easyjet basing policy
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[QUOTE=Norman Stanley Fletcher]
...easyJet is probably one of the most genuine 'equal opportunities' employers in the world. That means that nationality, race, sex or religion gets you no advantages or favours ahead of someone else. We have people at all levels in the company who represent every colour and creed...
Oh beautiful, how political correct. You get another three points extra !
I definitely support Cuffio, when he is more or less asking for some more fairness:
At another place, we also read about easy being an "european" airline, so that nationality does not count ! ?
and from above that easy is the equal opportunities player in the game.
But how does this fit with the mandatory start at an english base . . . not to forget that you will all your time keep a "nominated" or "original" home base, which will be by definition an english one ! ?
Also, what does it mean that you have this great opportunity (within the equal opportunity) to be at home every night - when you have to leave your real home for a far away so called home base, and never get back ? ? ?
F a i r in this sense would mean that, of course, you have to take up the next open position - wherever it is (not mandatory in England) and thereafter, when bases become available, that people being really "at home" at that place will be given some kind op chance (maybe 50% or so)
Keep in mind, this story about "You are at home every night" is only for cost saving - and not to give crews a better lifestyle at Waikiki Beach
Fair means that, of course, nobody at any base would be replaced "only because of some local guys". Everyone has the "priority" to stay where he is (or she).
But for new positions or even new bases, it would be fair to consider crews originating from this area in a "fair" percentage as well as "lifestylers" (sorry for that, I don't mean anyone personally).
Then, and only then, this a.m. phrase would be given a chance to become true: you are "at home" every night.
Otherwise, it is pure cynism.
By the way, all this has nothing to do with "favours" for some nationalities - it would simply be "fair" and equal opportunity
Happy landings so far
...easyJet is probably one of the most genuine 'equal opportunities' employers in the world. That means that nationality, race, sex or religion gets you no advantages or favours ahead of someone else. We have people at all levels in the company who represent every colour and creed...
Oh beautiful, how political correct. You get another three points extra !
I definitely support Cuffio, when he is more or less asking for some more fairness:
At another place, we also read about easy being an "european" airline, so that nationality does not count ! ?
and from above that easy is the equal opportunities player in the game.
But how does this fit with the mandatory start at an english base . . . not to forget that you will all your time keep a "nominated" or "original" home base, which will be by definition an english one ! ?
Also, what does it mean that you have this great opportunity (within the equal opportunity) to be at home every night - when you have to leave your real home for a far away so called home base, and never get back ? ? ?
F a i r in this sense would mean that, of course, you have to take up the next open position - wherever it is (not mandatory in England) and thereafter, when bases become available, that people being really "at home" at that place will be given some kind op chance (maybe 50% or so)
Keep in mind, this story about "You are at home every night" is only for cost saving - and not to give crews a better lifestyle at Waikiki Beach
Fair means that, of course, nobody at any base would be replaced "only because of some local guys". Everyone has the "priority" to stay where he is (or she).
But for new positions or even new bases, it would be fair to consider crews originating from this area in a "fair" percentage as well as "lifestylers" (sorry for that, I don't mean anyone personally).
Then, and only then, this a.m. phrase would be given a chance to become true: you are "at home" every night.
Otherwise, it is pure cynism.
By the way, all this has nothing to do with "favours" for some nationalities - it would simply be "fair" and equal opportunity
Happy landings so far
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[QUOTE=silverfox6]
Not true, plenty of guys joined at a European base from day 1...
Originally Posted by Norman Stanley Fletcher
But how does this fit with the mandatory start at an english base . . .
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Gee Silverfox6, don't hold back. Tell us what you really think!
Looks like someone has missed out on their (european) base of choice and is having a real whinge. You need to check your facts before you start shooting your mouth off. It is fairly obvious you don't know the first thing about the EJ basing policy for new joiners or current employees because by your definition of FAIR
EJ meets your test.
Once you are in you get preference over the new joiners as to base and you can join the queue at any time. Just put your towel down, save your space and wait your turn like everyone else.
If you don't like it don't sign the contract, stop whinging and find a job in the country that you want to live in (if you can) without having a go at a company that provides employment for a significant amount of flight crew throughout Europe, without prejudice.
Looks like someone has missed out on their (european) base of choice and is having a real whinge. You need to check your facts before you start shooting your mouth off. It is fairly obvious you don't know the first thing about the EJ basing policy for new joiners or current employees because by your definition of FAIR
F a i r in this sense would mean that, of course, you have to take up the next open position - wherever it is (not mandatory in England)
Once you are in you get preference over the new joiners as to base and you can join the queue at any time. Just put your towel down, save your space and wait your turn like everyone else.
If you don't like it don't sign the contract, stop whinging and find a job in the country that you want to live in (if you can) without having a go at a company that provides employment for a significant amount of flight crew throughout Europe, without prejudice.
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[QUOTE=silverfox6]
One assumes you meant the British Isles when you said England as you were referring to the Islands off the coast of Europe.
There are bases in Scotland & Northern Ireland that took in new joiners and both areas are definitely not English.
Proud to be British.
Originally Posted by Norman Stanley Fletcher
But how does this fit with the mandatory start at an english base . . . not to forget that you will all your time keep a "nominated" or "original" home base, which will be by definition an english one ! ?
(not mandatory in England)
(not mandatory in England)
There are bases in Scotland & Northern Ireland that took in new joiners and both areas are definitely not English.
Proud to be British.
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silverfox6 - I realise that English is not your first language, and I therefore assume you have not understood what has already been written. At the risk of repeating myself, no one at easyJet gets any advantage whatsoever from being of a particular nationality. That is FAIR - not some half-baked scheme to put those with vested interests ahead of everyone else in the queue. I am delighted to see that this is how easyJet operates - it is transparent and should be even more so in the future. There is no doubt that in the past the transfer list was set in concrete - but the concrete remained wet! I believe in recent times that has been less of the case - although undoubtedly defficiencies still exist. This is yet another advantage of a strong BALPA.
Also, regarding your statement that easyJet has a policy of 'mandatory start at an English base' - you are totally wrong. If you take a job with easyJet you go where the vacancies are - that may be an English, Scottish, Irish, French, German or Italian base. If that happens to be somewhere in England then that is where you will go. Inevitably, with so many bases in England, the statistical chances are that you will go there but that is not guaranteed. As a new starter you should go right to the bottom of the pile - that is FAIR. You then take your turn and wait for a vacancy at your chosen base. The more popular bases will be over-subscribed, so you may have to wait a long time for the base of your choice such are the laws of supply and demand. If you do not like the system you should not join - it is clear and unambiguous what the deal is.
Also, regarding your statement that easyJet has a policy of 'mandatory start at an English base' - you are totally wrong. If you take a job with easyJet you go where the vacancies are - that may be an English, Scottish, Irish, French, German or Italian base. If that happens to be somewhere in England then that is where you will go. Inevitably, with so many bases in England, the statistical chances are that you will go there but that is not guaranteed. As a new starter you should go right to the bottom of the pile - that is FAIR. You then take your turn and wait for a vacancy at your chosen base. The more popular bases will be over-subscribed, so you may have to wait a long time for the base of your choice such are the laws of supply and demand. If you do not like the system you should not join - it is clear and unambiguous what the deal is.
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Fair basing policy?
NSF is quite correct when he states that no one is given preference come nationality and bases with easyjet.
But I do beg to differ with his and bloggs2`s statements where they state:"you sign on to the list, you wait your turn and when your number is up, you will be at your base of choice.
For quite some time, I was top of the list for my preferred base.
New joiners, both rated and non-rated, became accepted ahead of me for over 6 months. Numerous calls and queries were made to the people in charge, but every time there was a different excuse.
The only sensible option was to find employment elsewhere.
We were quite a few who left the last 2 years due to this complete mismanagment of base allocations.
And managment wonder why turnover is high?
But I do beg to differ with his and bloggs2`s statements where they state:"you sign on to the list, you wait your turn and when your number is up, you will be at your base of choice.
For quite some time, I was top of the list for my preferred base.
New joiners, both rated and non-rated, became accepted ahead of me for over 6 months. Numerous calls and queries were made to the people in charge, but every time there was a different excuse.
The only sensible option was to find employment elsewhere.
We were quite a few who left the last 2 years due to this complete mismanagment of base allocations.
And managment wonder why turnover is high?
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BLE, you have my deepest sympathies at the corrupt and unfair treatment you received. I would not disagree with any of your statements, but I do belive that what I have said is correct in that this is what occurs now. It is most unfortunate that others like yourself had to suffer because of someone else's misguided efforts to look after a mate or whatever, but we should nonetheless rejoice at the considerable progress that has been made since your departure. The issue of new joiners being given preference over current employees has been a totally unacceptable feature of life at easyJet for years - hence my previous reference to things being set in the concrete but the concrete remains wet! Nonetheless, in recent times the shambles of the Transfer List, which was open to overt abuse, has been gradually attacked and what we have now is more transparent. Personally, I would feel considerably happier if both the Transfer and Command lists were available on the intranet, and people could then know exactly where they were on their respective lists. This would remove any doubt as to whether a 'slight of hand' may have taken place - because in the past it certainly did. Nevertheless, this is the classic advantage of a strong BALPA who can hammer away, bit by bit, and sort out the inequalities of life which ultimately make people leave.
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Thank you NSF, and I`m happy for you and all my friends at ej that flight ops managment has changed to the better.
It looks like rosters are improving as well, just hope BALPA can push hard enough for some proper pension agreements.
Until then, ej will remain a stepping stone for most young pilots and a nice, but hard, retirement job for ex-BA pilots.
I enjoy my present company a lot, we have an excellent rosters and leave policy, good pension and skilled managment. Having to ride right seat for quite some time again is probably the only drawback, but in the grand scheme of things, completely acceptable.
Good luck at making ej a career airline, you should try to make your way into managment!
It looks like rosters are improving as well, just hope BALPA can push hard enough for some proper pension agreements.
Until then, ej will remain a stepping stone for most young pilots and a nice, but hard, retirement job for ex-BA pilots.
I enjoy my present company a lot, we have an excellent rosters and leave policy, good pension and skilled managment. Having to ride right seat for quite some time again is probably the only drawback, but in the grand scheme of things, completely acceptable.
Good luck at making ej a career airline, you should try to make your way into managment!
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Basing policy
[QUOTE=Norman Stanley Fletcher]silverfox6 - I realise that English is not your first language, and I therefore assume you have not understood . . .
Pretty arrogant, isn't it ?
For you (and maybe some others) once again the official basing policy - as drawn from EasyJet website
OK, I have to admit I made a mistake by taking "England" for "UK".
sorry for that.
Our basing policy
All easyJet flight-crew are employed on UK contracts and are assigned a permanent UK base.
Where crews are ultimately based outside of the UK, it is on a ‘seconded’ basis.
These are the facts. So, I really would like to know, what I did not "understand" ! ?
Maybe you just did not even think about my arguments a split of a second.
UK is UK and not Europe - also when we talk about contracts and bases and so on
And for foreigners UK still is not "at home". . .
Pretty arrogant, isn't it ?
For you (and maybe some others) once again the official basing policy - as drawn from EasyJet website
OK, I have to admit I made a mistake by taking "England" for "UK".
sorry for that.
Our basing policy
All easyJet flight-crew are employed on UK contracts and are assigned a permanent UK base.
Where crews are ultimately based outside of the UK, it is on a ‘seconded’ basis.
These are the facts. So, I really would like to know, what I did not "understand" ! ?
Maybe you just did not even think about my arguments a split of a second.
UK is UK and not Europe - also when we talk about contracts and bases and so on
And for foreigners UK still is not "at home". . .
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silverfox
you seem most unhappy about all sympathetic comments regarding your predicament, so I conclude that you are not after sympathy from this forum.
The many contributors, to a greater or lesser extent, have tried to sympathise and let you know what they think / know.
A good deal of individuals in the UK (apparently not part of Europe!) are not based at their 1st, 2nd, or 3rd choice of base living hundreds of miles away from their homes and families. Some get home as much as those who live in Holland, France, Germany etc (Europe!).
If all you can do in reply is attack those who offer you help then perhaps you should either go on a CRM course or do someting else!
Get a Grip!
you seem most unhappy about all sympathetic comments regarding your predicament, so I conclude that you are not after sympathy from this forum.
The many contributors, to a greater or lesser extent, have tried to sympathise and let you know what they think / know.
A good deal of individuals in the UK (apparently not part of Europe!) are not based at their 1st, 2nd, or 3rd choice of base living hundreds of miles away from their homes and families. Some get home as much as those who live in Holland, France, Germany etc (Europe!).
If all you can do in reply is attack those who offer you help then perhaps you should either go on a CRM course or do someting else!
Get a Grip!
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Silverfox6, you really need to take a pill. You have the first line of the basing policy correct.However it would be possible to get a European base on first joining but only if the transfer list for that base was empty and no-one already in the company was waiting to go there. I stand to be corrected by others with more knowledge of this than myself (which wouldn't be hard). The whole uk contracts and seconded stuff sounds like legalese to me, and probably has something to do with EJ being a UK company. If you bothered to read a bit further the web site went on to explain...
Which I think is pretty self expanatory and also fair for a company of EJ's size. I don't know what else can be said to you, apart from if you can't figure it out from this then you are reading it the way you want it to be for some reason.
Enough said...
It may not always be possible to offer you your preferred choice of base when you first join easyJet. You will however be able to apply for a transfer once your initial base has been allocated.
Our base allocation system works in the following way:
During your selection you will be asked for your base preferences which, if you are successful, will be added to our training plan
Approximately one month prior to the start of your training course, base vacancies are made available to the recruitment team
Your base preferences will be considered against this information and, where possible, a base will be allocated to you that matches one of your choices
Of course we cannot guarantee that your initial base will be one of your preferences.
You will receive a letter detailing your allocated base approximately one calender month prior to the start of your course, at which time, if necessary, you will be able to apply, via email, to your Base Captain for a change.
Your name will then be added to the transfer list which works on a (strictly) first-come, first-served basis. As soon as a vacancy arises at the base of your choice, and you are next in line, you will be offered the chance to move.
We endeavour to ensure that our current pilots will always have their first choice of base before external candidates are considered
Our base allocation system works in the following way:
During your selection you will be asked for your base preferences which, if you are successful, will be added to our training plan
Approximately one month prior to the start of your training course, base vacancies are made available to the recruitment team
Your base preferences will be considered against this information and, where possible, a base will be allocated to you that matches one of your choices
Of course we cannot guarantee that your initial base will be one of your preferences.
You will receive a letter detailing your allocated base approximately one calender month prior to the start of your course, at which time, if necessary, you will be able to apply, via email, to your Base Captain for a change.
Your name will then be added to the transfer list which works on a (strictly) first-come, first-served basis. As soon as a vacancy arises at the base of your choice, and you are next in line, you will be offered the chance to move.
We endeavour to ensure that our current pilots will always have their first choice of base before external candidates are considered
Enough said...
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Silverfox6 - my quote about English not being your first language was a polite way of telling you that you are making problems when there are none. Bloggs2's last post plus the stuff already written seem crystal clear to me.
Let's try again. You go wherever easyJet send you when you join the company. Once you start work for easyJet you apply for the base you really want to be at. You are then given a number on a Transfer List. You position on the Transfer List is solely based on the date you asked for a transfer and is not dependent on your sex, nationality, religious beliefs, political affiliation or the school your dad went to. When your turn comes, and a vacancy appears at the base of your choice, you go and work there. It really is very straight forward.
My best advice to you is not to apply.
Let's try again. You go wherever easyJet send you when you join the company. Once you start work for easyJet you apply for the base you really want to be at. You are then given a number on a Transfer List. You position on the Transfer List is solely based on the date you asked for a transfer and is not dependent on your sex, nationality, religious beliefs, political affiliation or the school your dad went to. When your turn comes, and a vacancy appears at the base of your choice, you go and work there. It really is very straight forward.
My best advice to you is not to apply.
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Silverfox6, may I ask who sucked the jam out of your donut???..
The policy stated on the website is pretty much just that, a statement.
ej managment do what they need to, because they can. Somtimes their actions are contrary to their statements, welcome to aviation!
I second NSF, don`t apply.
If you`re already inside, get out or get quiet.
The policy stated on the website is pretty much just that, a statement.
ej managment do what they need to, because they can. Somtimes their actions are contrary to their statements, welcome to aviation!
I second NSF, don`t apply.
If you`re already inside, get out or get quiet.
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Originally Posted by BLE
Silverfox6, may I ask who sucked the jam out of your donut???..
=
=
I see no reason for words used as by BLE.
Does not give a "brilliant view" of EZY pilots. Or do we communicate as pilots like this??
SILVERFOX, I would not try to join EZY with your expactations!
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Originally Posted by Kraut
Well, this thread is gettig personel. SILVERFOX obviously has a different view. WE tried to explain. He does not accept our view.
I see no reason for words used as by BLE.
Does not give a "brilliant view" of EZY pilots. Or do we communicate as pilots like this??
SILVERFOX, I would not try to join EZY with your expactations!
I see no reason for words used as by BLE.
Does not give a "brilliant view" of EZY pilots. Or do we communicate as pilots like this??
SILVERFOX, I would not try to join EZY with your expactations!
Obviously these guys forgot what this thread was about: the idea or question of "cuffio", if homers should be given some preference against lifestylers (or whatever). Why the hell should this idea not be reasonable, at least to talk about ?
I simply did not like the tenor of some of these "answers" - which were pretty "nose high".
The best of all is NSF, who always gives lectures - instead of contributing to the DISCUSSION. Then, he calls me "unable to understand" - and finally calls himself "polite" for doing so.
That's not amusing at all.
It is also funny to hear that e.g. bloggs2 takes my pointing on the "given rules" regarding contracts and bases as some legal stuff only. . . Interesting that the contractual status is "only" something legal you don't have to consider - or what ?
And because of that, Silverfox is totally wrong, aha !
(so why did they stress all these political phrases like "European company", when it is in fact and at the end of the day straight forward UK?)
I would really recommend NSF + others to sit down and think about the matter of a DISCUSSION and not continously and simply teach about and praise their published rules in every possible detail.
...and of course, not to call anybody who has a different OPINION a sick person.
that's also not amusing
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Kraut, I think you will find BLE's quote was meant to be a simile/metaphor (its in the dictionary) as to silverfox's outlook on this particular discussion. It doesn't read as a personal attack, nor is this. By the way, I wish my German was as good as both your and silverfox's English!
Silverfox, read Kraut's post again, he isn't agreeing with you, just expressing surprise at the tone of the disagreement as he understood it. I tried to explain that the basing policy isn't as UK centred as you perceive it to be, and overall it has evolved into something a lot better than it was and reasonably fair to all. You obviously don't want to see it as such, so i can agree to disagree, if you can.
For others interested in this topic it isn't as bad as it is portayed by some. It isn't perfect, but once you are in you just have to wait in line for the base of choice to come up.
Silverfox, read Kraut's post again, he isn't agreeing with you, just expressing surprise at the tone of the disagreement as he understood it. I tried to explain that the basing policy isn't as UK centred as you perceive it to be, and overall it has evolved into something a lot better than it was and reasonably fair to all. You obviously don't want to see it as such, so i can agree to disagree, if you can.
For others interested in this topic it isn't as bad as it is portayed by some. It isn't perfect, but once you are in you just have to wait in line for the base of choice to come up.
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Originally Posted by bloggs2
Kraut, I think you will find BLE's quote was meant to be a simile/metaphor (its in the dictionary) .
Hm, looking in my dictionary ( an ordinary one) I do not find that wording used by BLE in any context at all.
If I should be wrong, I stand corrected. Just dont like "unfriendly words" in discussions, also contrary.
But the main point still is valid:
EZY basing policy is: join the que!
(a policy, which is however obviously not quite transparent to everybody!?)
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Kraut
The word that bloggs2 was refering to that is in the dictionary was simile/metaphor.
The phrase "who took the jam out of your donut" is not rude, it is basically saying, "calm down, why are you so upset?"
SW
The word that bloggs2 was refering to that is in the dictionary was simile/metaphor.
The phrase "who took the jam out of your donut" is not rude, it is basically saying, "calm down, why are you so upset?"
SW