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Ryanair Cancelling flights!

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Ryanair Cancelling flights!

Old 15th Dec 2017, 13:21
  #1081 (permalink)  
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Having been there some years ago I must say that unless things change drastically since then, I would be most careful until the unions get some meetings with management. Just call me a cynic, but would not trust them as far as I can throw them. Not that strong either.

Merry Christmas to all fellow comrades with joysticks. Lol. Hope Santa delivers better t&c for all.
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 13:42
  #1082 (permalink)  

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Originally Posted by Fergus Kavanagh View Post
No mention of this on the Beeb News website.
Is this really odd, or am I just being paranoid?
Ryanair in union offer to avoid Christmas strikes - BBC News
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 14:08
  #1083 (permalink)  
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Good news . Sets an example to others that it can be done .
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 14:28
  #1084 (permalink)  
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It's very good news for all of us, however think I'd want to see the ink dry on the union recognition agreement before calling off the industrial action.
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 14:32
  #1085 (permalink)  
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RYR did very well out of MON and Air Berlin, 25+ MON pilots and 40 odd Air Berlin which is more than EZY have got across the line, they have had to put on extra training courses and increase SIM capacity to cope with the large numbers!
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 14:35
  #1086 (permalink)  
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and one wonders why they need so many this side of Xmas......
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 15:12
  #1087 (permalink)  
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RYR share price down 7% Contrast the current FR situation with EZ

What might be curious is that ez shares took quite a bump this week, perhaps on the Brexit progress, their AB deal and their apparent success with setting up an OE AOC. Plus their expansion plans and the troubles in RYR. Yet in the past coupe of days ez have slipped back. One would have thought, if ez is succeeding, beneath the scenes, and their main rival is in troubled waters, that ez could be forecast to pick up a lot of disgruntled pax. Remember RYR have already said they will ground ore a/c than originally planned and so less supply in the market.
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 16:07
  #1088 (permalink)  
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I hope it all works out, but seriously, deep down do you really feel this is a serious offer by MOL?

Delay the talks until after X-Mas, massive recruitment drive and then he will get rid of the ones who threatened to strike... this is the most likely outcome.

Hope Iím wrong though!
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 16:09
  #1089 (permalink)  
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MOL is an astute person and he is where he is at the top due to his ability to bargain and to turn things to his advantage.

This "recognition" is a ploy since there are conditions attached in it. What MOL is trying to do is to stun his adversaries with this genius - I'll call it - a stroke since it will lull his opponents in thinking that he has given way and make them think that he's more amenable to "talk".

The worst thing that the pilots can do now is to say "yes, great, we'll talk and we give you the benefit of doubt and think that you are genuine, and we'll postpone the strike". MOL has already averted one in Italy. He'll come with other ploys up to the 20th, and when Xmas is over, he'll start to use delaying tactics to try to get things his own way.

The pressure must be kept and MOL must recognise the countries' unions and the EERC without any conditions. A union can have people from various companies as their members and he can't discriminate by saying that he wants such and such a person in the union.

What he's trying to do - as somebody mentioned in a previous post - is trying to have the control of "this union that RYR will recognise" and that this is just a disguised country ERC.

The only solution to call the strikes off, is for RYR to UNCONDITIONNALLY recognise the unions and the EERC IMMEDIATELY by signing whatever needs to be signed - unions lawyers know what is required to make things legally binding.
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 17:08
  #1090 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by RAT 5 View Post
I suspect there might have been a few major share-holders making whispers. Perhaps other outside agencies as well. Or do people believe this was a real 'Road to Damascus' moment?
I don't believe for a second that MO'L made this call on his own. This announcement has a board of directors' boot prints stamped all over it. It's likely his backside has a couple of boot prints on it as well.
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 17:23
  #1091 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by jonesyinthesky View Post
RYR did very well out of MON and Air Berlin, 25+ MON pilots and 40 odd Air Berlin which is more than EZY have got across the line, they have had to put on extra training courses and increase SIM capacity to cope with the large numbers!
Perspective... EZ are taking 1000 staff from AB alone...albeit not all will be pilots but will certainly be several times the numbers going to FR

FR seem to be on boarding much faster but what does this tell us about FR?
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 20:50
  #1092 (permalink)  
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It ain't sorted yet;

Thanks. I eventually found it under some files in the local planning office on Alpha Centauri.

Check out RTE news for the latest;

Ryanair has told pilot unions it cannot meet their representatives before Wednesday, the day when strikes are scheduled in Ireland and Portugal.
According to union sources, Wednesday's stoppage will not be called off without an initial meeting with Ryanair management taking place.
Sources said the pilots had written to Ryanair after the airline's unprecedented announcement this morning that it was prepared to recognise unions for the first time in its 32-year history in a bid to avert next Wednesday' strike.
In the letter, Impact said it was prepared to meet the company at any time, and preferably today.
However, it is understood that Ryanair management told Impact that it could not schedule a first engagement before Wednesday.
Pilot sources accused the airline of "playing chicken", and warned that the strikes will not be called off without an initial meeting taking place.
In a statement, Ryanair said Impact promised to call off the strike if Ryanair conceded recognition, adding "they've gotten our offer of recognition in writing."
The airline say "the sensible course of action" is for the meeting to take place next Wednesday and for the strike to be called off.

Cute as a box of foxes.
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Old 15th Dec 2017, 22:41
  #1093 (permalink)  
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It's not up to MOL to choose whom he talks to. His pilots choose a union and union reps for him to talk to. He can either talk or not talk and take the consequences. Whether the reps the union sends fly for Ryanair or some other company or are employees of a union (as chief industrial coordinators in VC usually are) is not really his choice or business. That's all just talk to try to portray the union as a plot by other companies to destroy Ryanair.

Unions need to coordinate their talks as he might try to continue trying to divide and conquer during negotiations.

With MOL I wouldn't even rule out asking for RYR employed negotiators to come to the table just to fire them once he has names....

Let's keep our fingers crossed for this to work out and support our RYR brethren in any way we can to raise industry standards for employment.
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Old 16th Dec 2017, 05:37
  #1094 (permalink)  
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First of all good luck to the pilots - I'm with you all the way.

Leopards do not change their spots and I suspect nothing will change till MOL departs.

As Reagan once famously said about the Russians "Trust but verify"!
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Old 16th Dec 2017, 06:58
  #1095 (permalink)  
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Its a step in the right direction and congratulations to former colleagues. One important issue is that the " unions" work in harmony, if different country reps start demanding "local terms" the process will fail, and justifiably so. Unionisation is meant to improve the communication and conditions for the majority not the minority. The value of "other company union reps" is questionable, its your train set and you need to avoid the traditional left wing issues that have been obstacles to progress that are often ingrained in old union practice, its a new dawn, treat it as such and the chances of success are improved. In short, goodwill on both sides!
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Old 16th Dec 2017, 08:58
  #1096 (permalink)  
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It reads to me as though the age-old Ryanair ERC concept is simply being renamed. From now on MO'L and Co. will simply call them unions. No mention of a single pilot union nor anything to do with collective bargaining. In fact, reference is still made to separate representation.
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Old 16th Dec 2017, 10:18
  #1097 (permalink)  
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If RYR pilots achieve Union recognition and enter structured negotiations with RYR it will be a momentous achievement.
All those RYR pilots who had no faith and rushed to sign the pay offer recently to get their hands on a cheap trick...........you should all be humbled , perhaps even a tad ashamed...........the least you could do now is sign up to a union membership and get with the progeamme.
Alas perhaps offer up your ill gotten gains the from the last couple of months to help fund your union ?
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Old 16th Dec 2017, 14:01
  #1098 (permalink)  
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The pilots wanted professional advisors present in their negotiations with management and that they got, as long as those advisers at the table are not currently employed by another airline. Fully understandable since no mgmt want to discuss internal terms with the employees of the competitor. It doesn't say they can't be ex employees, independent advisors or full time employees of a union.

Secondly they wanted to negotiate as a whole pilot body. By negotiating on country basis they are part way there, and again they can use the independent advisors to be present at all the different country negotiations, to create a unified solution.
And the potential risk of firing to they who step forward as union members at the negotiations, can be answered by a united front and further actions, since anything on paper offfer little protection and could easily be bypassed by they who like to delay things through the legal system.

The delay in the start of meetings could be because mgmt want to get in some advisors of their own, since there is little sign of them having any experience of actually negotiating with a proffesional union. Or maybe put together a new negotiating team altogether, without so much historical mediapublished baggage.
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Old 16th Dec 2017, 15:18
  #1099 (permalink)  
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Strike to go ahead unless Ryanair meet union beforehand

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Old 16th Dec 2017, 16:21
  #1100 (permalink)  
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not sure i follow this strategy. if Ryanair has offered the pilot unions talks on recognition (at last) to avert strike action. No one knows where these talks will lead yet and clearly it could be the airline simply buying a few weeks time. However, in this time surely the unions will grow stronger now that the momentum is with the pilots. carrying out strike action until a meeting seems odd. No employer is accept a huge list of demands before talks begin. if Ryanair have completely betrayed their pilots on recognition talks, they will realise any action next will be a lot more widespread.
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