Easy - Pay Rise
Join Date: Sep 2003
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I agree with Malibu77; if we are joining massively Balpa and giving part of our salaries to a trade union, we must be properly represented and get something out of this negotiation; the management is starting very low for giving up peanuts in time; They think that the workforce is going to be happy and that we have achieved something, for exemple a payrise of 2.5% instead of 2.1% as they generously offered.
However, I believe that we should ask for much more than that in order to catch up with the rest of the industry
Pension 15%;
Pay rise minimum 7%;
Sector allowances increased;
crew food and money back;
proper staff travel, stby ticket or reasonnable price for crew;
5/4 5/4;
no division and no different contracts between bases;
and that is a minimum!
at least we fight for something
However, I believe that we should ask for much more than that in order to catch up with the rest of the industry
Pension 15%;
Pay rise minimum 7%;
Sector allowances increased;
crew food and money back;
proper staff travel, stby ticket or reasonnable price for crew;
5/4 5/4;
no division and no different contracts between bases;
and that is a minimum!
at least we fight for something
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: East Sussex England
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Malibu 77, I think you are spot on. The only item that you missed, was that of pay for positioning and delayed duties following discretion/delays. At the moment we receive sweet FA. Cabin crew are paid for positioning!.
Perhaps it would be better to have Flight duty pay per hour. Seemed to work well at my previous airlines.
Great to see from the company BALPA site that people are joining/rejoining in droves. Many congrats to all that have.
MANAGEMENT- WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE, OR PREPARE FOR A SHOWDOWN. WE HAVE ALL HAD ENOUGH.
Join Date: Sep 2003
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All EZY colleagues > Let's stop moaning here and all join BALPA (at least for a couple of month to get the vote)!
If we have the percentage that e.g. Virgin had we are in a position to make all the above stated ideas and opinions change more into reality.
Come on, Let's JOIN!!!!!
If we have the percentage that e.g. Virgin had we are in a position to make all the above stated ideas and opinions change more into reality.
Come on, Let's JOIN!!!!!
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Malibu 77, you are absolutely right!!!
Just missed out on the seniority list. As easyjet still are taking DEC, with so many well qulified FOs and already tested.
We need to make easyjet see that NO DEC can join the company aslong as there is a waiting list!!!! This is not negotiable!!!
Other than that the demands that Malibu 77 stated are spot on. If the company wants to play hardball lets show them what its all about!!!!
Go for it or happy jobhunting!!!!
Just missed out on the seniority list. As easyjet still are taking DEC, with so many well qulified FOs and already tested.
We need to make easyjet see that NO DEC can join the company aslong as there is a waiting list!!!! This is not negotiable!!!
Other than that the demands that Malibu 77 stated are spot on. If the company wants to play hardball lets show them what its all about!!!!
Go for it or happy jobhunting!!!!
Join Date: Jun 2001
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It's so nice to see that, after 4 years of trying, the message is finally getting through. The only way to get what we need is with mass support - and hopefully that's where we're heading now.
No doubt there will still be a few who will sit it out waiting for a good result saying, as ever, that they will only join when Balpa produces the goods.
Fortunately, they are in the minority - Fantastic!
No doubt there will still be a few who will sit it out waiting for a good result saying, as ever, that they will only join when Balpa produces the goods.
Fortunately, they are in the minority - Fantastic!
Join Date: Mar 2004
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Forget not that many of are now actively steering people towards BALPA. In return results will be required and I don't mean 2.5% and getting back the weeks leave they robbed. Its time to send a big Wake-Up call round the orange hut.
Join Date: Apr 2002
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Don't think of getting more than a 3.5% increase in pay and 3% in pension.
Methinks that is just about the best we can expect from the company.
In order for more La La Land wants different payscales for Europe, they made that very clear.
I agree with the above stated sentiments but also be realistic about it all. 5254 is probably here to stay, no private healthcare expected. LoL insurance will be revised and bettered.
If you think that BALPA will only settle for 5454 pvt healthcare 15% pension and 7% pay increase you are very much mistaken.
Methinks that is just about the best we can expect from the company.
In order for more La La Land wants different payscales for Europe, they made that very clear.
I agree with the above stated sentiments but also be realistic about it all. 5254 is probably here to stay, no private healthcare expected. LoL insurance will be revised and bettered.
If you think that BALPA will only settle for 5454 pvt healthcare 15% pension and 7% pay increase you are very much mistaken.
Join Date: Jul 2001
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There's money in them thar hills! There is money there to give 'thems and such as thems' a big bonus - there is plenty of money there to pay us!
I agree that greed would be our downfall but the reasonable pay demands as put forward by BALPA could and should be achieved this time round. As others have said before - this is a marathon and not a sprint. In the same way that our managers have badly misunderstood what they can get away with, we must be careful we do not do the same. The company has stirred up such a hornets' nest that they must act quickly to sort this mess out. Fortunately there is still time left for them to bring out a sensible offer that will make the pilots pull back from the brink. What we must not do is put forward such a ludicrous demand that will make the company feel that they have no option but to fight it out. Both sides need a way out and it is vital we leave the management a little space to manoeuvre in. I believe the current BALPA claim is about right and that is where we should be aiming.
Once again, to all those waverers out there - join up now to have your say in your future. There is a battle raging for the future of easyJet and we need your support to ensure that BALPA carries the day. Join up today!
I agree that greed would be our downfall but the reasonable pay demands as put forward by BALPA could and should be achieved this time round. As others have said before - this is a marathon and not a sprint. In the same way that our managers have badly misunderstood what they can get away with, we must be careful we do not do the same. The company has stirred up such a hornets' nest that they must act quickly to sort this mess out. Fortunately there is still time left for them to bring out a sensible offer that will make the pilots pull back from the brink. What we must not do is put forward such a ludicrous demand that will make the company feel that they have no option but to fight it out. Both sides need a way out and it is vital we leave the management a little space to manoeuvre in. I believe the current BALPA claim is about right and that is where we should be aiming.
Once again, to all those waverers out there - join up now to have your say in your future. There is a battle raging for the future of easyJet and we need your support to ensure that BALPA carries the day. Join up today!
Reality check.
UK industrial law works thus:
If the Union asks for the moon on a stick, e.g. 15% payrise plus a bucket of frills and benefits. Then the company at the end of the negotiation phase will ask for Binding Arbitration administered by the folks at ACAS. This means someone independent of the company and the union gets to choose the winning negotiation position.
If the Union has asked for a moon on a stick then the Company offer will be selected. No arguments - its legally binding.
If you ignore the request for Binding Arbitration then you had better have your legal ducks in a row, a very high and very committed union memebership and a willingness to take the company to the brink.
Just as we all know that lay enthusiasts know little about being a commercial pilot so the average pilot knows little about industrial negotiation and trade union law.
Cheers
WWW
UK industrial law works thus:
If the Union asks for the moon on a stick, e.g. 15% payrise plus a bucket of frills and benefits. Then the company at the end of the negotiation phase will ask for Binding Arbitration administered by the folks at ACAS. This means someone independent of the company and the union gets to choose the winning negotiation position.
If the Union has asked for a moon on a stick then the Company offer will be selected. No arguments - its legally binding.
If you ignore the request for Binding Arbitration then you had better have your legal ducks in a row, a very high and very committed union memebership and a willingness to take the company to the brink.
Just as we all know that lay enthusiasts know little about being a commercial pilot so the average pilot knows little about industrial negotiation and trade union law.
Cheers
WWW
Join Date: Nov 2005
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...me smells a wee weasley manager!!!
there are two sides to every dispute. Who said ' the moon on stick' was required.....
A set of reasonable and fair proposals that is what is being asked for, to bring us further up the food chain in return for our productivity increase and still leaves us behind the top runners.
Multiple contracts leads to division and therefore salaries can then be reduced as required, unopposed.
There is little doubt that 5 2 5 4 is unrealistic and this needs to be addressed.
It is time to get the whole package sorted out, now the 'your lucky to have a job' climate is over.
ACAS or not, planes dont move on their own, let us hope it does not come to that.
Arbitartion is the last chapter in a long process and many airlines will be looking at how this ends up.
A clear show of unity opposed to this is what is needed.
Join Balpa now.
there are two sides to every dispute. Who said ' the moon on stick' was required.....
A set of reasonable and fair proposals that is what is being asked for, to bring us further up the food chain in return for our productivity increase and still leaves us behind the top runners.
Multiple contracts leads to division and therefore salaries can then be reduced as required, unopposed.
There is little doubt that 5 2 5 4 is unrealistic and this needs to be addressed.
It is time to get the whole package sorted out, now the 'your lucky to have a job' climate is over.
ACAS or not, planes dont move on their own, let us hope it does not come to that.
Arbitartion is the last chapter in a long process and many airlines will be looking at how this ends up.
A clear show of unity opposed to this is what is needed.
Join Balpa now.
Join Date: Jul 2005
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Good points well made, particularly by WWW - we do need to keep this thread balanced. I would be the first to admit that my working knowledge of industrial law is not up to much.
However, I do not feel any of the more demanding requests made on this thread equate to the ‘moon on a stick’. We have to remember that we are pretty much the hardest working short haul operator in the UK (not sure about the rest of Europe though). Why should we earn significantly less per hour than many of our competitors? To me we are in a strong position.
To say the least we should accept is around 7% seems on the low side. I would argue that if our productivity has gone up by 8% (we need proof obviously) and inflation is around 3%, then to brake even we need 11%. We do not want to brake even.
WE NEED TO REVERSE THE ROT.
If easyjet can’t afford to pay the workforce market rate, then there is a serious problem with easyjet. We are not low cost pilots!
Join Now.
However, I do not feel any of the more demanding requests made on this thread equate to the ‘moon on a stick’. We have to remember that we are pretty much the hardest working short haul operator in the UK (not sure about the rest of Europe though). Why should we earn significantly less per hour than many of our competitors? To me we are in a strong position.
To say the least we should accept is around 7% seems on the low side. I would argue that if our productivity has gone up by 8% (we need proof obviously) and inflation is around 3%, then to brake even we need 11%. We do not want to brake even.
WE NEED TO REVERSE THE ROT.
If easyjet can’t afford to pay the workforce market rate, then there is a serious problem with easyjet. We are not low cost pilots!
Join Now.
Join Date: Jan 2003
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Reality check
'No one in Lalaland has received the letter the Cockpit crews received last week...mmmhhh wonder why??'
Probably because they're not cockpit crews.
They've also bee told that there are no pay increaeses from now on. Join the company on £15k, stay on £15k. So theoretically that means in ten years time Smith in accounts will still be on £15k. Understand? So don'yt give all your latte bllx, at least theres something on the tabl;e for you to fightover
Probably because they're not cockpit crews.
They've also bee told that there are no pay increaeses from now on. Join the company on £15k, stay on £15k. So theoretically that means in ten years time Smith in accounts will still be on £15k. Understand? So don'yt give all your latte bllx, at least theres something on the tabl;e for you to fightover
Join Date: Jun 2005
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Then corner maybe it's time everyone made a stand. Believe me the pigs will still have their snouts in the trough.
Yes we should have a significant pay increase but we must set our sights on what the union's original benchmark was, I think it will be difficult for the union to change their negociating position now. Anything other than that is tempting disappointment - which it shouldn't.
What has been asked for is reasonable and affordable. Once this pay round is sorted then we look to resolve the problems of 5254 and others. BMI Baby seem to have that approach. A strong union membership that each year brings the standards up rather than at Easy where things are eroded.
As we are making roughly the same profit as last year it would be interesting to see what bonuses the directors paid themselves. I am sure they will do so again this year. Maybe it will be a question for our lords and masters when interviewed about the companies results about how an industrial dispute with the pilots will affect the future share price?
Yes we should have a significant pay increase but we must set our sights on what the union's original benchmark was, I think it will be difficult for the union to change their negociating position now. Anything other than that is tempting disappointment - which it shouldn't.
What has been asked for is reasonable and affordable. Once this pay round is sorted then we look to resolve the problems of 5254 and others. BMI Baby seem to have that approach. A strong union membership that each year brings the standards up rather than at Easy where things are eroded.
As we are making roughly the same profit as last year it would be interesting to see what bonuses the directors paid themselves. I am sure they will do so again this year. Maybe it will be a question for our lords and masters when interviewed about the companies results about how an industrial dispute with the pilots will affect the future share price?
RW et al had an annual percentage payrise on their basic salary (in the last accounts). This was between 14% and 16%, and was decided by an group of people who carefully analysed the performance of the company.
Can we have just half of that?
And WHY do FO's earn less sector pay than cabin crew? WHY are there 3 pay scales for SFO's (£42k, £40k, £35k)?
WHY do cabin crew get positioning pay and we don't?
I am stuck on the £35K scale. I have £65k to pay off and each year I get a bonus of a bag of arse wipes or a book and a pen. My pension will mature at £9.8k a year. My holiday has gone from 5 blocks of 6 days to 4 blocks of 5 days. I will work right through Christmas and New Year. If I worked for TFly I'd earn £7k more, or maybe £12k more at First Choice.
I have no life outside work.
Sort it now, eJ, or I'll have to join a proper airline. I have Airbus and Boeing, and no bond.
Can we have just half of that?
And WHY do FO's earn less sector pay than cabin crew? WHY are there 3 pay scales for SFO's (£42k, £40k, £35k)?
WHY do cabin crew get positioning pay and we don't?
I am stuck on the £35K scale. I have £65k to pay off and each year I get a bonus of a bag of arse wipes or a book and a pen. My pension will mature at £9.8k a year. My holiday has gone from 5 blocks of 6 days to 4 blocks of 5 days. I will work right through Christmas and New Year. If I worked for TFly I'd earn £7k more, or maybe £12k more at First Choice.
I have no life outside work.
Sort it now, eJ, or I'll have to join a proper airline. I have Airbus and Boeing, and no bond.
Join Date: Jun 2000
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Would a modest pay rise and a move towards 4on 4off go down well?Benefit of reducing "sickness" and reduction of high days.
In addition to sector pay, an introduction of hourly rate. This will cover delays and promote a slightly more relaxed view to discretion.The pension will never be up with BA or Tfly even if we get 30% but a company increase would be something. I would rather have the option to have it in my salary.
What we need to find is an offer that potenially costs the Co as little as pos and benefits us hugely. Otherwise we will end up with naff all.
In addition to sector pay, an introduction of hourly rate. This will cover delays and promote a slightly more relaxed view to discretion.The pension will never be up with BA or Tfly even if we get 30% but a company increase would be something. I would rather have the option to have it in my salary.
What we need to find is an offer that potenially costs the Co as little as pos and benefits us hugely. Otherwise we will end up with naff all.
I don't think small tweaks will make any difference. We, as pilots, have to decide whether or not eJ is a "career" airline. Does it show signs now of being fair and equitable in the future?
Or is eJ just a "stepper". Because if it is, we as pilots must jump ship earlier rather than later (owing to seniority in other airlines).
It's as simple as that. And I've not decided yet, and I suspect many others are also looking at this process and will be making their minds up too.
Or is eJ just a "stepper". Because if it is, we as pilots must jump ship earlier rather than later (owing to seniority in other airlines).
It's as simple as that. And I've not decided yet, and I suspect many others are also looking at this process and will be making their minds up too.
Join Date: Jul 2005
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I agree with 'The Discretion Gimp'. It has to cost the company as little as possible.
In that light perhaps due to the tax break we get with our sector pay we should go for a significant increase in this at the expense of basic. Also, the idea of an hourly rate seems a good one.
Perhaps BALPA should rethink its position. There seems a great deal of unification and support for a big push on this current round of negotiation (amongst us lot that’s fairly rare phenomenon!).
In that light perhaps due to the tax break we get with our sector pay we should go for a significant increase in this at the expense of basic. Also, the idea of an hourly rate seems a good one.
Perhaps BALPA should rethink its position. There seems a great deal of unification and support for a big push on this current round of negotiation (amongst us lot that’s fairly rare phenomenon!).
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Ever thought about the letter of MS as a helping hand to us, written by him like that on purpose? You know, being an "ex-pilot comrade" 
and knowing about good union representation.....(BA)
Good points well made and I think BALPA has got it right with what they are proposing to the company. Time will tell!
and knowing about good union representation.....(BA)Good points well made and I think BALPA has got it right with what they are proposing to the company. Time will tell!