to eventually drop all longhaul flying? I realise the Florida/Cancun flying is lower margin, but it is pretty stable and consistent in terms of customer year round I would think.

With intense intra-European competition from Easy, Ryanair, Wizz, Vueling, Flybe (E190s), Transavia, Air Berlin, Norwegian (100 737NGs + 100 Neos) and others, I would expect the shorthaul flying to be equal in terms of low margin flying with hyper-competitive pricing (especially to the leisure destinations). Shorthaul flying in Europe could get very ugly quickly in a depressed economy. All of the flying, longhaul and shorthaul, is impacted by economic cycles. So, why give up the consistent and stable Florida/Caribbean flying? Why not stay diversified in terms of types of flying? Why put all of your eggs in the shorthaul basket with so much intra-European competition? Just curious... :confused: Obviously the answers to these questions are probably found with people at far-higher pay grades than mine.. :}:confused::cool:

mesh 14th Jul 2012 07:32

Straight from the top, we have been inundated with guys and girls with to quote 'commercial jet' experience. These will form the major part of the initial interviews. Monarch have and will continue to interview some TP and Military guys to add an extra dimension. I would think the first few courses starting September would be made up of mostly of type rated guys. Further courses consisting of 'other' qualified individuals.

As far as the A330 is concerned the MD has in the past stated you need at least 6 hulls to run any efficient LH program and that's where the problem lies. Monarch have so far failed to find the remaining hulls due to a number of factors, too expensive, wrong configuration etc etc. There are a lot of routes out there that could be good for us but the simple answer is we need to decide whether to invest in the extra hulls. So far and I mean a lot longer than I have been at Monarch this decision has not been made. We have used the A330 and the A300 to pick up a lot of ad hoc work. We are currently bidding to use them on the same sort of work. In all announcements from the management they have stated we are going SH schedule. However with a caveat that we will continue to keep LH in our back pocket, who knows. All I have said and will go onto say is for those joining us. Do not join thinking we will be operating a schedule LH service. As stated earlier you will be flying SH, even if we keep the A330's for the next 6-8 years. We are about to take on upwards of 100 FO's and 40 commands. This expansion is due to us increasing our SH schedule as published. Next announcement I predict will be leasing of around 6 A320 family aircraft. These will some on line next year with the new guys and will cover the new bases. Having said that I could be completely wrong and 4 lovely 330's are making their way to us :)

LHRbound 14th Jul 2012 11:11

That doesn't sound good for me then, as if they were looking at rated guys first, I've missed the cut! I have 3200 total with over 1200 A320 (current) and 1700 B737.

I had hoped to have heard something as flying shorthall UK is my goal, but I guess its not to be at this stage, I just don't know what I am missing CV wise!

mesh 14th Jul 2012 11:54

I wouldn't say that, I think we have only booked one course in September at the moment. These courses will be going into the new year. I know for a fact that guys in interviews next week and week after aren't all type rated. As stated earlier Monarch are not as organised as others in terms of recruitment. If they are interviewing none rated guys this week it doesn't mean they have gone through all the rated. All I meant was of the guys interviewed at the moment, those that have a rating will be on the first course, as you would expect.

Good luck and hang in there

drag king 14th Jul 2012 12:04

Things are moving then, slowly but surely. That is very good in these grim times.

I think I stand (not even a) little chance to be part of this because I am slightly below the 2000TT mark, no-rated and no-airliners experience (even TP) under my belt but dreaming is still free of charge! :)

I have notice that the link in the email I received is not longer working, so I assume it will be kept dormant until they have gone through the 1st batch of application. However I might have to make a change regarding my availability so is there any safe way of doing it? Replying to the workflow email isn't a good idea, me think...

Best luck to those who get the call!

Fansfail 14th Jul 2012 12:31

I'll agree with what Mesh said...

There has been a mix of experience levels that have been interviewed and offered jobs, I'm sure that mix will continue as well. However the majority will probably end up being rated guys with a sprinkling of TP/Mil on top. What the ratios end up being is anyone's guess. As far as I know the first intake in Sept is for rated guys only, the first full type rating course for non TR people being mid to late Oct. Courses will be running one a month ish into next year.

Wasn't there a Monarch holding pool in existence previously? Is there any indication that they have plucked people out of this? Presumably they have if the guys are still about...

LHRbound 14th Jul 2012 12:32

Thanks for the reply MESH, I hope you're right as the more I hear about working for Monarch, the more I would love a shot at gaining that career!

Hope to post some good news on here soon.

RHINO 14th Jul 2012 14:12

Tartin Tom and Iver,

none of what you have suggested has a cat in hells chance of coming to pass as it is uneconomic. Are you suggesting we take over Thomas Cook's business model for long haul operations......

There is a huge difference between crews sitting on the beach for a week thinking what a great and successful company they work for and that same company turning a profit out of a small longhaul operation. Sadly crew are the last people to appreciate the reality.....

Monarch if nothing else is going to be run for a profit otherwise (need a smiley for a coffin!). Those have been somewhat lacking of late and the new head shed have embarked on a course of action to change it.

Personally, I think they are on the right track....

Anyway back to the thread....those that have applied 'good luck' and be patient!

Rushed Approach 14th Jul 2012 16:23

Some advice for applicants, if I may:

1) If you don't get an interview this time, but want to work for Monarch, make sure you always have an up to date CV on file, and that it's not full of typos. If it's older than a year old it is likely to be binned when we next recruit.

2) Dress smartly for the interview, i.e. suit and tie or equivalent

3) Application forms should be legible, and, again, not be full of errors. If a page says "Additional Information", don't leave it blank - this is your chance to distinguish yourself from the competition.

4) Find out about the Company and know why you want to work for us

5) Know the aircraft you fly technically - we'll be asking questions!

All basic stuff, but ignored by many candidates.

We'll be taking on a mix of pilots, some cadets, some type rated and some not type rated/ex-military as we believe this will give us a broad range of aviation and life experiences. We could easily fill all of the places with cadets, or from type rated pilots for that matter with the numbers we have applying, which is now approaching 1000.

HPbleed 14th Jul 2012 17:38

To be honest, if you need to be told to do any of the above you perhaps shouldn't be working for Monarch...

Direct DIKRO 14th Jul 2012 17:48

Great post Rushed Approach,

Just keeping everything crossed, all the interview prep you've mentioned has been done, just need the interview now:sad:

Any further insight into how people are being fished out, are they postal or online applicants or both?

Are there any timeframes before everyone will found out their fate?

Rushed Approach 14th Jul 2012 18:38

For those asking about time to command, the mean average is a little over 6 years historically. This winter's commands will have about 6 years' RHS and this may increase slightly over the next couple of seasons to about 7 (depending on expansion) before dropping right down again when we encounter a three year hiatus of recruitment (08 to 11) and hence gap in the list. So 5-6 years is probably a good ball park to work on for those joining now with the obvious caveat that any plan that extends more than a couple of years into the future in the airline business is one that will be subject to change! In common with most airlines, commands are awarded on length of service then merit, and the Cadet, F/O and Captain pay scales are now based on length of service rather than time in the rank.

Monarch does not in general lose any pilots to TCX, TUI or easyJet, and never has (there has been the odd one or two in unusual circumstances). The few F/Os we do lose tend to go to BA, Virgin, Emirates for those seeking the long haul "tick" and the odd one or two to a "too good to miss" biz jet outfit. Even then, some of them regret the move it would seem!

In terms of long haul, the market is difficult at present - in a recession where do those who started to get used to long haul holidays a few years back resort to when the pay packet gets squeezed? Answer - short haul back to Spain/Turkey/Egypt and the Canaries where they used to go, with a cheaper ticket with more competition on the route and a lot less APD. We will continue to watch the LH market carefully and take advantage of any opportunities that arise. Time to multi-fleet flying (A320/321 and A330) as a new F/O? Assuming we keep the two A330s we have on their current lease, 3-4 years would be a ball park figure in my opinion. Less obviously if the market picks up and the fleet expands.

To Monarch the short haul "basket" is not high risk - where we compete with the likes of easy and Ryanair, and indeed BA, on the same routes we are generally the market leader on that route. Our passengers come back to us with a very high re-booking rate and our load factors have recently hit new highs that other airlines continue to be envious of. The business has recently undergone a complete overhaul and will continue to develop and flourish as a result.

So get your application in! :ok:

BlackandBrown 14th Jul 2012 19:01

This is getting to be like Odysseus and the Sirens. Put wax in your ears!

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