easyjet pilots to strike??
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Join Date: Jul 2002
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gentlemen, time please
Come on guys lets put this to bed. the thread was about our chance to change things through our (threatened?) withdrawal of labour. The doves never gave the hawks a chance( or the other way around depending on which side of the fence you sit).The vote has been cast and it was a damp squib.There is no point continueing this thread. Only worry yourself about things you have control over. We now no longer have control over the outcome of the ballot.In fighting and bickering is churlish and not the domain of a professional aviator. We have been dealt our hand and now it is time to play the game.
Pilotofjet out.
Pilotofjet out.
Join Date: Nov 2001
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Gypsy is of course correct, look around you guys. Only about 10% of the country earn over 40K and they have to work for it. The problem is that these pages reflect militant and minority views, there is no mass support for them as the vote demonstrates. BALPA will of course claim victory, a more disreputable organisation is difficult to find, they dwell in the era of the dockers, miners, car and print unions and look what has happened to them. What other 'profession' goes into print with the anti capitalist neo marxist rubbish that regularily appears in these forums.
Join Date: Feb 2003
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ajk,
What a load of rubbish !
Pilots deserve every penny and more.
High risk occupation No management back up .
Unsociable hours etc.
Further rubbish from europe on the cards.
PLEASE THINK BEFORE YOU PRINT!
What a load of rubbish !
Pilots deserve every penny and more.
High risk occupation No management back up .
Unsociable hours etc.
Further rubbish from europe on the cards.
PLEASE THINK BEFORE YOU PRINT!
Just as an aside. Whilst reading the BALPA flight time limitations info pack today somewhere South of AGN I wondered the following:
How much does each passenger pay for my services per flight? (Low cost FO)
I had all the data to hand as it happens. For each passenger last year it cost my employer 84p to employ me and that is a charge they must pass on to the passengers.
It is of course slightly less due to no-shows who never get a refund but I dicounted that.
Thats not what I earnt from every passenger, but what every passenger had to stump up for me to fly them from A to B. Remember to include all your employment costs, recurrent training, expenses, Employers NI, pension and benefit contributions etc. etc.
I thought that for 25p more my annual hours could have been brought down well under 600hrs and I would barely every be fatigued.
Hows about a campaign seeking a 25p passenger surcharge for comprehensively rested pilots?
It'll never happen, but it should.
WWW
How much does each passenger pay for my services per flight? (Low cost FO)
I had all the data to hand as it happens. For each passenger last year it cost my employer 84p to employ me and that is a charge they must pass on to the passengers.
It is of course slightly less due to no-shows who never get a refund but I dicounted that.
Thats not what I earnt from every passenger, but what every passenger had to stump up for me to fly them from A to B. Remember to include all your employment costs, recurrent training, expenses, Employers NI, pension and benefit contributions etc. etc.
I thought that for 25p more my annual hours could have been brought down well under 600hrs and I would barely every be fatigued.
Hows about a campaign seeking a 25p passenger surcharge for comprehensively rested pilots?
It'll never happen, but it should.
WWW
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I hate to rain on your parade, WW, but I flew under 600hrs last year and felt well and truly fatigued thanks to s**t and inefficient rostering i.e 11 hour duty days, bit only one hour flight time.
Welcome to easyjet.
Welcome to easyjet.
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It seems to me that there's a cocktail of problems at easy.
First, very poor management causing operational troubles, allowing incompetent individuals to continue to screw things up, and ruining the company's value (47% drop in shares in last year versus 41% drop at BA and 7% rise at Ryanair).
Second, for whatever reason, the pilots are ranged against the management. Who's to blame?
Third, the management, instead of trying to get the pilots on-side, continue to try to drive down terms and conditions whilst they can get away with it.
Fourth, and crucially, the vote would not have been 'YES' without recommendation from the BALPA people. This is where these guys have been sold down the river, and it's yet another great reason not to waste your time and money on membership of this organisation.
Take an extra 1% on your pay guys, and stop wasting money backing up the colleagues and their advisers who've pushed through another deal which drives the industry down.
First, very poor management causing operational troubles, allowing incompetent individuals to continue to screw things up, and ruining the company's value (47% drop in shares in last year versus 41% drop at BA and 7% rise at Ryanair).
Second, for whatever reason, the pilots are ranged against the management. Who's to blame?
Third, the management, instead of trying to get the pilots on-side, continue to try to drive down terms and conditions whilst they can get away with it.
Fourth, and crucially, the vote would not have been 'YES' without recommendation from the BALPA people. This is where these guys have been sold down the river, and it's yet another great reason not to waste your time and money on membership of this organisation.
Take an extra 1% on your pay guys, and stop wasting money backing up the colleagues and their advisers who've pushed through another deal which drives the industry down.
Grim Sleeper
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I'm one of the lily-livered, spineless europhile chickens who followed balpa's recommendation.
I figured that a company making £80m+ profit a year could quite easily afford to run on 60% of its pilot workforce (I think I'm being generous as to the 40% of pilots who would actually have gone on strike) plus whatever subleasing it would have to do to run its program for six months. Especially as striking pilots would not be paid.
I personally could not afford to do that. And I know that the members of our PC would not have given up lightly - they did their sums too, and probably came to the same conclusion.
The answer is we need HIGHER balpa membership in eJ to win this thing. With 80% plus we could make a cohesive threat to them - 55% just won't cut it. The last thing we want is the existing members to give it up now and make things even easier for management in 2004.
Like many have said - it may be s!!t but it's the only show in town. So I'm not being chicken this time - I'm staying in.
I figured that a company making £80m+ profit a year could quite easily afford to run on 60% of its pilot workforce (I think I'm being generous as to the 40% of pilots who would actually have gone on strike) plus whatever subleasing it would have to do to run its program for six months. Especially as striking pilots would not be paid.
I personally could not afford to do that. And I know that the members of our PC would not have given up lightly - they did their sums too, and probably came to the same conclusion.
The answer is we need HIGHER balpa membership in eJ to win this thing. With 80% plus we could make a cohesive threat to them - 55% just won't cut it. The last thing we want is the existing members to give it up now and make things even easier for management in 2004.
Like many have said - it may be s!!t but it's the only show in town. So I'm not being chicken this time - I'm staying in.
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In the light of all that has been 'debated' over the past few weeks, I draw your attention to one thread. This is relevant to the union v non-union voices, and the yes/no debate.
There is a thread in Airlines & Routes titled "easyjet shares". Go to the post from Touch & Go. Click on the link to Telegraph and find the link to easyjet's intended purchase of DBA.
You will find that it is up in the air because the local union refused to accept the terms that would have been imposed by RW. They would not allow their lives to be so effected & controlled.
Now, some may say, Bravo; others Luddites. DBA are losing money and may close down without a rescue. However, there were enough of those to draw a line and stand by it; upto now. Better to take your chances in the open market than be subjected to conditons that you find unacceptable; so they thought.
Who knows what the outcome will be. Perhaps ej will write off the money already spent (substantial) and walk away, or will enter fair and equal negotiations. If not ej, then perhaps someone else will come along. If RW was prepared to spend so much money on keeping the option, he must believe there are other payers in the market. At least the guys seem to have a principle and stand by it, and take the risks.
Note, also, the tactics at boardroom level during the many reported takeovers. It is never the first offer that is accepted. The buyer has to sweat a little and pay the right price. There is respect for both sides. professional negotiations! I wonder if anyone at New Road was aware of the goings on during the ej Go takeover negotiations? Can it be true that ej just marched in and imposed their first offer. I suspect that B.C. squeezed the last drop out of ej.
Oh well, as J.B. said "you live to die another day"
Good luck..
There is a thread in Airlines & Routes titled "easyjet shares". Go to the post from Touch & Go. Click on the link to Telegraph and find the link to easyjet's intended purchase of DBA.
You will find that it is up in the air because the local union refused to accept the terms that would have been imposed by RW. They would not allow their lives to be so effected & controlled.
Now, some may say, Bravo; others Luddites. DBA are losing money and may close down without a rescue. However, there were enough of those to draw a line and stand by it; upto now. Better to take your chances in the open market than be subjected to conditons that you find unacceptable; so they thought.
Who knows what the outcome will be. Perhaps ej will write off the money already spent (substantial) and walk away, or will enter fair and equal negotiations. If not ej, then perhaps someone else will come along. If RW was prepared to spend so much money on keeping the option, he must believe there are other payers in the market. At least the guys seem to have a principle and stand by it, and take the risks.
Note, also, the tactics at boardroom level during the many reported takeovers. It is never the first offer that is accepted. The buyer has to sweat a little and pay the right price. There is respect for both sides. professional negotiations! I wonder if anyone at New Road was aware of the goings on during the ej Go takeover negotiations? Can it be true that ej just marched in and imposed their first offer. I suspect that B.C. squeezed the last drop out of ej.
Oh well, as J.B. said "you live to die another day"
Good luck..
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Slim20
Re your post of 27 Feb – “The answer is we need HIGHER balpa membership in eJ to win this thing”
I agree, but you also need to dump your present PC and vote one in that will more fully represent the aspirations of the membership. I gather that the present lot may have “negotiated” to satisfy the requirements of a rather narrower section of the membership than would normally be deemed healthy (ie their own).
As RAT 5 points out, “At least the guys (DBA pilots) seem to have a principle and stand by it, and take the risks”, unlike, I’m afraid, you guys and gals.
However, with a new PC and a well crafted set of principles, you’ll be ready for the next and inevitable battle with your CEO. And once you’ve achieved these, you’ll be in a good position to aggressively market them to non-members, increase the membership and achieve some real results.
Please, though, whatever you all do, don’t blame BALPA. Remember, the membership is BALPA – you just seem to have been shafted by a duff PC, which, also remember, you all voted for, in the first place.
Hang in there and good luck!
Re your post of 27 Feb – “The answer is we need HIGHER balpa membership in eJ to win this thing”
I agree, but you also need to dump your present PC and vote one in that will more fully represent the aspirations of the membership. I gather that the present lot may have “negotiated” to satisfy the requirements of a rather narrower section of the membership than would normally be deemed healthy (ie their own).
As RAT 5 points out, “At least the guys (DBA pilots) seem to have a principle and stand by it, and take the risks”, unlike, I’m afraid, you guys and gals.
However, with a new PC and a well crafted set of principles, you’ll be ready for the next and inevitable battle with your CEO. And once you’ve achieved these, you’ll be in a good position to aggressively market them to non-members, increase the membership and achieve some real results.
Please, though, whatever you all do, don’t blame BALPA. Remember, the membership is BALPA – you just seem to have been shafted by a duff PC, which, also remember, you all voted for, in the first place.
Hang in there and good luck!
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Anotherpost75
You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about!
Total garbage!
And NO, I am not a member of the PC!
You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about!
I gather that the present lot may have “negotiated” to satisfy the requirements of a rather narrower section of the membership than would normally be deemed healthy (ie their own).
And NO, I am not a member of the PC!
