Could someone tell me how oxfords modular atpl theory and waypoint program are viewed by the airlines?

Theoretically speaking if I happen to do oxfords atpl full time and thereafter their waypoint program. Wouldnt this be considered the same quality as integrated? or am I being a bit too optimistic on my way of thinking?

I wonder from 0 to ATPL module system, is the following the correct route as what I understood?

PPL -> Multi CPL/IR -> MCC -> ATPL

My current location could not even complete PPL due to limited airspace so I am looking at country such as MY for PPL and the rest in NZ/AU. Or do every module in NZ/AU.

Any advise? pm me if posting sch name is not advisable.

Thank.;)

Lowest cost 0 to fATPL in the UK
 

The following taken from a flight training price comparison web site Oct 2011 :ok:

Best possible UK Flight Training Organisation prices for each module:
PPL (from targetaviation) £6982
Night Rating (from targetaviation) £820
100 Hours solo flight (including Landing fees fuel and vat) EGGP £7374.00
ATPL exams (from CATS) £999.00
CPL - 28 hr incl MEP Ravenair £6638.50
IR Instrument Rating Ravenair £9999.00
MCC course various £1750.00
Grand Total (for comparison purposes) ** £34,562.50

How much can you pay for the same deal?
* Costs taken off official company web sites / price lists including discounts and advertised special offers
BCFT Bournmouth Commercial Flight raining £43,724.03
Excludes: CAA exam fees CPL test fee, IR test fee CAA issue costs, PPL equip

Multiflight £37,950.00
Excludes: Medical, CPL test fee, IR Test Fee, CAA exam fees, CAA licence issue fees, Aircraft hire for tests, 170A fee, Landing and approach fees in UK, flights to and from USA, accommodation in USA, headset, meals in the USA, all training must be done in min hrs - Excludes the MCC even thought it is essential for fATPL.
PPL and hour build MUST be done in USA.

Flying Time Aviation £45,450.00
Excludes all tests CAA fees and a/c hire for tests, minimum hours only on all courses, medical

Atlantic Flight Training Ireland £51,346.00
Excludes, Flight test fees, flights to ireland, accommodation in ireland, Medical

Triple A Flying £31,500.00 Only for isolated PPL CPL and IR, excludes half of all you need, too much to list !

Aero's £23,00.00 Only for isolated PPL CPL and IR, excludes half of all your need for an fATPL

Flight Training Europe £71,000.00 Actual includes everything !

Heavy Goods Vehicle (Cat C) drivers course: 5 days, £895, earn £18-20k/year

General Domestic Electrician's course: 17 days, £2,295 (+ tools & van), earn ~£25-35k/year

General Domestic level 2 Plumbing course: 10 weeks, £4,795 (+ tools & van), earn ~£30-40k/year

Level 3 Plumbing and Gas Engineer course: 20 weeks, £12,975 (+ tools & van), earn ~£35-45k/year

Earnings, of course are rough average values - but you can live anywhere you like, be your own boss, work business hours & holidays (don't underestimate how much this means!), and earnings can be much higher running a successful business (and much lower with an unsuccessful one!).

CPL pilot, with ATPL subject passes (modular): 2-3 years, £40,000 (+ type rating), earn ~£15-25k/year?

An employee for the rest of your life, forced to live where the airports are (very commonly in a foreign country), getting up at 3 am or home at 1 am, and never seeing a weekend or having a public holiday (like Christmas) off. Your license will be on the line every six months, and totally worthless in the event of any of a dozen common medical conditions.

It has to be said ...

Has anyone looked at the waypoint programme at OAA (MECPL, IR and MCC)? roughly £28,000 but with accomodation on top. Need 150 hours, ppl and night rating and also atpl exams done but to me sounds like a good modular course at a well known school

thanks
 

hi
This sounds crazy but me as a beginner who has never attained any training at zero knowledge about flight, do you think this school can accept me with my O, level education qualifications

Mate unless you have the right to work in the EU it really isn't worth looking at any EU courses, they are much more expensive than else where. No airline unless you have some special qualification will sponsor you for a work permit.

Most schools will take you on with zero qualifications all they are interested in is getting the cash out of you.

hi
thanks for your concern. i will try my best before i clock twenty next year to get a sponsor to help me but i am deeply going mad with this..
that's why i need advice in these things.
thanks

Do airlines love more Modular Pilot or Integrated Pilot?
 

Hi here,

I have just some considerations to share with the ppruners.

I met and discussed with the biggest academies, they all said: "in our integrated path you will be in the careers pool" Over here, is there somebody who was in front of this choice?
Are arilines rectruiting "modular" pilot? I a will be at 99% a module pilot due to money and job restrictions... but I am still asking to myself: do I risk to be rejected becouse I am not an integrated pilot?

Are there flight schools whose are truly considered high standard FTOs?


:ok:

There are just as many companys that won't look at you because your an intergrated pilot than there is that will only take intergrated.

The majority don't care either way.

The last 3 companys I worked for wouldn't touch them with a stick low hours unrated. And in that 5 year period they must have taken on about 20 first rating modular pilots and only 2 intergrated low hour but had bought the rating. Unfortunately one didn't complete the base check.

Not in the world of the well known brands there aren't! By the way it is integrated there is only one r.

hi again,

let's say, do serious airlines prefer modular one because they have chosen the "good way" to get trained?
For instance, lat's take Easyjet (not Ryanair because we well know the procedure): they always employ pilot trough CTC or OAA, and accord to the press actually, Easyjet is one of the company is recruiting. So my question is, how do I get in Easy avoiding this cast cages?

bye bye!

It is cheaper, but the question I ask myself: will you get a job with it in the end? Because that's what it's all about: get a job and earn more than you invested.
Seeing that my local flight school asks €0,20 a second flying a Twin star I'm getting desperate and think about just forgetting it all:ugh:

I still ask to me:

Is cheaper OK 50k... Integrated is 80k or more. BUT: if with the first one I throw the money and with the second one maybe not.... this is the problem?

hey shekspeare where are you????:ugh:

Employment Statistics | Oxford Aviation Academy - OAA.com

They speak for themselves.

Apart from getting screwed for a brookfield contract and temp contract with easy. Both of which you can get access to with mod training. There isn't anything in it. And the plane deliverys will be ending soon so that life line to wannabies will dry up.

The other old favourit BMI isn't in a good position just now.

TC are going for contract summer pilots

So none of the well know brands are recruiting. Even BA are only going to take extras from CTC so if you want a chance at any extra spaces you would be mad going to any of the others.

And I have my doudts about whats going to happen in the EU next year with various things that will come through to shaft the airlines. If my expectations do occur the BA cadets will be doing a bit of trolly dollying before flying the line.

So all thats going to be left is the unknown brands which you will have no advantage with.

what about "modular low hours pilots"
 

Yes, I am still thinking that is a very difficult choice.

I always said: "let's try to get a licence and then I will see". But now I am pretty sure I will be in a big number of dreamer people that have tried the same strategy and did not find yet a true employment.

For instance: over here: (specially in this thread) are there modular pilots who got a job in airline with only 200hours??? Any real experience? :ok:

nobody can really answer to my question? :bored:

I will answer to you. do you mind?

do you think an airline will hire you if you come from integrated, or do you think you will pay more if you go integrated?.



here do you see people getting hired with 200h? where do you see people getting hired with 20'000hours integrated or not?
do you see advertisement in the flying mag calling for low hours integrated pilots??? no!


actually, airlines don't need pilots except to make you believe to join a flight school and spend all your cash in one of their TRTOs.

the truth is one you have paid your cash in their non return trap , you can bet contract will change and you have no recourse to leave or pay more money.

see flight school getting closed?, example: cabair, pay more or we will close the school! why the hell they choose the DA40-42 where nobody can find spare parts?

or look at BA who still can not decide since months to run or not a cadet training and people talking and talking,...and getting nothing at the end, just some promess...

and finally look at Greece and Italy, and USA who have trillion of debt, do you thing airlines will start to hire today or tomorrow?

go integrated if you want, i know where you will finish, certainly not on the right seat of an airbus 320.

if you are here on pprune, it s because millions of pilots can not find a job...if there were jobs everywhere, this site would not exist as pilot would not find the time to write comments here.

this profession is dead since long time, I bet in 3 years, you will ask yourself why you chose this profession. You will probably finish in debt and no way to pay back...

don't be a dreamer, come back to earth, and learn a proper job where yo can make real money!

Funny that, seeing as 21 CTC cadets have just been placed with Qatar Airways, 8 have been pre-selected for Monarch for starting in Summer 2013, and around 8 a week are currently starting type rating for easyJet.

CTC is a different kettle of fish to the others. And for years it was a modular course.

The main reason for them going Integrated was that they can throw you out the door with 170 hours instead of 200 thus getting an additional 3000 quid plus profit out of each student.

Hi aviators,

I am currently living in Chelmsford (Essex) and working in a hospital, saving as much as possible to pay my ATPL, CPL, IR...I´m going to start the ATPL (Distance learning) in the next few weeks and the next year going on with the rest.

Will I be able to do CPL, IR, and ME and working at the same time?? I got a permanent job ( 3 long days on, 4 days off) in my ward so that´s why I can pay these expensive studies, i would prefer not leaving my job until everything has been paid.

How long does it take doing these last 3 licences ? CPL, IR and ME is all about flying or I´ll have to go to classes as well??

Any help will be appreciated.

A young spanish ppl struggling to become a PILOT.:}

Just a quick thought, especially if like me you are thinking about which training provider to use....

The Government doesn't recognise student pilots as official students, so we are hoping to bring this issue to their attention.

Class pilots in training as students - e-petitions

Please add your signature to this, 100,000 seems along way off but I think we can get there.

Thanks

:)

After reading this thread have I got it right from what people are saying? If going integrated then go CTC? If going modular choose pretty much anyone? I went to the CTC open day on Saturday and they claim that if you pass with them they have a 100% placement with an airline.

I would be very careful of any flying training orgranisation making such claims.
Airlines will only take pilots if they need them. The law of supply and demand.

Read the small print and the T & Cs, what does "placement" actually mean?
Many years ago some BA cadets were "placed" as cabin staff until a flight crew job became available.

Even if there was the possiblity of a placement TODAY, that might not be the case when you qualify in 15 months time. It could be the greatest pilot demand since 1940, on the other hand.... and NOBODY really knows.

I did think it would be too good to be true. Also using one of the links above shows Easyjet took on 70 odd last year yet at the open day they said they took about 200.

Another thing that annoyed me was that they said they placed you in rented accommodation near the training facility. When I asked if I could just stay at home seen as I live less than 10 miles away they basically said no!

Have decided to go modular. Has anyone used PAT in Bournemouth? Going to speak to them shortly to see what they have to say.

They were getting through with CTC before they went intergrated. There is virually no change in the course though between then and now.

CTC have sown up that end of the hours range.

And although on a crappy TP I know of 5 low houred wannbies who have just got jobs and are starting type ratings. Only one of them is intergrated and he wasn't going to get the job but his dad knows the owner so he is getting in even though the trainers arn't to happy about it.

Poeli:

"It is cheaper, but the question I ask myself: will you get a job with it in the end? Because that's what it's all about: get a job and earn more than you invested.
"

I think that has already been answered, ie: YOU ask yourself: will you get a job with an integrated FTO ? And also - if "thats what its all about" get a job as a banker.

I will give you my example just so you see where some people stand.

I have SAVED (through working my arse off for the last 8 years) for my PPL (I have just progressed into navigation), and the ATPL theory, CPL, IR,ME that will follow. What that means in plain english, is that I have enough CASH to be 100% debt free and with a nice little blue CAA folder under my arm in a years time or so - PROVIDED I DO IT MODULAR.

What happens then ? - Well, if I DO NOT get a "proper" job then I will not have 800 pounds a month repayments and will easily be able to stay current & perhaps think of an instuctors rating if the "proper" job doesnt materialise too soon. To me taking the integrated course would mean inability to maintain my license/ratings once I attain them due to severe debt.

In any case, I would not have the heart to ask my mum/dad to remortgage their house for such a gamble. Yes, its hard to get a "proper" flying job but t**gh sh*t, just get on with it - Im spending all of my life savings but dont moan about it because I love flying.

As for people giving it all this"...there is no jobs, its a waste of time..." sure, there is no farkin jobs, BUT - do you love flying or do you just want to pull chicks in your (insert a posh airline name here) uniform & aviators, while getting paid 100k for the pleasure ???

Totally agree with chuck-ski!
At the moment, I have my ppl, currently hour building in my spare time where I can as I'm working my butt off saving money (£1000 per month). I do have time on my side as I'm only 19 and luckily have a full time job in an atc unit.
And as for jobs, I worked as cabin crew for 6 months prior, and in aviation I found out it's not about what you do, it's about who you know. So why would I spend an extra £30k on going integrated?! Keep going and you'll get there

Help with renewal of LR
 

Hey,

Can anyone help me as my LR is lapsed and my IR will be down too in march. According to DGCA where can i renew it and how much sim time will i have to do get that renewed. If i renew the LR than will my IR be renewed automatically with it or will i have to do some extra flying? And where can i get it done?
Thanks

I don't think many folk here will have a clue about Indian licensing system. This thread is nearly all about the two deferent methods of completing commercial training in the UK.

The old will I get a job?
 

I know two people in the last 3 months to leave Oxford Integrated and do a FI course and still not get one. One did have an interview with Ryanair; but didn't actually get it. So he paid 30k for that interview you could perhaps argue?

In every career you will have those that work their way up and those that are looking for the fast track to the top. The fast track is high reward high risk; which the large FTO's jazz up their chances. You never get a ratio of the success rate because it wouldn't be so glossy.

Can you justify an extra 30k for the same quality of training? A nice lady organising the course for you? Not to mention the fact you have interest and taxed earnings taking your 70k to close to 160-180k to actually repay to the bank. If you can't then modular or choose a different career.

It doesn't help that students can get 9k + bursaries in goverment loans for their education for ridiculus courses such as warehouse management and david beckham studies. And for us their isn't anything.

Think about it, why would the gouvernment give money for training when there are not enough jobs for everyone who did the training WITHOUT the money?
That would also be a waste in my opinion. It would make flight training slightly cheaper but won't change the current job situation.

It gives loans. The government however only gives the universities money to run courses that they perceive as useful (engineering, medicine, science...); the "ladies basket weaving" courses are run entirely on student fees (borrowed and they have to give back).

There are serious problems with the loans system of-course, and I'm sure student pilots would like a chance to take one of those loans out, but the government isn't subsidising most of those courses beyond the loan interest via the student loan company.

I did not realise that was the case. However in the UK I know alot of people that went to Uni for courses that won't help them get a job at the end of it and the student loans company does help them out.

People that would be better off going and getting a job. People are having to work for longer because people are coming into the tax system at 21-23.

When you look at 100k to get a job. You'd be better off buying half a house and going to work at Tesco.

I'm really wanting to be a commercial pilot, hopefully one day for a large airline. At the moment, money is looking like it's going to be a big issue, so, Modular seems like the way forwards, but, I'm really worried I will walk out with my (f)ATPL, go and get a type rating, and then, after being around £54k in debt, have no job at the end. At least with an integrated you are sometimes practically guaranteed one, at least for a 'summer job', but then, at least after that, you have the experience, so are maybe more attractive to potential employees. A friend of my brothers is now a pilot for Ryanair, having gone down the Integrated route at OAA (His parents have money flowing out their ears), and he says that people who go integrated are much more attractive to airlines than modular, because it's quicker and shows dedication (or something like that). Is this true? I'm only 16 at the moment, but, we hardly have any money, so, it looks like it'll be the modular route for me.

Thanks

More dedicated than someone who is funding their training the modular route by working 60 hours a week and knowing they are going to be doing that for a couple more years before they have just their bare licences in their hands!? :*:mad:

Ah, yeah, good point, although the modular route can only last 18 months if you do it full time?

I believe that only applies to the groundschool exams. I.e. you have 18 months after you've completed your first exam to finish the rest. Once the last exam is complete you then have 36 months in which to gain your CPL/IR. :)

As in, if you do the course full time, at FABlackpool, for example, they say they can get you through from zero-(f)ATPL in 18 months

Yes totally agree keep pushing. Go and work as cabin crew for a year anything...there are loads of different ways push push push don't fall by the wayside. 8/10 milionairs were financially bankrupt you need to take some risks keep pushing in anything you do success will come.

"I don't say I can't, I ONLY SAY I CAN" Arnold schwarzenegger. Professional bodybuilder, 1st Austrain Governer of Calif.

How many people did he prove wrong that told him it can't be done.