Ryanair and BALPA/IALPA
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Frying & Atse.
What I should have also said, and I realised after the event, that in BA's case these 'spikes' as atse aptly calls them did refer in general to the cabin crew, I believe, and not the flight deck crew. That is relevant in so much as it would appear that maybe FR have noticed that same tendancy and would explain why the cabin crew received such a letter and not the flightdeck.
I'm sure I'll get flamed by the other contingent now but this place is a bit of a 'damned if you do and damned if you don't'!
I think most organisations, and I'm sure Ryanair fall in this category, accept that if you are genuinely sick such that you cannot perform your duties to the standard required, then you should go sick. On the other side of the scale, I've seen people pitch up for work that never should and you have to send them home. Mostly, however, and sadly, there are many that think a 'sicky' here and there is their right. Shame those lot aren't self-employed, because sick = no pay; tends to focus the grey matter a bit.
What I should have also said, and I realised after the event, that in BA's case these 'spikes' as atse aptly calls them did refer in general to the cabin crew, I believe, and not the flight deck crew. That is relevant in so much as it would appear that maybe FR have noticed that same tendancy and would explain why the cabin crew received such a letter and not the flightdeck.
I'm sure I'll get flamed by the other contingent now but this place is a bit of a 'damned if you do and damned if you don't'!
I think most organisations, and I'm sure Ryanair fall in this category, accept that if you are genuinely sick such that you cannot perform your duties to the standard required, then you should go sick. On the other side of the scale, I've seen people pitch up for work that never should and you have to send them home. Mostly, however, and sadly, there are many that think a 'sicky' here and there is their right. Shame those lot aren't self-employed, because sick = no pay; tends to focus the grey matter a bit.
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People really know whats going on?
Sorry chaps, but there seems to have been a bit of an oversight here...
Cabin crew are required to PAY, yes PAY RYR about GBP27.00 for every day they are sick up to a maximum of 3 days...
so yes, people dont just go sick because it hurts their pay...
furthermore, this trend has also begun with the pilots, with sick pay DEDUCTIONS appearing on many pilots salary slips...
alongside this, the cabin or flight crew member does not receive his or here sector (flight) pay for that day...
Sorry to say this, but this is fact.
So with this in mind, im afriad to say that for those who think a sicky here should be self-employed, this policy puts things more into perspective...
Understand that RYR have things set up to their advantage, no matter what happens...
and to finish this post off, there is rumour that the new cabin crew from the recently added EU states are not paid a constant basic pay rate, that their income is only based on sector pay (flight pay)
again, this last addition is rumour...those in RYR will be able to read between those lines...
Cabin crew are required to PAY, yes PAY RYR about GBP27.00 for every day they are sick up to a maximum of 3 days...
so yes, people dont just go sick because it hurts their pay...
furthermore, this trend has also begun with the pilots, with sick pay DEDUCTIONS appearing on many pilots salary slips...
alongside this, the cabin or flight crew member does not receive his or here sector (flight) pay for that day...
Sorry to say this, but this is fact.
So with this in mind, im afriad to say that for those who think a sicky here should be self-employed, this policy puts things more into perspective...
Understand that RYR have things set up to their advantage, no matter what happens...
and to finish this post off, there is rumour that the new cabin crew from the recently added EU states are not paid a constant basic pay rate, that their income is only based on sector pay (flight pay)
again, this last addition is rumour...those in RYR will be able to read between those lines...
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Not only that Chickens, but a number of them (the new cabin crew) are not directly employed by Ryanair but by third party companies that they have to pay in advance for their training. If, as appears to be the case, they only receive sector pay - and obviously only when they work - then one gets the "ohh soo very Ryanair" drift....
There is also a memo out there with the requirements to be followed if you go sick. That + the memo already posted tells pretty well the whole story. Anybody got a copy of the other document they can post here?
Jack the Lad: do you have information to challenge or refute what Chickens has said? If so, please provide it. It looks to me that he knows a bit more about Ryanair than you do with your
comment. What makes you so "sure", since a number of posters have already made it clear that they believe Ryanair certainly does not fall into that category?
There is also a memo out there with the requirements to be followed if you go sick. That + the memo already posted tells pretty well the whole story. Anybody got a copy of the other document they can post here?
Jack the Lad: do you have information to challenge or refute what Chickens has said? If so, please provide it. It looks to me that he knows a bit more about Ryanair than you do with your
... and I'm sure Ryanair fall in this category ...
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atse,
Not sure the reference to the CAA is entirely fair as FR is Irish registered & therefore the responsibility in this area falls in Dublin.
Maybe some will think this is a pedantic point, but here's the rub. The bulk of FR's profits come from the UK, but under JAA rules, our CAA doesn't get a look in.
is blindingly obvious to everyone except Ryanair management, the CAA, the IAA and some PPRuNe posters).
Maybe some will think this is a pedantic point, but here's the rub. The bulk of FR's profits come from the UK, but under JAA rules, our CAA doesn't get a look in.
So, no CAA support after 01NOV04
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two seperate but related articles
irelands' sunday tribune 12 september 200a
buisness section
"we haven't received any letter,but if we do i think it would get a pretty short reply.i think it would consist of two words:foxtrot oscar" ryanair boss micheal o'leary responds to reports that brussels is looking for return of the charleroi subsidies.
front page
"ryanair admits profits more important than punctuality"
ryanair has admitted publicly for the first time that profits are more important than getting its planes to their destinations on schedule.it has also been revealed that staff at the low fares airline are set a monthly target of money to acquire from passengers in excess baggage charges.
The information emerged in the course of an investigation into the dismissal of a ryanair employee for failing to collect a £50 excess baggage charge from a customer.while being cross-examined at the employment appeals tribunal,a deputy duty manager at the airline stated that "the collection of excess baggage charges was more important than the punctual departure of flights".
in her defence,the dismissed customer service assistant argued that she ushered the customer onto the early morning flight to beauvais without charging for excess baggage because to go through the manual process of charging would have delayed departure.
she told the tribunal that she "never saw the memorandum from the duty station manager about excess baggage being more important than getting passengers on the plane".she explained how other ryanair attendants "would bargain with passengers" over excess baggage charges and said the company "set a target of £1,000 per month" for each attendant to collect.
she said that she herself managed to collect £7,000 over eight days at christmas and didn't feel that there was any issue over her handling of the excess baggage charges.
The attendant was also disciplined by ryanair when she allowed
two asian passengers board a flight to charleroi in belguin even though they had invalid visas.as a result,the two passengers were refused entry and ryanair was forced to fly them back to dublin.the airline was also fined £6,000.
While the attendant had "contributed substantially to her dismissal" and the company had made "laudable attempts to deal with the matter",the employment appeals tribunal awarded her 700 euros.
any publicity is good publicity!
so for all you treasured customers and staff,if you don't like it,well you can "foxtrot oscar" with the brussels lot.then he wonders why he will never get the second terminal at dublin.
buisness section
"we haven't received any letter,but if we do i think it would get a pretty short reply.i think it would consist of two words:foxtrot oscar" ryanair boss micheal o'leary responds to reports that brussels is looking for return of the charleroi subsidies.
front page
"ryanair admits profits more important than punctuality"
ryanair has admitted publicly for the first time that profits are more important than getting its planes to their destinations on schedule.it has also been revealed that staff at the low fares airline are set a monthly target of money to acquire from passengers in excess baggage charges.
The information emerged in the course of an investigation into the dismissal of a ryanair employee for failing to collect a £50 excess baggage charge from a customer.while being cross-examined at the employment appeals tribunal,a deputy duty manager at the airline stated that "the collection of excess baggage charges was more important than the punctual departure of flights".
in her defence,the dismissed customer service assistant argued that she ushered the customer onto the early morning flight to beauvais without charging for excess baggage because to go through the manual process of charging would have delayed departure.
she told the tribunal that she "never saw the memorandum from the duty station manager about excess baggage being more important than getting passengers on the plane".she explained how other ryanair attendants "would bargain with passengers" over excess baggage charges and said the company "set a target of £1,000 per month" for each attendant to collect.
she said that she herself managed to collect £7,000 over eight days at christmas and didn't feel that there was any issue over her handling of the excess baggage charges.
The attendant was also disciplined by ryanair when she allowed
two asian passengers board a flight to charleroi in belguin even though they had invalid visas.as a result,the two passengers were refused entry and ryanair was forced to fly them back to dublin.the airline was also fined £6,000.
While the attendant had "contributed substantially to her dismissal" and the company had made "laudable attempts to deal with the matter",the employment appeals tribunal awarded her 700 euros.
any publicity is good publicity!
so for all you treasured customers and staff,if you don't like it,well you can "foxtrot oscar" with the brussels lot.then he wonders why he will never get the second terminal at dublin.
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Ryanair has just received a letter from the Walloon Regional Government asking for the return of illegal airport subsidies. Here, according to an Irish newspaper, is what Ryanair had to say:
“As soon as Ryanair receives this letter in English, we will respond immediately and will publish full details of this response.”
Attaboy MOL. Take no nonsense from those pesky foreigners, especially those wanting their money back!
“As soon as Ryanair receives this letter in English, we will respond immediately and will publish full details of this response.”
Attaboy MOL. Take no nonsense from those pesky foreigners, especially those wanting their money back!
Just going back to the point about CAA oversight of Ryanair's operations, the CAA has the right to request of the IAA powers to oversee Ryanair's operations under Article 83(bis) of the Chicago Convention.
This provides for an airworthiness authority to delegate oversight of an operation registered in its country to the airworthiness authority of another country. In short, it provides for situations such as that where the majority of Ryanair's operations fall in the UK instead of its state of registry, Ireland.
I wonder if the UK CAA has ever endeavoured to request such power to be delegated to it by the IAA under this article?
This provides for an airworthiness authority to delegate oversight of an operation registered in its country to the airworthiness authority of another country. In short, it provides for situations such as that where the majority of Ryanair's operations fall in the UK instead of its state of registry, Ireland.
I wonder if the UK CAA has ever endeavoured to request such power to be delegated to it by the IAA under this article?
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Flightrider
I can't comment on the rules under the Chicago Convention & bow to your superior knowledge.
BUT, does both the UK & Eire's membership of the JAA change things?
I put this very question of oversight to a CAA FOI earlier this year. His response was "No and it's a sore point."
I can't comment on the rules under the Chicago Convention & bow to your superior knowledge.
BUT, does both the UK & Eire's membership of the JAA change things?
I put this very question of oversight to a CAA FOI earlier this year. His response was "No and it's a sore point."
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Backtrack, your CAA FOI may well have said "it's a sore point" etc. but the reality is that both the IAA and CAA have the obligation to act if they think there is something to act upon. Also, as I understand it, both say they will act if they get reports, but also claim that they don't get such reports.
For all the talk of individuals within both of these organisations, BOTH have proved remarkably careful in tackling the said operator. Indeed, do they not both agree that the said operator "meets all their requirements"? For that indeed is exactly what the operator claims.
For all the talk of individuals within both of these organisations, BOTH have proved remarkably careful in tackling the said operator. Indeed, do they not both agree that the said operator "meets all their requirements"? For that indeed is exactly what the operator claims.
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JAA (in)action
...based on "rumour"...
Would the European parliament let civilians of it's newest member states work well below the minimum wage of the European state in which they are working?
Would the European parliament let civilians of it's newest member states work well below the minimum wage of the European state in which they are working?
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you will not eat or drink
todays directive to now prevent pax from bringing their own drinks or food onto ryanair flights,because it is affecting our onboard sales,just beggars belief.
do we have them arrested for smuggling on a sandwich or cup of coffee?i think we are scraping the barrel a bit now and behind the scenes the war chest may be draining.
do we have them arrested for smuggling on a sandwich or cup of coffee?i think we are scraping the barrel a bit now and behind the scenes the war chest may be draining.
The Ts &Cs currently prohibit passengers from consuming thier own alcohol on board and from carrying hot drinks on board (for safety reasons).
There is nothing stating that passengers may not bring their own food on board, nor prohibiting them from consuming it on board. Where would such a rule stop - a single tic-tac?
Clarification of your post please, clohessy the claw?
There is nothing stating that passengers may not bring their own food on board, nor prohibiting them from consuming it on board. Where would such a rule stop - a single tic-tac?
Clarification of your post please, clohessy the claw?
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directive to cabin crew 16.9.04
cabin crew instructed in memo book that brought on drinks and food affecting onboard sales and immediately to be stopped.no safety mentioned.
the cockpits crew carry on hot drinks and food is this affecting safety or are they trying to starve them out.
what clarification do you need?
the cockpits crew carry on hot drinks and food is this affecting safety or are they trying to starve them out.
what clarification do you need?
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We are way off the point of this topic but what happened was there was a company going around the boarding area selling food and drinks to paxs as they were waiting to board so when EW got wind of this he sent out the memo. Cabin crew were told not to stop anybody from today on as the company is not going around the boarding area anymore.
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We always take our own food on Ryanair because we get what we want and it's cheaper. The cabin crew have never mentioned a thing about it. There seems to be some sort of conspiracy to repeat this lie about food being prohibited until it becomes a 'fact'.
The only time we've seen any reaction was when some Corsican rugby supporters started passing litre bottles of pastis around. That was solved quickly and amicably by the confiscation of the bottles until we arrived a Stansted.
The only time we've seen any reaction was when some Corsican rugby supporters started passing litre bottles of pastis around. That was solved quickly and amicably by the confiscation of the bottles until we arrived a Stansted.