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Things are getting interesting at RYR for Cadets

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Things are getting interesting at RYR for Cadets

Old 6th Mar 2018, 19:17
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: UK, Paris, Peckham, New York
Posts: 8
Will look forward to seeing the pay they are offering, I would hazard a guess they will pay way less than the rating cost over that period, it's how their brains work! and
are still making them become contractors. How can you bond a contractor? now the cadets will not have many expenses to claim of tax man leaving them a very large tax bill having to pay ryr's portion of social security, so no advantage to becoming a contractor.

Why also this arbitrary 5k figure, just make it free! That 5k is rent and food for the cadet, They just can't do nothing for free...like when they give us the free winter jackets but charge us £10 postage...it's in their mentality!

The 5-6month wait to start line training is common at the moment, he pipeline has struggled. Many line trainers quiting, weekly adverts for more line trainer positions at all bases...
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Old 6th Mar 2018, 19:57
  #22 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Netherlands
Age: 12
Posts: 37
Sign a bond, be limited to operate for Ryanair.
On the other hand you are self-employed.

The tax returns will be of interest for the tax authorities around Europe and probably they are rubbing their hands in glee...
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Old 6th Mar 2018, 20:49
  #23 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Netherlands
Age: 12
Posts: 37
Rumour from somebody undergoing training at RYR.

E10 less per hour.

So let’s assume 800 hours per year.
800x E10 = E8000
5 years x E8000 = E40000

Last edited by SanHor; 6th Mar 2018 at 21:14. Reason: Euro sign not working
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Old 6th Mar 2018, 21:37
  #24 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: World
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I heard from a good source that there are no deductions in salary and Cadets will get paid from day 1 of Base Training.
Sounds like a pretty good deal, your training will only cost you 5K and there is a reducing bond of 5 years.
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 06:30
  #25 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 46
Agree with the above... they are not doing this as a genuine gesture to improve the T’s & C’s of the cadets, they really do not operate that way. As has been mentioned they have appalling retention rates for FO’s who rightly realise there are far better options out there. On the surface perhaps better than paying €29,000 Eur upfront but you can guarantee there will be some sort of ‘salary’ sacrifice. I use the term salary loosely as I’m sure these cadets will still be contractors, which is the main major issue in RYR. Get everybody employed on genuine contracts, then I’ll call it a step forward!
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 06:34
  #26 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: in a 5 m/s thermal
Age: 25
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Originally Posted by Skyhigh_ View Post
I heard from a good source that there are no deductions in salary and Cadets will get paid from day 1 of Base Training.
Sounds like a pretty good deal, your training will only cost you 5K and there is a reducing bond of 5 years.

But if you are waiting 5 months till line training you wont get paid during that period right? - as per rumours

So that 1 day salary for the base training, then a wait for almost half a year for the next cent.

That doesnt sound a pretty good deal for me, altough, its great that things are moving this way in this industry - someday they will even buy you your uniform...
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 08:28
  #27 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: France
Posts: 104
Meanwhile :

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/...list-1.3417345

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Old 7th Mar 2018, 08:33
  #28 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Milton Keynes
Posts: 46
Originally Posted by Skyhigh_ View Post
I heard from a good source that there are no deductions in salary and Cadets will get paid from day 1 of Base Training.
Sounds like a pretty good deal, your training will only cost you 5K and there is a reducing bond of 5 years.
i have spoken to the other half and there is no salary reduction, no catches, you are paid exactly the same as normal fo and offered either a Ryanair contract or agency contract at the end of training, the bond is not reducing like APC whereby they take it from salary. You are paid from base training. RYR do not have a problem with applications but a lot of good candidates are missing out because they couldn't afford the type rating. The difference here is that they are paying you during base training and you get a Ryanair contract during trainig which wasnt the case before, basic salary of €21k and €16 psbh once released from safety pilot.
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 12:59
  #29 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: UK
Posts: 15
Originally Posted by jonesyinthesky View Post
i have spoken to the other half and there is no salary reduction, no catches, you are paid exactly the same as normal fo and offered either a Ryanair contract or agency contract at the end of training, the bond is not reducing like APC whereby they take it from salary. You are paid from base training. RYR do not have a problem with applications but a lot of good candidates are missing out because they couldn't afford the type rating. The difference here is that they are paying you during base training and you get a Ryanair contract during trainig which wasnt the case before, basic salary of €21k and €16 psbh once released from safety pilot.
So if you fly about 85 sbh per month it gives you : 1750 € (basic) + 1360 € (16*83) = 3110 € before tax, which would give between 2300 to 2500 € net on a busy month ? If that's correct, that's quite low... If you put it over a 4 year period (before becoming cpt) you will earn much less than what f/o can make now (half less !), even by taking into account the 29,5k type rating. Am I missing something ?
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 13:38
  #30 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Milton Keynes
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Originally Posted by CaptFlyer View Post
So if you fly about 85 sbh per month it gives you : 1750 € (basic) + 1360 € (16*83) = 3110 € before tax, which would give between 2300 to 2500 € net on a busy month ? If that's correct, that's quite low... If you put it over a 4 year period (before becoming cpt) you will earn much less than what f/o can make now (half less !), even by taking into account the 29,5k type rating. Am I missing something ?
no no no, that is just for the 6 month training contract, they weren't paid previously, you then go onto normal rate.

DUB is as follows;
base salary = €25,400
productivity bonus = €6k
sector pay = €37,818
Allowance = €5.5k
Total = €74,718
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 16:45
  #31 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Dublin
Posts: 27
*Possible silly question*

What dictates whether you are offered a RYR contract or McGinley contractor one etc when joining?

Is it simply the company's discretion or based on TR performance/ base you're assigned to or something else?
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 17:13
  #32 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 2,190
jonesyinthesky,

I'm going to guess you are something to do with FR management. Because only FR management count the "allowance" (an amount for stuff you have to pay for - which is paid for by the company in all other airlines) as salary.

And your sector pay? Based on how many hours?
And the productivity bonus? Is that guaranteed, or do you blow it if something outside of your control happens?

And what if you are sent to Poland, rather than DUB?

And why no pay for the 5+ months waiting for line training? Real airlines pay you from completion of the LST.

And why such a crap deal while you are line training? Just an excuse to get a cheap bum in the seat to move the pax like any other pilot

Stinks.
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 18:02
  #33 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Oct 2017
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Originally Posted by HundredPercentPlease View Post
jonesyinthesky,

I'm going to guess you are something to do with FR management. Because only FR management count the "allowance" (an amount for stuff you have to pay for - which is paid for by the company in all other airlines) as salary.

And your sector pay? Based on how many hours?
And the productivity bonus? Is that guaranteed, or do you blow it if something outside of your control happens?

And what if you are sent to Poland, rather than DUB?

And why no pay for the 5+ months waiting for line training? Real airlines pay you from completion of the LST.

And why such a crap deal while you are line training? Just an excuse to get a cheap bum in the seat to move the pax like any other pilot

Stinks.
if you read my previous post you might have noticed my other half works there and i am EX RYR, i fly for another LCC and i am very much enjoying myself at the moment

however, i will forgive your ignorance and tone and answer the following;

there is little variation between bases, i should know, i spent time in WRO, BGY and PSA as part of my command upgrade programme, they couldn't get away with having large salary differences between bases.

they base their sector pay on avg 850 hours per annum, productivity is based on offering to work 3 off days in Nov/Dec

to be fair this is a much better deal than under previous one Mc Ginley contract. Cadets are going to go from not owing close to €30k to only €5k plus they are now earning from base training.

i am more than happy to answer questions and draw upon my RYR experience and inside knowledge but i will not tolerate rudeness.
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 18:24
  #34 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Dublin
Posts: 1
Hi All, please feel free to ask me anything re this programme.
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 18:49
  #35 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Earth
Posts: 156
Originally Posted by jonesyinthesky View Post
never thought i would see this, uncle Mick is subsidising FO type ratings - Christmas has come early if you didn't have money for their type rating, decent deal, €5k up front and not €29,500 payment, just bonded for 5 years - wonder if other LCC will follow suit.

https://careers.ryanair.com/cadets/

there is a video on linkedin as well
Why pay anything? This is the problem with European pilots, you complain about low industry pay but actively take part in P2F....I mean really!!

Stand together and stop this nonsense, show a little patience and have some dignity FFS!!
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 19:42
  #36 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
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Originally Posted by jonesyinthesky View Post
if you read my previous post you might have noticed my other half works there and i am EX RYR, i fly for another LCC and i am very much enjoying myself at the moment

however, i will forgive your ignorance and tone and answer the following;

there is little variation between bases, i should know, i spent time in WRO, BGY and PSA as part of my command upgrade programme, they couldn't get away with having large salary differences between bases.

they base their sector pay on avg 850 hours per annum, productivity is based on offering to work 3 off days in Nov/Dec

to be fair this is a much better deal than under previous one Mc Ginley contract. Cadets are going to go from not owing close to €30k to only €5k plus they are now earning from base training.

i am more than happy to answer questions and draw upon my RYR experience and inside knowledge but i will not tolerate rudeness.
I actually have a question: you seem to be quite happy about the conditions in RYR, but you mention you are EX RYR. Why did you leave then?
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Old 7th Mar 2018, 22:25
  #37 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Milton Keynes
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Originally Posted by eduelp View Post
I actually have a question: you seem to be quite happy about the conditions in RYR, but you mention you are EX RYR. Why did you leave then?

long haul/wide body exp but I will be back, left on good terms, if you leave on good terms and don't abandon your contract etc they will welcome you back, lots of my ex RYR colleagues left on bad terms which in hindsight was slightly foolish because most were Irish and will want to return home to fly one day, with RYR being the only 737 gig in town, some applied to go back but were not successful because of this, one lad I know ended up in far east and is now at Air Baltic but is desperate to come back to UK/Ireland
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Old 8th Mar 2018, 16:20
  #38 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 70
Originally Posted by jonesyinthesky View Post
if you read my previous post you might have noticed my other half works there and i am EX RYR, i fly for another LCC and i am very much enjoying myself at the moment

however, i will forgive your ignorance and tone and answer the following;

there is little variation between bases, i should know, i spent time in WRO, BGY and PSA as part of my command upgrade programme, they couldn't get away with having large salary differences between bases.

they base their sector pay on avg 850 hours per annum, productivity is based on offering to work 3 off days in Nov/Dec

to be fair this is a much better deal than under previous one Mc Ginley contract. Cadets are going to go from not owing close to €30k to only €5k plus they are now earning from base training.

i am more than happy to answer questions and draw upon my RYR experience and inside knowledge but i will not tolerate rudeness.
If you won’t tolerate rudeness, I suggest a return to Ryanair’s style of management might be a bad move for you.
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Old 8th Mar 2018, 17:26
  #39 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 422
Can't see it stemming the tide for a number of reasons. Firstly, the bond is probably not enforceable by EU law and secondly the nature of the type of person who will skip on the bond is that they will soon be out of whatever country they are based in working for a new employer with no forwarding address. A cross border legal action would be a nightmare.
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Old 8th Mar 2018, 20:26
  #40 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: in a 5 m/s thermal
Age: 25
Posts: 41
That sounds good to me
Any figures on the rest? sectors etc, and on the rest of the contract? plus if its before/after tax

I would be so happy if this would be true, altough cant understand that 5000 euros, with the MCC required, but this is not for us to solve anyway

h
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