Easy - Pay Rise
Join Date: Nov 2005
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I shall be joining EZ soon and so I am watching the current negotiations carefully.
I would like to make one small point, I can see that the current offer is a disappointment but predicting that little can be won from the management through this process will only serve to lower our expectations, and this diminishes our negotiating position. We would serve ourselves better by being positive and hopeful, supporting the negotiating team and encouraging membership of BALPA.
I look forward to flying with you.
I would like to make one small point, I can see that the current offer is a disappointment but predicting that little can be won from the management through this process will only serve to lower our expectations, and this diminishes our negotiating position. We would serve ourselves better by being positive and hopeful, supporting the negotiating team and encouraging membership of BALPA.
I look forward to flying with you.
Join Date: Aug 2002
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Got the F*****G mail today!!! COMPLETE B******T!!!
Its all been said here by the last posters and Ive said it before- NOW IS THE TIME TO JOIN!!!! SPREAD THE WORD IN THE CREWROOMS!!!
/CP
Its all been said here by the last posters and Ive said it before- NOW IS THE TIME TO JOIN!!!! SPREAD THE WORD IN THE CREWROOMS!!!
/CP
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: East Sussex England
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TRon,
Many congrats on rejoining BALPA. I share your thoughts on BALPA, although as you say, the new CC, appear to be doing a great job. It has never been more important to be a member of BALPA.
If MS and co want to know about cost savings, perhaps they could start with aircraft registrations. Why pay extra for an out of sequence allocation, ending in a jumped up manager's initials. Call that cost saving?. I could give them a very long list!.
Having just experienced the worst and most exhausting summer of my entire 18 year Commercial Aviation Career, I am appalled and enraged at this pathetic derisory offer. It was bad enough receiving JP'S diatribe, but this absolutely takes the biscuit.
It is time to unite and stand firm. We will no longer accept the cheapening of our once great profession.
What will you say next time you are expected to go into discretion. I for one know what I will say............
Many congrats on rejoining BALPA. I share your thoughts on BALPA, although as you say, the new CC, appear to be doing a great job. It has never been more important to be a member of BALPA.
If MS and co want to know about cost savings, perhaps they could start with aircraft registrations. Why pay extra for an out of sequence allocation, ending in a jumped up manager's initials. Call that cost saving?. I could give them a very long list!.
Having just experienced the worst and most exhausting summer of my entire 18 year Commercial Aviation Career, I am appalled and enraged at this pathetic derisory offer. It was bad enough receiving JP'S diatribe, but this absolutely takes the biscuit.
It is time to unite and stand firm. We will no longer accept the cheapening of our once great profession.
What will you say next time you are expected to go into discretion. I for one know what I will say............
Join Date: Apr 2002
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TRon, jeez man, you are only whinging in the cruise;christ what do you guys do on turnarounds,taxy,take-off,climb,descent approach&landing? You gotta get a lot more productive if you wanna compete in the whinging-wars with us in RYR! Seriously though all the best from the"other team", if you get somewhere I suspect the "Dublin Dragons" might sense a quelling of the flames is in order,to the benefit of all.Ever the optimist.
Last edited by captplaystation; 15th Nov 2005 at 20:59.
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Hi minclean...
All I can say is get out while you still can....You might benifit from reading the post about Easy MXP...Norman Stanley Fletcher is describing the situation in EJ to the point. You should also read the letter that our Flt Ops Director wrote to all the pilots in LGW.
There are bits of it in the thread above.
You can really tell by the tone in your mail that you dont know what company your joining!
I am also encouraging to join BALPA and I am already a member.
Happy job hunting....
All I can say is get out while you still can....You might benifit from reading the post about Easy MXP...Norman Stanley Fletcher is describing the situation in EJ to the point. You should also read the letter that our Flt Ops Director wrote to all the pilots in LGW.
There are bits of it in the thread above.
You can really tell by the tone in your mail that you dont know what company your joining!
I am also encouraging to join BALPA and I am already a member.
Happy job hunting....
Join Date: Nov 2002
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MS Letter... What a JOKE!!!
Is this guy realy serious???????????
We must NEVER accept different payscale according to base as this is the open door to the explosion of our T&C.
We get paid for the job we do NOT for the place we live!!!!!!!!
At least they admit that we have the worst management in this industry (that's what I understood reading his comments on how well we perform compared to BA and Ryan). So enough with all those new management positions, manager of this, manager of that, manager of fuelsaving project,.... there will be soon more manager than pilots in this company!
They start putting pressure on us again with this disgutting offer, so I hope we will be putting pressure on them as well when it will be time to vote,as I wish to see two questions in the ballot:
1-shall we accept the management offer?
2-are you ready to take action if the management doesn't change his attitude and come with a decent proposition?
But are the pilots in this company ready to stand up and say "enough!!"????
From a disgussed pilot.....
Wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiings
We must NEVER accept different payscale according to base as this is the open door to the explosion of our T&C.
We get paid for the job we do NOT for the place we live!!!!!!!!
At least they admit that we have the worst management in this industry (that's what I understood reading his comments on how well we perform compared to BA and Ryan). So enough with all those new management positions, manager of this, manager of that, manager of fuelsaving project,.... there will be soon more manager than pilots in this company!
They start putting pressure on us again with this disgutting offer, so I hope we will be putting pressure on them as well when it will be time to vote,as I wish to see two questions in the ballot:
1-shall we accept the management offer?
2-are you ready to take action if the management doesn't change his attitude and come with a decent proposition?
But are the pilots in this company ready to stand up and say "enough!!"????
From a disgussed pilot.....
Wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiings
Join Date: Jul 2005
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Hi Guys and Girls!
As a fellow ezy pilot and BALPA member I've been reading with interest the current developments. It is with concern however, that I see that some of our distinguished colleagues aspire to a meagre 3.5% and 3% salary/pension increase. WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
We are one of the most productive pilot workforces on earth. Why o why should we be paid less than the likes of BA, Britannia or Virgin (who actually achieve less flying in a year)?
And why should we accept an insulting company pension contribution of even 10% of basic. I for one actually want to be able to retire without having to supplement my pension by working as the local village gardener in my 'Golden Years'.
If virgin didn't aim high during their negotiations they wouldn't have achieved such a result.
COME ON LETS AIM HIGHER GUYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
P.S This is not greed this is common sense. The cost of living in this country has gone through the roof in the past few years, whilst wages have stayed pretty much static. I just want a decent standard of living. The ability to actually afford to buy a decent house would be a good start.
As a fellow ezy pilot and BALPA member I've been reading with interest the current developments. It is with concern however, that I see that some of our distinguished colleagues aspire to a meagre 3.5% and 3% salary/pension increase. WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
We are one of the most productive pilot workforces on earth. Why o why should we be paid less than the likes of BA, Britannia or Virgin (who actually achieve less flying in a year)?
And why should we accept an insulting company pension contribution of even 10% of basic. I for one actually want to be able to retire without having to supplement my pension by working as the local village gardener in my 'Golden Years'.
If virgin didn't aim high during their negotiations they wouldn't have achieved such a result.
COME ON LETS AIM HIGHER GUYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
P.S This is not greed this is common sense. The cost of living in this country has gone through the roof in the past few years, whilst wages have stayed pretty much static. I just want a decent standard of living. The ability to actually afford to buy a decent house would be a good start.
Join Date: Jul 2005
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I resigned from BALPA after joining the company, after seeing it as a toothless organisation, that was more management than the management ...
.... the worm has turned it seems, I eat humble pie to the current CC and fall on my sword.
I will rejoin today, and offer my support while still looking for pasture new.
5/2/5/4, loss of leave, JP's letter, payrise, MS's letter.... too much.
I would like to support Mailibu77 proposal, a mere 3% is not a start.
Incremental Pay
Pay Rise
Medical Health
FO's not treated as second class citizens
Removal of 5254
More leave
Pension
As has been stated we are in this position due to poor management, so stop paying their bonus and get rid of the 'Orange loonies' in their short trousers and get real buisness men.
Ģ2 extra per pax is nothing, yet according to MS letter would increase our profit by 117%... amazing.
We do not want to to see our company fall, but they expect Gold from their employees and repay with sh1t.
Go for it BALPA.
.... the worm has turned it seems, I eat humble pie to the current CC and fall on my sword.
I will rejoin today, and offer my support while still looking for pasture new.
5/2/5/4, loss of leave, JP's letter, payrise, MS's letter.... too much.
I would like to support Mailibu77 proposal, a mere 3% is not a start.
Incremental Pay
Pay Rise
Medical Health
FO's not treated as second class citizens
Removal of 5254
More leave
Pension
As has been stated we are in this position due to poor management, so stop paying their bonus and get rid of the 'Orange loonies' in their short trousers and get real buisness men.
Ģ2 extra per pax is nothing, yet according to MS letter would increase our profit by 117%... amazing.
We do not want to to see our company fall, but they expect Gold from their employees and repay with sh1t.
Go for it BALPA.
From the middle of the letter:
Loyalty bonus proposal: "ALL flight crew to share in the profit achieved above plan".
From the earlier part of the letter: "we will not be meeting the planned results for the 2005 financial year".
And they expect us to give away the loyalty bonus for a scheme that hinges on meeting a planned profit that they decide?
For the record, our profits this year are still forecast to be greater than last year.
Loyalty bonus proposal: "ALL flight crew to share in the profit achieved above plan".
From the earlier part of the letter: "we will not be meeting the planned results for the 2005 financial year".
And they expect us to give away the loyalty bonus for a scheme that hinges on meeting a planned profit that they decide?
For the record, our profits this year are still forecast to be greater than last year.
Join Date: Jul 2005
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It is with concern however, that I see that some of our distinguished colleagues aspire to a meagre 3.5% and 3% salary/pension increase. WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I would be happy to take the above figures. Anymore and you may start to lose my support.
I'd consider any pay rise more than 4.1% (top level of settlement this year according to BALPA) to be greedy.
3% on pension would be fine with me with a view to increasing it at next years negotiation. It is a marathon, not a sprint.
I'd be more than happy to discuss with management the removal of the loyalty bonus for incremental payscales that were the equivalent of th loyalty bonus or better and were also applied to FO/SFO.
I'm willing to stand up and be counted but if your demands are unreasonable then you lose my support.
Join Date: Jul 2001
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Regarding the loyalty bonus, no one should countenance signing up to the company-proposed scheme. You have to remember that you are dealing with people who are openly stating their intention to reduce salary levels in the long term. As sure as night follows day, the only absolute certainty is that we will never meet the required levels to receive the big payouts - and the company knows it! The present loyalty bonus is the 'crown jewels' of our current pay deal - the only downside being that our FOs no longer receive it. I was delighted to note BALPA's hard line on the subject - any future agreement must benefit all pilots and not just the captains.
This is the best opportunity we have ever had to ensure that all easyJet pilots, particularly those overseas who may in the past have seen BALPA as a 'British' thing, join together to win this battle. This is not about a pile of left-wing losers trying to bring down their company - it is about hard-working, conscientious employees fighting to save their futures from unscrupulous and uninspiring individuals who would leave them in the street with nothing. The tragedy is that easyJet could be the best shorthaul airline in Europe if we had the right people running it. And by best I mean the most profitable plus offering terms and conditions that are the envy of the rest of the profession. We are here to make easyJet work - and that means working for both the shareholders (of whom I am one) and the employees (of whom I am also one). The only way that this will be achieved is by 80%+ membership of BALPA. Every single pilot at easyJet who has the remotest interest in the future of their company should join up today.
This is the best opportunity we have ever had to ensure that all easyJet pilots, particularly those overseas who may in the past have seen BALPA as a 'British' thing, join together to win this battle. This is not about a pile of left-wing losers trying to bring down their company - it is about hard-working, conscientious employees fighting to save their futures from unscrupulous and uninspiring individuals who would leave them in the street with nothing. The tragedy is that easyJet could be the best shorthaul airline in Europe if we had the right people running it. And by best I mean the most profitable plus offering terms and conditions that are the envy of the rest of the profession. We are here to make easyJet work - and that means working for both the shareholders (of whom I am one) and the employees (of whom I am also one). The only way that this will be achieved is by 80%+ membership of BALPA. Every single pilot at easyJet who has the remotest interest in the future of their company should join up today.
Join Date: Feb 2004
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malibu 77 and flyingorange have got it spot on...
Rik Binson, I do not the see that us asking to have our T+Cs increased to reflect our importance in this company as greed. The company is low cost, I am not....neither is my mortgage, my car, my kids or the missus!!!!!
We work bloody hard for this company, it would not make a penny without us, lets all back BALPA to get us what we deserve. We should be pushing as hard as we possibly can to make sure that get what we are worth.
to quote flying orange
Incremental Pay
Pay Rise
Medical Health
FO's not treated as second class citizens
Removal of 5254
More leave
Pension
All of these matters need addressing and they need addressing now. I am actively seeking other employment but I want to be able to vote yes to a package that reflects the worth of the EZY pilot community.
Rik Binson, I do not the see that us asking to have our T+Cs increased to reflect our importance in this company as greed. The company is low cost, I am not....neither is my mortgage, my car, my kids or the missus!!!!!
We work bloody hard for this company, it would not make a penny without us, lets all back BALPA to get us what we deserve. We should be pushing as hard as we possibly can to make sure that get what we are worth.
to quote flying orange
Incremental Pay
Pay Rise
Medical Health
FO's not treated as second class citizens
Removal of 5254
More leave
Pension
All of these matters need addressing and they need addressing now. I am actively seeking other employment but I want to be able to vote yes to a package that reflects the worth of the EZY pilot community.
Join Date: Jun 2005
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Guys, we are all on the same side singing the same tune just in different key. Lets just get everyone together behind the CC, for once they are standing firm. They have my support and I'm sure will get the best deal they can for us.
Viva la revolution
Viva la revolution
Last edited by nimrod42; 16th Nov 2005 at 16:19.
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A couple of points: firstly at the 2004 pay talks, much time was spent working out alternatives to the Loyalty Bonus, which the company has stated openly it wants to get rid of. While it may not cost the company a great deal now, there is a whole wedge of pilots soon to complete 5 years of service, and a smaller amount not far off ten. The reason given was that it goes against the company ethos, i.e. If the company only makes Ģ1 profit, we get our bonus. The company wanted to make it a function of profit, and it was during this time the management admitted it was trying to cut costs so we knew that whatever formula for profitsharing we agreed, it was going to mean less money eventually and that was why no changes to the current system were ever introduced. It needed to be visible, because nobody trusts the management, and based on factors we could control. Sounds pretty much like the deal they are trying to put on the table now, and the current CC are rejecting them for exactly the same reason. Everything they do is about cost cutting, but have let 280 pilots in three years slip through their fingers, one has to wonder where all this is going.
One has also to remember the great Australian pilots dispute of 1989 as there are lessons to be learnt here as well. The pilots of 4 Domestic Airlines helped the management stem pay rises for many years during the tough 1980's because they said they could not afford it; the AFAP agreed to help but with the proviso that when things got better, their wages would catch up to where they were. That was a promise. When, in 1989, the pilots wanted to see their money, this had gone on for so long that the claim was for 30% to which the airline management then totally reneged on their promise despite the goodwill of the pilots. The rest is history but the lesson, as Virgin pilots learnt recently, is that when they say"They cannot afford it," means they do not want to afford it and if the pilots let the management of easyJet off the hook right now when a big pay rise is owed, then their chance to restore our wages will be gone forever.
One has also to remember the great Australian pilots dispute of 1989 as there are lessons to be learnt here as well. The pilots of 4 Domestic Airlines helped the management stem pay rises for many years during the tough 1980's because they said they could not afford it; the AFAP agreed to help but with the proviso that when things got better, their wages would catch up to where they were. That was a promise. When, in 1989, the pilots wanted to see their money, this had gone on for so long that the claim was for 30% to which the airline management then totally reneged on their promise despite the goodwill of the pilots. The rest is history but the lesson, as Virgin pilots learnt recently, is that when they say"They cannot afford it," means they do not want to afford it and if the pilots let the management of easyJet off the hook right now when a big pay rise is owed, then their chance to restore our wages will be gone forever.
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Hi Guys
Just wondering what the lowdown is for the proposed differing pay scales for euro bases.
Is this speculation or based on fact and does it apply to the regional UK bases or just new euro bases?
I'm joining in December as a DEP in a regional base and whilst my contract reflects a common UK salary level, I'm just wondering if there are plans afoot that will affect me on promotion to LHS - ie new local contracts.
By the way, count me in on BALPA. I'm not militant but fair Ts&Cs isn't too much to ask for and in my experience, once given away, terms will be extremely difficult to win back.
I'm packing in a very good job to join Easy and I'm wondering in with my eyes wide open. For me, it's the regional base that attracts due to new arrival in family and reappraisal of priorities. However, it shouldn't be necessary to have inferior local terms, they open these bases because they make money - as soon as they don't they're closed.
I've had bad experiences of BALPA in the past - it was the most expensive bloody diary I've ever owned, but it seems the company has left you nowhere to go but down the route of collective representation. We know we can't be greedy - it's a cut throat business and the industry history is peppered with now defunct or struggling airlines that upheld "dreamland" terms for too long. But l agree with just keeping things fair and in line with industry norm.
It's common and easy for bean counters and pilots who've gone to the "Dark Side" to look at the Pilots salary bill and choose it as the first port of call in cost cutting excercises. But airlines are unique in that you will rarely, if ever, find so many similarly professionally qualified people on a single payroll. The fact is aircraft don't fly themselves(thank God) - they require a number of professionally qualified individuals to operate and lets make no bones about it - they operate currently at a profit. I am not in the least bit uneasy with earning the salary I do. No one gave me my licence, I worked bloody hard and made a lot of personal and financial sacrifices to get it - as have all of us. But the fact remains that it is a PROFESSION and not just a job and the package should always reflect this.
Anyway, rant over. I'm not aboard yet but nevertheless, would like to offer my support to the CC at this time.
Look forward to flying with you all
Just wondering what the lowdown is for the proposed differing pay scales for euro bases.
Is this speculation or based on fact and does it apply to the regional UK bases or just new euro bases?
I'm joining in December as a DEP in a regional base and whilst my contract reflects a common UK salary level, I'm just wondering if there are plans afoot that will affect me on promotion to LHS - ie new local contracts.
By the way, count me in on BALPA. I'm not militant but fair Ts&Cs isn't too much to ask for and in my experience, once given away, terms will be extremely difficult to win back.
I'm packing in a very good job to join Easy and I'm wondering in with my eyes wide open. For me, it's the regional base that attracts due to new arrival in family and reappraisal of priorities. However, it shouldn't be necessary to have inferior local terms, they open these bases because they make money - as soon as they don't they're closed.
I've had bad experiences of BALPA in the past - it was the most expensive bloody diary I've ever owned, but it seems the company has left you nowhere to go but down the route of collective representation. We know we can't be greedy - it's a cut throat business and the industry history is peppered with now defunct or struggling airlines that upheld "dreamland" terms for too long. But l agree with just keeping things fair and in line with industry norm.
It's common and easy for bean counters and pilots who've gone to the "Dark Side" to look at the Pilots salary bill and choose it as the first port of call in cost cutting excercises. But airlines are unique in that you will rarely, if ever, find so many similarly professionally qualified people on a single payroll. The fact is aircraft don't fly themselves(thank God) - they require a number of professionally qualified individuals to operate and lets make no bones about it - they operate currently at a profit. I am not in the least bit uneasy with earning the salary I do. No one gave me my licence, I worked bloody hard and made a lot of personal and financial sacrifices to get it - as have all of us. But the fact remains that it is a PROFESSION and not just a job and the package should always reflect this.
Anyway, rant over. I'm not aboard yet but nevertheless, would like to offer my support to the CC at this time.
Look forward to flying with you all
Join Date: Mar 2004
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Profit related bonuses in easyjet to all but those at the top are worthless. They massage the figures to make your potential bonus look good, then talk it all away with orange b###sh#t. Replacing the current scheme with anything related to profit will cost us dearly.
I'd love to know also where they are getting their pilot attrition rates from...must that other Easyjet over on planet Orange where the weather is always CAVOK.
Easyjet is very short of pilots. The recruitment market is good and lots of guys are leaving. We should have the upper hand here. Lets make it count..into BALPA now guys. This has to be the time. The guys in Europe they need to be in too.
I'd love to know also where they are getting their pilot attrition rates from...must that other Easyjet over on planet Orange where the weather is always CAVOK.
Easyjet is very short of pilots. The recruitment market is good and lots of guys are leaving. We should have the upper hand here. Lets make it count..into BALPA now guys. This has to be the time. The guys in Europe they need to be in too.
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Spread the word, get recruiting - BALPA needs you now!!
We need to stop this B*&llsh!t in its tracks. Year after year, time after time our Terms & Conditions are eroded - Now the company want our European Brethren to become second class citizens - what next? Different rates for regional UK bases - that's what's been implied. To all the ezyPilots in France and Germany (and soon Italy), join BALPA and help us fight this and win for ourselves a package comparable with the likes of Thompsonfly & Virgin. It's no coincidence that the airlines with the best conditions have a huge percentage of Union membership. Should we be prepared to park the Jets if needs be? Time will tell!
We need to stop this B*&llsh!t in its tracks. Year after year, time after time our Terms & Conditions are eroded - Now the company want our European Brethren to become second class citizens - what next? Different rates for regional UK bases - that's what's been implied. To all the ezyPilots in France and Germany (and soon Italy), join BALPA and help us fight this and win for ourselves a package comparable with the likes of Thompsonfly & Virgin. It's no coincidence that the airlines with the best conditions have a huge percentage of Union membership. Should we be prepared to park the Jets if needs be? Time will tell!
If you are an easyJet pilot reading this thread and not yet a BALPA member, JOIN NOW.
The fight is now on and we have a cc with courage and conviction who need your support.
Click here
The fight is now on and we have a cc with courage and conviction who need your support.
Click here