Atlas Polar
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From reading you guy's sure looks like those ALPA guys screwed the pooch. Are there others looking to get out too?
Man, I thought ALPA had their act together. Didn't they lose two or three elections last year?
Man, I thought ALPA had their act together. Didn't they lose two or three elections last year?
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I would hope that with this finally behind us that our Polar bretheren drop a line to the new Teamsters group and get involved ASAP!
The next 8-12 months are going to be BUSY around here!
Any chance we can now close this thread and start a new one?
There is no more Polar vs Atlas, one group one voice.
DBW
The next 8-12 months are going to be BUSY around here!
Any chance we can now close this thread and start a new one?
There is no more Polar vs Atlas, one group one voice.
DBW
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I just got into an airline accident and am in jail in a foreign country. ALPA, understandably, won't take my call. How long do I have to play house with my cell mate until I get some help? I'm tired of being the bitch.
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Originally Posted by Miami Freight
I just got into an airline accident and am in jail in a foreign country. ALPA, understandably, won't take my call. How long do I have to play house with my cell mate until I get some help? I'm tired of being the bitch.
Teamsters Rush to Assist Crew in Kalitta Crash
July 8, 2008 Teamsters officials rushed to Bogota immediately after they learned of a Kalitta cargo plane crash involving crew members belonging to the union, Airline Division Director David Bourne said Tuesday.
Teamsters Local 747 President E.E. Sowell is now in Bogota, where he is expected to be communicating directly with the pilots. Sowell, an attorney, will be representing the pilots’ interests. Two members of the local union’s go team are also in Bogota to help with the accident investigation.
“If something happens, we’ll be there,” Bourne said. “I understand the Teamsters’ safety team and the airline’s safety team have a good working relationship, and I expect a cause of the crash will be determined. We have notified our aviation safety consultant, Greg Feith, and he is available to assist should any problems arise.”
Eight crew members survived after their Boeing 747 crashed into a house near Madrid, Colombia. According to reports, two people inside the house were killed. The airplane was delivering a load of flowers from Bogota to Miami.
Some crew members were taken to the local hospital, while the more severely injured were taken to larger hospitals in Bogota.
The National Transportation Safety Board sent investigator Dennis Jones to assist Colombian officials in the investigation.
More On :
Kalitta Crew Members All Home
July 24, 2008
Local 747 reports that the eight Kalitta crew members downed near Bogota, Colombia, are all home. They suffered injuries that range from serious to minor. All are being treated by their own doctors.
A National Transportation Safety Board investigator is assisting Colombian officials in finding out what caused the accident.
The company is also undergoing a National Aviation Safety Audit Program (NASAP) audit. The July 7 crash in Colombia was the second crash of a Kalitta Air 747 in six weeks.
“We’re so grateful that all of our crew members are back home, though we’re deeply saddened by the loss of two lives as a result of the accident,” said Airline Division Director David Bourne. “Local 747 President Gene Sowell deserves a great deal of credit for rushing immediately to Bogota as he learned about the crash. This is what union members do for their brothers and sisters.”
All eight crew members survived after their Boeing 747 crashed into a house near Madrid, Colombia. According to reports, two people inside the house were killed. The airplane was delivering a load of flowers from Bogota to Miami.
Some crew members were taken to the local hospital, while the more severely injured were taken to larger hospitals in Bogota.
More On :
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Originally Posted by miamifreight
I just got into an airline accident and am in jail in a foreign country. ALPA, understandably, won't take my call. How long do I have to play house with my cell mate until I get some help? I'm tired of being the bitch.
The local 1224 temporary card and emergency number is HERE IN PDF
Please, no crank calls.
As DBW said, will there be any volunteers on the Polar side to come fourth or are we left to ourselves again?
I've noted ALPA has already cut the Atlas side off from insurance, website, and any support before the Monday secondary certification of the results. Not that they didn't cut us off long ago.
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Congrats Bourne Boobs !
The election of ALPA by the pilots at Colgan—where the IBT also sought representation rights and where the IBT received less than 10 percent of the votes; the endorsement of ALPA rather than the Teamsters by the NPA Board; and the past decertification of the IBT at NetJets, UPS, ATA, and Evergreen shows that Teamster election rhetoric and promises typically give way to representation that does not benefit flight deck crewmembers. Will you relect the Obese one to represent you too?
Good Luck with that, Bourne Boobs !
Good Luck with that, Bourne Boobs !
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For anyone who knows the history of Colgan and how the old man and his kids kept ALPA at bay for 35 or so years, one must certainly congradulate the pilots for the victory.
For those who long dealt with the Teamsters under Don Treichler, the move by Mr. Hoffa to replace him can only be viewed as a new hope and fresh air. Captain Bourne's accumen and his publicly reported successes certainly are a strikingly positive contrast in comparison to the clear lack of success of his former Polar counterpart.
Contrary to his public statements, it appears that Mr. Prater seems to be taking ALPA backwards at a rapid pace. Having new members from Colgan to replenish his coffers must be rather important, given the loss of USAirways and America West and the apparent repudiation of ALPA by JetBlue due to his poor leadership.
It would also certainly seem logical that despite the opinions of some who have voiced displeasure of association with a union (IBT) of many disciplines; common sense and logical thought indicates strength in that approach. By having support of those who service/load/dispatch, etc..., one can truly be effective if and when necessary.
It is time to move forward for the Atlas and Polar crews. Mr. Rilly's commentary; which I've observed for months, seems only to focus on contributing bile to the debate and nothing of substance. Thoughtful discussion and common ground are necessary to survive in this industry. Mr. Rilly does not offer any endorsement but creating disharmony for what apparently is only an attempt to make others miserable and needlessly risk jobs of those he purports to support.
For those who long dealt with the Teamsters under Don Treichler, the move by Mr. Hoffa to replace him can only be viewed as a new hope and fresh air. Captain Bourne's accumen and his publicly reported successes certainly are a strikingly positive contrast in comparison to the clear lack of success of his former Polar counterpart.
Contrary to his public statements, it appears that Mr. Prater seems to be taking ALPA backwards at a rapid pace. Having new members from Colgan to replenish his coffers must be rather important, given the loss of USAirways and America West and the apparent repudiation of ALPA by JetBlue due to his poor leadership.
It would also certainly seem logical that despite the opinions of some who have voiced displeasure of association with a union (IBT) of many disciplines; common sense and logical thought indicates strength in that approach. By having support of those who service/load/dispatch, etc..., one can truly be effective if and when necessary.
It is time to move forward for the Atlas and Polar crews. Mr. Rilly's commentary; which I've observed for months, seems only to focus on contributing bile to the debate and nothing of substance. Thoughtful discussion and common ground are necessary to survive in this industry. Mr. Rilly does not offer any endorsement but creating disharmony for what apparently is only an attempt to make others miserable and needlessly risk jobs of those he purports to support.
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Moving on...
Mr Flyer,
thank you for the astute observations. Mr Rilly knows we are moving on, with or without him. It's time for him to focus his previously sour invective towards the future. MOVING ON....
thank you for the astute observations. Mr Rilly knows we are moving on, with or without him. It's time for him to focus his previously sour invective towards the future. MOVING ON....
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12/19 Statement from ALPA . . .
Good Luck IBT, as the ball is now in your court, it's your turn to walk the talk.
Atlas/Polar Leave ALPA
In a representation election for the combined group of Atlas Air and Polar Air Cargo pilots, the Teamsters were selected as their new collective bargaining agents following that organization’s filing of authorization cards and request for an NMB election. This result was not unexpected based on the contentious merger of the two carriers, the Polar Air Cargo strike in 2005—during and following which the two groups substantially disagreed on a number of issues—and the general pilot disunity that resulted. Regrettably, the IBT took advantage of such internal disputes and separated the Atlas and Polar crewmembers from their ALPA colleagues and a union with extensive professional resources, services, expertise, and influence focused solely on issues that affect the piloting profession. Unfortunately, pilots are less than 1 percent of the Teamster membership and have little influence in the general or strategic direction of that union, allocation of its resources, and the dedication of staff to pilot issues compared to the influence wielded by truck drivers and workers in warehouses, dairies, bakeries, breweries, food service, and laundries who dominate that union’s membership.
The election of ALPA by the pilots at Colgan—where the IBT also sought representation rights and where the IBT received less than 10 percent of the votes; the endorsement of ALPA rather than the Teamsters by the NPA Board; and the past decertification of the IBT at NetJets, UPS, ATA, and Evergreen shows that Teamster election rhetoric and promises typically give way to representation that does not benefit flight deck crewmembers.
We regret that ALPA insurance products, financial support, training programs, peer interaction, professional staff resources, and status and influence as the largest pilot union in the world will no longer be available to Atlas and Polar crewmembers. We look forward to the day when ALPA can again provide that support to them via membership in our union, which also provides them membership within the IFALPA structure, as Polar and Atlas crewmembers spend the majority of their time flying outside of this country.
In a representation election for the combined group of Atlas Air and Polar Air Cargo pilots, the Teamsters were selected as their new collective bargaining agents following that organization’s filing of authorization cards and request for an NMB election. This result was not unexpected based on the contentious merger of the two carriers, the Polar Air Cargo strike in 2005—during and following which the two groups substantially disagreed on a number of issues—and the general pilot disunity that resulted. Regrettably, the IBT took advantage of such internal disputes and separated the Atlas and Polar crewmembers from their ALPA colleagues and a union with extensive professional resources, services, expertise, and influence focused solely on issues that affect the piloting profession. Unfortunately, pilots are less than 1 percent of the Teamster membership and have little influence in the general or strategic direction of that union, allocation of its resources, and the dedication of staff to pilot issues compared to the influence wielded by truck drivers and workers in warehouses, dairies, bakeries, breweries, food service, and laundries who dominate that union’s membership.
The election of ALPA by the pilots at Colgan—where the IBT also sought representation rights and where the IBT received less than 10 percent of the votes; the endorsement of ALPA rather than the Teamsters by the NPA Board; and the past decertification of the IBT at NetJets, UPS, ATA, and Evergreen shows that Teamster election rhetoric and promises typically give way to representation that does not benefit flight deck crewmembers.
We regret that ALPA insurance products, financial support, training programs, peer interaction, professional staff resources, and status and influence as the largest pilot union in the world will no longer be available to Atlas and Polar crewmembers. We look forward to the day when ALPA can again provide that support to them via membership in our union, which also provides them membership within the IFALPA structure, as Polar and Atlas crewmembers spend the majority of their time flying outside of this country.
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I might be incorrect, but I believe that the IBT was never on the ballot at Colgan. And with the NPA, does the endorsement of their Board come from a membership poll or just that sitting group? Given their turmoil and numerous changes of Negotiating Committees; five different at last count, one must ask if they speak for the majority or Air Tran or just are making a recommendation, albeit one with no other choices. There certainly seems to be some disparate opinions there, it appears the IBT decision was more based on not wanting to get into the middle of an internal dispute that may be yet unresolved.
The ball is now, as mentioned in the IBT court. If their new President is breaking from the old and intent on bringing about change, he certainly has the opportunity in this case.
To do so will leave his naysayers within ALPA, on this and other forums to seek new excuses to comiserate.
"atlast" ...Thank you for informing me about Mr. Rilly. It appears that FedEx is now sadly looking at potential cutbacks. We must assume that he will soon focus his immaturities elsewhere if he is one of those affected.
The ball is now, as mentioned in the IBT court. If their new President is breaking from the old and intent on bringing about change, he certainly has the opportunity in this case.
To do so will leave his naysayers within ALPA, on this and other forums to seek new excuses to comiserate.
"atlast" ...Thank you for informing me about Mr. Rilly. It appears that FedEx is now sadly looking at potential cutbacks. We must assume that he will soon focus his immaturities elsewhere if he is one of those affected.
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MOVing on...
The contract survey is out and we will get what we can negotiate for. Pure and simple. Many thanks to ALPA for stalling our negotiations from a point in time when the Industry was sustaining a peak to now, when it's in a trough.
Still, like I say... Moving on!
Still, like I say... Moving on!
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Moving On...
LANCERDVR
Dear Lancerdvr,
thank you for that thoughtful invective and your unhealthy dose of pessimism for the future. May I humbly suggest a more useful allotment of your time? For example, call the 1224 telephone number and ask how you can contribute to making YOUR union work.
If you are as sad and sickened as you purport you might not be safe to fly; better call in sick.
Moving on Sincerely
Atlast
Looks like the previous post from lancerdvr has been removed. Oh well!
I wish I had a little hope that this change of representation will work but I know that it won't.
thank you for that thoughtful invective and your unhealthy dose of pessimism for the future. May I humbly suggest a more useful allotment of your time? For example, call the 1224 telephone number and ask how you can contribute to making YOUR union work.
If you are as sad and sickened as you purport you might not be safe to fly; better call in sick.
Moving on Sincerely
Atlast
Looks like the previous post from lancerdvr has been removed. Oh well!
Last edited by atlast; 20th Dec 2008 at 18:55. Reason: Previous post from Lancerdvr removed
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Alright, for all of you with axes to grind concerning Teamsters response to the Kalitta accident in Bogata, the local president and attorney flew down the next day, and was on site until it was obvious that his services were no longer needed. The stateside office did what they could to help. Problems were encountered, but it speaks volumes that the Teamsters beat the NTSB to the scene, and were better set up to communicate. (The NTSB only had one worldphone, apparantly).
While we are on the subject, ALPA made their CIRP availible to all involved, as Kalitta was still developing their program at the time.
Everyone involved probably could have done better, but it was an extremely difficult situation.
I hope, when it comes to safety, pilots will always pull together for the common good, regardless of union, airline or nationality. Rather optomistic to be sure, but it worked pretty well in Bogota.
Please do not ever use this tragedy again to plug a personal agenda.
While we are on the subject, ALPA made their CIRP availible to all involved, as Kalitta was still developing their program at the time.
Everyone involved probably could have done better, but it was an extremely difficult situation.
I hope, when it comes to safety, pilots will always pull together for the common good, regardless of union, airline or nationality. Rather optomistic to be sure, but it worked pretty well in Bogota.
Please do not ever use this tragedy again to plug a personal agenda.