EK CCM's Fired
Join Date: Sep 2005
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Quod Boy - by the sounds of it, you were most probably still in nappies while these ppl were busy getting this company off the ground, so have some respect please.
And if you don't know who we are refering to and you also don't care - then why waste your time typing your silly remarks.
And if you don't know who we are refering to and you also don't care - then why waste your time typing your silly remarks.
Join Date: Sep 2005
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Yes, too true. MJ did her job fantastically and more beyond that.
The best thing they could do now, would be to beg her and the others to come back.....before its too late and all is lost.
The best thing they could do now, would be to beg her and the others to come back.....before its too late and all is lost.
Join Date: Sep 2005
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1400 Crew have resigned since the start of the year
If the people who where sacked are to blame for the crew resignations why is it only now crew are resigning??? Most of the people sacked have been in EK for the best part of 20 years so if they where to blame wouldn't crew have resigned before now???
These people are not to blame for the crew unhappiness or the fact that EK are not winning awards. They where infact there when EK where No 1 and the crew where happy.
I agree with Gee Whizz - these people should be re-instated before things get any worst. The crew moral could not get any lower than what it is at the moment.
Join Date: Jun 2002
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This is not very funny
EK are looking for new cabin crew managers advertising twice in the last 3 months.
I got approuched through a head hunting aviation agent 2 months ago in London.
I had a very interesting hour phone conversation followed up by another this week.
His words, there on a quest for the best, they have a hugh amount of planes coming and no structure or crew to handle the growth spert just a year away.
Other airlines have been hearing about some bad internal infighting and problems for about a year.
Maybe I'll stay put
I got approuched through a head hunting aviation agent 2 months ago in London.
I had a very interesting hour phone conversation followed up by another this week.
His words, there on a quest for the best, they have a hugh amount of planes coming and no structure or crew to handle the growth spert just a year away.
Other airlines have been hearing about some bad internal infighting and problems for about a year.
Maybe I'll stay put
Join Date: May 2005
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QB, you may not be sipping a G&T at DOSC but by the sounds of it you are speaking from hearsay.
So if you do have nothing to say about the initials because you do not recognise them, have the least amount of decency to let us carry our opinions.
If it were not for the likes of MJ who participated in making this airline what it was in its succesful years, most new pilots would have never made it to EK, the likes of you perhaps.
So stay put in your corner at the pub, but don't speak of things you know nothing or little about. F/D like you we knowand we've seen all you like are groupies and your little porsher got no time for anything sensible apart from enlightening us with your perspective based on your shifting to the LHS, that is of course after EK has finished it's policy of recruitinig DEC's sorry little QBoy.
So if you do have nothing to say about the initials because you do not recognise them, have the least amount of decency to let us carry our opinions.
If it were not for the likes of MJ who participated in making this airline what it was in its succesful years, most new pilots would have never made it to EK, the likes of you perhaps.
So stay put in your corner at the pub, but don't speak of things you know nothing or little about. F/D like you we knowand we've seen all you like are groupies and your little porsher got no time for anything sensible apart from enlightening us with your perspective based on your shifting to the LHS, that is of course after EK has finished it's policy of recruitinig DEC's sorry little QBoy.
Join Date: Jan 2004
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Mascarpone, with comments like that I only hope that you are the next in line to get fired.
Personal attacks are not the way to assist your argument in support of the group of CCMs that were fired.
I admit to knowing absolutely nothing about what is going on, the only thing that we, the pilots, have heard about this is on this forum. But I have been here a damn sight longer than most and whilst I do sympathise with the way things are going, comments like yours are simply too immature to take seriously.
If you want to really support these people then do so quietly, but with strong resolve and be prepared to give up your own position if needed and go home knowing that you have sacrificed everything yourself because you truly believed that what you was doing was right. So, let me ask you one question; are you prepared to resign over this? Are you prepared to go over TDs head? Or maybe, one day, you'll look back and see that the IFS managemenbt structure badly needed a reshuffle. From where I'm sitting, my perspective is that it did.
Finally, I hope you get that Porsche driving Groupie stereotype out of your head. Surprisingly enough, not many of us FD can afford a Porsche!
Personal attacks are not the way to assist your argument in support of the group of CCMs that were fired.
I admit to knowing absolutely nothing about what is going on, the only thing that we, the pilots, have heard about this is on this forum. But I have been here a damn sight longer than most and whilst I do sympathise with the way things are going, comments like yours are simply too immature to take seriously.
If you want to really support these people then do so quietly, but with strong resolve and be prepared to give up your own position if needed and go home knowing that you have sacrificed everything yourself because you truly believed that what you was doing was right. So, let me ask you one question; are you prepared to resign over this? Are you prepared to go over TDs head? Or maybe, one day, you'll look back and see that the IFS managemenbt structure badly needed a reshuffle. From where I'm sitting, my perspective is that it did.
Finally, I hope you get that Porsche driving Groupie stereotype out of your head. Surprisingly enough, not many of us FD can afford a Porsche!
Join Date: Jan 2005
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Cheese Features
It appears that you hail from the IFS side of things at Emirates. May I gently remind you that although PPrune is in the public domain, it was primarily set up as a pilots web site. YOU are the guest here, not QB. For the record, QB has been around longer than you might care to think.
We would all like to get some feedback on what is happening in IFS, but I doubt anyone is interested in a flight deck/cabin crew slagging war.
It appears that you hail from the IFS side of things at Emirates. May I gently remind you that although PPrune is in the public domain, it was primarily set up as a pilots web site. YOU are the guest here, not QB. For the record, QB has been around longer than you might care to think.
We would all like to get some feedback on what is happening in IFS, but I doubt anyone is interested in a flight deck/cabin crew slagging war.
Join Date: Oct 2004
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Cheese Richard,
Not much support for you here and it's not hard to see why.
Looking for back-up in the pilots' forums and then attacking the respondents is not the smartest tactic I've ever heard of. With that level of awareness you might want to lay low for a while in case your head is the next to roll at EK. I think their idea is to sack morons.
I imagine most if not all of the pilots here have little idea on the identity of most or all of the sets of initials posted.
At the end of the day, whilst most of us would like to see the company do well and whilst most of us apply personal standards of unassailable professionalism out of pride and self-respect and airmanship and a sense of "rightness" about the job, etc etc etc, at the end of the day the success or otherwise of the company is largely out of our hands.
Short of a catastrophe far beyond a single hull-loss/massive loss of life, the airline will never fold and we will still be paid. If management persist in decisions which lessen the effectiveness of the operation, we just have to shake our heads and get on with it, operating as professionally as we can and keeping up with the changes in policy as they appear.
Suggest you do the same. Or else resign in sympathy and in keeping with your principles.
Are you going to resign?
As for 1400 resignations, the upside is, the rest of the Third World has no shortage of applicants for the job, many of whom even speak a little English and will do whatever they're told for as many duty hours as they have to.
Not much support for you here and it's not hard to see why.
Looking for back-up in the pilots' forums and then attacking the respondents is not the smartest tactic I've ever heard of. With that level of awareness you might want to lay low for a while in case your head is the next to roll at EK. I think their idea is to sack morons.
I imagine most if not all of the pilots here have little idea on the identity of most or all of the sets of initials posted.
At the end of the day, whilst most of us would like to see the company do well and whilst most of us apply personal standards of unassailable professionalism out of pride and self-respect and airmanship and a sense of "rightness" about the job, etc etc etc, at the end of the day the success or otherwise of the company is largely out of our hands.
Short of a catastrophe far beyond a single hull-loss/massive loss of life, the airline will never fold and we will still be paid. If management persist in decisions which lessen the effectiveness of the operation, we just have to shake our heads and get on with it, operating as professionally as we can and keeping up with the changes in policy as they appear.
Suggest you do the same. Or else resign in sympathy and in keeping with your principles.
Are you going to resign?
As for 1400 resignations, the upside is, the rest of the Third World has no shortage of applicants for the job, many of whom even speak a little English and will do whatever they're told for as many duty hours as they have to.
Join Date: Apr 2004
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It's been a while...
I tip my hat to you, that was the best thing ever said on PPRuNe!
At the end of the day, whilst most of us would like to see the company do well and whilst most of us apply personal standards of unassailable professionalism out of pride and self-respect and airmanship and a sense of "rightness" about the job, etc etc etc, at the end of the day the success or otherwise of the company is largely out of our hands.
Short of a catastrophe far beyond a single hull-loss/massive loss of life, the airline will never fold and we will still be paid. If management persist in decisions which lessen the effectiveness of the operation, we just have to shake our heads and get on with it, operating as professionally as we can and keeping up with the changes in policy as they appear.
Short of a catastrophe far beyond a single hull-loss/massive loss of life, the airline will never fold and we will still be paid. If management persist in decisions which lessen the effectiveness of the operation, we just have to shake our heads and get on with it, operating as professionally as we can and keeping up with the changes in policy as they appear.
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I have had dealings with more than a few of the MCC's and CCM's including quite a few of the ones named here. I have also had several professional dealings with TD.
One thing that became very evident is that most of the MCC's and CCM's were grossly under skilled, devious, inconsistent and downright dishonest in their behavior.
TD on the other hand is singularly one of the more intelligent, responsible managers I have met in aviation. This was evident at the pilots meeting were he fended some pretty tough questions with a degree of honesty and integrity that is sadly missing in our management. I believe he really cares about his organization and if you listened to what he has to say, you might figure that out as well.
IFS was on a downward slide BEFORE TD took over, this was because the organization was chock full of small minded, small airline managers, who had been promoted way beyond their ability. Furthermore the IFS "we are wonderful" mentality led to a degree of complacency and arrogance that is endemic today. In an organization as big as we are becoming you cannot have that, you need structure and solid individuals in management positions.
As much as I hate the way management do stuff around here, I personally think this is a positive step, we really did need to get rid of this lot and hopefully the truly inept PG & MH as well.
One thing that became very evident is that most of the MCC's and CCM's were grossly under skilled, devious, inconsistent and downright dishonest in their behavior.
TD on the other hand is singularly one of the more intelligent, responsible managers I have met in aviation. This was evident at the pilots meeting were he fended some pretty tough questions with a degree of honesty and integrity that is sadly missing in our management. I believe he really cares about his organization and if you listened to what he has to say, you might figure that out as well.
IFS was on a downward slide BEFORE TD took over, this was because the organization was chock full of small minded, small airline managers, who had been promoted way beyond their ability. Furthermore the IFS "we are wonderful" mentality led to a degree of complacency and arrogance that is endemic today. In an organization as big as we are becoming you cannot have that, you need structure and solid individuals in management positions.
As much as I hate the way management do stuff around here, I personally think this is a positive step, we really did need to get rid of this lot and hopefully the truly inept PG & MH as well.
Join Date: May 2005
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SandIgger sorry for the Daley.
Well I am pleased that you can at least differentiate between a dessert cheese and an after dinner one.
Perhaps the day it is not such a well kept secret by the management, the crew would perform.
And change is inevitable yes is that anything new? Or should we drink your words for their wisdom, we've heard of change for the last 20 years, it came in the form of management who could not cope and manage beyond their four fingers ahead of their nose.
Get a life, no one is communicating to the crew beyond performance performance performance; go on suit yourelf to the third world and get as many as you like we will see how the chiinese and koreans who crowd your aircraft will fare in the face of the customers, open the way for a new qatar airways!
And perhaps as well if you selected your trainers on the basis of their proficency rather than who they are married to or sleep with we would start a new track.
You say I should: "Resign with my principles", you mean to say that because I have principles I should resign and stick to them and let the likes of you override them.
Seriously where do you come from? The last time I heard a comment like this was on a 2nd world war footage speaking on the third Reich.
Do people just lay down and let you just flatten them, obviously your principles are as far removed from those of the developped world as one could ever imagine and you want to bring EK to the new age......
But hey! It takes a bit of everything to make up the world.
What you fail to read is that I agree with the principle of removing the deadwood, no one considers MJ deadwood all the others, yes!
Does that make you happy?
Well I am pleased that you can at least differentiate between a dessert cheese and an after dinner one.
Perhaps the day it is not such a well kept secret by the management, the crew would perform.
And change is inevitable yes is that anything new? Or should we drink your words for their wisdom, we've heard of change for the last 20 years, it came in the form of management who could not cope and manage beyond their four fingers ahead of their nose.
Get a life, no one is communicating to the crew beyond performance performance performance; go on suit yourelf to the third world and get as many as you like we will see how the chiinese and koreans who crowd your aircraft will fare in the face of the customers, open the way for a new qatar airways!
And perhaps as well if you selected your trainers on the basis of their proficency rather than who they are married to or sleep with we would start a new track.
You say I should: "Resign with my principles", you mean to say that because I have principles I should resign and stick to them and let the likes of you override them.
Seriously where do you come from? The last time I heard a comment like this was on a 2nd world war footage speaking on the third Reich.
Do people just lay down and let you just flatten them, obviously your principles are as far removed from those of the developped world as one could ever imagine and you want to bring EK to the new age......
But hey! It takes a bit of everything to make up the world.
What you fail to read is that I agree with the principle of removing the deadwood, no one considers MJ deadwood all the others, yes!
Does that make you happy?
Last edited by mascarpone; 24th Sep 2005 at 08:49.
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Good post sandIgger
I suppose like any company they have to source the reason as to why the amount of cabin crew are resigning as they are. Like any company they will look downwards.
I do not know MJ but having read much input in this topic it seems that everybody liked and respected her. However in this company that is not always the reason for being in that position. It is very sad to see people with 20 years service being terminated.
Someone already stated that these people were causing problems for TD. Whether that is true I do not know. All I do know is that we only see things from one perspective. There is usually more to this if we could scratch beneath the surface a little more.
Only time will tell as to whether this was the right choice. If it was then there could be improvement. We all know that there are cliques, mafias and small empires here. If this was not the right decision, then the big bosses will not look so far down the list of people to terminate.
TD has alot at stake here, ultimately he is responsible for rectifying the problem of cabin crew resignations and IFS. This was therefore the first step to cure this. He has had orders from high up to make thigs right. If he doesnt succeed then guess who will be lent on next.
I think that this is just the start. There is alot of dead wood here which needs to be burnt. There are people in positions in this company that have been here a long time but all of us could not really say what they do. The company needs streamlining.
I wish the people who were terminated much luck for the future.
I suppose like any company they have to source the reason as to why the amount of cabin crew are resigning as they are. Like any company they will look downwards.
I do not know MJ but having read much input in this topic it seems that everybody liked and respected her. However in this company that is not always the reason for being in that position. It is very sad to see people with 20 years service being terminated.
Someone already stated that these people were causing problems for TD. Whether that is true I do not know. All I do know is that we only see things from one perspective. There is usually more to this if we could scratch beneath the surface a little more.
Only time will tell as to whether this was the right choice. If it was then there could be improvement. We all know that there are cliques, mafias and small empires here. If this was not the right decision, then the big bosses will not look so far down the list of people to terminate.
TD has alot at stake here, ultimately he is responsible for rectifying the problem of cabin crew resignations and IFS. This was therefore the first step to cure this. He has had orders from high up to make thigs right. If he doesnt succeed then guess who will be lent on next.
I think that this is just the start. There is alot of dead wood here which needs to be burnt. There are people in positions in this company that have been here a long time but all of us could not really say what they do. The company needs streamlining.
I wish the people who were terminated much luck for the future.
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Anybody can be replaced - the world is full of people - but what a shame to lose the experience.
Have you worked with ppl like that? what a shambles. And would you like to be in an emergency situation with them?
I think not.
many of whom speak little English and will do whatever they are told for as many hours as they have to
Have you worked with ppl like that? what a shambles. And would you like to be in an emergency situation with them?
I think not.
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Have you worked with ppl like that?
what a shambles.
And would you like to be in an emergency situation with them?
You may have missed the subtle ironic edge I was trying to inject into that statement you quoted.
Miss CheeseStick, all I can say is:
would you like some whine with that cheese???
Join Date: May 2005
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SandIgger sorry for the Daley;
Obviously been getting used to F/C food mate, we need to put you on a crew meal regimen you might otherwise grow out of the zebra stripes on your shoulders. Thinking perhaps just for the likes of you we should add piping to the uniform and whistle when you board to announce the arrival of the archetypal captain and his retinue?
I apologise I did not know this was the DOSC forum.
Where should we go Mr. little stick if we need to continue our whine?
Thanks for all the help.
Me little crew lost and no idea where to go maybe you can help with your wizlittledom!
Global Nomad;
panthers change place but never change spots! Thanks for the warning I willl heed it! But was it a masked threat?
Obviously been getting used to F/C food mate, we need to put you on a crew meal regimen you might otherwise grow out of the zebra stripes on your shoulders. Thinking perhaps just for the likes of you we should add piping to the uniform and whistle when you board to announce the arrival of the archetypal captain and his retinue?
I apologise I did not know this was the DOSC forum.
Where should we go Mr. little stick if we need to continue our whine?
Thanks for all the help.
Me little crew lost and no idea where to go maybe you can help with your wizlittledom!
Global Nomad;
panthers change place but never change spots! Thanks for the warning I willl heed it! But was it a masked threat?
Last edited by mascarpone; 24th Sep 2005 at 09:29.
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No problems, cheese, apology accepted. And there's no shame in being corrected either.
I see you've deleted some of your previous posts after receiving a kicking. Having a re-think, hey? Good to see.
Whatever your personal history and problem is with pilots, this is not the place to go slagging off if you're hoping for back-up although it does provide sport for some of the fellas in a battle of "wits". I just hate to see someone going into a fight un-armed!!
I see you've deleted some of your previous posts after receiving a kicking. Having a re-think, hey? Good to see.
Whatever your personal history and problem is with pilots, this is not the place to go slagging off if you're hoping for back-up although it does provide sport for some of the fellas in a battle of "wits". I just hate to see someone going into a fight un-armed!!
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Dessert Cheese,
Why did you delete the other thread that you began, couldn't take the heat? It took me forever to come up with a cogent arguement and you deleted it with a key stroke. Mind you, the Tiramisu tasted good!
Cerberus
Why did you delete the other thread that you began, couldn't take the heat? It took me forever to come up with a cogent arguement and you deleted it with a key stroke. Mind you, the Tiramisu tasted good!
Cerberus