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Leading Edge LEAP+FI, & TUI UK Pilot Cadet Programmes

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Leading Edge LEAP+FI, & TUI UK Pilot Cadet Programmes

Old 7th Feb 2023, 15:58
  #181 (permalink)  
 
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Unfortunaly for a lot of us, we don't have the privillage of parents having second homes they can sell, or even one home they can remortgage, or any well of family members to inherit from. My parents couldn't even afford a £50 weekend Ryanair flight or the cost of a passport. I didn't get my passport or get to see a plane in person until I was 23 and 3 years later I'm now a licenced pilot.
Funding is a huge blocker and for most, the only way past that is to get a well paid job and I mean £60k+ a year in the UK if you want to pay for the modular route in a reasonable amount of time. To do full modular course now in the UK over 3 years you're looking at burning through an average of £2k a month over 3 years and that isn't even accounting for a type rating. It doesn't matter how much you want it. For the majority, you either need to get onto a sponsored course or get a very well paid job that will llikely require a degree.
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Old 7th Feb 2023, 16:06
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Originally Posted by SoftwareDev
Unfortunaly for a lot of us, we don't have the privillage of parents having second homes they can sell, or even one home they can remortgage, or any well of family members to inherit from. My parents couldn't even afford a £50 weekend Ryanair flight or the cost of a passport. I didn't get my passport or get to see a plane in person until I was 23 and 3 years later I'm now a licenced pilot.
Funding is a huge blocker and for most, the only way past that is to get a well paid job and I mean £60k+ a year in the UK if you want to pay for the modular route in a reasonable amount of time. To do full modular course now in the UK over 3 years you're looking at burning through an average of £2k a month over 3 years and that isn't even accounting for a type rating. It doesn't matter how much you want it. For the majority, you either need to get onto a sponsored course or get a very well paid job that will llikely require a degree.
I do agree with you, I was just giving my side and my situation, I do count myself very lucky that my mum does have a second house, without it Id be screwed. However, I donít like the whole notion of success = degree. Itís pretty toxic, and I was fed the same thing growing up. Most of my friends from school, are now in a high paying job. My mate is on 50k a year in management role with rubbish a levels. Some higher some lower. If youíve got a levels, youíre fine. Even high GCSEs. Degrees are becoming less and less useful, especially in this case someone wanting to be apilot, why pay 30k and then maintenance loans aswell to get a job, that is only to end. A degree is for something that you really want and are passionate about and you want a long career in. Speaking to loads of people at different school, one guy has flown in under three years being an Amazon delivery driver, training at the side and heís finished his modular course.

i do agree, a degree would put you in a higher place for jobs like finance, law, medicine etc. But to me, and in MY opinion, a degree for the sole purpose of saving for a pilots course is ridiculous imo, the money spent (that has to be paid back) for a temporary job isnít something I would want to do, PERSONALLY. I have so much regret, if, when I was 18, carried on my Hermes job (I got about 20,000 a year) I could have easily saved 90,000£. But I didnít.
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Old 7th Feb 2023, 16:23
  #183 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Arena_33
I think you are looking at the issue from a very different perspective to most unfortunately. I myself am in the same boat as softwaredev - had to get a degree to get a job that pays enough to fund training.

A degree for the purpose of saving for training is not ridiculous, it isn't ideal no, but for some of us it is the only option. Student finance only has to be paid back in small amounts and for the vast majority will be written off after 30 years, with repayments rarely going above £150 pm, so student debt cant be looked at in the same way as a normal loan situation.

I assume 'easily' being able to save £90,000 in cash earning £20k was sarcasm??
Iím just speaking out of my own experiences. My sister has a first class honours, from Edinburgh - she is sitting in a admin job 🫡 like you say itís individual circumstances. I am sure everyone will be different. I just am not motivated at all to do my degree. Itís a lot of hard work especially maths to do it just to save. I had a lot more fun driving vans around. I guess; if youíre not looking to be a pilot for letís say 10 years. If youíre a school leaver, have no money / then I guess focusing on a career first and then having a pilot career as a future aspiration.

Maybe im just different, I just couldnít hold a three year degree out to get a job I have no interest in actually having long term.

and haha maybe, I was basing it again on my situation : living at home with maximum saving intentions , donít have to pay board or anything.
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Old 7th Feb 2023, 19:44
  #184 (permalink)  
 
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An AeroEng degree may have some use but not everyone is cut out for the university route. I tried it, was rubbish at calculus and algebra and dropped out after around six months. I simply wasn't cut out for university learning, as is the case with a lot of people.

I know a fellow who was a plumber in London and had a mortgage, wife and kids by 25. That in itself would fund the modular route with no debt. We were both train drivers at the same company, incidentally train driving is a great way to fund flying, I used it to fund my PPL. If it hadn't been for COVID, I'd have looked at going modular and if I hadn't just moved to intercity work I'd have put in for this.

The Pendolino west coast operator is apparently doing a big trainee recruitment programme this month for trainee train drivers. All the training is paid for by the company plus a £40k salary and defined-benefit pension from day one of training, salary goes up progressively to nearly £70k once two years qualified. The TUI programme is very good but it doesn't come close financially.
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Old 8th Feb 2023, 19:54
  #185 (permalink)  
 
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Anyone had updates beyond Stage 3 / invitations to Stage 4 for the TUI programme?

Iíve completed my digital interviews, but no updates so far beyond that. I was invited to them basically immediately after the online assessments - I scored Average, and Above Average x2.
Just wondering how itís going for you guys, if youíve heard anything, or if anyone knows a timescale?

Heard there have been over 10,000 applicants to the role, so I presume Stage 3 -> 4 will be the great filter!
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Old 9th Feb 2023, 07:54
  #186 (permalink)  
 
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A degree costs more and takes longer than a modular fATPL, so getting one should be considered a luxury, it certainly shouldn't be considered a useful step into aviation, the US excluded obviously..

It's very very simple to find training: foolproof even.
1 get a job.
2 get a second/third job.
3 move in with your parents.
4 don't smoke, drink or procreate.
5 borrow just enough to establish decent credit.
6 actually know what a fATPL will cost you, then save half and borrow half.

In the UK, budget £40k to be employable as a cadet.
2 years of living like a monk and you'll have £20k, then split the rest across multiple loans and 0% credit cards.



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Old 9th Feb 2023, 11:58
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Originally Posted by SoundGazelle
I’ve completed my digital interviews, but no updates so far beyond that. I was invited to them basically immediately after the online assessments - I scored Average, and Above Average x2.
Just wondering how it’s going for you guys, if you’ve heard anything, or if anyone knows a timescale?

Heard there have been over 10,000 applicants to the role, so I presume Stage 3 -> 4 will be the great filter!
Apparently we will find out in mid March if we are to be selected for the assessment day, which will be held w/c 22/05.

Last edited by D4NPC; 9th Feb 2023 at 12:43.
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Old 9th Feb 2023, 11:59
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For modular in the UK youíre looking at £65kish if completed in minimum hours with no exam resits, no flying test resits, no medical investigations and thatís just for PPL CPL ME/IR APS MCC without a type rating which is currently around Ä30k with Ryanair.

You then have to factor in general day to day living costs on top. Living with parents for free is not an option everyone has.

Right now in the UK to complete modular training over 3 years you will be burning through £2000 per month minimum in training costs.

Loans and credit cards? Good luck getting anything decent without a well paid job.

Also - that training makes you a qualified commercial pilot. It does not make you an airline pilot. You may never get an airline job. Any debt is a massive risk if at the end, no airline wants to hire you and you have no other career or qualifications. Thatís why people get a degree first. There are thousands of qualified commercial pilots who havenít been able to get an airline job. Flight schools are full of them teaching PPL for minimum wage.
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Old 9th Feb 2023, 12:44
  #189 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SoftwareDev
For modular in the UK youíre looking at £65kish if completed in minimum hours with no exam resits, no flying test resits, no medical investigations and thatís just for PPL CPL ME/IR APS MCC without a type rating which is currently around Ä30k with Ryanair.

You then have to factor in general day to day living costs on top. Living with parents for free is not an option everyone has.

Right now in the UK to complete modular training over 3 years you will be burning through £2000 per month minimum in training costs.

Loans and credit cards? Good luck getting anything decent without a well paid job.

Also - that training makes you a qualified commercial pilot. It does not make you an airline pilot. You may never get an airline job. Any debt is a massive risk if at the end, no airline wants to hire you and you have no other career or qualifications. Thatís why people get a degree first. There are thousands of qualified commercial pilots who havenít been able to get an airline job. Flight schools are full of them teaching PPL for minimum wage.

Im not sure itís correct that instructors can be assumed to be failed airline pilots, the job needs to be done and by many pilots who donít want to be airline pilots an instructor role would be extremely desired. Without instructors, there would be no pilots, and without instructors there would be no flight schools.

The graduate pool in leading edge and skyborne are pretty low right now, not empty but low. My friend graduated skyborne along with 4 others who all got jobs at east jet.

but yeah, instructors arenít just failed airline pilots. I myself; have not a focus on instructing, but hell, if I graduate flight school and donít find a job straight away, you know what I wouldnít want to do? Get a job using my degree, Iíd much prefer to stay in aviation despite the wage and be a instructor until i found one.

there would be no instructors if it was a undesirable minimum wage job, everyone would go for something better, my driver role earned well above minimum wage
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Old 9th Feb 2023, 13:30
  #190 (permalink)  
 
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I absolutely did not say instructors can be assumed to be failed airline pilots. Itís an important and respectable profession. You also need another £10k on top of your training for the instructor rating.
Instructors get paid per hour flying. Many earn great money when they have a good reputation at a busy school. Many donít.
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Old 11th Feb 2023, 14:18
  #191 (permalink)  
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For anyone on the Leading Edge programme, I had my Phase 4 results email today - Was good news for me, and I'm on to Phase 5 (last one I believe?)

I'll be in Oxford at the academy on March 1st if anyone else is there?

Nothing from TUI at the moment - well not for me anyhow..
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Old 13th Feb 2023, 09:40
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Hi Blakey0204
Congratulations, i'll be there too! see you on the 1st
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Old 14th Feb 2023, 09:08
  #193 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by username482
Hi Blakey0204
Congratulations, i'll be there too! see you on the 1st
Congratulations to you too, see you there!
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Old 14th Feb 2023, 12:50
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Originally Posted by Blakey0204
For anyone on the Leading Edge programme, I had my Phase 4 results email today - Was good news for me, and I'm on to Phase 5 (last one I believe?)

I'll be in Oxford at the academy on March 1st if anyone else is there?

Nothing from TUI at the moment - well not for me anyhow..
The Leading Edge programme isn't anything that I applied for so I don't know much about it.
But getting to stage 5 of an assessment is definitely an achievement so congratulations to everyone that made it.
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Old 14th Feb 2023, 21:08
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Unfortunately it was a no for me, my essay let me down! I wish all the best to those going forward and will be interested to see who get awarded a spot! Onwards for me!

Cheers.
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Old 26th Feb 2023, 13:48
  #196 (permalink)  
 
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TUI MPL

Hey, I know weíre to hear back by mid March for the TUI programme, but has anybody been told no yet?
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Old 26th Feb 2023, 13:55
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Originally Posted by DreamBigger
Hey, I know weíre to hear back by mid March for the TUI programme, but has anybody been told no yet?

Hey, another email I sent weíve been told to hear back end of March, do you know anyone thatís been told no?
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Old 26th Feb 2023, 14:23
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Complete the Eng degree and join the Air Squadron whilst you are there. That will get you some flying hours for free.
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Old 4th Mar 2023, 23:19
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Still waiting to hear from TUI after the digital interview, although everyone keeps saying assessment days are end of May which if this is the case it makes no difference whether I get through or not as I'm away.
Does anybody know if these are set in stone or just hearday?
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Old 5th Mar 2023, 09:20
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Originally Posted by Panda91
Still waiting to hear from TUI after the digital interview, although everyone keeps saying assessment days are end of May which if this is the case it makes no difference whether I get through or not as I'm away.
Does anybody know if these are set in stone or just hearday?
The email they sent out said theyíre planned for the week commencing 22nd May, so unless that has changed Iíd say itís fairly set in stone. For a September start, itís already quite a quick turnaround from the end of May, particularly as there is still the sim assessment to complete after, so I canít see them being any later.
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