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Bristow S76 Ditched in Nigeria today Feb 3 2016

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Bristow S76 Ditched in Nigeria today Feb 3 2016

Old 27th Mar 2016, 18:13
  #561 (permalink)  
 
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Much closing of stable doors long after the horses have bolted - at least that particular accident is unlikely to happen again - we'll have to wait for the next 'unusual' scenario to test the quality of the training/captaincy I suppose.
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Old 27th Mar 2016, 20:06
  #562 (permalink)  
 
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@industry insider
As I said many posts ago, this was a simple autopilot issue which was mis interpreted by the crew. The fact that Bristow has sent all of its BHNL S-76 crews to the simulator for "additional training" alludes to the fact that "additional training" should prevent a recurrence in BHNL's view.
Dear industry insider, it might be too early to give any statement like this "this was as simple autopilot issue which was misinterpreted by the crew". There is nothing what will support your theory, so far.

Instead, the opposite views, there are facts that support or consider them as potential events (NCAA's mandatory maintenance checks on due within 72 hours and Bristow's statement of additional simulator training).

The Nigerian Civil Aviation Authority (NCAA) has ordered all Airlines operating the SIKORSKY S76C series to carry out a safety inspection on this helicopter type with immediate effect.
As an interim safety measure, the under listed safety inspections affects all Sikorsky S76C series helicopters operating in Nigeria.
The action required are as follows:
1. Visual Inspection in accordance with relevant S76C AMM 20-32-00.
2. Detailed Inspection in accordance with relevant S76C AMM 66-00-00.
3. Detailed Inspection in accordance with relevant S76C AMM 66-10-00,66-20-00,66-30-00,66-40-00.
The NCAA's mandatory order to inspect all S76 series helicopter within 72 hours and every 300 hours will give a lead. The mandatory order's ATA numbers refers that the area of the accident investigators interest. Based on the ATA numbers the area of interest is the Flight Control System (flight controls, rods, tubes, mixing unit, servo actuators, links, caution switches and etc).

Bristow Legal Director Tolu Olubajo's statement:
Bristow Helicopters said it had sent all its pilots on the Sikorsky S-76 series on simulator training in order to keep them abreast of latest developments. Bristow Legal Director, Tolu Olubajo …on training, we have sent all pilots on Sikorsky on simulator training on current handling of the aircraft, we are conducting test like hydraulic test, review all maintenance programmes, inspection and maintenance checks of cockpit, life jackets and so on,” he said.
Bristow's statement supports the facts that the additional simulator flight training focus is the controllability issues and the hydraulic check (Stick Jump test).

These are the hard facts together with the published Preliminary report which also support the scenario that the loss of the controllability was the event why the helicopter was ditched.

I have received today from the local source an unofficial information that the both of (12th of August 2015 and the 3rd February, 2016) accidents helicopter's hydraulic fluid were contaminated. Let's wait until the official confirmation will be received.
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Old 27th Mar 2016, 22:22
  #563 (permalink)  
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.... in case of hydraulic fluid contamination, then, shouldn't it be likely to find a record of clogged filters, abnormal fluid color and perhaps of a fluid change in the recent flights maintenance book ? (I have already seen an S76 contaminated hydraulic fluid that was looking more like a genuine Irish Guiness )
In this situation also I don't doubt, a further investigation procedure is required.
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Old 27th Mar 2016, 22:28
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Hmmm - inspecting the whole flight control system rather than one specific item sounds much more like clutching at straws trying to find a plausible excuse for the ditching rather than an exercise in checking a failed system (that has been proven to have failed) to ensure there isn't a fleet-wide problem.

Sending the crews for further training just looks like a*se-covering but is only to be expected so someone is seen to be doing something.
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Old 27th Mar 2016, 23:12
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Okey, Houston, we've had a problem here!
Please check my the latest post Bristow accidents. The latest post has been transffered to the "Bristow S76 Down in Lagos discussion #131".

Very relevant post for the both threads and for the flight safety!
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 00:29
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Dear Copterline

My information is from "behind the curtain".
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 10:04
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@industry insider
Dear Copterline
My information is from "behind the curtain".

Dear industry insider, your posts has already been made clear your position and your intentions for the safety matters.

@industry insider
Rubbish Copterline. I am not aware of a fatal accident anywhere in the offshore industry in an EC225. The fleet was only grounded by statute in certain places.

According to you, every S-76 accident is caused by a servo problem. You are wrong and I am getting a bit fed up reading your posts which show little or no objectivity. You are looking for every accident to fit your pre-conceived theory.

@industry insider
Not surprising Crab.
As I said many posts ago, this was a simple autopilot issue which was mis interpreted by the crew.

@industry insider
But not too hard to fly the EFIS AP out if you slow down to 120 knots, especially if you have selected the AP off so you know its coming.
I still see no real reason for a ditching here.

@industry insider
The AP / AFCS didn't "fail". It was a relatively small anomaly. The decision to ditch a serviceable helicopter is therefore very puzzling when it flies perfectly well AP out with a little extra concentration.

@industry insider
We all know the obvious way to isolate and diagnose an AP issue. But as Nescafe says (and obviously knows or has been briefed by BHNL) the issue appears the crew may not know the AP like you do and combined with the Harmattan causing poor visibility, it seems that they "talked" themselves into the need for a ditching.
Industry insider, could you make an answer to Geoffersincornwall "what guys back at the Sikorsky factory curtains are thinking?" We all would appreciate it very much if you would slightly to open the curtain for us?

The question is a quote below.

@Geoffersincornwall
I can just imagine the guys back at the Sikorsky factory trying to get their heads around this. The system was designed and built by the previous generation of engineer/designers so in theory the current generation bear no guilt - if there is guilt to be borne. But would they be wise to come forward and admit that the hydraulic system has a fundamental design flaw? Can you imagine the fall-out that would accompany such an admission?
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 12:18
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Copterline

You are obsessed with a single theory based on one accident and you have no apparent ability to be objective. Your mass quoting of previous posts does not alter facts. Helicopters do crash or ditch for multiple reasons and crashes may not conform to your somewhat single track theory.

The S-76 series has 6m + flight hours and almost 40 years of operations. It has been a reliable helicopter overall. It is gradually becoming commercially obsolete now, it happens with all aircraft.

You may notice, no one else is debating with you anymore. They have given up because you will only listen to yourself. So post away to your heart's desire. I have lost the will to engage with you any more.
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 13:23
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@industry insider
The S-76 series has 6m + flight hours and almost 40 years of operations. It has been a reliable helicopter overall. It is gradually becoming commercially obsolete now, it happens with all aircraft.
ASN Wikibase accident and serious occurrence data base #178588

28-JUL-1978
Sikorsky S-76A N763SA Sikorsky Aircraft 0 near West Palm Beach, FL
21-MAR-1980
Sikorsky S-76A PT-HKB VOTEC 14 off Macaé, RJ
03-SEP-1980
Sikorsky S-76A N766AL Air Logistics 0 near Patterson, LA
12-MAR-1981
Sikorsky S-76A G-BGXY Bristow Helicopters 4 South Kirkton, Westhill, Aberdeenshire
31-MAR-1981
Sikorsky S-76A N765AL Air Logistics 0 Conroe, TX
29-SEP-1981
Sikorsky S-76A PT-HKC VOTEC 0 Macaé, RJ
30-APR-1982
Sikorsky S-76A C-GIMF Okanagan Helicopters 13 Gulf of Thailand
14-SEP-1983
Sikorsky S-76A N521AC Amway Corp 0 Lake Michigan
07-NOV-1983
Sikorsky S-76A PT-HKD VOTEC 0 off Macaé, RJ
08-NOV-1983
Sikorsky S-76A TF-RAN Icelandic Coast Guard 4 Western Fjords
13-NOV-1983
Sikorsky S-76A N4252S Houston Helicopters off Singapore
05-MAR-1984
Sikorsky S-76A N15479 private 0 Spartanburg, SC
01-MAY-1984
Sikorsky S-76A N763AL Air Logistics 0 High Island BLK595, TX
11-AUG-1984
Sikorsky S-76A N63WW Capital Equipment Associates 1 Fort Dix, NJ
22-SEP-1984
Sikorsky S-76A N79K private 0 near Unionville, PA
01-NOV-1984
Sikorsky S-76A N27422 Petroleum Helicopters (PHI) 5 off Hainan Island
19-FEB-1985
Sikorsky S-76A N31223 Petroleum Helicopters (PHI) 0 Houma, LA
11-JUN-1985
Sikorsky S-76A N176FJ Raco Helicopters 1 Belmar, NJ
28-JUN-1985
Sikorsky S-76A N5054Y Air Logistics 0 Eugene Island
05-JAN-1986
Sikorsky S-76A N7612L Air Logistics 3 near Houma, LA
06-JUN-1986
Sikorsky S-76B N5AZ United Technologies 4 Sutton, MA
04-FEB-1987
Sikorsky S-76A N767AL Air Logistics 2 Angleton, TX
30-MAY-1987
Sikorsky S-76 (AUH-76) 208 Philippine Air Force 4 Manila Bay
23-JUN-1988
Sikorsky S-76A N54C 0 Moundsville, WV
07-AUG-1988
Sikorsky S-76 N69WW private 0 Teterboro, NJ
22-FEB-1989
Sikorsky S-76A N767SA 0 Washington, PA
01-DEC-1989
Sikorsky S-76 (AUH-76) 209 Philippine Air Force 0 Sangley Point AB, Cavite City
12-MAY-1990
Sikorsky S-76 (AUH-76) 203 Philippine Air Force 9 Zamboanga
01-AUG-1990
Sikorsky S-76A+ JA9943 Aero Asahi 2 Hakone
22-AUG-1990
Sikorsky S-76 (AUH-76) 204 Philippine Air Force 1
17-JUN-1991
Sikorsky S-76A N5418N Petroleum Helicopters (PHI) 0 Gulf of Mexico
18-APR-1992
Sikorsky S-76A+ G-BOND Bond Helicopters 0+1 North Sea
07-AUG-1992
Sikorsky S-76A N50KY Kentucky State Government 0 Graefenburg, KY
06-FEB-1993
Sikorsky S-76A+ I-EAIR Eliair 4 Venezia-Tessera (VCE)
14-JUN-1993
Sikorsky S-76B HL9245 Sunkyung Engineering 7 near Seoul
23-APR-1994
Sikorsky S-76A PK-PUD Pelita Air Service 0 Udang Field, off Matak Island, Riau
08-NOV-1994
Sikorsky S-76A N2620 Mobil Administrative Services (MASCI) 1 off Cameron, LA
24-JUL-1995
Sikorsky S-76A VR-BQD private 0 Aspropirgos
09-APR-1996
Sikorsky S-76A B-7302 Zhuhai Helicopter 2 Dawanshan Island
12-DEC-1996
Sikorsky S-76B G-HAUG Norbrook Industries 3 2 mls SE of Omeath, Co. Louth
03-APR-1997
Sikorsky S-76B-7 2310 Royal Thai Navy 0 Bangkok NAS
22-SEP-1997
Sikorsky S-76A+ N517AL Air Logistics 0 Patterson, LA
03-OCT-1997
Sikorsky S-76A B-7301 Zhuhai Helicopter 7 off Wenzhou
20-DEC-1997
Sikorsky S-76B PH-KHB KLM/Era Helicopters 1 North Sea
- -1997
Sikorsky S-76B HL9249 Dong Ah Construction
20-FEB-1998
Sikorsky S-76C JA6733/MH733 Japan Coast Guard 3 37 km off Cape Esan, Kameda
18-MAR-1998
Sikorsky S-76A B-7306 Zhuhai Helicopter 2 near Zhuhai
28-MAR-1998
Sikorsky S-76A C-GMQE 0 Victoria, BC
24-JUN-1998
Sikorsky S-76A+ ZS-RIJ Court Helicopters 0 off Luanda
04-SEP-1998
Sikorsky S-76B I-LXCA Luxottica spa 0 near Padova
03-APR-1999
Sikorsky S-76A SE-JES Norrlandsflyg 0 25 km NE of Torneträsk
14-JUN-1999
Sikorsky S-76A N2743E Petroleum Helicopters (PHI) 4 Jackson, KY
08-MAR-2000
Sikorsky S-76A PK-PUK Pelita Air Service 2 South China Sea
02-AUG-2000
Sikorsky S-76A PT-HRD Líder Táxi Aéreo 5 Penha, SC
20-MAR-2001
Sikorsky S-76A N376AL Air Logistics 0+1 Gulf of Mexico
19-MAY-2001
Sikorsky S-76A 758 Philippine Air Force 7 Sitio Manguba, 60 km from Puerto Princesa
05-JUL-2001
Sikorsky S-76B HL9240 Dae-Woo Shipbuilding Co 8 near P'ohang
16-JUL-2002
Sikorsky S-76A+ G-BJVX Bristow Helicopters 11 28 mi NE of Cromer, Norfolk
22-NOV-2002
Sikorsky S-76A PT-HUI Aeróleo Táxi Aéreo 0 Macaé, RJ
30-JAN-2003
Sikorsky S-76B-7 2309 Royal Thai Navy 1 Ban Mai, Muang, Chantaburi
14-MAR-2003
Sikorsky S-76A+ C-FTGD Canadian Helicopters 0 Baku Airport
05-JUL-2003
Sikorsky S-76A PT-YVM BHS Táxi Aéreo 5 off Campos dos Goytacazes, RJ
22-AUG-2003
Sikorsky S-76A+ PT-YAU Aeróleo Táxi Aéreo 0 Macaé Airport, RJ
23-MAR-2004
Sikorsky S-76A++ N579EH Era Aviation 10 70nm SW, Galveston, TX, Gulf of Mexico (GOM)
20-APR-2004
Sikorsky S-76A PT-YBG Líder Táxi Aéreo 0 Macaé, RJ
22-JUL-2004
Sikorsky S-76A PP-MYM BHS Táxi Aéreo 6 160 km NE off Rio de Janeiro, RJ
18-SEP-2004
Sikorsky S-76C SE-JUJ Norrlandsflyg 0 E of Skräckskär
10-JAN-2005
Sikorsky S-76C+ JA6903/MH903 Japan Coast Guard 0 52 km WSW off Niigata (KIJ)
12-JAN-2005
Sikorsky S-76A PP-MCS BHS Táxi Aéreo 0 Macaé Airport, RJ
17-JUN-2005
Sikorsky S-76C+ N317MY Corporate Aviation Services 0 New York, NY
10-AUG-2005
Sikorsky S-76C+ OH-HCI Copterline 14 Baltic Sea, off Tallinn
06-SEP-2005
Sikorsky S-76A+ N90421 Houston Helicopters (HHI) 0 Gulf of Mexico
22-OCT-2006
Sikorsky S-76A++ N22342 Petroleum Helicopters Inc (PHI) 0 Eugene Island (EI) Block 259, Gulf of Mexico
- -2006
Sikorsky S-76A PT-HRF Líder Táxi Aéreo 0
-JUL-2007
Sikorsky S-76A++ B-73.. Zhuhai Helicopter/COPC 0 Bohai Bay
08-FEB-2008
Sikorsky S-76A C-GIMR Canadian Helicopters 0 Temagami, ON
29-MAY-2008
Sikorsky S-76A N176SH EMS Helicopters, opf. Aero Med 0 Grand Rapids, MI
18-SEP-2008
Sikorsky S-76B N399BH private 0 Bettystown, Meath County
04-JAN-2009
Sikorsky S-76C++ N748P Petroleum Helicopters (PHI) 8 near Houma, Terrebonne Parish, LA
11-MAR-2011
Sikorsky S-76C JA6905/MH905 Japan Coast Guard 0 Sendai Airport (RJSS)
11-JUL-2011
Sikorsky S-76C++ F-HJCS Héli-Union 3 Andaman Sea, off Myanmar coast
17-APR-2012
Sikorsky S-76B N56RD RDC Marine Inc 0 near Vermilion VR376A, Gulf of Mexico
13-AUG-2012
Sikorsky S-76A C-GHJT Helijet International 0 Langara Island, BC
26-SEP-2012
Sikorsky S-76C G-CGOU Bristow Helicopters 0 19 miles ENE of Humberside Airport, Kirmington, Lincolnshire
15-MAR-2013
Sikorsky S-76A++ N574EH Era Helicopters LLC 3 Grand Lake, LA
27-APR-2013
Sikorsky S-76B N305SJ Dominican Watchman National 0 Constanza
31-MAY-2013
Sikorsky S-76A C-GIMY Ornge Global Air Inc. 4 Moosonee, ON
16-NOV-2013
Sikorsky S-76C++ HL9294 LG Electronics 2 Gangnam, Seoul
05-DEC-2013
Sikorsky S-76B N707MY MYU Helicopters 0 Port Fourchon (LS99), LA
12-DEC-2013
Sikorsky S-76C 9M-STE MHS Aviation 0 South China Sea, 159 km off Bintulu, Sarawak
21-MAR-2015
Sikorsky S-76C+ PK-FUP PT Hevilift Aviation Indonesia 0 Kutai Lama, Anggana, East Kalimantan
12-AUG-2015
Sikorsky S-76C+ 5N-BGD Bristow Helicopters (Nigeria) 6 off Oworonshoki, Lagos Lagoon
03-FEB-2016
Sikorsky S-76C++ 5N-BQJ Bristow Helicopters (Nigeria) 0 75nm off Lagos

@Geoffersincornwall
I can just imagine the guys back at the Sikorsky factory trying to get their heads around this. The system was designed and built by the previous generation of engineer/designers so in theory the current generation bear no guilt - if there is guilt to be borne. But would they be wise to come forward and admit that the hydraulic system has a fundamental design flaw? Can you imagine the fall-out that would accompany such an admission?
Industry insider don't forget to make an answer for @Geoffersincornwall!
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 15:45
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Are you suggesting, Copterline, that all of these accidents fit your pattern and theory? I am not sure you would be correct, if so.

I think it's you who should reply to Geoffers not II as its you who is making accusations against an OEM. What would you do?
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 15:52
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 16:15
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@terminus mos
Are you suggesting, Copterline, that all of these accidents fit your pattern and theory? I am not sure you would be correct, if so
No, no but if you visit on ASN Wikibase occurrence / S-76 site you will find out that there is too many cases where the loss of the controllability is an issue. Check one by one these 93 accidents or occurrences you will have a picture.
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 16:23
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@HLCPTR your quote #581
I may be slow but if I read your symbols correctly?

do you mean: Do not beat it anymore, it is already dead?
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 17:03
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Originally Posted by Copterline 103
No, no but if you visit on ASN Wikibase occurrence / S-76 site you will find out that there is too many cases where the loss of the controllability is an issue. Check one by one these 93 accidents or occurrences you will have a picture.
So you quote a Wiki page - to which anyone can edit or post - as an authoritative reference? For a start they have the location of the 12 Mar 1981 tragic accident to a Bristow S-76 incorrect. As I was flying the same type from Aberdeen at the time I know it occurred near Peterhead and many miles away from the quoted Westhill. So what else do they have wrong.

Wiki also don't have my 1985 accident listed (a mechanical issue in another type). Wiki is hardly something you can rely upon to support your arguments. As HLCPTR indicates, you are 'flogging a dead horse' with your repetitive posts.
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 17:34
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I started this thread just as information about an accident to a Bristow S76 in Nigeria, but it has been hijacked by all sorts of people, but of late mostly by Copterline to keep flogging his dead horse about every accident or incident on the S76 having a root cause in the hydraulic system. Maybe my S76 tyre puncture when taxiing in Port Harcourt in 2006 was due to hydraulic fluid contamination? I don't know because I don't have access to 60.000 non-public documents
Might I suggest that if this hydraulic horse is going to be flogged to death, Copterline starts a new thread of his own where those with an interest can avidly keep checking for the latest hydraulically inspired events while the rest of us wait to see if there's further concrete news about the S76 ditching.
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 20:23
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@keke napep
Maybe my S76 tyre puncture when taxiing in Port Harcourt in 2006 was due to hydraulic fluid contamination?
keke, there are already too many people who have lost their lives and too many families without their father or without their brother or sister. I wish that everybody would appreciate the flight safety. There are too many pilots who have to press ENG START BUTTON of S76 helicopters in daily bases. The safety and the real issues whatever these are have to be openly analyzed. My experience is that there are interest parties, who don’t care if someone died, but I care and I will make my best to make this helicopter industry safer for the crew members and passengers.

I can guarantee you that if there wouldn't be a real issue behind this I wouldn't care at all about these accidents. I wouldn’t care if someone innocent loses his or her life tomorrow. But I care and I have seen too much.

I have seen a tragedy where 14 people lost their lives, I have listened to more than 50 times CVR recordings to help the accident investigators to have an understanding what the f…. is ongoing when to pilots are fighting last half a minute of their lives. They made everything to safe their lives. After this experience I assume that every human will make all necessary actions that this will not happen again.

I hope that some crew could save their own lives and their colleagues lives by making the Stick Jump test properly and in a case of in-flight if all actions to analyze, verified and the helicopter is still unflyable. At least the crew should try to switch OFF HYD1 and if that doesn't help switch OFF HYD2. Referring to gulliBell #549

@gulliBell
The only way to counter an un-commanded extension/retraction of a servo is to depressurization the system at the servo inlet, which is the purpose of the servo shutoff valve.
As far as I know, in the Copterline accident the crew didn't switch off the servo when its power piston went to full extension. I don't think they knew they were faced with a hydraulic problem.
The flight safety is an issue which no one should take arrogantly, so I think your comment “the tire puncture when taxiing” and the reference to “the hydraulic fluid contamination” was very inappropriate and unprofessional.
My intention is not to hijack Your thread and I won’t do it. This thread has had 16.456 visitors during the last seven (7) days and the thread Bristow Down in Lagos has had 760 visitors during the last 24 hours. Let’s work together for the safety.

Last edited by Copterline 103; 28th Mar 2016 at 20:36. Reason: Typo corrections
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 21:06
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Copterline,

You claim to be an S76 TRE/IRE and you talk about pressing an S76 start button? .

Well I've also got more than a few thousand hours on the type and am also a TRE/IRE on it. I lost a good friend, Mark Wake who was one of 11 killed when G-BJVX crashed into the North Sea in July 2002, and another 2 good friends when5N-BGD crashed last August.

Flight safety is not an attitude I take arrogantly, but I'm also not so arrogant as to think that ramming my own personal theories down everyone throat is a way of enhancing it. Sometimes bringing a little humour into a situation (even a tragic one) makes people remember things far better than listening to someone who constantly wants to be so arrogant as to assume they're the only one who can possibly know the answer and harps on about conspiracy theories behind closed curtains as a way to try and show he knows more than anyone else. If you have proof of something, man up and show us, otherwise your opinion is worth no more than any other person's.
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 21:51
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@keke Napep
You claim to be an S76 TRE/IRE and you talk about pressing an S76 start button? .
keke, I'm the lucky one since the last flight with S76C+ ten years ago. Since till now an TRI/TRE/IRI/IRE SP/MP for AW139.

Still memorizing that S76C+ start up sequence will be started by pressing start button which is located in the #1 and #2 Power lever and then the start up process is fully automatic. Correct if my memory is not good enough?
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Old 28th Mar 2016, 22:56
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Ah well, maybe you really have flown the S76 then, but flashing round lots of supposed qualifications really isn't a good way to try and make a point on this forum, unless you really are someone like Nick Lappos and he doesn't constantly push his qualifications down everyone's throat. Constant talk of 60.000 secret documents, helping numerous AIBs, IRI etc doesn't impress people who just get on, carry out daily or every day checks before flight as laid down either in the RFM or their company check lists. I'm sure you know that the only part of the RFM which is legally binding is the limitations section. However, in case of litigation, it would be a foolish company which did not incorporate all the elements of the normal and emergency checks from the RFM into their own checklists.
When I worked for Bristow we carried out the hydraulic checks as laid down in the RFM as part of each start up and carried out the FDR and autopilot checks daily or A/R (before each flight for IMC flight). Every pilot carried out annual simulator training (as required by the NCAA) of 12 hours (14 hours for those pilots carrying out command assessment for upgrade). In addition, while I was still working for them and we were using the FSI simulator in West Palm Beach we had a session on the GFS, covering one or two of the systems in more detail. In addition an Elite Simulators FNPT (based on an IFR AS355F1 with a simple EFIS) was purchased some years ago and eventually installed in a purpose-built facility in Port Harcourt so that pilots could receive additional instrument procedure training and MCC and Command training. Of course, Bristow do not have a GFS in their simulator facility in Aberdeen, but all pilots are required to do external online S76 refresher training every year.
Keke Napep is offline  
Old 28th Mar 2016, 23:02
  #580 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
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but flashing round lots of supposed qualifications really isn't a good way to try and make a point on this forum
You mean, like you just did?


Well I've also got more than a few thousand hours on the type and am also a TRE/IRE on it.
Nescafe is offline  

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