College or Work?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dublin
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
College or Work?
Hi Guys,
Apologies in advance if this is in the wrong forum. I'm just about to finish up secondary school. I'm going to do fairly well in my exams and could go onto college but it just seems like a waste of time as all I've ever wanted to do was be a pilot. But unfortunately I dont have a rich "Mummy and Daddy" to fund me through flight training.
So I'm just looking for your opinions on whether your better of going to college and getting a degree under your belt and then saving up the money which would realistically be at least 10 years before I'll have anywhere near the money required for flight training? or just go straight into the work place in an aviation related environment(e.g. ramp agent, cabin crew) and start saving now straight away?
Any advice is much appreciated.
Apologies in advance if this is in the wrong forum. I'm just about to finish up secondary school. I'm going to do fairly well in my exams and could go onto college but it just seems like a waste of time as all I've ever wanted to do was be a pilot. But unfortunately I dont have a rich "Mummy and Daddy" to fund me through flight training.
So I'm just looking for your opinions on whether your better of going to college and getting a degree under your belt and then saving up the money which would realistically be at least 10 years before I'll have anywhere near the money required for flight training? or just go straight into the work place in an aviation related environment(e.g. ramp agent, cabin crew) and start saving now straight away?
Any advice is much appreciated.
Last edited by jackw; 30th Apr 2012 at 21:04.
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 433
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Depends what you want from life. I was in a similar situation to you and ended up going to university to do a tough, in demand degree that would open a lot of doors. Benefit of doing that is that my earning potential is a lot higher than it was pre-university and I should have a good career to keep me going whilst training. It most certainly is not for everyone though.
It is my opinion that if more aspiring pilots got themselves on the career ladder (and that doesn't have to come from a degree) prior to training, fewer would stoop to the levels we often see in order to get a flying job.
There are positives and negatives to be found in most routes to be honest and it's all about what you want to gain. I know the impatience to get to where you want to be, but really there is more to life and there is certainly a lot of growing up to be done from school leaving age.
Edited to say: As pudoc points out, university fees have become (in England at least) very large. Had the current offer been on the table I would not have bothered with university - it's about tripled in price for the coming year's intake. That said, the repayment schedule is arguably better than before.
It is my opinion that if more aspiring pilots got themselves on the career ladder (and that doesn't have to come from a degree) prior to training, fewer would stoop to the levels we often see in order to get a flying job.
There are positives and negatives to be found in most routes to be honest and it's all about what you want to gain. I know the impatience to get to where you want to be, but really there is more to life and there is certainly a lot of growing up to be done from school leaving age.
Edited to say: As pudoc points out, university fees have become (in England at least) very large. Had the current offer been on the table I would not have bothered with university - it's about tripled in price for the coming year's intake. That said, the repayment schedule is arguably better than before.
Last edited by BerksFlyer; 30th Apr 2012 at 21:30.
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: EU
Posts: 626
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't know if it's the same in your country, Jack, but remember uni can be an added expense too.
Personally I know plenty of pilots with nothing but high school education up to degrees. I only have high school qualifications, school was never for me. I spent too much time flying rather than studying!
Not a commercial pilot yet though...but just do what's best for you as the above poster said.
Becoming a pilot isn't a science, it's an art.
Personally I know plenty of pilots with nothing but high school education up to degrees. I only have high school qualifications, school was never for me. I spent too much time flying rather than studying!
Not a commercial pilot yet though...but just do what's best for you as the above poster said.
Becoming a pilot isn't a science, it's an art.
Jack,
What is the story with Government Funding in the South compared to the North for College? I know Dublin is bloody expensive when it comes to Studying. That said the North and UK isn't any cheaper.
If you were gonna go for the Degree, an Engineering or Science based Degree would benefit you more down the line. I have friends with Sports, Marketing and Law Degrees who are twiddling their thumbs at the minute (So much they will fall off soon). Another friend of mine has a Degree in Electrical Engineering. He got a job straight away upon graduating this year. I myself am back at the books studying Electrical Engineering while trying to get in some hours here and there when I can with the PPL.
As already mentioned it is down to you and what you really want out of life. If you can get yourself a half decent Job after your Exams then I would get straight into work and get the Flight Training done.
What is the story with Government Funding in the South compared to the North for College? I know Dublin is bloody expensive when it comes to Studying. That said the North and UK isn't any cheaper.
If you were gonna go for the Degree, an Engineering or Science based Degree would benefit you more down the line. I have friends with Sports, Marketing and Law Degrees who are twiddling their thumbs at the minute (So much they will fall off soon). Another friend of mine has a Degree in Electrical Engineering. He got a job straight away upon graduating this year. I myself am back at the books studying Electrical Engineering while trying to get in some hours here and there when I can with the PPL.
As already mentioned it is down to you and what you really want out of life. If you can get yourself a half decent Job after your Exams then I would get straight into work and get the Flight Training done.
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,815
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
there are some course which hold better prospects than others.
The pilots that I have flown with that never seem to have issues with cash and having a second source of income are.
Pharmacists and Opticians these seems to have the advantage of a high starting salary and plenty of potential for locum work.
Alot of the proffessional courses need a time in job to become useful and then you need to stay current to be able to sell yourself. I only know one engineer that manages to do consultancy work on the side.
Have a look at doing a degree in scotland the fees are alot less than the rest of the UK.
Optometry BSc (Hons) at Glasgow Caledonian University, | 52280546 | Whatuni.com
£1820 a year fees and male to female ratio of 40:60 can't be bad.
Depends if that floats your boat. You should never do a course that doesn't interest you. You need a backup in case it all goes wrong with the flight training side of things. If you couldn't face looking in someones eyes for the rest of your working life don't do it.
On no account look at aviation degrees with pilot studies, they are a waste of time and money in my opinion. Utterly worthless in the real world how ever much the providers will tell you otherwise.
The pilots that I have flown with that never seem to have issues with cash and having a second source of income are.
Pharmacists and Opticians these seems to have the advantage of a high starting salary and plenty of potential for locum work.
Alot of the proffessional courses need a time in job to become useful and then you need to stay current to be able to sell yourself. I only know one engineer that manages to do consultancy work on the side.
Have a look at doing a degree in scotland the fees are alot less than the rest of the UK.
Optometry BSc (Hons) at Glasgow Caledonian University, | 52280546 | Whatuni.com
£1820 a year fees and male to female ratio of 40:60 can't be bad.
Depends if that floats your boat. You should never do a course that doesn't interest you. You need a backup in case it all goes wrong with the flight training side of things. If you couldn't face looking in someones eyes for the rest of your working life don't do it.
On no account look at aviation degrees with pilot studies, they are a waste of time and money in my opinion. Utterly worthless in the real world how ever much the providers will tell you otherwise.
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: For me to know, and attractive women to find out.
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
But unfortunately I dont have a rich "Mummy and Daddy" to fund me through flight training.
Whilst doing modular you can also work, yes its unlikely that you'll be able to cover the training costs in what you will earn as an 18/19/20 year old, but remember you can work at your pace- i.e complete/continue the training when you have the money. End of the day, you'll come out with the same licence as the rest of the integrated guys, wont start the argument on how likely you are to get a job as modular/integrated there are threads on that. But it just goes to show, there are other ways in, even for those that don't play polo on the weekends
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was in a position very similar to you two years ago. I opted to go to university to do a pretty bland course in order to have something to fall back on should flying "not work out" or I decide to not go into aviation.
I'm currently about to complete my second year and drop out for an integrated course (a course of action that average PPruner would abhor as it seems).
The fact is that I have no motivation to continue with the course. I will leave this year with a diploma in the social sciences or some other rubbish, so not completely void of qualification.
Looking back on it, Uni has been a great experience, and if I had chosen a course I was more interested in, rather than one with real-world applications that seemed pragmatic, I would - without a doubt - be staying for another year.
My advice to you is; If there's a course you really want to do, and you can stand the fees without getting into a mountain of debt (read "be Scottish") then go for it. Otherwise, save your debt and time for aviation.
You must finally note, the hard work, debt, and risk that a career in piloting will bring will be n-fold that of a typical graduate job.
I'm currently about to complete my second year and drop out for an integrated course (a course of action that average PPruner would abhor as it seems).
The fact is that I have no motivation to continue with the course. I will leave this year with a diploma in the social sciences or some other rubbish, so not completely void of qualification.
Looking back on it, Uni has been a great experience, and if I had chosen a course I was more interested in, rather than one with real-world applications that seemed pragmatic, I would - without a doubt - be staying for another year.
My advice to you is; If there's a course you really want to do, and you can stand the fees without getting into a mountain of debt (read "be Scottish") then go for it. Otherwise, save your debt and time for aviation.
You must finally note, the hard work, debt, and risk that a career in piloting will bring will be n-fold that of a typical graduate job.
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Above the clouds where the sun is always shining
Age: 33
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
loan
hello,
I don't know if it's possible in Ireland but i did my training with some money from my parants but the biggest part came from a loan from the bank with not to bad conditions which they made specific for pilots in training.
I don't know the specifics by heart but you only start paying back the loan when you start receiving salary.
My advice is go to some banks and gain information
(the same for the flight schools, in some you have greater chance to get a job)
I don't know if it's possible in Ireland but i did my training with some money from my parants but the biggest part came from a loan from the bank with not to bad conditions which they made specific for pilots in training.
I don't know the specifics by heart but you only start paying back the loan when you start receiving salary.
My advice is go to some banks and gain information
(the same for the flight schools, in some you have greater chance to get a job)
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Sky
Posts: 501
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi there,
Like some other ppl I was in the same position as you are now in. I wanted to fly, but 2 years ago the market was really down. No hirings, no cadetships, just nothing! Even OAA coudn't place their students. Okay, they placed some, but there were a lot of students without a job. Now it is becoming slightly better, but far from good! But when was the market at his best?
The biggest reason for me that I went to study is that I want a back up plan. Because when I'm 50 years old and my eyes are giving it slightly up, I could do something else. With this study, it is possible.
I'm not the most motivated person in my class. But I work hard to gain good notes and first passes.. Don't want to resit exams..
Oh besides: if you are doing it for the money.. do it good. I'm now 7 days busy. I'm doing an internship, going to school and I'm working in the weekends for money (to pay the college fee and saving up for a PPL).
I can tell you this: it is sh*t and it is sh*t. Choose the one with less sh*t..
Like some other ppl I was in the same position as you are now in. I wanted to fly, but 2 years ago the market was really down. No hirings, no cadetships, just nothing! Even OAA coudn't place their students. Okay, they placed some, but there were a lot of students without a job. Now it is becoming slightly better, but far from good! But when was the market at his best?
The biggest reason for me that I went to study is that I want a back up plan. Because when I'm 50 years old and my eyes are giving it slightly up, I could do something else. With this study, it is possible.
I'm not the most motivated person in my class. But I work hard to gain good notes and first passes.. Don't want to resit exams..
Oh besides: if you are doing it for the money.. do it good. I'm now 7 days busy. I'm doing an internship, going to school and I'm working in the weekends for money (to pay the college fee and saving up for a PPL).
I can tell you this: it is sh*t and it is sh*t. Choose the one with less sh*t..
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: SE London
Age: 29
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm in the same position
Hi OP,
I'm 17, nearly 18 in a month. If I was in education I would be in second year of college, however I never attended college, I can't focus myself on subjects which bear no relevance to my life an never will.
I'm currently working full-time, I'm not crap wage, only made good by the fact I'm living at home and not payign rent. £15,000pa. However this is funding my PPL, I've got 2 logged hours under my belt, aim to do 4 hours a month, which is £620, I could push for 5, but I do have other bill, work expenses, travel, food and so on!
I don't know what to suggest, go with your insticts, but make sure you pput full effort into whatever you do!
I'm 17, nearly 18 in a month. If I was in education I would be in second year of college, however I never attended college, I can't focus myself on subjects which bear no relevance to my life an never will.
I'm currently working full-time, I'm not crap wage, only made good by the fact I'm living at home and not payign rent. £15,000pa. However this is funding my PPL, I've got 2 logged hours under my belt, aim to do 4 hours a month, which is £620, I could push for 5, but I do have other bill, work expenses, travel, food and so on!
I don't know what to suggest, go with your insticts, but make sure you pput full effort into whatever you do!
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Temporarily unsure of my position
Age: 33
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Think very carefully about what you want...
I though i'd add my own tale of woe to this thread...
I did an integrated course straight out of A-Levels, graduated with the expensive little blue book in December 2010, had the usual interview most people have with a certain blue and yellow irish airline, but didn't make the cut. Now i'm working in an office and flying fairly regularly at weekends down the flying club whilst sending out CV's and making contacts.
Re-assessing the situation, I think i've made a mistake doign the full blown fATPL. Don't get me wrong, I do love to fly, it's a wonderful skill to have and the people you meet along the way are excellent, but I've come to re-assess my life a bit. You could argue that I should 'sod off' to Africa and get a bush pilot job, which would be a lot of fun and a great experience, but all the SEP bashing in the world doesn't put food on the table and a roof over your head, unless you get lucky with an airline afterwards.
When you think about what's important in life, family, friends and a stable future, then flying starts to become less and less attractive. I don't want to come back to the UK in my late twenties with little to no money and no hope of a descent 'normal' job, especially with everyone around me settling down, getting married and having kids. You can't get those years back. Do I really want to risk my future chasing something that could potentially never happen. I agree, this route is fine for some people and would probably pay off in the end, but you have to have absolute commitment and put up with a lot of crap along the way, even then, i've known lives that have been shattered by trying to break into aviaiton.
I have a placement at University to study a degree in Physics this September (despite Mr Cleggs lovely new funding system), which I intend to start unless something miraculous comes up. Hopefully after i'll move into the Finance or Energy sectors, maybe even Bae of Airbus if it's possible. Flying will always be a big part of my life, i can't wait to save up enough to do my aeros course next year, then maybe even an FI to teach at weekends down the club, who knows, but what i do realise now is that a good education opens a lot more doors than you may not realise now. Stay at Uni, fly for fun. Hindsight is a painful thing.
I did an integrated course straight out of A-Levels, graduated with the expensive little blue book in December 2010, had the usual interview most people have with a certain blue and yellow irish airline, but didn't make the cut. Now i'm working in an office and flying fairly regularly at weekends down the flying club whilst sending out CV's and making contacts.
Re-assessing the situation, I think i've made a mistake doign the full blown fATPL. Don't get me wrong, I do love to fly, it's a wonderful skill to have and the people you meet along the way are excellent, but I've come to re-assess my life a bit. You could argue that I should 'sod off' to Africa and get a bush pilot job, which would be a lot of fun and a great experience, but all the SEP bashing in the world doesn't put food on the table and a roof over your head, unless you get lucky with an airline afterwards.
When you think about what's important in life, family, friends and a stable future, then flying starts to become less and less attractive. I don't want to come back to the UK in my late twenties with little to no money and no hope of a descent 'normal' job, especially with everyone around me settling down, getting married and having kids. You can't get those years back. Do I really want to risk my future chasing something that could potentially never happen. I agree, this route is fine for some people and would probably pay off in the end, but you have to have absolute commitment and put up with a lot of crap along the way, even then, i've known lives that have been shattered by trying to break into aviaiton.
I have a placement at University to study a degree in Physics this September (despite Mr Cleggs lovely new funding system), which I intend to start unless something miraculous comes up. Hopefully after i'll move into the Finance or Energy sectors, maybe even Bae of Airbus if it's possible. Flying will always be a big part of my life, i can't wait to save up enough to do my aeros course next year, then maybe even an FI to teach at weekends down the club, who knows, but what i do realise now is that a good education opens a lot more doors than you may not realise now. Stay at Uni, fly for fun. Hindsight is a painful thing.
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Weston super mare
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
After my GCSE’s I did A-levels, then thought about university to do aerospace engineering, would have cost a lot to do and like yourself all I wanted to do was fly.... Then I made one of the best decision I have ever made and applied for a Airbus apprenticeship, I applied for the craft (shop floor) only needed 3 GCSE’s and I had 4 A-levels (and at first to be honest I was a bit up my own ass about it) and was worried it would be a step backwards... wrong.
I was paid from day 1 to do an NVG in aerospace engineering, I’m a qualified aircraft fitter, systems trained, composite materials trained etc... Now I am an in-service repair engineer on good(ish) money and know Airbus aircraft almost inside out which I’m sure will help me with ATPL exams, hopefully I will have the funds to go integrated next year. Ok I am almost 26 now, but for me this would be the best way to work to get money for flight training.
and after all this Airbus said they would pay for my degree and let me have the time off work to do it So really my point is... get a career that you can fall back on, If I can’t find a flying job after training I will always have a half decent CV to fall back on. For me I feel my 2 A-level years were a complete waste of time. And Kermit your 3rd paragraph is so true that’s the position I’m in now.
I was paid from day 1 to do an NVG in aerospace engineering, I’m a qualified aircraft fitter, systems trained, composite materials trained etc... Now I am an in-service repair engineer on good(ish) money and know Airbus aircraft almost inside out which I’m sure will help me with ATPL exams, hopefully I will have the funds to go integrated next year. Ok I am almost 26 now, but for me this would be the best way to work to get money for flight training.
and after all this Airbus said they would pay for my degree and let me have the time off work to do it So really my point is... get a career that you can fall back on, If I can’t find a flying job after training I will always have a half decent CV to fall back on. For me I feel my 2 A-level years were a complete waste of time. And Kermit your 3rd paragraph is so true that’s the position I’m in now.
