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-   -   Is Ukraine about to have a war? (https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/639666-ukraine-about-have-war.html)

MightyGem 4th May 2022 19:14


And furthermore there are UK Churchill 2's on location at Niinisalo as well as 120 UK troops. The US is participating, too with Latvian and Lithuanian forces.
Churchill 2s?

Beamr 4th May 2022 19:28


Originally Posted by MightyGem (Post 11225133)
Churchill 2s?

CHALLENGER 2's. Blimey, what a brain fart by me...

Wokkafans 4th May 2022 20:22

An attempt to take out the Amur Railway Bridge over the River Dnieper today. A view of the strike from on the bridge is in the Reddit link.

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFoota...eb2x&context=3


NutLoose 4th May 2022 20:41


Originally Posted by Sue Vêtements (Post 11225102)
You could still run a train over that . . .


. . . if if was a really really really light one

Who do you think you are, Kenneth Moore in the Northwest Frontier? ;) Gupta would be having kittens..


​​​​​….

NutLoose 4th May 2022 20:53

They only blew it up three days ago and it’s back up! Network Rail would still be having a meeting..


pasta 4th May 2022 21:06


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11225168)
They only blew it up three days ago and it’s back up! Network Rail would still be having a meeting..

https://twitter.com/Ukraine66251776/...24180236804097

Fair play, maybe they didn't have to relay the tracks!

NutLoose 4th May 2022 21:15

First sightings of a Mi-28 operating in Ukraine


Saying that, they have just recovered the one shot down on day one.


WideScreen 4th May 2022 21:31


Originally Posted by Beamr (Post 11224930)
Here's a rather straight forward approach. Efficient though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hr-xBtVU4lg

With NV goggles, the bird might be (far) outside its W&B ...

WideScreen 4th May 2022 21:45


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11224995)
For something random and supposedly down to Russia's poor safety record, there does appear to be a lot of them, and some quite relevent :E


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....ff0095d587.png

Hard to understand why Ukraine would have benefit to attack shopping malls / police stations East of the Ural. Not to speak about: How to reach these items, explore/inspect the environment AND plan/execute an attack.

Combine that with the emerging messages about the local Russian oblasts being very unhappy with the central Putin war (ehhh, special operation) policy, and it could very well be, these are early signals of a secondary break-up of Russia (after the demise of the USSR/CCCP itself).

NutLoose 4th May 2022 21:58

Judging by the recruiting offices going up this could be locals against the war, the ones out east produce missiles and rockets plus fuel explosives for them, the shopping centre may have just been a genuine fire.

It’s allegedly reported Ukrainian heli pilots are being trained to fly western helicopters in Germany..


..

tartare 5th May 2022 00:14


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11225194)
Judging by the recruiting offices going up this could be locals against the war, the ones out east produce missiles and rockets plus fuel explosives for them, the shopping centre may have just been a genuine fire.

It’s allegedly reported Ukrainian heli pilots are being trained to fly western helicopters in Germany..https://twitter.com/theragex/status/1521893015626866690


..

Helicopter wing 64 stationed there has the CH-53G - but assume other types may be flown in.
Apaches?
https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/photos_182865.htm

tdracer 5th May 2022 00:55


Originally Posted by tartare (Post 11225234)
Apaches?

Not likely - my understanding is that the Apache is so complex to fly and operate that it requires more training than any other helicopter in the US Army fleet.

RatherBeFlying 5th May 2022 01:15

Blowing Bridges and Diesel Locomotives
 
Back in WWII B-26's were tasked with blowing bridges preparatory to the Normandy invasion. After it was noted that dropped spans were quickly put back in service, emphasis shifted to taking out abutments which took much longer to replace.

RF has gotten a bit clever lately and is now reported targeting power stations supplying the railroads bringing western weapons to the frontlines. How many diesel locomotives can be sourced in Europe?

Beamr 5th May 2022 02:50

Ukraine has 1520mm gauge and western europe 1435mm. Can't source many locomotives from west.

fdr 5th May 2022 02:59

Own Goals
 
The internal attacks within Russia suggest that there is some level of resistance to the Wars of Putin. The conscripts don't agree with Putin apparently. Remarkable that even as a non-combatant state Belarus had interdiction of Russian troop movements from its own people angry about all things Russian or Lukashenko. It then comes as a surprise that while Russia is losing colossal levels of it's military in the field against the committed defenders of Ukraine, on the 4th of May, Lukashenko starts positioning his troops to commence aggression against Ukraine. That seems to be a career-limiting move, Lukashenko lasting more than a week after committing Belarus troops to a war which his own people disagree with would be surprising. His move is a complication to Ukraine, and gives an impetus for strike capability from the west that Ukraine can use to push back. Ukraine maintains forces in place to repel Belarus, and this time, they already have the majority of the local population on their side in removing Lukashenko from the table. How the Belarus armed forces will proceed will be interesting. A revolt against Minsk is not impossible.

Belarus has 2 full strength and 2 part strength mech brigades, and the majority of its 46,000 man military are 18-month term conscripts. Conscripts are already showing their opinion of Putin in burning down recruitment offices and refusing to fight, surrendering, and attacking the blocking troops. Conscript armies come with big risks, and Lukashenko may be about to achieve what his population has wanted for some time, a Belarus without Lukashenko.

Aviation wise, the Belarus airforce has some 29s and 25s, and some Mi-8 & 24s.

mahogany bob 5th May 2022 06:43

WHAT TO DO ??
With the war now in it’s 3rd month and in danger of escalating to armageddon it is time for the WEST to face the FACTS - no matter how unpleasant they are
  1. There is no way that Ukraine can WIN the war - prolonged western help will only prolong the agony.
  2. The chance of PUTIN being overthrown from within is next to NIL His popularity has increased since the war started.
  3. ECONOMIC sanctions will NOT work.
  4. NATO is seen as the enemy - Russians do not want more American missiles on their borders.Bellicose threats of expansion only throws petrol on the flames!
  5. There is NO danger of Russia attacking a strong NATO country. Why would they?
SOLUTION
Negotiate a peace treaty NOW and one in which Russia is NOT seen as the loser.
GIVE the DONBAS region to Russia.
Let’s face it they are NEVER going to leave this area.
Ensure that UKRAINE has access to the sea via a long coastline which includes Odessa.
AFTER the war ends NATO can make darn sure that they are not caught with their knickers down again by STRENGTH and aid to Ukraine and the other threatened border states .
RUSSIA must be shown that further expansionism is NOT to their advantage.
GERMANY will not repeat its catastrophic error of relying on Russian-energy.
RUSSIA will eventually suffer from adverse world opinion and lose influence.
RUSSIA will realise that they have gained NOTHING and LOST a lot
and PUTIN will be unelected.

EUROPE can then return gradually to OSTPOLITIK and the world can keep spinning. The perceived LOSS OF FACE will be superceded by general all round RELIEF .
This is not APPEASEMENT or DEFEATISM but COMMON SENSE.

I have a feeling that given WHERE WE ARE , CHURCHILL ( and TRUMP ) would negotiate something similar.

No-one suggests that this will be EASY ,particularly for the UKRAINE resistance HEROES ,but can anyone come up with a BETTER solution?

Less Hair 5th May 2022 06:57

Easy: Russia has to retreat and pay for rebuilding Ukraine.

mahogany bob 5th May 2022 07:20

Less Hair

DREAM ON !

RUSSIA will never retreat - it’s not in their DNA.

tartare 5th May 2022 07:22

I think there are much bigger strategies at play here.
The US has realised it can badly weaken the Russian conventional military, possibly for decades, perhaps even permanently.
So it's fighting a proxy war.
NATO is quite happy to join in with the same goal.
Lloyd Austin has said as much.
It's a proxy war I agree with entirely by the way... all power to our Ukrainian friends.
We supply the weapons - they fight like demons - and Russia's conventional armed forces exhaust their ammunition, are turned into scrap metal and can only wave the big nuclear stick in future.

Beamr 5th May 2022 07:22

Taking into account that retreating is not in their DNA they retreated from Kiev pretty fast.


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