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Nice to see you were shafted the other day.
You and Flaps1 should still resign.
As long as you two clowns are involved with BALPA myself and many others wont rejoin.
Please stop being a tourist and leave MY country.
You and Flaps1 should still resign.
As long as you two clowns are involved with BALPA myself and many others wont rejoin.
Please stop being a tourist and leave MY country.
Last edited by mjenkinsblackdog; 23rd Nov 2003 at 18:07.
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Flaps,
I admire your efforts on behalf of all the pilots at Easy but I think you should be on the other side of the table! Last year's deal was pretty poor and resulted in numerous resigations from BALPA.
Examples were...
1. Reduced salary for the first six months in command
2. Reduced sector pay
3. Paying for crew food
It just didn't look good to me and showed BALPA to be pretty poor value for money. There are lots of people in the company who have had bad experiences with BALPA and THAT is why you only have 50% of the pilots in the union. I wasn't prepared to keep paying to have a deal like last year's recommended to me.
I know it would have been a lot worse without BALPA but I'm afraid you let them get away with far too much - especially where F/Os were concerned.
I admire your efforts on behalf of all the pilots at Easy but I think you should be on the other side of the table! Last year's deal was pretty poor and resulted in numerous resigations from BALPA.
Examples were...
1. Reduced salary for the first six months in command
2. Reduced sector pay
3. Paying for crew food
It just didn't look good to me and showed BALPA to be pretty poor value for money. There are lots of people in the company who have had bad experiences with BALPA and THAT is why you only have 50% of the pilots in the union. I wasn't prepared to keep paying to have a deal like last year's recommended to me.
I know it would have been a lot worse without BALPA but I'm afraid you let them get away with far too much - especially where F/Os were concerned.
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Flaps thingy
As I said when BALPA wanted us all to vote for their recognition we were told that BALPA would look after us all. As you now say, you won't represent non members at disciplinaries. Shame on you all - your word is about as reliable as anything that comes from orangeland.
On the FTL debate, if it is all going so well perhaps it would be helpful then if you cut and pasted the latest bits from your own BALPA chat website. Thats were the news of disappointment comes from.
Stop doing a JP style spin on PPUNE
As I said when BALPA wanted us all to vote for their recognition we were told that BALPA would look after us all. As you now say, you won't represent non members at disciplinaries. Shame on you all - your word is about as reliable as anything that comes from orangeland.
On the FTL debate, if it is all going so well perhaps it would be helpful then if you cut and pasted the latest bits from your own BALPA chat website. Thats were the news of disappointment comes from.
Stop doing a JP style spin on PPUNE
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cosmo MJBD and Mac
It sure is easy to critisise but what is the alternative you are offering to hving these guy negotiate on your behalf. You have left BALPA (or not joined) either because you are too tight to pay the fee or you believe no negotiation is necessary and you would accept whatever the company offers....or is there some other conclusion I am missing??? Please explain?
Does your lack of membership mean that in the future the BALPA pilots comittee (incl. Flaps and The colonel) will no longer exist and we will all somehow be better off? Is that how your protest works or do you just post here to let of steam and not really mean any of it?
I am trying to make some sensible conclusion as to how you think it should work. What is it you want and how do you propose we get it? Why is it that after all this time in the company you have not managed to motivate others to your cause in sufficent numbers to oust the incumbents?
Rejoin (or join), get together support for your ideas and I for one will certainly vote you in to sort it out if you can provide some evidence that you can produce a better result than the guys who are busting their collective arses for you at present.
In the meantime I thank my lucky stars that someone was there last year to stop it from being worse than it was.
NG
PS Thanks to the colonel for the tax savings over the last 4 years, must certainly amount to more than I have ever paid to BALPA.
It sure is easy to critisise but what is the alternative you are offering to hving these guy negotiate on your behalf. You have left BALPA (or not joined) either because you are too tight to pay the fee or you believe no negotiation is necessary and you would accept whatever the company offers....or is there some other conclusion I am missing??? Please explain?
Does your lack of membership mean that in the future the BALPA pilots comittee (incl. Flaps and The colonel) will no longer exist and we will all somehow be better off? Is that how your protest works or do you just post here to let of steam and not really mean any of it?
I am trying to make some sensible conclusion as to how you think it should work. What is it you want and how do you propose we get it? Why is it that after all this time in the company you have not managed to motivate others to your cause in sufficent numbers to oust the incumbents?
Rejoin (or join), get together support for your ideas and I for one will certainly vote you in to sort it out if you can provide some evidence that you can produce a better result than the guys who are busting their collective arses for you at present.
In the meantime I thank my lucky stars that someone was there last year to stop it from being worse than it was.
NG
PS Thanks to the colonel for the tax savings over the last 4 years, must certainly amount to more than I have ever paid to BALPA.
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Engee,
Well I knew I'd get a response like yours. I did say if you read my post that it would certainly have been a lot worse without BALPA. I just find it hard to pay money to an organisation which RECOMMENDS I take a pay cut for the first six months in command! Of course nobody on the council gave a stuff about that one because it didn't affect them. It's not the money it's the principle. It's a shame there isn't an alternative as I think there was a little too much self interest going on last year (anyone over 60?)
It's not about being tight - it's about expecting the union to stop things like those that were recommended last year even getting to the table. I don't pay subs to unions to negotiate pay cuts for me - simple as that. At the end of the day I'll vote with my feet if ever get to that stage but at the moment I'm happy to be getting what I came here for.
Well I knew I'd get a response like yours. I did say if you read my post that it would certainly have been a lot worse without BALPA. I just find it hard to pay money to an organisation which RECOMMENDS I take a pay cut for the first six months in command! Of course nobody on the council gave a stuff about that one because it didn't affect them. It's not the money it's the principle. It's a shame there isn't an alternative as I think there was a little too much self interest going on last year (anyone over 60?)
It's not about being tight - it's about expecting the union to stop things like those that were recommended last year even getting to the table. I don't pay subs to unions to negotiate pay cuts for me - simple as that. At the end of the day I'll vote with my feet if ever get to that stage but at the moment I'm happy to be getting what I came here for.
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Engee,
As you know I was a member .
Right up until Klinky ,MAlooney ,and the bakers boy.
Suggested we should agree on the previous deal.
Myself and many others voted NO.
Klinky himself said,What a great deal it was at the time.
Thats why I have no faith in the above right now.
You may remember I was strongly opposed to accepting the plan.
I even told ***** to keep his nose out of it at the time of acceptance when letters were going around the crew rooms.
The present people you have representing you are well below standard to make a dent in improving our position.
You need a Duncan Smith style revote of your reps OR the new negiotiating will be a complete Waste of time.
Think About it.
You need a more aggresive team to do the job to make any impact.
Preferably just Trade unionists NOT pilots.
Therefore insuring against double deals and back room favours.
If you remember RYANAIR very nearly had a strike a few years back.
At the last hour the little paddy ran down the stairs and sorted a 5 year plan with SHARES.
Even MOL knows you cant run an airline without PILOTS.
Once you have a serious 5 year deal on the table including Shares or a Bonus scheme with PROPER ROSTERING and increment salary increases,plus an increase in pension contribution.
Once you are actually proposing such a deal!
You would have higher numbers in BALPA.
Not before!
Mr MaLooney cant even tell you what is being proposed!
How in gods name does he expect us all to rejoin!
As you know I was a member .
Right up until Klinky ,MAlooney ,and the bakers boy.
Suggested we should agree on the previous deal.
Myself and many others voted NO.
Klinky himself said,What a great deal it was at the time.
Thats why I have no faith in the above right now.
You may remember I was strongly opposed to accepting the plan.
I even told ***** to keep his nose out of it at the time of acceptance when letters were going around the crew rooms.
The present people you have representing you are well below standard to make a dent in improving our position.
You need a Duncan Smith style revote of your reps OR the new negiotiating will be a complete Waste of time.
Think About it.
You need a more aggresive team to do the job to make any impact.
Preferably just Trade unionists NOT pilots.
Therefore insuring against double deals and back room favours.
If you remember RYANAIR very nearly had a strike a few years back.
At the last hour the little paddy ran down the stairs and sorted a 5 year plan with SHARES.
Even MOL knows you cant run an airline without PILOTS.
Once you have a serious 5 year deal on the table including Shares or a Bonus scheme with PROPER ROSTERING and increment salary increases,plus an increase in pension contribution.
Once you are actually proposing such a deal!
You would have higher numbers in BALPA.
Not before!
Mr MaLooney cant even tell you what is being proposed!
How in gods name does he expect us all to rejoin!
Last edited by Jetdriver; 26th Nov 2003 at 01:23.
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mjbd
I've just written a long reply to the last few posts but then thought again and deleted it.
I will not get drawn into a childish public debate centred on name-calling.
I am a better person than that, and always will be.
Please recruit your own Council and show us how it's done.
moderator - over to you!
I've just written a long reply to the last few posts but then thought again and deleted it.
I will not get drawn into a childish public debate centred on name-calling.
I am a better person than that, and always will be.
Please recruit your own Council and show us how it's done.
moderator - over to you!
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Sorry Mactom if i have misread your post but I still think that there must have some point where a decision had to be made with trade offs etc. A command is not a pay cut and while it was crap (really CRAP!) what were the other tradeoffs??
Keep in mind you are an FO for a short time and a captain for the rest...I guess that was the reasoning anyway.
If you are close to your move the the LHS then perhaps its time to be pragmatic and at the advantages of working at easy. If you were originally with GO then you are not now and if you dont want to accept the reduced salary then dont.
Speak to some of the others who have been around aviation for 30 years and you will hear worse than easyJet...thats not an excuse for what has happened but rather a context on which you can base your decisions.
So, tell me where to go if you like but perhaps it would be more fruitful to join those who are trying to deal with issues such as those you have mentioned....those who have some influence such as the BALPA council. Unless you have confidence in the dog!
NG
PS I would love to see the dog join the council. Why not put your money.....
Keep in mind you are an FO for a short time and a captain for the rest...I guess that was the reasoning anyway.
If you are close to your move the the LHS then perhaps its time to be pragmatic and at the advantages of working at easy. If you were originally with GO then you are not now and if you dont want to accept the reduced salary then dont.
Speak to some of the others who have been around aviation for 30 years and you will hear worse than easyJet...thats not an excuse for what has happened but rather a context on which you can base your decisions.
So, tell me where to go if you like but perhaps it would be more fruitful to join those who are trying to deal with issues such as those you have mentioned....those who have some influence such as the BALPA council. Unless you have confidence in the dog!
NG
PS I would love to see the dog join the council. Why not put your money.....
Well I am very happy with the EZY BALPA Company Councils efforts so far. Lots of members are.
Cheers
WWW
Cheers
WWW
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Blackdog wrote;
Please stop being a tourist and leave MY country.
When I flew with you you were telling me how you worked out in the Gulf and how you longed to go back.
Your statement above reminds me of a pot, a kettle and the colour black Maybe the arabs thought the same? 
I too am happy with my CC's efforts, I only wish that more people joined instead of whinging. Same old story with the human race. Plenty of people criticise but they don't get off their fat asses and help.
Please stop being a tourist and leave MY country.
When I flew with you you were telling me how you worked out in the Gulf and how you longed to go back.
Your statement above reminds me of a pot, a kettle and the colour black
Maybe the arabs thought the same? I too am happy with my CC's efforts, I only wish that more people joined instead of whinging. Same old story with the human race. Plenty of people criticise but they don't get off their fat asses and help.
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Scottie,
They probably did BUT at least I did something about it!
I certainly didnt outstay my welcome!
For your information I do get off my backside and hussle with Alpha on a regular basis because it hasnt been sorted properly by either btb or the company.
Remind me NOT to bother on your behalf next time.
Bring your own.
Flaps1,
RTFQ and answer it.
They probably did BUT at least I did something about it!
I certainly didnt outstay my welcome!
For your information I do get off my backside and hussle with Alpha on a regular basis because it hasnt been sorted properly by either btb or the company.
Remind me NOT to bother on your behalf next time.
Bring your own.
Flaps1,
RTFQ and answer it.
Last edited by mjenkinsblackdog; 24th Nov 2003 at 18:27.
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Only occasionally laddie!
The rest of the time its the person in the LEFT hand sit.
Thats a failing of both your beloved Balpa and the company.
Another reason for a revote of the principal reps before serious talks occur.
With easyjet having over 800 pilots we NEED professional representation.
That doesnt mean over worked pilots doing it part time on the side.
The rest of the time its the person in the LEFT hand sit.
Thats a failing of both your beloved Balpa and the company.
Another reason for a revote of the principal reps before serious talks occur.
With easyjet having over 800 pilots we NEED professional representation.
That doesnt mean over worked pilots doing it part time on the side.
Last edited by mjenkinsblackdog; 24th Nov 2003 at 18:46.
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MJBD,
Well we're all sick and tired of hearing what you are against, what you don't like and who is to blame for it, why don't you say what you are for instead of bleating and blathering get of your arse and do something about it!
This forum and thread is about rosters, why are you not on the committee ? Why have you never been on any committee? BECAUSE IT'S ALL WORDS AND NO ACTION, thats why. You sit there and slag off anyone who gives of their own time and tries to make your life better, until you join Balpa we don't want your advice on what you think should happen down at New Road, it's none of your business. And because you sit where you do, doing nothing, you will just have to like it or lump it!!
Well we're all sick and tired of hearing what you are against, what you don't like and who is to blame for it, why don't you say what you are for instead of bleating and blathering get of your arse and do something about it!
This forum and thread is about rosters, why are you not on the committee ? Why have you never been on any committee? BECAUSE IT'S ALL WORDS AND NO ACTION, thats why. You sit there and slag off anyone who gives of their own time and tries to make your life better, until you join Balpa we don't want your advice on what you think should happen down at New Road, it's none of your business. And because you sit where you do, doing nothing, you will just have to like it or lump it!!
Last edited by Jetdriver; 26th Nov 2003 at 01:12.
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Klink,
Read the above!
Its all in plain ENGLISH.
You said,How great the previous deal was{remember}.
Plus flaps 1 saying 6on and 3 off is a step forward{is he on DRUGS].
Thats why you are unsuitable to be Chairing a Tea party let alone the easy council.
I have already asked Flaps 1 .
What is being proposed on several occasions.
Sadly No answer .
PLEASE TELL US ALL WHAT IF ANYTHING IS BEING PROPOSED.
Dont respond saying you will have to join because it doesnt wash.
Now speak up laddie we are all listening!
It is my BUSINESS as both you and I are employees of easyjet!{remember}.
Unless of course old uncle ***has put you on the board{GOD FORBID}.
As I said before we need PROFESSIONAL REPRESENTATION not
amateurs.
Finally I was asked by a lady committee member ages before you got involved to be on the committee.
Read the above!
Its all in plain ENGLISH.
You said,How great the previous deal was{remember}.
Plus flaps 1 saying 6on and 3 off is a step forward{is he on DRUGS].
Thats why you are unsuitable to be Chairing a Tea party let alone the easy council.
I have already asked Flaps 1 .
What is being proposed on several occasions.
Sadly No answer .
PLEASE TELL US ALL WHAT IF ANYTHING IS BEING PROPOSED.
Dont respond saying you will have to join because it doesnt wash.
Now speak up laddie we are all listening!
It is my BUSINESS as both you and I are employees of easyjet!{remember}.
Unless of course old uncle ***has put you on the board{GOD FORBID}.
As I said before we need PROFESSIONAL REPRESENTATION not
amateurs.
Finally I was asked by a lady committee member ages before you got involved to be on the committee.
Last edited by Jetdriver; 26th Nov 2003 at 01:14.
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Before I answer you and your twisted ramblings, you be VERY careful before you ever again imply or suggest my colleague, Flaps one is on drugs lest we see you in court, mister. While it is clear you may not care about your reputation, we certainly do about ours!
What is being proposed to the company is an aggressive step forward to better our conditions and improve our lifestyle. Most members are not even privy to those details, as is the custom while negotiating a pay claim. I have spent many hours and given up several days off to get this far. I will be in New Rd all day Wednesday (a day off) working on it, Flaps One will be there doing something else.I am doing it again next week as well.
The point is: what have you ever done apart from yell and scream on forums like these? I answer ONLY to our members, and they deserve the best we can do. Membership is again on the increase, and we won't stop until we negotiate with the full force of the pilots behind us.
You have never been on a committee, council or any other group whose ambtions extend to improving your lot. You have never been promoted, and you could have gone to Now if you felt so strongly, maybe the fact that you would have had to take a 10% pay cut means you can't put your money where you mouth is , after all!!!!!
What is being proposed to the company is an aggressive step forward to better our conditions and improve our lifestyle. Most members are not even privy to those details, as is the custom while negotiating a pay claim. I have spent many hours and given up several days off to get this far. I will be in New Rd all day Wednesday (a day off) working on it, Flaps One will be there doing something else.I am doing it again next week as well.
The point is: what have you ever done apart from yell and scream on forums like these? I answer ONLY to our members, and they deserve the best we can do. Membership is again on the increase, and we won't stop until we negotiate with the full force of the pilots behind us.
You have never been on a committee, council or any other group whose ambtions extend to improving your lot. You have never been promoted, and you could have gone to Now if you felt so strongly, maybe the fact that you would have had to take a 10% pay cut means you can't put your money where you mouth is , after all!!!!!
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KLink,
The drugs thingy was a Joke{sorry I forgot you dont have a sense of humour laddie .}.
Once again you have glossed over the question without being specific{surprise surprise}.
Believe it or not I wish you the best of British in your talks ,but if its anything LIKE last time{it will be a shambles}.
You need a 5 year plan to make an impact.
REAL ROSTERING designed for humans not CLOCKWORK ORANGES.
Backed up with PROFESSIONAL IMPLEMENTATION.
Year by year nonsense wont cut it.
Particularly ,If easyjet is being looked as a real career choice as the little ad says at the top of the page.
If you came up with specifics you might get some of us to rejoin.
Sadly its all cloak and dagger HUSH HUSH.
Or is it I gont have a clue so Im not saying?
TA TA
Please tell me what relevance does me being promoted have on this discussion. I could of course mention how you failed your command course in Rba ,but thats not my style.
I dont wish to be on any committee,tea club,mason shaking,or shirt lifting society because I have other interests OUTSIDE of easyjet.
The drugs thingy was a Joke{sorry I forgot you dont have a sense of humour laddie .}.
Once again you have glossed over the question without being specific{surprise surprise}.
Believe it or not I wish you the best of British in your talks ,but if its anything LIKE last time{it will be a shambles}.
You need a 5 year plan to make an impact.
REAL ROSTERING designed for humans not CLOCKWORK ORANGES.
Backed up with PROFESSIONAL IMPLEMENTATION.
Year by year nonsense wont cut it.
Particularly ,If easyjet is being looked as a real career choice as the little ad says at the top of the page.
If you came up with specifics you might get some of us to rejoin.
Sadly its all cloak and dagger HUSH HUSH.
Or is it I gont have a clue so Im not saying?
TA TA
Please tell me what relevance does me being promoted have on this discussion. I could of course mention how you failed your command course in Rba ,but thats not my style.
I dont wish to be on any committee,tea club,mason shaking,or shirt lifting society because I have other interests OUTSIDE of easyjet.
Last edited by Jetdriver; 26th Nov 2003 at 01:16.
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mjbd....
Of course you do.....reading and posting on PPRUNE
Maybe joining a 'shirtlifting society' would allow some release for your pent-up rage.
I've been following your posts for a few years now, and they have been, wthout exception, bitter, unprofessional and often offensive attacks on your employers and colleagues in a public forum. Whilst I have no desire to work for Easy, I have to say that if you hate the job as much as you do, then why not leave? It can't be good for you living with such hate.
Maybe all the hours you spend posting on here would be better spent sending applications out to other airlines? (please not the airline I work for though
)
The only person who is going to make your life better is YOU. No-one else, and certainly not an internet forum! Bite the bullet and move somewhere you'll be happy and stop whinging about your life on here.
Have a beer and chill dude
I have other interests OUTSIDE of easyjet
Maybe joining a 'shirtlifting society' would allow some release for your pent-up rage.
I've been following your posts for a few years now, and they have been, wthout exception, bitter, unprofessional and often offensive attacks on your employers and colleagues in a public forum. Whilst I have no desire to work for Easy, I have to say that if you hate the job as much as you do, then why not leave? It can't be good for you living with such hate.
Maybe all the hours you spend posting on here would be better spent sending applications out to other airlines? (please not the airline I work for though
)The only person who is going to make your life better is YOU. No-one else, and certainly not an internet forum! Bite the bullet and move somewhere you'll be happy and stop whinging about your life on here.
Have a beer and chill dude
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Busta,
Myself and about half of easyjet are working on a tunnel out right now.
The orange juice ran out ages ago.
Thanks for your concern.
Who do you work for?{only kidding}.
Myself and about half of easyjet are working on a tunnel out right now.
The orange juice ran out ages ago.
Thanks for your concern.
Who do you work for?{only kidding}.
Last edited by mjenkinsblackdog; 25th Nov 2003 at 02:40.