BA Future Pilot Programme (FPP)(Merged)
Join Date: May 2004
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can anyone give me one sane rational economic reason why BA are paying for the training of wannabes when now there are plenty (to put it politely) of us who have already gone through the process that BA is now voluteering to pay for? From newly qualified guys to type rated experienced guys.
I agree with sudden twang and their point 5 above. If you want to be cynical you can adapt it to say BA don't want finance restricting entry as they genuinely want the best candidates as people failing the course and requiring extra training will end up costing them money. With selection being very stringent I reckon the failure rate from this scheme will be next to zero. I've recently joined BA after starting with easyjet as a cadet a few years ago and the difference between the BA cadet programme and the modern easyjet programme is incredible. I would highly recommend BA as an employer, if you get a place on the FPP you will have a fantastic and varied career ahead of you.
And for all those detailing their various GCSE and A level results and asking for advice on their chances at selection, just apply. That is the only way to find out.....
Good luck
jasoninbucks
Whilst I think that you're ably qualified-on paper-as the type of guy that BA are looking for, I really think that you should go onto the other threads and have a good look at the way BA conduct their (piloting) business to see what you're applying for/letting yourself in for. To start with...you're no spring chicken and the course is intensive and very much full time/full on. Your family will have to come a poor second for the duration of the course.
Seniority is absolutely everything in BA. This will affect how much you earn etc (other threads) but particularly your life style. You will probably get rosters that give you one full weekend off in eight, (you'll probably see the odd Sat or Sun off only) for a very long time-three or four years perhaps-at a time when your kids are very much inot weekend school activities. Seniors don't want to work weekends either but they have to seniority not to. (Fortunately BA has weighting system when bidding for leave/Christmas off, but otherwise, you will be enjoying a very different lifestyle from the one you enjoy now). Time to command will likely be ten years or longer-took me eighteen-and that wasn't because I passed up the opportunity it was slow expansion and many who were my age clogging the system to retirement. You won't be running your own department/ship until then, even though 99.5% of your fellow crew members will be charming. Can you cope with that into your 50's.
Your family will have to embrace the airline culture. BA are generous with tickets and allowances for Christmas trips for example. You can take your family to enjoy Christmas in one of your fleet's European destinations as you will be working over Christmas. If they will find that exciting then you'll all enjoy it. If not you'll have a few lonely Christmases wondering whether you should have stayed as a head of department in a parralel universe. Airline flying is a 24/7 job. From a fatigue point of view shorthaul is better than longhaul-it's a different kind of tiredness-and from Bucks the commute should be easy, but you will get bloody tired from time to time with early, early mornings and late nights. If you're away and the boiler fails in the middle of winter/the washing machine floods/one child has the measles and needs quaratine/the car simply won't start, then your wife will have to deal with it, time and again. You can't simply say that you'll be in later/please get me home early. That's not the way it works.
It's been a while since I worked for BA but the gist of this is valid. These are just a few examples, others are available to peruse on other threads, or to ask. Teaching is 9-5 with weekends off, something that you've grown very used to-airline flying is the absolute opposite. ( I'm sure it's not as simplistic as that-I'm demonstrating my lack of knowledge of the teaching profession now). I'm not in any way saying don't pursue your dream, it's a wonderful job straight out of Boy's Own, but (at your age...) beware what you wish for and do the research first.
Seniority is absolutely everything in BA. This will affect how much you earn etc (other threads) but particularly your life style. You will probably get rosters that give you one full weekend off in eight, (you'll probably see the odd Sat or Sun off only) for a very long time-three or four years perhaps-at a time when your kids are very much inot weekend school activities. Seniors don't want to work weekends either but they have to seniority not to. (Fortunately BA has weighting system when bidding for leave/Christmas off, but otherwise, you will be enjoying a very different lifestyle from the one you enjoy now). Time to command will likely be ten years or longer-took me eighteen-and that wasn't because I passed up the opportunity it was slow expansion and many who were my age clogging the system to retirement. You won't be running your own department/ship until then, even though 99.5% of your fellow crew members will be charming. Can you cope with that into your 50's.
Your family will have to embrace the airline culture. BA are generous with tickets and allowances for Christmas trips for example. You can take your family to enjoy Christmas in one of your fleet's European destinations as you will be working over Christmas. If they will find that exciting then you'll all enjoy it. If not you'll have a few lonely Christmases wondering whether you should have stayed as a head of department in a parralel universe. Airline flying is a 24/7 job. From a fatigue point of view shorthaul is better than longhaul-it's a different kind of tiredness-and from Bucks the commute should be easy, but you will get bloody tired from time to time with early, early mornings and late nights. If you're away and the boiler fails in the middle of winter/the washing machine floods/one child has the measles and needs quaratine/the car simply won't start, then your wife will have to deal with it, time and again. You can't simply say that you'll be in later/please get me home early. That's not the way it works.
It's been a while since I worked for BA but the gist of this is valid. These are just a few examples, others are available to peruse on other threads, or to ask. Teaching is 9-5 with weekends off, something that you've grown very used to-airline flying is the absolute opposite. ( I'm sure it's not as simplistic as that-I'm demonstrating my lack of knowledge of the teaching profession now). I'm not in any way saying don't pursue your dream, it's a wonderful job straight out of Boy's Own, but (at your age...) beware what you wish for and do the research first.
Join Date: Aug 2011
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TDME & Sygyzy
Thanks for such honest comments. I know one or two BA pilots and I know that it would be a very different change of lifestyle (although I think you recognise that teaching isn't 9-5; average for me is around 65hrs per week during term time!)
My gut feeling is that my age/family commitments are against me, but we'll see - no harm in applying, just to see.
Thanks again for the positive comments.
My gut feeling is that my age/family commitments are against me, but we'll see - no harm in applying, just to see.
Thanks again for the positive comments.
Join Date: Mar 2001
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Lots of very bitter people on here.. If BA want to recruit for a FPP instead of selecting from graduates already with an fATPl, sorry, but that's their choice!!
For all those wondering, if you come close to minimum requirements, it's worth applying. Worse that can happen is you get a 'no' - which considering the amount of applications expected compared to the number of places available is the most likely scenario. But by some chance your application might shine and you could end up at the assessment stage. As far as I'm aware, applicatons will be screened be people, not computers!
Good Luck to all. This is by far the best scheme in years!
Make sure you really put everything you have into your application. Use spell checker and get someone else to read through it for grammatical errors! You are applying for the career of a lifetime- give it everything you have and the rewards will be huge!
For all those wondering, if you come close to minimum requirements, it's worth applying. Worse that can happen is you get a 'no' - which considering the amount of applications expected compared to the number of places available is the most likely scenario. But by some chance your application might shine and you could end up at the assessment stage. As far as I'm aware, applicatons will be screened be people, not computers!
Good Luck to all. This is by far the best scheme in years!
Make sure you really put everything you have into your application. Use spell checker and get someone else to read through it for grammatical errors! You are applying for the career of a lifetime- give it everything you have and the rewards will be huge!
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> Human Factor
quote'BA hoovered up the best self sponsored candidates from the main training schools'-this is just not true-BA have not interviewed from either of the main FTO's and have not employed a single cadet over the last 2 years.
quote'applicants with a spare £80k cash is limited'-this is true but out of date-you now need minimum £110k and £130k is more realistic to include out of pocket expenses and type rating-the first question at any interview is -can you afford the type rating? Are we sure that BA are including the type rating in their offer,I find it somewhat suspicious that the £84k is the same as the FTO's course costs without type rating!
Why are BA (and Atlantic Airlines)so keen to advertise this scheme-in my opinion the FTO's are getting desperate for good quality entry candidates who also have the bundle of cash-they have taken entrants from Holland,France,Bahrain but with the cash problems of the world and political problems in the middle east their cash flow is drying up.
It is interesting that if BA are so unimpressed with the quality of the pilots exiting the current FTO's why would they turn to the same FTO's to produce the quality of pilots they desire.
My opinion is that the FTO's have pleaded with the major airlines to provide a new ongoing cash flow,in return BA will use their high profile to ensure that there will be an almost infinite number of wanabees,who are prepared to loan themselves up to the hilt-BA ensures a source of top quality pilots who are bonded with them for seven years-the FTO's get new quality applicants and more importantly new cash. The reason that neither turn to the current excess of frozen ATPL's is not about quality,there are plenty of good pilots there but no new money!
quote'BA hoovered up the best self sponsored candidates from the main training schools'-this is just not true-BA have not interviewed from either of the main FTO's and have not employed a single cadet over the last 2 years.
quote'applicants with a spare £80k cash is limited'-this is true but out of date-you now need minimum £110k and £130k is more realistic to include out of pocket expenses and type rating-the first question at any interview is -can you afford the type rating? Are we sure that BA are including the type rating in their offer,I find it somewhat suspicious that the £84k is the same as the FTO's course costs without type rating!
Why are BA (and Atlantic Airlines)so keen to advertise this scheme-in my opinion the FTO's are getting desperate for good quality entry candidates who also have the bundle of cash-they have taken entrants from Holland,France,Bahrain but with the cash problems of the world and political problems in the middle east their cash flow is drying up.
It is interesting that if BA are so unimpressed with the quality of the pilots exiting the current FTO's why would they turn to the same FTO's to produce the quality of pilots they desire.
My opinion is that the FTO's have pleaded with the major airlines to provide a new ongoing cash flow,in return BA will use their high profile to ensure that there will be an almost infinite number of wanabees,who are prepared to loan themselves up to the hilt-BA ensures a source of top quality pilots who are bonded with them for seven years-the FTO's get new quality applicants and more importantly new cash. The reason that neither turn to the current excess of frozen ATPL's is not about quality,there are plenty of good pilots there but no new money!
Join Date: Feb 2008
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Arriba
From the BA FPP Webiste
Are we sure that BA are including the type rating in their offer,I find it somewhat suspicious that the £84k is the same as the FTO's course costs without type rating!
This is where the Future Pilot Programme really comes into its own. We have structured the programme so that APL will sponsor your flight training, jet orientation course and type rating.
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Arriba, what you're saying isn't true. You do not need 110k to train nowadays. People who chose to train integrated without airline mentorship didn't have to do so. If your heart is set on paying for a TR then one can train modular and fund a TR for the same, if not less, than the cost of training integrated without the funding of a TR on top.
BA obviously have decided to start this scheme so they can vet who they want from the very beginning. The standard of candidates on this scheme will be far higher than the average at any FTO (not to say there won't be anyone currently at the 3 FTOs concerned that may be of that standard) - because BA will be as picky as they want to be. They can create a steady flow of pilots of their own choosing right from the word go. It isn't hard to see the benefit for them.
As above, if you read through everything it is made clear that BA will be
funding the TR. This is the fairest snd most respectful scheme out there for quite some time now, even if it isn't perfect.
The point about why are they using the same FTOs - it won't be to do with the standard of training received, it will be more to do with the candidates themselves. The skills and qualities over and above what can be gained during training are what they're concerned with having control over.
BA obviously have decided to start this scheme so they can vet who they want from the very beginning. The standard of candidates on this scheme will be far higher than the average at any FTO (not to say there won't be anyone currently at the 3 FTOs concerned that may be of that standard) - because BA will be as picky as they want to be. They can create a steady flow of pilots of their own choosing right from the word go. It isn't hard to see the benefit for them.
As above, if you read through everything it is made clear that BA will be
funding the TR. This is the fairest snd most respectful scheme out there for quite some time now, even if it isn't perfect.
The point about why are they using the same FTOs - it won't be to do with the standard of training received, it will be more to do with the candidates themselves. The skills and qualities over and above what can be gained during training are what they're concerned with having control over.
Join Date: Aug 2011
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I heard it will be end of august.
Great scheme although I can see a lot of people applying just for the fun of it when there are so many people who would give their right arm for it.
Great scheme although I can see a lot of people applying just for the fun of it when there are so many people who would give their right arm for it.
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I agree, with the way it's been marketed it's bound to happen. Thankfully they'll be looking for those that demonstrate true passion for flying. You can only hope the cream will come to the top.
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Are Australians able to apply for this CPP, providing they are able to live and work in the UK? Is it truly a global cadetship?
If so, what are the equivalent educational requirements for Australians? I currently hold an Australian CPL.
Thanks in advance
If so, what are the equivalent educational requirements for Australians? I currently hold an Australian CPL.
Thanks in advance
Is there any further information outside of the Future Pilot site? Have read nowhere anything about not having a CPL nor nationality requirements.
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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The point about why are they using the same FTOs - it won't be to do with the standard of training received, it will be more to do with the candidates themselves.
For "low houred fATPL holders", the DEP process will continue. For CPL holders, I can verify what moo says. A CPL will disqualify you from this scheme. Sorry.
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"You must hold a valid passport, have the ability to travel globally without restriction, and also have the right to live and work in the UK."
Doesn't the above statement basically opens up the FPP globally, as long as you are able to qualify for a working Visa in the UK? I've tried looking, but it doesn't state anywhere in the site that it is only open to EU passport holders.
Please correct me if I'm wrong?
Doesn't the above statement basically opens up the FPP globally, as long as you are able to qualify for a working Visa in the UK? I've tried looking, but it doesn't state anywhere in the site that it is only open to EU passport holders.
Please correct me if I'm wrong?