grumpy at aircraft when asked for boarding pass. why?
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As an act in isolation itself it's nothing. However it is the last and final, and to many apparently pointless check in a long list of intrusive measures. People are pretty hacked off by the time you smile sweetly and ask to see the same thing that was checked often less than 30 seconds ago. OK that's the procedure and I guess it has reasons that the DFT require it, but in the real world it's a pain in the arse.
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It's also not apply universally, so many pax who don't understand the system are quite confused as to why some airlines check boarding passes and others don't, e.g.
DO
UK airlines, Air France, Emirates
DON'T
Air Malta, Lufthansa, Swiss
And as the airlines who do check don't have the gumption to tell the pax to keep their pass handy, many get quite hacked off at having to get it out again.
All in all, an example of the poor customer experience that airlines are masters of.
asy1, you need to grow up and develop some empathy.
DO
UK airlines, Air France, Emirates
DON'T
Air Malta, Lufthansa, Swiss
And as the airlines who do check don't have the gumption to tell the pax to keep their pass handy, many get quite hacked off at having to get it out again.
All in all, an example of the poor customer experience that airlines are masters of.
asy1, you need to grow up and develop some empathy.
Gatvol
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Obviously a lot of posts to a simple question.
I consider the extra questioning of my documents as an added piece of security by the airlines. There are methods on which some could enter the plane after the gate and bewteen the aircraft. Its also appears to be used to better direct the flow and lessen the boarding time.
One thing you do not want when first boarding, especially on a long haul is to get CC placing a Red Flag on your seat number.
Also something I note once in a while is passenger attitudes when there is a delay. Had one recently going through Paris. Two hours late arriving from JFK (big surprise there). People were at the desk demanding this and that and yelling at the staff as though they had created a problem.
I have found that over the years its great to be in line behind one of these people and when your turn comes, just be nice, what can you do for me, please and thank you. The staff relaxes it allows them to focus and I have actually gotten a bump up with a kind attitude.
Try it sometime.
I consider the extra questioning of my documents as an added piece of security by the airlines. There are methods on which some could enter the plane after the gate and bewteen the aircraft. Its also appears to be used to better direct the flow and lessen the boarding time.
One thing you do not want when first boarding, especially on a long haul is to get CC placing a Red Flag on your seat number.
Also something I note once in a while is passenger attitudes when there is a delay. Had one recently going through Paris. Two hours late arriving from JFK (big surprise there). People were at the desk demanding this and that and yelling at the staff as though they had created a problem.
I have found that over the years its great to be in line behind one of these people and when your turn comes, just be nice, what can you do for me, please and thank you. The staff relaxes it allows them to focus and I have actually gotten a bump up with a kind attitude.
Try it sometime.
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May I suggest that, entirely accidentally, all this inconsistency enhances security?
The terrorist needs to know in advance what the system is in order to spot how to defeat it. He wants a high degree of certainty in that process. If the process keeps changing, and has no consistency to it, it makes his task that much more difficult. Now of course the tidy minds haven't designed the system that way, and the chaos isn't intelligent chaos, but it's better than complete predictability, no?
Sven
The terrorist needs to know in advance what the system is in order to spot how to defeat it. He wants a high degree of certainty in that process. If the process keeps changing, and has no consistency to it, it makes his task that much more difficult. Now of course the tidy minds haven't designed the system that way, and the chaos isn't intelligent chaos, but it's better than complete predictability, no?
Sven
FWIW, it also hinders security for the same reason. E.g staff forget or fail or the process 'breaks'. E.g. staff at the gate think the airplane is checking the boarding cars whilst they think the gate is checking..
for simple example.
Have to go, 2 yo is trashing the other room
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People are pretty hacked off by the time you smile sweetly and ask to see the same thing that was checked often less than 30 seconds ago.
While it's unfair that cabin crew should bear the brunt, that grumpy pax has likely had to get up in the wee hours, endure interminable queues, been growled at by overbearing, capricious security morons and so on. If you can't sympathise then at least empathise, and word your request accordingly. If you make it sound like yet another command don't be surprised at the reaction.
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About ten days ago at ABZ Gate1 which is shared by AF to CDG and KLM to AMS departing within five minutes of each other an announcement was made asking pax to keep boarding passes ready for presentation on boarding the aircraft. Strangely I wasn't deafened by the the screams of outraged pax nor did I notice any low mutinous grumble developing.
Easy
I'm with you, it's no big deal.
F3G, you're starting to sound like your friend SNS3G
Easy
I'm with you, it's no big deal.
F3G, you're starting to sound like your friend SNS3G
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that grumpy pax has likely had to get up in the wee hours, endure interminable queues, been growled at by overbearing, capricious security morons and so on
Yet I'm still smiling when i kindly ask for your boarding card. Why? Not only because it's company policy and i have to follow rules I haven't written (take it with them, not the CC) but because personally, i don't trust the gate staff i.e. just a few days ago i was going to PSA and a NOC pax got on board. If i wasn't to check the boarding card, it could've caused a lot of problems.
And the phrases "i just put it away" and "i just showed it to the other girl" are, probably, the most common and used phrases in the airline industry.
I simply don't understand why does it cause so much grumpiness when having to show your boarding card. It'll take 5 seconds to do so and it's part of your agreement with the airline (i really wish people would read Terms&Conditions; trust me, it's all there)
Rgds,
ATS
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While I agree that it's unbelievable that this thread has gone on for so long, an experience at BHX recently also served to show the futility of the exercise.
As I was boarding an AFR flight to Lyon the gentleman behind presented his boarding card to the stewardess with a loud and cheerful, "Off to Amsterdam today!" Puzzled silence ensued with a query as to whether he was flying BHX-LYS-AMS or BHX-AMS. As I had to wait for the people in front to get bags and coats away I heard the whole exchange, with the gentleman saying it was funny, normally his company told him when it wasn't a direct routing, and the stewardess agreeing it was indeed strange, but he was probably going to change in Lyon, so welcome on board.
He then proceded to the seat behind me, and proptly got into an argument with the person boarding behind him as he was sitting in the other chap's seat. He then made it back up to the front of the aircraft and last I saw of him was him scurrying across the apron with a ground handler. How he ever thought this was the right plane I don't know, because the gates only get put up at the last minute at BHX, so it's not like there are a list of other flights going later from the same gate to get confused over.
Without wanting to reignite the security debate again, I was never convinced of the "it's for security" argument, and after that little episode, am even less convinced of it. Actually, I can't really think of any good reason for it, especially if you can board with the wrong destination on the boarding pass anyway. But as it's no skin off my nose to hold it in my hand for a few extra minutes after going through the gate. I am one of those people who does show it and I do smile - frankly it takes more energy to be unpleasant.
As I was boarding an AFR flight to Lyon the gentleman behind presented his boarding card to the stewardess with a loud and cheerful, "Off to Amsterdam today!" Puzzled silence ensued with a query as to whether he was flying BHX-LYS-AMS or BHX-AMS. As I had to wait for the people in front to get bags and coats away I heard the whole exchange, with the gentleman saying it was funny, normally his company told him when it wasn't a direct routing, and the stewardess agreeing it was indeed strange, but he was probably going to change in Lyon, so welcome on board.
He then proceded to the seat behind me, and proptly got into an argument with the person boarding behind him as he was sitting in the other chap's seat. He then made it back up to the front of the aircraft and last I saw of him was him scurrying across the apron with a ground handler. How he ever thought this was the right plane I don't know, because the gates only get put up at the last minute at BHX, so it's not like there are a list of other flights going later from the same gate to get confused over.
Without wanting to reignite the security debate again, I was never convinced of the "it's for security" argument, and after that little episode, am even less convinced of it. Actually, I can't really think of any good reason for it, especially if you can board with the wrong destination on the boarding pass anyway. But as it's no skin off my nose to hold it in my hand for a few extra minutes after going through the gate. I am one of those people who does show it and I do smile - frankly it takes more energy to be unpleasant.
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I simply don't understand why does it cause so much grumpiness when having to show your boarding card.
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How he ever thought this was the right plane I don't know, because the gates only get put up at the last minute at BHX
If you have gained no such insight after 213 posts, it's probably safe to say you never will.
Hovering AND talking
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Originally Posted by Abusing the Sky
I simply don't understand why does it cause so much grumpiness when having to show your boarding card.
Originally Posted by PaperTiger
If you have gained no such insight after 213 posts, it's probably safe to say you never will.
Cheers
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The CC have a right to examine the boarding pass and the best way would be to compluy with their request. The reason for checking the boarding pass maybe anything security or financial or something else. If asked, show your boarding pass. End of problems.
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Shack
This is a good example of how an airline can set the right expectation and make it easy for passengers to comply. I wonder why it is not standard practice?
No reasonable person would take offence to this request.
Yesterday, I took two flights on European airlines. One checked the pass at the door, the other didn't.
As I travel reguarly, I knew not to bother for the first and then to keep the pass at hand for the second.
Neither made an annoucement to the passengers though and one could imagine that a less frequent traveller making the same journey could have "learned" from the first experience and put the pass away and then felt stupid by being stopped at the door on the second flight.
Being made to feel stupid may result in grumpiness (or it may not.)
About ten days ago at ABZ Gate1 which is shared by AF to CDG and KLM to AMS departing within five minutes of each other an announcement was made asking pax to keep boarding passes ready for presentation on boarding the aircraft. Strangely I wasn't deafened by the the screams of outraged pax nor did I notice any low mutinous grumble developing.
No reasonable person would take offence to this request.
Yesterday, I took two flights on European airlines. One checked the pass at the door, the other didn't.
As I travel reguarly, I knew not to bother for the first and then to keep the pass at hand for the second.
Neither made an annoucement to the passengers though and one could imagine that a less frequent traveller making the same journey could have "learned" from the first experience and put the pass away and then felt stupid by being stopped at the door on the second flight.
Being made to feel stupid may result in grumpiness (or it may not.)
Last edited by Final 3 Greens; 25th Nov 2008 at 05:33.
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Abusing the sky
If you wish to understand this, try taking a foundation course in psychology and gaining some insight into personality preferences, behavioural traits and loci of control etc. There are some good ones available by distance learning.
Add to that your familarity with procedures and others lack if it and I'd say things were pretty well setup up for some classic misunderstandings.
None of which, in my opinion, excuses rudeness, but it does help to explain it.
I simply don't understand why does it cause so much grumpiness when having to show your boarding card. It'll take 5 seconds to do so and it's part of your agreement with the airline (i really wish people would read Terms&Conditions; trust me, it's all there)
Add to that your familarity with procedures and others lack if it and I'd say things were pretty well setup up for some classic misunderstandings.
None of which, in my opinion, excuses rudeness, but it does help to explain it.
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And I too had to wake up at stupid o'clock in the morning, drive to the apt, wait for the staff bus in the freezing cold, queue at staff channel (i don't just magically appear in the a/c), take off my coat, jacket and shoes (I'm still freezing from waiting for the staff bus), my crew bag is checked by the same security people you mentioned, my liquids are tested because of the fear i might lip gloss a pax to death, my food is searched too, when they finish with me i have to go to the crew room, sign in the system, brief my crew, sort out paperwork, make my way to the stand, get in the a/c, do the security checks and start boarding. And before you say "it's my job", well it's kinda... NOT. You see, i only get paid from take off to touchdown so technically it's not my job as i am not being paid for it.
You wonder about people’s attitudes. I for one consider myself a most pleasant passenger, but I do see rudeness in others and so with regards to your post above. You will not understand the attitude if you do not accept that there is a difference between You – who’s job it is to deal with Grumpy people (and gets paid by them) and Them – who are paying for the privilege of flying with you and have been fcked about by the airport and airline. Honestly. We are not equal. We are not friends. We are not colleagues. We are not ‘in these difficult times together’. We are your customers. Now hang my coat up and get me a drink of water, its pills time..
There was a great study by, I think Dr Rosemary XYZ (can’t remember family name) who tried to demonstrate a lack of productivity if you took away from staff certain basics and/or luxuries. She failed to prove her theory but did prove how staff (and others) rally around to help each other in resistance to outside influences. Can anyone remember the name? It would make a good example to bring in now in more detail.
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Just adding to the above post that I don’t like that attitude and it is not mine. But folk are folk and the majority will have this attitude. Not now, sitting at their desk eating a chocolate biscuit, but the moment the flight gets delayed 15 minutes they will, or they get charged for being 1kg over on their luggage, or the taxi was more expensive than expected on the way to the airport. And then…
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Don't know who you work for, but at T5:
- Card in machine to get boarding pass
- Show boarding pass at visa desk
- Show boarding pass to enter fast track
- Show boarding pass at lounge door
- Show boarding pass at lounge desk (honest, some days they check twice)
- Show boarding pass to get a shower
- Show boarding pass to buy duty frees
- Show boarding pass at gate
- Show boarding pass at door of plane
Most days I manage a smile, but sometimes it just gets to me......
- Card in machine to get boarding pass
- Show boarding pass at visa desk
- Show boarding pass to enter fast track
- Show boarding pass at lounge door
- Show boarding pass at lounge desk (honest, some days they check twice)
- Show boarding pass to get a shower
- Show boarding pass to buy duty frees
- Show boarding pass at gate
- Show boarding pass at door of plane
Most days I manage a smile, but sometimes it just gets to me......
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All through this thread, people are using the "airport experience" to try to excuse their rudeness or grumpiness. For pities sake, can we please stop talking about it in such dramatic terms! Yes, I'll agree that travelling through an airport nowadays is not the most fun you're ever going to have, but it hardly ranks up there with lifes most traumatic experiences. If you can't cope with showing a boarding card a few times without losing your temper, then I worry about your fitness to fly. We are, after all, talking about showing a little bit of paper at the door of the aircraft.
Yes, I do agree that it would be much better if announcements were made asking you to keep your boarding pass handy, and, having seen the views on this thread, I will ask if this can be included in our PAs when the flight is called, but it's really not a disaster if someone has put their boarding card away again. Bearing in mind they have only just put it away, it's usually close to hand. In my case, I just ask them if they would mind stepping to one side in the galley while they look for it. No fuss. No drama. And usually, no tantrums. It's not really that hard, is it?
Jsl
Yes, I do agree that it would be much better if announcements were made asking you to keep your boarding pass handy, and, having seen the views on this thread, I will ask if this can be included in our PAs when the flight is called, but it's really not a disaster if someone has put their boarding card away again. Bearing in mind they have only just put it away, it's usually close to hand. In my case, I just ask them if they would mind stepping to one side in the galley while they look for it. No fuss. No drama. And usually, no tantrums. It's not really that hard, is it?
Jsl
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I will ask if this can be included in our PAs when the flight is called
As regards to your comments about the "airport experience", it has been quite normal for many years to hold focus groups to determine the "customer experience" with dealing with a business and to look for ways of improving that (preferably no/low) cost
. I did that type of work as a management consultant for several years. )Hint, introducing a call centre with 28 different menus is not the best way 
)The airport environment (particularly in the UK) has regressed from a customer experience angle for many reasons and the travelling public are more stressed than ever.
Stress manifests itself in many ways, one of which can be aggressive behaviour (in my book grumpiness is at the milder end of the spectrum, but is still aggression.)
Unfortunately, it is by no means only passengers who show this stress, for example the supervisor before the scanners at London City Airport was repreatedly shouting at people yesterday afternoon, when I passed through.
That isn't acceptable behaviour, either and I take it as a symptom of the stress generated by the whole system, as I am sure that the lady in question is quite okay away from work.