Can Wigston survive the onslaught?
Originally Posted by possel
I've read through this thread and just have to say that I am glad I left the RAF when I did, now almost 30 years ago. However, this one brought back memories:
There were far too many people who had this attitude - do the minimum to look good so long as it isn't apparent until you have moved on. They were simply selfish and just did not have the "best interests of the service" in their mind at all, whether in the case of cost, airworthiness, flight safety, operational effectiveness or even just improved morale. They were the people who would only consider themselves, not the RAF as a whole, and they would not do something "because the book doesn't say I can do it" whereas, on the contrary, others had the view that "the book doesn't say I can't do it" and were willing to make a rational decision based on their knowledge and experience.
The trouble is that such people did have a better career, they did reach higher ranks and now they do have a massive pension. I find it sad that the situation has apparently not improved and could perceivably be worse!
There were far too many people who had this attitude - do the minimum to look good so long as it isn't apparent until you have moved on. They were simply selfish and just did not have the "best interests of the service" in their mind at all, whether in the case of cost, airworthiness, flight safety, operational effectiveness or even just improved morale. They were the people who would only consider themselves, not the RAF as a whole, and they would not do something "because the book doesn't say I can do it" whereas, on the contrary, others had the view that "the book doesn't say I can't do it" and were willing to make a rational decision based on their knowledge and experience.
The trouble is that such people did have a better career, they did reach higher ranks and now they do have a massive pension. I find it sad that the situation has apparently not improved and could perceivably be worse!
One example. I recall authorising use of out of date parachute canopies with air dropped containers and reverse engineering of container cradles last used in Lincoln’s and shacks… at a follow up meeting with MoD(PE) I was told in no uncertain terms that my actions were not permitted because the the combinations would have to be subjected to a full test program before clearance. Taking the rap, I asked if the dozen or so live drops we had already done could be taken into account and did the committee want me to try and get the containers back from behind the lines…
it all went quiet. (My logic was that I could see nowhere where it said I couldn’t do what I did)
Was listening to Robin Olds' autobiography, this piqued my interest, Wiggy the woke...take note:
'....Don't try to bullshit the troops, but make sure they know the buck stops with you, that you'll shoulder the blame when things go wrong. Correct without revenge or anger. Recognize accomplishment. Reward accordingly. Foster spirit through self-pride, not slogans, and never at the expense of another unit. It won't take long, but only your genuine interest and concern, plus follow-up on your promises, will earn you respect. Out of that you gain loyalty and obedience. Your outfit will be a standout. But for God's sake, don't ever try to be popular! That weakens your position, makes you vulnerable. Don't have favorites. That breeds resentment. Respect the talents of your people. Have the courage to delegate responsibility and give the authority to go with it. Again, make clear to your troops you are the one who'll take the heat.”
― Robin Olds
'....Don't try to bullshit the troops, but make sure they know the buck stops with you, that you'll shoulder the blame when things go wrong. Correct without revenge or anger. Recognize accomplishment. Reward accordingly. Foster spirit through self-pride, not slogans, and never at the expense of another unit. It won't take long, but only your genuine interest and concern, plus follow-up on your promises, will earn you respect. Out of that you gain loyalty and obedience. Your outfit will be a standout. But for God's sake, don't ever try to be popular! That weakens your position, makes you vulnerable. Don't have favorites. That breeds resentment. Respect the talents of your people. Have the courage to delegate responsibility and give the authority to go with it. Again, make clear to your troops you are the one who'll take the heat.”
― Robin Olds
Originally Posted by 57mm
Maybe after all this we will get our first female CAS. I can think of at least one candidate.....
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: not scotland
Posts: 307
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Wrathmonk
Which, if I’m thinking on the same lines, would result in two other ‘firsts’ as well.
A ‘bridge too far’, I would have thought. She may be competent, and a ‘people person’, but surely CAS should foremost be a warfighter with relevant experience in that field?
Originally Posted by Toadstool
She’ll need to get promotion but I’m not betting against that. Excellent career so far.
In the interim, whilst Gerry M would seem the popular choice, my vote would be for Sammy Sampson - looking at what is available ‘open source’ he does not appear to have ever been a core member of the Air Force Board and is therefore not tainted by recent policy decisions etc.
Originally Posted by oldmansquipper
In GW1 I was in the HQSTC EA for things survival equipment. On several occasions we had to make difficult decisions on the run so the front line effectiveness was not compromised. (Re supply of SF by airdrop when all the RAF existing stock of equipment had been exhausted)
One example. I recall authorising use of out of date parachute canopies with air dropped containers and reverse engineering of container cradles last used in Lincoln’s and shacks… at a follow up meeting with MoD(PE) I was told in no uncertain terms that my actions were not permitted because the the combinations would have to be subjected to a full test program before clearance. Taking the rap, I asked if the dozen or so live drops we had already done could be taken into account and did the committee want me to try and get the containers back from behind the lines…
it all went quiet. (My logic was that I could see nowhere where it said I couldn’t do what I did)
One example. I recall authorising use of out of date parachute canopies with air dropped containers and reverse engineering of container cradles last used in Lincoln’s and shacks… at a follow up meeting with MoD(PE) I was told in no uncertain terms that my actions were not permitted because the the combinations would have to be subjected to a full test program before clearance. Taking the rap, I asked if the dozen or so live drops we had already done could be taken into account and did the committee want me to try and get the containers back from behind the lines…
it all went quiet. (My logic was that I could see nowhere where it said I couldn’t do what I did)
Originally Posted by Fortissimo
What, first non-aviator and first dentist??! 🤣🤣
Nice try....
Originally Posted by MPN11
A ‘bridge too far’, I would have thought. She may be competent, and a ‘people person’, but surely CAS should foremost be a warfighter with relevant experience in that field?
Originally Posted by Fortissimo
What, first non-aviator and first dentist??! 🤣🤣
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Redhill, Surrey, or another planet
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by oldmansquipper
In GW1 I was in the HQSTC EA for things survival equipment. On several occasions we had to make difficult decisions on the run so the front line effectiveness was not compromised. . . .. (My logic was that I could see nowhere where it said I couldn’t do what I did)
Originally Posted by NutLoose
She might be able to stop the rot and decay that is setting in..
https://news.sky.com/story/rafs-thre...ssure-12680964
for what it’s worth.
I can hear the hatches being battened down and the cans of non specific coloured paint being opened…..
god (whichever one you believe in) save us!
for what it’s worth.
I can hear the hatches being battened down and the cans of non specific coloured paint being opened…..
god (whichever one you believe in) save us!
Originally Posted by WB627
Nothing new under the sun!
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The Roman Empire
Posts: 2,345
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't know if this has been mentioned in any of the previous 99 posts, however...
A total of 13% of the UK population is made up of ethnic minorities. The RAF, under Wigston, has a recruitment target of 20% ethnic minorities. First of all this is apparently a more ambitious target than that of either the Army or RN. So presumably this isn't a tri-service policy, having come down from CDS or the politicians, but an RAF (under Wigston) self generated figure. Secondly, a target of 20% vs 13% of the population indicates a policy of deliberate over representation, by around 50%, dare one say a policy of "positive discrimination"?
A total of 13% of the UK population is made up of ethnic minorities. The RAF, under Wigston, has a recruitment target of 20% ethnic minorities. First of all this is apparently a more ambitious target than that of either the Army or RN. So presumably this isn't a tri-service policy, having come down from CDS or the politicians, but an RAF (under Wigston) self generated figure. Secondly, a target of 20% vs 13% of the population indicates a policy of deliberate over representation, by around 50%, dare one say a policy of "positive discrimination"?
As Major (rtd) Heappey is a Truss supporter, I assume he may well still be in post come 6 September, so his support may be significant regarding CAS going early other than by his own volition.
It appears to me that our current generation of leaders, political, military, and business appear, in very large part, to have replaced a sense of honour and duty with an unshakeable belief in their own abilities, point of view, and irreplaceability, the former Group Captain R&S being herself an honourable exception. I admit I may be looking through a rose-tinted visor when thinking in earlier generations we would have seen resignations for the good of the service on the Caesar's wife principle.
I lack the experience and don't know enough facts to pass judgement on the competence and actions of the VSOs involved.
P.S. Good to see the Wing Commander and Air Ministry official weren't distracted from doing their jobs by events across the Channel on that day.
It appears to me that our current generation of leaders, political, military, and business appear, in very large part, to have replaced a sense of honour and duty with an unshakeable belief in their own abilities, point of view, and irreplaceability, the former Group Captain R&S being herself an honourable exception. I admit I may be looking through a rose-tinted visor when thinking in earlier generations we would have seen resignations for the good of the service on the Caesar's wife principle.
I lack the experience and don't know enough facts to pass judgement on the competence and actions of the VSOs involved.
P.S. Good to see the Wing Commander and Air Ministry official weren't distracted from doing their jobs by events across the Channel on that day.
