Some good news/bad news from the EU! EASA FTL rejected

[Mr Angry from Purley]

What the

So this village idiot thinks that during a daytime standby I should sleep so that I can operate safely due to having rested all day.

What if I am not called out.

I am then on standby the next day having not rested well due to having rested all day. I hope I don't get called out as I have had a terrible night of sleep and feel very tired.

The rules on sby are somewhat different in many EU countries than the UK. CAP371 allows similar such "worst case" scenarios also so its nothing new.
FYI in Germany for example they had 24hr standby duties and this was one of the areas that caused most discussion by the "village idiots"

[tubby linton]

This link shows the voting in an easier to understand format.
VoteWatch Europe: European Parliament, Council of the EU

Some operators saw Cap371 as a limit to be worked to , which was never its intent when it was formulated. They will see the EASA rules as a new target and because of the loopholes left in its framwork they will exploit these in every way imaginable.
I hope that the new Director of Chirp is ready for the avalanche of fatigue reports he will receive when these new rules come into force and I also hope that he is ready to go to EASA and get them to see sense based upon scientific fact.

[Vasco dePilot]

Rule by bureaucrats via Poodle MEPs

The EU is about to turn the clock back 40 years in aviation safety terms: To where we were before the Report of the Committee on Flight Time Limitations, chaired by Group Captain Douglas Bader. After UK CAA consideration of the Bader recommendations, the Flight Time Limitations Board was created and we had a significant improvement in FDTLs. Despite this, airlines exploited the limits specified in CAP371 as if they were rostering targets. Heaven only knows what lies ahead of us now.
The EU Commission's handling of this one issue is what is turning me into a Eurosceptic. It has demonstrated why so many people in the UK hate the EU bureaucrats with such passion. I am embarrassed to admit that it has taken this issue, an issue which I know something about, which I feel passionately about to join them in their hatred. I am old and bold enough to remember the days pre Bader Report. Is this the issue which will turn me into a UKIP supporter?

[aguadalte]

Europe adopts new FTL regulations...

http://news.aviation-safety.net/2013/10/09/europe-adopts-new-flight-time-limitations-ftl-regulations/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

Its done...

[tubby linton]

Vasco , of the nine UKIP MEPs three didn't vote ,and the other six voted in favour of the new rules.

[captplaystation]

A - Money talks

B - The individuals expected to vote either a) didn't show up, or b) knew b*gger all about the subject they were voting on , or c) had been "lobbied" (polite word for bribed) by someone from our Darling Industry prior to the vote.

Whatever, we have been (as usual ) screwed & will now have the usual conversion of limits to targets that we have become accustomed to.

[mm43]

Seems there is a problem with the above link - try:-

ASN News ŧ Europe adopts new Flight Time Limitations (FTL) regulations

[Herod]

Not so. The UKIP MEP I was referring to is listed as voting against.

[Aerofoil]

The last straw!

As quite rightly pointed out by a friend of mine 'the first smoking hole in the ground...they will turn around and blame it on pilot error!'

UKIP had my vote before and after this they now have my absolute unconditional support, vote, time, backing whatever it takes to get the UK out of Europe and out of the control of these unellected fat cats.
What right do YOU have to tell US how we run OUR OWN COUNTRY!?

[tubby linton]

Herod, the motion was to stop the implementation of the new FTL. All of the UKIP MEPs voted against it.(i.e. in favour of the new rules). I cannot believe that UKIP would promote European interests rather than our home grown ones but the evidence is below.

VoteWatch Europe: European Parliament, Council of the EU

[gorter]

UKIP are a bunch of two faced liars. They all said they would support the pilots in rejecting the proposals. Several emails to that effect were sent to me and my pilot colleagues. Yet EVERY SINGLE UKIP MEP either voted for the legislation, or they abstained.

[Herod]

TL, I stand corrected. I wonder how many MEPs got confused? Better than saying he's a duplicitous b*stard. So now we can't trust Con, Lab, Lib/dem, UKIP. Who's left?

[Aerofoil]

I do agree with you regarding the figurehead. However, as with previous elections going back a long way, its now a case of voting out who you LEAST want in power nowadays with career politicians. I believe this is the same in a lot of countries now? I think for many though that UKIP is fast becoming the party speaking and pledging how everyone is feeling and has felt for many years and so far is the only party making these feelings heard and giving these people a voice while others are too scared of offending rather than doing what is right for the country.

There are many examples of why europe does not work for us anymore and this FTL 'force through' is another prime example to add to the list! Its in the interest of nobody except the least safe countries in europe meanwhile it is dragging down the safety standards of the nations who have managed to build a fairly solid set of FTL's over the years and everyone is being ignored to satisfy a bunch of non elected politicians' wishes. But what would we know...we just live through these FTLs/rosters and have done for decades in many cases!

[gorter]

Well if you look at the FTL vote as a single issue, the greens are the only ones left.

[Captaintcas]

As these MEP's are a clear threat to aviation safety, refuse them entry to your aircraft.

1 day of European wide Industrial action will very quickly stop this nonsense.
If ATC can make politicians listen, so can we.

The time of being nice and handing out pamflets is over boys, real action is required.
They ONLY listen when their wallet or votes are in danger.

[newt]

All sounds very interesting chaps but what are the practical implications of this result?

What will be the effect on annual flying hours ie 900 total?

How many extra trips will one have to do a month etc?

Just interested as I approach my next birthday and given a change in the retirement age after I retired at 55, how will this affect the more senior pilots ie those continuing to work to 65?

[richxby]

Does anybody know if the full document is available online? I've searched for it but to no avail?

[B16a]

Its a shame that this has been approved. Feels like of a backwards step in aviation safety which is sad after all of the improvements from tough mistakes. I wonder how pilots and cabin crews will view this. As if there working hours and job demands weren't high enough.

[yamihere]

More details available at Richard North's blog;
Global governance: the "fun" is over for the time being

A further link to:
Parliament votes not to oppose Commission measures on flight time limitations

[MaydayMaydayMayday]

It's interesting that half the folk on the thread are suddenly supporting UKIP, you might want to consider the breakdown of votes across the UK by party:

Votes AGAINST the EU FTL proposal

British Democratic Party (1)
Conservative (1)
DUP (1)
Green Party (2)
Labour (1)
Liberal Democrat (1)
Plaid Cymru (1)
Sinn Fein (1)
SNP (2)
Ulster Conservatives and Unionists-New Force (1)
UKIP (1)
We Demand a Referendum (1)

Votes FOR the EU FTL proposal:

Conservative (20)
Independent (1)
Labour (10)
Lib Dem (9)
UKIP (7)

No abstentions and 12 didn't vote.