BA Future Pilot Programme (FPP)(Merged)

[MLX-371]

Yes you can, it's equivalent to A-Levels in maths, Physics, and "engineering Science" / or Biology.

I suppose you are speaking about the French Scientific Baccalaureate, aren't you ?

As they are requiring BBC grades or above regarding A-Levels, how can we determine the grade for a French exam which is generally expressed out of 20 ? I have done some research about it, and in conlusion, it was said that grades were hardly comparable between these two systems.

And as the French Scientific Baccalaureate is not based on only three subjects but more than 10, why would it be the equivalent of A-Levels in Maths, Physics, and "Engineering Science" or Biology ? Can't we consider other subjects than these ones to apply, as they didn't mentioned it ?

It is only required "Bs or above" in English, Maths and a Science subject for GCSEs, isn't it ? I think it would have been more appropriate to ask this question to UK NARIC, but I wanted to know your point of view !

Thanks !

[BusinessMan]

jez d is correct. And it's worse than that because (unless you are under a pre-tagged ROTE scheme like BAs, Netjets etc) then you don't get any income tax relief on the training expenses either because it's not training required to enable you in the undertaking of your current position.

Effectively, for most UK trainees, the UK govt gain 20% VAT on the course costs and then an additional 20-40% (band-dependent) on the income you have had (or will have) to earn in order to pay both that training cost and it's VAT and any loan interest. It could hardly be a less attractive system.

But I digress (sorry for the temporary thread drift).

@berksflyer - see your point re grades but IMHO I think that once people get to the final stage those glowing academic grades won't be the make or break. I think it's more important early in the process, enabling BA to a) ensure a basic minimum standard b) limit out a swathe of applicants c) minimise risk on the ATPL exams (which, frankly, won't be at all difficult for anyone who's got these minimum grades).

In my experience of recruitment (having been on both sides of the table in the past), getting selected once you've got to the final cut will be about professionalism, personality, how you deal with people, how you operate in a small team, potential for (eventual) command, could they sit next to you in the cockpit for hours etc. Either way the academics clearly aren't a worry for you, best of luck with the scheme

[Babar350]

Well MLX, I applied couple of years ago for the Cathay cadet scheme, no answer but I filled the form exactly like another person who has been accepted and I used this format : If Bac S then it is A-Levels in the 3 principal courses.

You can then, explain this to the recruiting people you may meet. But as far as I know A-Levels is an "equivalent" to the Bac S and GCSE is the "Brevet des collèges"

Check this : [Elseware] > Equivalence des Diplômes

Since it's from a French university website I guess it's accurate .

[The African Dude]

you can't even scrape BBC in A-levels I would question your motivation. If you really are that motivated and passionate why did you not work harder at school?

Get real. Some people have problems at home which can distract from such achievements. I am no exception. I didn't get BBC but I still went to uni, won some awards and then got an interview with BA as a DEP. Doesn't sound like I have a motivation problem, does it?

Working hard does give you a better chance of success but it is no guarantee. Try not to sound so arrogant.

That said: if the minimum requirements say you need a B in Maths, then you're not doing yourself any favours by expecting to get in with anything less.

[MarkR1981]

Get real. Some people have problems at home which can distract from such achievements. I am no exception. I didn't get BBC but I still went to uni, won some awards and then got an interview with BA as a DEP. Doesn't sound like I have a motivation problem, does it?

Working hard does give you a better chance of success but it is no guarantee. Try not to sound so arrogant.

That said: if the minimum requirements say you need a B in Maths, then you're not doing yourself any favours by expecting to get in with anything less.

Glad somebody beat me to it. I to fall into this category, there are many different variables that affect peoples performance at different stages of their life besides raw academic ability.

And whilst a reasonable academic ability can and should be expected as a prerequisite for a professional pilot there are many other factors which are important too, and one of those is surely attitude!!

Good luck to anyone who pursues this opportunity, and to those who are worried about grades, to be realistic it probably will hamper your chances, however If you dont apply you will never know. Also if you want it enough and you do have the ability, then be proactive and do what it takes to get the grades you require.

[Rhcriad Bsranon]

Just a suggestion, but perhaps those that don't quite cut the mustard (academically) for the BA FPP might consider other avenues into aviation. I've read over the years of pilots without even an 'O' level to their name becoming successful airline pilots, so perhaps the solution lies elsewhere?

Surely this can't be the only option?

BTW, no disrepect intended to any of the knowledgeable and gifted contributors to this forum.

[Bealzebub]

I got my C in maths because I was affected in the early years of maths study at secondary school after being bullied, meaning I was behind everyone else and had to catch up which was enough work.

An unfortunate and unpleasant experience. BUT what you need to be able to show is how despite this adversity, you were able to overcome it and excelled rather than allowed it to become an excuse for mediocrity. That is the sort of determination and passion that is being looked for. You are not alone, and plenty of people have done just that.

You are still very young and hopefully the situation is much better now. It is up to you what you do to show determination and success, because that is what will count. "Catching up" isn't likely to be enough. You need to shine!

[Mikeoscar94]

As has already been mentioned, I think it will be almost impossible for people without degrees to get through this course.

Guess I'll just keep plodding on with my modular, taking one day at a time.

[lander66]

As has already been mentioned, I think it will be almost impossible for people without degrees to get through this course.

I highly doubt this is the case however I do think it will be hard for someone to go straight out of sixth form and get a position here because I would imagine BA would like someone who has at least a bit of life experience, whether this comes from working or getting a degree. This would simply be a sign of maturity. As far as academic ability goes I think anyone who meets the minimum requirements and passes the aptitude tests will be capable of completing the work. The main issues for BA once these tests are passed are likely to be, personality, leadership qualities, teamwork, commitment and most of all passion! I shouldn't think a AAA graded individual will get much of a leg-up over a BBC graded individual. Once the tests are passed, they are passed and other issues are more important.

[Wander00]

Son of a friend is interested in the pogramme, but is getting conflicting advice on whether or not he should get some flying experience (light aircraft or gliding). Some are telling him BA (and other organisations) want aviation virgins, others of which I am one say getting some experience would show interest and commitment. Any advice out there

[Hovermonkey]

As has already been mentioned, I think it will be almost impossible for people without degrees to get through this course.
I highly doubt this is the case however I do think it will be hard for someone to go straight out of sixth form and get a position here because I would imagine BA would like someone who has at least a bit of life experience, whether this comes from working or getting a degree. This would simply be a sign of maturity. As far as academic ability goes I think anyone who meets the minimum requirements and passes the aptitude tests will be capable of completing the work. The main issues for BA once these tests are passed are likely to be, personality, leadership qualities, teamwork, commitment and most of all passion! I shouldn't think a AAA graded individual will get much of a leg-up over a BBC graded individual. Once the tests are passed, they are passed and other issues are more important

@lander 66 - Think you hit the nail on the head there. The academic requirements will be looked at in the initial paper sift as a coarse method of getting rid of the chaff. Thereafter, you can forget your degree/A levels; they don't matter. What BA will look at more (foremost IMO) will be your aptitude, both for flying and leadership - after all this is what they are investing their time and money (wages) in. In my experience, spare capacity and a cool head (in the air) is by far the biggest boon to professional flying training and this is something that they will certainly look for in the selection - not something that can be demonstrated by a 2:1 in Geography.

[Sygyzy]

Rhcriad Bsranon

Other avenues into flying if you don't have the academic prowess.

Yup, easy, find ~£84000 for the basic integrated course and then fund your type rating and THEN punt yourself around looking for that elusive first job. If that's difficult then go along to the RAF and Auntie Betty will train you for free-with some strings attached. The competition there is stiff too.

As other posters have pointed out you probably don't need a 2:1 to be a pilot from the academic standpoint, but that's why all top employers look for degree level achievement. It shows that you can work on you own for a number of years and come up with the roses. In this, BA are even giving you a second chance if your school grades don't cut the mustard.

This appears to be a once in a generation opportunity which is why it will be so keenly contested.

45+years ago when Hamble was running, the personal payback costs (albeit structured differently) were approx one year's salary gross-repayable over 5 years. Not too dissimilar to the current scheme.

[Topjet]

I wonder how favourably they'll look upon an En route London controller.... Maybe ATC qualifications will count towards something? I hope!

[Zippy Monster]

Originally Posted by Roger-Wilco

I have obviously shown i can't work on my own and come up with the roses...I guess I had better come up with a bloody good excuse for my lack of 2:1....it's certainly not because im incapable of getting one, I just had incorrect priorities in my Youth, which is the biggest regret of my life and a big red mark on my CV!

Know exactly how you feel - I did exactly the same. 9A*s and 1A at GCSE, AAAB at A-level (none of which were General Studies!), went to uni, spent 3 years drinking and ended up graduating with a "Vorderman", "Douglas", or whatever they call a 3rd these days! Utterly regretful, and I still have the occasional nightmare of sitting in some of those exams without having a clue what was going on.

5 years down the line, I've got a good few years already under my belt on a permanent contract with great salary/conditions and around 2500hrs in the logbook with a major European airline.

Moral of the story - don't let the lack of degree success put you off or intimidate you into worrying they're going to question it at length! BA have said there is no minimum class of degree if you have the high school qualifications - therefore they must be expecting people in that position to apply. It's probably best to just "be yourself" in the interview and don't try to bullsh*t them - they won't be daft, and will probably see straight through even a 'bloody good excuse!'

After every recurrent sim session, the first question the TRE asks is "so, what did you think?" or "you debrief me first, how did you do?" or something to that effect. One of the main qualities they will be looking for is to self-critique [sp?] and analyse your own performance, both good and bad points. The interviewers will be probably be looking for evidence of this ability. While it obviously wouldn't be a good idea to sit and explain how all you did was get drunk and get laid for 3 years, if you don't make an obvious effort to cover it up but instead explain how you tried to mitigate it and improve further down the line - basically, try to put the best positive spin on it you can - the overall result might not unimpress them as much as you're worrying about.

Best of luck!

[hasell]

Is the scheme now closed -or not yet open for applications??

Hi,
Can anyone say if the scheme is now closed or paused for applications. I clicked on the link but I could only access a link to register my interest.

Thanks.

[MLX-371]

If you have a previously flown, the hours flown will be reviewed on an individual basis. However, you must not hold a Commercial Pilot's licence or higher, or have commenced an integrated course of flight training, if you wish to apply for the Programme.

As I said previously, I hold a PPL, and a theoretical ATPL, but as a modular student. Am I still considered as eligible ?

[Groundloop]

I'm not quite sure how the BA FPP is a boost to the aviation industry, as all the jobs will be going to people who aren't yet qualified as pilots. It is a massive blow to everyone with fATPLs, as there are now 400 less jobs to apply to.

But there are another 400 jobs for experienced pilots! These 400 must come from somewhere thus producing vacancies elsewhere.

Any airline that is planning to recruit 800 pilots is a major boost to the industry at the moment.

[Hovermonkey]

Hasell:

Applications haven't opened yet according to the site - expected to at the end of the month i believe...

[shortfinals]

Behind BA's latest recruitment drive

Is it what it looks like? It can't be that bad: BA is recruiting again - Learmount

[catfoodtastesbad]

In addition to Groundloop's comment:

These 400 new cadets are likely to be people that would have risked un-tagged integrated courses anyway. With these slots taken up by FPPs Ryanair/easyJet/whoever will have fewer cadets to choose from, this will hopefully open up options in these airlines for experienced pilots/modular fATPLs etc.