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Tracey Curtis-Taylor (Merged threads)

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Tracey Curtis-Taylor (Merged threads)

Old 25th Nov 2016, 17:02
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Her wiki page is a work of fiction.

Tracey Curtis-Taylor (born 1962) is a British aviator who has organised and piloted multiple flight expeditions with historic aircraft across Asia, Europe, Africa, Australia and America.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracey_Curtis-Taylor

Multiple?

Not solo though

What we want to know now is about why Ewald never got an award and how he helped her 'outreach' programme?
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 18:04
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Bearing in mind this is nominally an anonymous forum, is the person posting as "terry holloway" actually Terry Holloway of the Air League and Marshalls?
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 18:24
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Yes.

But I doubt he will stick around to answer my and Jonzaro's questions
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 18:37
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Originally Posted by Stanwell
So there we have it, ladies and gentlemen.
Kindly crawl back under your respective rocks.

Sorry to disagree with you, Terry.
That's all right!
However the lady has taken an unfair pasting from people who don't know the facts and should know how to behave!

Originally Posted by Tay Cough
Bearing in mind this is nominally an anonymous forum, is the person posting as "terry holloway" actually Terry Holloway of the Air League and Marshalls?
Of course it is. I really don't understand why people feel the need to hide their identity unless there is a fear of litigation or being found out!

Originally Posted by Jay Sata
Her wiki page is a work of fiction.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracey_Curtis-Taylor

Multiple?

Not solo though

What we want to know now is about why Ewald never got an award and how he helped her 'outreach' programme?
Well Erwald was mentioned in the HCAP Citation, and by his own declaration he was a passenger. Why would he lie?

Originally Posted by Littlest Hobo
That statement sums up the situation for me perfectly. I'd be appalled if my daughter was exposed to Ms. Curtis-Taylor's outreach in the name of aviation/engineering/STEM.

I speak not only as a mother, but also as an engineer, private pilot and STEM ambassador.
Have you heard her speak? She is a very good ambassador.
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 18:44
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However the lady has taken an unfair pasting from people who don't know the facts and should know how to behave!

Really? I don't think so..Have you read ALL of this thread? Lots of input from people who know her and are not terribly impressed, apart from the 'slightly' inaccurate solo flight stuff.
DW
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 18:52
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Originally Posted by SATCOS WHIPPING BOY
Terry you are more than welcome to your opinions and you are entitled to question our motives, in much the same way that we are questioning those of TCT and her supporters. Previous posters have summed it all up pretty well but I respectfully suggest you have a look at the evidence that has been pulled together by around 300 different posters on this thread alone.

From the outset it is clear that sponsorship has been raised based upon a ...how shall I put this tactfully... a lie.

There has been been no attempt to correct the media portrayal of these flights and there has even been clear occasions when she herself has stated the words "I was alone", "on my own" and "back from my SOLO flights" long after the events.

Any ab-initio to 10,000hr pilot knows the significance of the simple word; none will ever forget their first SOLO, that time when it was just their ability keeping them safe.

A lot of people know TCT very well and they know her history too - both personal and professional backgrounds. Many too know that most airfields where she has had any involvement have resulted in her leaving, or being asked to leave. A track record of airspace busts, crashes and a cavalier attitude to authority give a very good indicator as to her worth as a role model. A tendency to embellish "achievement" and a clear intent to deflect responsibility for adverse events onto others does not sit very well in any environment let alone aviation.

The LAA made their decision long before the video of her at Herne Bay was made public, I wonder what bluster she would have come out with at their AGM if it had been shown before the vote.

So...

Rather than calling the whistle-blowers childish and in need of getting a life, may I suggest you and your HCAP colleagues take a moment to REALLY look at the type of individual you are supporting. The citation re-writes just make you all look rather silly. Being gullible is not a crime and there would be no shame in admitting that you were, like us, misled from the start. If you were a true friend to her then you would be offering her help rather than delaying the end result by denying what has happened.

Whilst I have your attention and knowing that you know TCT, can you ask her what happened to the cameras that were on the SoA at the time it crashed at Winslow? I strongly suspect these were ferreted away PDQ as they are likely to show an event other than as described in her "incident" (sic) report. Whilst you are at it, ask her the questions yourself that we have been asking for months - you only need to flick back a page or two - and see if you, hand on heart, believe a word she says in reply.

As for anonymity; I have been on this forum for many years. Those that need to know who I am do so. This also extends to all parties that I have communicated with including staff at Entebbe Airport, Winslow Airport, Portsmouth University and many other bodies that have been drawn into this charade.
In which case why be anonymous?
She was NOT Solo and we all know that, and the basis of the awards is that she had a passenger on board.
I'm sorry that you antis, all sucked in by Jay Sata, can't recognise that it was a very impressive and gutsy trip whether dual or solo. By the same count I guess Jay Sata sees Amy Johnson as a fraud of some kind because she often flew with Jim Mollison on some of her flights.
Just give the girl some credit for her positive achievements instead of being so spiteful! That's what I mean by grow up!

Originally Posted by JW411
I have just heard on the BBC news that MPs have just passed a bill which prohibits the wearing of medals and military insignia to which you are not entitled. Maximum penalty is 6 months in jail and/or a 5,000 penalty. Get your cheque book out dear.
That appears no knock Goodwood on the head then!

Originally Posted by Lind1795
Are my eyes deceiving me? I think I have just seen a post by Terry Holloway on the Maurice Kirk thread saying TCT will be receiving another award on Monday - this time from the RAeS. Is that correct? Post seems to have disappeared.

I have just looked at the RAeS website and there certainly seems to be an award ceremony scheduled for the 28th November.
Yes. Recognising, as did The Air League and HCAP, the positives of her flight.

Originally Posted by Jay Sata
Yes.

But I doubt he will stick around to answer my and Jonzaro's questions
What questions and why not?

Originally Posted by DownWest
However the lady has taken an unfair pasting from people who don't know the facts and should know how to behave!

Really? I don't think so..Have you read ALL of this thread? Lots of input from people who know her and are not terribly impressed, apart from the 'slightly' inaccurate solo flight stuff.
DW
We beg to differ then!
Do you know her?

Originally Posted by Jay Sata
Her wiki page is a work of fiction.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracey_Curtis-Taylor

Multiple?

Not solo though

What we want to know now is about why Ewald never got an award and how he helped her 'outreach' programme?
What is fictional about that?
She organised, flew, and it was a vintage aircraft!
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 19:05
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No
But I did post on this thread before it became an expose. Most of TCT's back story has been shown to be a bit overplayed, to put it mildly. She does come across quite well in some of the videos, but others point out that she is not telling the truth. She has a lot to lose, but nobody else to blame if she does.
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 19:18
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Originally Posted by terry holloway
What questions and why not?
Terry

Thanks for your several posts. It is good to find someone prepared to debate this question seriously and who is prepared to present the other side of the argument.

The questions that I believe Ms Curtis-Taylor should answer were set out clearly in at least two posts that I have made in this thread. Here is a link to the second.

I would be very grateful if you can persuade Ms Curtis-Taylor to answer them.

PS: As does everyone here, I post under a "Nom de Prune". Mine is perhaps a little less opaque than some......
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 19:28
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So that's it then?

Air League awards boss Terry Holloway blames me for all the publicity and this thread?

She was NOT Solo and we all know that, and the basis of the awards is that she had a passenger on board.
I'm sorry that you antis, all sucked in by Jay Sata, can't recognise that it was a very impressive and gutsy trip whether dual or solo. By the same count I guess Jay Sata sees Amy Johnson as a fraud of some kind because she often flew with Jim Mollison on some of her flights.
Just give the girl some credit for her positive achievements instead of being so spiteful! That's what I mean by grow up!
The basis of the awards is she had a passenger
What does that mean Terry? Ewald was no passenger he was the engineer who built the Spirit of Artemis and also a commercial pilot with thousands of hours. All these flights were dual.

However the lady has taken an unfair pasting from people who don't know the facts and should know how to behave!
What facts?

Please explain.

Amy Johnson did it in 21 days in what was pretty much a Tiger Moth that can be bought today. Amanda Harrison is the only UK commercial Tiger Moth pilot and given the funds she could set off to replay Amy Johnson's flight next spring.

TCT lied from day one.

She told the worlds media that she was emulating Lady Mary Heath and Amy Johnsons epic trips.

She told the worlds media it took five years to find an aircraft to cope with the conditions.

Rubbish.

I could go out tomorrow and buy a Tiger Moth and assuming all the paperwork was OK be on my way to Sydney next week.

The truth is close to home Terry because Amanda Harrison has flown from Cambridge (where you are still an executive) and TCT has also been a key player at Cambridge?

Last edited by Mike Flynn; 25th Nov 2016 at 19:40.
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 19:36
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She was in Cambridge two weeks ago giving a (wellrecieved) talk on Queens, and will be back at some time. We helped her in the early stages or her planning and I introduced her to my chum Sam Rutherford (oh dear!).
When I see her I will pose the questions. I have seen her answer to the wings thing. She was presented with Navy wings and told she could and should wear them. Personal mi think that was wrong of the RN. The RAF have just given wings to Vic Norman, and I understand Carol Vauderman will soon get a pair......! That's up to the armed forces and nothing to do with those of us who are not serving. Winston Churchill got a paitprvas well!

Last edited by terry holloway; 25th Nov 2016 at 20:39.
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 19:47
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Whilst I accept that Terry Holloway has now verified his position at The Air League, and actually endorses the TC-T deceitful and fraudulent behaviour, we can perhaps now get a clearer understanding as to how he would go about conducting his own daily business. This is just normal daily antics/business for some.

I think he comes here to offer an absolutely pitiful and disgraceful defense in justifying the award, bearing in mind that the goal post were moved 3 times at HCAP just to make it fit and stick.

The other thing that really frustrates me is that 'they' believe we are stupid fools.
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 19:54
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Have you heard her speak? She is a very good ambassador.
I've heard a lot of people who spoke very well, selling a lot of things. That makes them good salespeople, but does not mean that what is being sold has the value presented.

I am a four decades pilot, and my experience includes trips as the only person aboard the plane, for thousands of miles. I am an aviation professional, whose business is serving general aviation clients. My business is absolutely dependent upon honour and ethics. The misrepresented and self contradictory information presented by TCT has convinced me, independent of the opinions of others, that TCT has a different moral compass than I. She does not represent the general aviation I proudly serve, so she cannot be an ambassador for aviation as I know it.

Two wrecked aircraft (yeah, the second one was much more than the "Incident" she declared), multiple violations of airspace she has admitted, low and poor weather flying she has admitted, and telling people she flew solo when that is not true, all indicate to me a person who should not be welcomed to reach out to new or impressionable aviation minded people. Awards having to be reworded after the fact to conform to the revealed truth, many examples of revisions to information to remove untruthful statements, all point to a poor moral foundation.

Ambassadors are selected to represent a group of people with pride and honour. TCT has not demonstrated to me that she can fill this role.

Yes, I have heard her speak on video. She spoke some lies, and just kept rolling along as though that was normal for her.

I am not affiliated with any of the organizations which have been drawn into this topic. As such, I have no standing with them, but can still hope they share my sense of honour in piloting (or even just being a person), and will stand up for this honour. An organization who awards accomplishment for a flight, which is so mired in doubt and dishonour, does not represent my piloting ethics.

If the TCT publicity machine, and peripheral supporting companies and associations really wanted to have an effective outreach program, instead of funding a joyride for a couple of pilots who seem determined to fly on their terms irrespective of anyone else's sense of what's right, they'd apply all that money directly to scholarships. For the cost of flying a Stearman and Caravan thousands of miles, you could get a lot of student pilots in the air for a few hours. What will impress those new aviators more? Recalling a few hours flying, or maybe scholarship right through to CPL? Or the faint memory of hearing a woman speak one day? No one speaks well enough to out memory a few hours of hands on flying!

TCT, where are you? You are credited with speaking well - speak to us! We're a tough audience, but we will listen to the truth....
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 19:55
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For those outside the UK who do not know the situation I am a retired journalist and recreational pilot.

Despite allegations on the Bird in the Biplane website I have never met,spoken to or indeed know what Sam Rutherford looks like. I am not an "associate" of Sam Rutherford as claimed
by Tracey Curtis Taylor.
Mr Rutherford has engaged in an online media campaign to discredit me and the BIAB team members by making false assertions concerning the expeditions and the roles of team members. I have previously stated publicly that I consider this to be part of a course of conduct designed to cause damage and distress. Mr Rutherford’s campaign is also promoted by his associate who operates under the pseudonym, Jay Sata in the press and in online forums, and in particular Pprune. The actions of Mr Rutherford are now the subject of legal proceedings and have been reported to the police. Sam Rutherford is a member of the LAA – he was not present at the AGM but was represented by his proxy, Chris Martyr
I have never met or indeed had any contact with Tracey Curtis Taylor. I have no reason to believe Chris Martyr is a proxy of Sam Rutherford.

If she wishes to continue to post unsubstantiated allegations on her website then that is up to her.

I have no personal agenda with her,her company Bird ina Biplane Ltd,the Honourable Company of Air Pilots,the Air League,Marshall's Aerospace Cambridge,Artemis,Boeing Aircraft Corporation or indeed any sponsors.

That's the legal bit out of the way.

I will admit I have long standing contacts and relationships with various news contacts who I discuss stories I am interested in.

What they do with information I aquire in the public domain is up to them
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 20:06
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Originally Posted by Jay Sata
So that's it then?

Air League awards boss Terry Holloway blames me for all the publicity and this thread?





What does that mean Terry? Ewald was no passenger he was the engineer who built the Spirit of Artemis and also a commercial pilot with thousands of hours. All these flights were dual.



What facts?

Please explain.

Amy Johnson did it in 21 days in what was pretty much a Tiger Moth that can be bought today. Amanda Harrison is the only UK commercial Tiger Moth pilot and given the funds she could set off to replay Amy Johnson's flight next spring.

TCT lied from day one.

She told the worlds media that she was emulating Lady Mary Heath and Amy Johnsons epic trips.

She told the worlds media it took five years to find an aircraft to cope with the conditions.

Rubbish.

I could go out tomorrow and buy a Tiger Moth and assuming all the paperwork was OK be on my way to Sydney next week.

The truth is close to home Terry because Amanda Harrison has flown from Cambridge (where you are still an executive) and TCT has also been a key player at Cambridge?
I don't know Amanda Harrison but I was prepared to contribute to her fund when she cancelled the trip. That was disappointing. However there are others who could do it and quite a few of my friends have (Aus that is). Tracey has never been "a key player" at Cambridge. She was going out with Robert Marshall for a brief period but then all her flying was from Old Warden where she kept her Ryan. She probably visited Cambridge Airport only on a handful of occasions. She flew with me 3 times about 5 years ago for some lessons on radio and GPS nav, and probably flew with Robert on trips from Cambridge on five or six occasions, but a long time ago. She called in whilst passing to say hello to me and our Chief Test Pilot Chris Huckstep who knew her through Shuttleworth, and who incidentally also has a high regard for her positive achievements which included two long flights hand flying the Stearman as Pilot in Command.
Those are facts, which contradict what you said and assumed. You can therefore see why I am critical of those making degtotary posts about her based on third party information and rumour, egged on by a few particularly toxic individuals.
For the record I hold no particular torch for Tracey and until her visit to Cambridge two weeks ago I hadn't seen her for over two years. I have only sprung to her defence now because I consider it grossly unfair that an unfortunate proportion (but actually small proportion) of the flying community is unfairly doing her down I a very vocal and almost hysterical way through these posts , and failing to recognise her accomplishments and achievements in flying an old aeroplane for a long way. Yes, the media got it wrong and she failed to correct them (initially). She has been very clear in her recent public statements that she was carrying a passenger. The Air League (of which I am Vice Chairman) and HCAP both gave her richly deserved awards for flights which we knew WERE NOT SOLO. The RAeS will similarly recognise her achievements next week, imunderstanb.
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 20:07
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So Sad,.
Unfortunately, if you choose to roll in the mud (i.e.with a proven liar), some of it sticks.
And yes, I have flown across part of Africa in an "open cock-pit bi-plane" ( a Tiger Moth) and, like TC-T, with a highly qualified commercial pilot in the other location.

Last edited by Haraka; 25th Nov 2016 at 20:29.
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 20:14
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Originally Posted by Islandlad
This thread has taken an interesting turn. Is Terry speaking for Marshalls? 'We' who is this we?

Is he representing T C-T on PPRuNe? Is he putting his considerable reputation on the line standing next to TC-T?

And why step up now?

And can i remind (point out) him that it was not Jay who first asked the 'solo' question. It was not even asked by Jay on this thread.

Just a few thoughts.
Read my response to Jay Sata.
I am NOT speaking for Marshall of Cambridge. My comments as we refer to the Ar League, and those that know me will be well aware of my integrity and ethics in business. I am also certainly not the mouth pice for TCT on PPrune. She is more than capable of speaking up for herself should she have the inclination to do so.
I merely consider the series of posts about her are very unfair, which are in the majority of instances very mis informed. It is also grossly unfair to link her to Maurice Kirk.

Originally Posted by Step Turn
I've heard a lot of people who spoke very well, selling a lot of things. That makes them good salespeople, but does not mean that what is being sold has the value presented.

I am a four decades pilot, and my experience includes trips as the only person aboard the plane, for thousands of miles. I am an aviation professional, whose business is serving general aviation clients. My business is absolutely dependent upon honour and ethics. The misrepresented and self contradictory information presented by TCT has convinced me, independent of the opinions of others, that TCT has a different moral compass than I. She does not represent the general aviation I proudly serve, so she cannot be an ambassador for aviation as I know it.

Two wrecked aircraft (yeah, the second one was much more than the "Incident" she declared), multiple violations of airspace she has admitted, low and poor weather flying she has admitted, and telling people she flew solo when that is not true, all indicate to me a person who should not be welcomed to reach out to new or impressionable aviation minded people. Awards having to be reworded after the fact to conform to the revealed truth, many examples of revisions to information to remove untruthful statements, all point to a poor moral foundation.

Ambassadors are selected to represent a group of people with pride and honour. TCT has not demonstrated to me that she can fill this role.

Yes, I have heard her speak on video. She spoke some lies, and just kept rolling along as though that was normal for her.

I am not affiliated with any of the organizations which have been drawn into this topic. As such, I have no standing with them, but can still hope they share my sense of honour in piloting (or even just being a person), and will stand up for this honour. An organization who awards accomplishment for a flight, which is so mired in doubt and dishonour, does not represent my piloting ethics.

If the TCT publicity machine, and peripheral supporting companies and associations really wanted to have an effective outreach program, instead of funding a joyride for a couple of pilots who seem determined to fly on their terms irrespective of anyone else's sense of what's right, they'd apply all that money directly to scholarships. For the cost of flying a Stearman and Caravan thousands of miles, you could get a lot of student pilots in the air for a few hours. What will impress those new aviators more? Recalling a few hours flying, or maybe scholarship right through to CPL? Or the faint memory of hearing a woman speak one day? No one speaks well enough to out memory a few hours of hands on flying!

TCT, where are you? You are credited with speaking well - speak to us! We're a tough audience, but we will listen to the truth....
Come and join The Air League. We need people like you to help to get the young enthused with aviation.
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 20:19
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Probably better expressed as linking Maurice Kirk to TC-T perhaps?
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 20:20
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Originally Posted by Haraka
So Sad,.
Unfortunately, if you choose to roll in the mud (i.e.with a proven liar), some of it sticks.
And yes, I have flown across part of Africa in an "open cock-pit bi-plane" ( a Tiger Moth) and, like TC-P, with a highly qualified commercial pilot in the other location.
There is no rolling in the mud!
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 20:24
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TCT

Terry

I admire you coming on here to defend TCT but the fact is it is too late.

She could have saved herself from how this story is going to pan out in the press over the coming weeks by just addressing the issues from day one and said 'sorry I was making a reality tv programme'.

You describe Ewald as a "passenger".

That is a blatant lie.

He was not some camera person sitting in the front seat but the man who built the Stearman and is also a commercial pilot with thousands of hours.

You and your colleagues know that and I have inside info on the dispute in the HCAP to her Masters Medal.

Worse still you and your 'gin and tonic' brigade have dished awards to her like confetti.

I am sure you are aware there are suggestions in tabloid newsrooms that 'connections' with a certain royal person have played a part in this story.

Now can we move on from this?

Quote Terry Holloway

I don't know Amanda Harrison but I was prepared to contribute to her fund when she cancelled the trip. That was disappointing. However there are others who could do it and quite a few of my friends have (Aus that is). Tracey has never been "a key player" at Cambridge.

She was going out with Robert Marshall for a brief period but then all her flying was from Old Warden where she kept her Ryan.

She probably visited Cambridge Airport only on a handful of occasions. She flew with me 3 times about 5 years ago for some lessons on radio and GPS nav, and probably flew with Robert on trips from Cambridge on five or six occasions, but a long time ago.

She called in whilst passing to say hello to me and our Chief Test Pilot Chris Huckstep who knew her through Shuttleworth, and who incidentally also has a high regard for her positive achievements which included two long flights hand flying the Stearman as Pilot in Command.


Those are facts, which contradict what you said and assumed. You can therefore see why I am critical of those making degtotary posts about her based on third party information and rumour, egged on by a few particularly toxic individuals.

For the record I hold no particular torch for Tracey and until her visit to Cambridge two weeks ago I hadn't seen her for over two years.

I have only sprung to her defence now because I consider it grossly unfair that an unfortunate proportion (but actually small proportion) of the flying community is unfairly doing her down .

I a very vocal and almost hysterical way through these posts , and failing to recognise her accomplishments and achievements in flying an old aeroplane for a long way.

Yes, the media got it wrong and she failed to correct them (initially). She has been very clear in her recent public statements that she was carrying a passenger.

The Air League (of which I am Vice Chairman) and HCAP both gave her richly deserved awards for flights which we knew WERE NOT SOLO. The RAeS will similarly recognise her achievements next week, imunderstanb.
I think and perhaps others will disagree she has done nothing to advance women in aviation.

The awards will just prolong this saga.

Surely it would be better to put this matter to bed with a new challenge.

Perhaps you and others can come up with a new award for a woman to fly a Tiger Moth from Cambridge to Sydney.

Can I suggest the Amy Johnson Challenge open to all to fly UK to Sydney in 21 days?

Last edited by Mike Flynn; 25th Nov 2016 at 20:40.
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 20:29
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Terry

Thanks for saying that you will ask Ms Curtis-Taylor to respond to the questions. I am sure that all of her critics look forward to seeing her answers.

As regards "The Wings": she isn't wearing navy wing in the pictures, but RAF wings. That has caused many people to take offence. If she has a good explanation, then fine. If not, however, an apology and undertaking never to do so again would be helpful.

I think we all look forward to hearing her detailed response to the questions I posted. Preferably under her own name....
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